StarksEwing1 wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Chandler wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Chandler wrote:

smackeddog wrote:Seems like whenever he has a big stats game, it has little impact on the team winning. Sulked and wanted a trade because Doncic was taking the ball out of his hands (so seems more interested in getting his than winning). Not really a fan of his.

+ 1

Fact is the Mavs were a bad team last year. Harrison Barnes was there best player. Mathews, as you will see, was very inconsistent. They had no outside shooting nor post presence. But would admit that Smith was hardly an impact player to lead a team into the playoffs.

Not being sarcastic, but can you post where he was sulking or whining about a trade? Have not seen any. Think this has been overstated without any proof. Think he and his representatives just made a business and development decision. Mavs have a player in Luca that they want to make the focul point. Smith quickly became disposable. Nothing wrong with a team changing directions. But then there should be nothing wrong with a player deciding that it is best to move on. KP did so without the team telling him they were moving in a different direction. Seems that is ok with some around here.

you realize he left the team, right? took a time-out

Hooefully there is more to the story and he just needs a fresh start. I remember hating the Spree trade. I wanted no part of a guy that would choke his coach. I certainly didn’t want to give up Starks for that guy. Obviously it turned out well for the K I is. Many years after that I became friends with a guy who was a Bay Area reporter at that time. He wasn’t the main reporter for the Warriors but did cover them on a semi regular basis. He told me all the beat guys were excited that Spree had gone after P.J. Said the guy was a total @ss and that no one liked him. He had the misfortune of following Nellie, a guy loved by the beat writers. Nothing ever came out about that nationally.

Yes its true PJ was a ballbuster BUT choking someone is far worse. I also hated the trade originally because Starks was my guy but Spree behaved himself decently in NY and helped us get to the finals. Still has some screws loose lol

CrushAlot wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Chandler wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Chandler wrote:

smackeddog wrote:Seems like whenever he has a big stats game, it has little impact on the team winning. Sulked and wanted a trade because Doncic was taking the ball out of his hands (so seems more interested in getting his than winning). Not really a fan of his.

+ 1

Fact is the Mavs were a bad team last year. Harrison Barnes was there best player. Mathews, as you will see, was very inconsistent. They had no outside shooting nor post presence. But would admit that Smith was hardly an impact player to lead a team into the playoffs.

Not being sarcastic, but can you post where he was sulking or whining about a trade? Have not seen any. Think this has been overstated without any proof. Think he and his representatives just made a business and development decision. Mavs have a player in Luca that they want to make the focul point. Smith quickly became disposable. Nothing wrong with a team changing directions. But then there should be nothing wrong with a player deciding that it is best to move on. KP did so without the team telling him they were moving in a different direction. Seems that is ok with some around here.

you realize he left the team, right? took a time-out

Hooefully there is more to the story and he just needs a fresh start. I remember hating the Spree trade. I wanted no part of a guy that would choke his coach. I certainly didn’t want to give up Starks for that guy. Obviously it turned out well for the K I is. Many years after that I became friends with a guy who was a Bay Area reporter at that time. He wasn’t the main reporter for the Warriors but did cover them on a semi regular basis. He told me all the beat guys were excited that Spree had gone after P.J. Said the guy was a total @ss and that no one liked him. He had the misfortune of following Nellie, a guy loved by the beat writers. Nothing ever came out about that nationally.

Yes its true PJ was a ballbuster BUT choking someone is far worse. I also hated the trade originally because Starks was my guy but Spree behaved himself decently in NY and helped us get to the finals. Still has some screws loose lol

You would have to hear this guy tell it. He said all the beat guys hated PJ. Not saying it was right. I did it want him on the Knicks. I thought he should be kicked out of the league. There was a bit more to the story. Nothing justifies spree’s actions.

StarksEwing1 wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Chandler wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Chandler wrote:

smackeddog wrote:Seems like whenever he has a big stats game, it has little impact on the team winning. Sulked and wanted a trade because Doncic was taking the ball out of his hands (so seems more interested in getting his than winning). Not really a fan of his.

+ 1

Fact is the Mavs were a bad team last year. Harrison Barnes was there best player. Mathews, as you will see, was very inconsistent. They had no outside shooting nor post presence. But would admit that Smith was hardly an impact player to lead a team into the playoffs.

Not being sarcastic, but can you post where he was sulking or whining about a trade? Have not seen any. Think this has been overstated without any proof. Think he and his representatives just made a business and development decision. Mavs have a player in Luca that they want to make the focul point. Smith quickly became disposable. Nothing wrong with a team changing directions. But then there should be nothing wrong with a player deciding that it is best to move on. KP did so without the team telling him they were moving in a different direction. Seems that is ok with some around here.

you realize he left the team, right? took a time-out

Hooefully there is more to the story and he just needs a fresh start. I remember hating the Spree trade. I wanted no part of a guy that would choke his coach. I certainly didn’t want to give up Starks for that guy. Obviously it turned out well for the K I is. Many years after that I became friends with a guy who was a Bay Area reporter at that time. He wasn’t the main reporter for the Warriors but did cover them on a semi regular basis. He told me all the beat guys were excited that Spree had gone after P.J. Said the guy was a total @ss and that no one liked him. He had the misfortune of following Nellie, a guy loved by the beat writers. Nothing ever came out about that nationally.

Yes its true PJ was a ballbuster BUT choking someone is far worse. I also hated the trade originally because Starks was my guy but Spree behaved himself decently in NY and helped us get to the finals. Still has some screws loose lol

newyorknewyork wrote:

nykshaknbake wrote:

Uptown wrote:Smith is the same age as Frank (maybe a few months older) so hopefully he is afforded the same patients that some of us preach for Frank. Smith is far from a finished product but he has some very enticing tools....Tools that are ready made for the way the game is played today for lead-guards...Extremely athletic, can finish above the rim, can score, can create for him-self, plays down hill..etc. Obviously, he is an unfinished product and has a lot of work to do to round out his game, but he is not without the tools...

This. I think he has a high ceiling and could be an all star if he can learn to be a good facilitator. It's silly to expect a lot of polish on that end at 19-20 years old. Despite people here saying definitively that he can't shoot he's at 44% and 34.5% from 3;both improvements from last year. Meanwhile those same people claim Frank has proven he can shoot despite his numbers and regression. Defense is going to be a weak point, but it is with so many lead guards. It's absolutely now Frank vs DSJ, even more than Mudiay, so expect a lot of polarization on this board.

The question is more so if he can fit into a team concept THAN if he can turn himself into an all star level player. Talent is there to be an all star, but even if he were to accomplish that feat. Doesn't guarantee that he is able to fit in a team concept and play with other gifted players who need the ball which has been a red flag when evaluating him.

He will be able to change the narrative here in NY. And I will only evaluate what he does for the Knicks. Hopefully Fizz is able to mold him into the type of player we need him to be to win.

We don't exactly have a team concept and Fiz hasn't molded anybody into anything worthwhile yet.

TripleThreat wrote:

jskinny35 wrote:Haven't watched him play much - wondering what the consensus is about him and his potential. Are we expecting him to become our starting point or do the Bricks still pick a point like Ja Morant over other solid players like RJ or Cameron if all are available? Seems like he needs the ball in his hands a lot, and doesn't play too much defense. On flip side he is athletic, penetrates and can distribute when he wants to... Thoughts?

Has the physical skill set to have been the first overall pick in his draft easily.

Has, over time, begun to develop a reputation as an unreasonable ******* in the NBA.

To be a professional athlete, there's a certain level of rage/arrogance/ego that you need to endure the grind. That being said, you can't be totally unreasonable about it.

Case in point, players only meeting. You point out others people ****. But when it comes time, you own your own ****. Owning your own **** is being reasonable. Not owning your own **** is being unreasonable ( basically being a piece of ****)

Rick Carlisle is very respected around the league. If he can't fix you, odds you can't be fixed.

Maybe he'll clean up his act in NY. Odds are against it.

I'l take that bet. I'l bet good money he will be a complete jerk if we keep him.

GustavBahler wrote:https://www.mavsmoneyball.com/platform/amp/2019/2/2/18206290/the-unexpected-path-of-dennis-smith-jr-kristaps-porzingis-mavericks-nba-trade-deadline

Chemistry was an issue. Sometimes it just doesnt work out. Dont believe this is a situation where one side is to blame. Doncic is already one of the best P&R players in the league. Not that big a surprise that the focus had shifted to Doncic. Wether or not Smith jr. was pitch perfect, the lack of chemistry on the court made a change inevitable.

If Smith jr doesnt stick, dont believe its going to be because of his personality. More about what he does to round out his game. Im pretty sure he's got a huge chip on his shoulder at this point over this. Lets see how he responds.

meloshouldgo wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:https://www.mavsmoneyball.com/platform/amp/2019/2/2/18206290/the-unexpected-path-of-dennis-smith-jr-kristaps-porzingis-mavericks-nba-trade-deadline

Chemistry was an issue. Sometimes it just doesnt work out. Dont believe this is a situation where one side is to blame. Doncic is already one of the best P&R players in the league. Not that big a surprise that the focus had shifted to Doncic. Wether or not Smith jr. was pitch perfect, the lack of chemistry on the court made a change inevitable.

If Smith jr doesnt stick, dont believe its going to be because of his personality. More about what he does to round out his game. Im pretty sure he's got a huge chip on his shoulder at this point over this. Lets see how he responds.

You could be right about chemistry. Look ive made it known that im not a huge DSJ fan but there is no question he has offensive ability and is still very young. If we can somehow get him to work more on distribution and at least a little defense it could be a lot of fun.

I think this will turn out badly, but I'll still take Smith Jr's cost controlled contract over Mudiay. If we have to have one dimensional chuckers then I would want the least expensive and youngest one. Hoping he can be taught to play the right way but ZERO confidence in Fiz's ability to do so especially after a great caoch like Carlisle couldn't.

StarksEwing1 wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:https://www.mavsmoneyball.com/platform/amp/2019/2/2/18206290/the-unexpected-path-of-dennis-smith-jr-kristaps-porzingis-mavericks-nba-trade-deadline

Chemistry was an issue. Sometimes it just doesnt work out. Dont believe this is a situation where one side is to blame. Doncic is already one of the best P&R players in the league. Not that big a surprise that the focus had shifted to Doncic. Wether or not Smith jr. was pitch perfect, the lack of chemistry on the court made a change inevitable.

If Smith jr doesnt stick, dont believe its going to be because of his personality. More about what he does to round out his game. Im pretty sure he's got a huge chip on his shoulder at this point over this. Lets see how he responds.

You could be right about chemistry. Look ive made it known that im not a huge DSJ fan but there is no question he has offensive ability and is still very young. If we can somehow get him to work more on distribution and at least a little defense it could be a lot of fun.

From what Ive read, mistakes were made all around, dont see the point of calling it now. Needs to work on his D first, agree about that. When he makes it a focus Smith's court vision, and speed make him a tough cover.

GustavBahler wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:https://www.mavsmoneyball.com/platform/amp/2019/2/2/18206290/the-unexpected-path-of-dennis-smith-jr-kristaps-porzingis-mavericks-nba-trade-deadline

Chemistry was an issue. Sometimes it just doesnt work out. Dont believe this is a situation where one side is to blame. Doncic is already one of the best P&R players in the league. Not that big a surprise that the focus had shifted to Doncic. Wether or not Smith jr. was pitch perfect, the lack of chemistry on the court made a change inevitable.

If Smith jr doesnt stick, dont believe its going to be because of his personality. More about what he does to round out his game. Im pretty sure he's got a huge chip on his shoulder at this point over this. Lets see how he responds.

You could be right about chemistry. Look ive made it known that im not a huge DSJ fan but there is no question he has offensive ability and is still very young. If we can somehow get him to work more on distribution and at least a little defense it could be a lot of fun.

I think this will turn out badly, but I'll still take Smith Jr's cost controlled contract over Mudiay. If we have to have one dimensional chuckers then I would want the least expensive and youngest one. Hoping he can be taught to play the right way but ZERO confidence in Fiz's ability to do so especially after a great caoch like Carlisle couldn't.

Carlisle was tough on Smith jr. characteristically tough. Never read anything about Carlisle suggesting that he was a problem. Believe Carlisle is too proud to apologize to Smith jr, if he didnt believe he could have handled the transition to Doncic better.

Smith jr was starting from day one, didnt get to ease into learning how to be a starting PG in the NBA.

NY will give Smithjr a great opportunity to run a team. Already has some experience to learn from. Not predicting anything, just glad he's here for the opportunity.

The idea that an accomplished coach has to apologize to an entitled 19 yr old, is why the NBA is falling apart at the seams. Opportunity wasn't lacking discipline was. Discipline more than talent is needed to succeed in the NBA. You can make it to the NBA on talent alone, because you now play only one year in college and may not have major weaknesses in your game exposed. Once you get here it's a different game and everyone elese is also faster, stronger and in a few cases smarter. A coach like Carlisle would have made him great if he had put in the effort sincerely opn both ends of teh floor. Fiz won't make him better, but may lead him to more highlight reels and short term foolishness.

BigDaddyG wrote:

Welpee wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

ESOMKnicks wrote:I have always thought that DSJr is a poor man's DRose. And we all remember how the rich man's DRose worked out over here.

Stats-wise, even Mudiay is a little better. DSJr is a bigger TO machine than even Mudiay. And this is quite an achievement in itself.

I always thought the Steve Francis comparisons we're apt. Crazy hops, nice ability to change direction and is good for one highlight a game. The bad? Over dribbles, shaky shot selection and isn't efficient enough to justify a high usage. He has to learn the point guard position and will need patience.

People have short memories, Francis was consider a top player. He put up like 20 ppg, 6 reb, 6 assists and 1.5 steals his first four seasons in the league. Then his career fell off the cliff, but in the beginning he was a top flight player.

He was a top flight "talent." But he isn't known as a winning basketball player. I'm not saying he was inherently selfish, but he played streetball type game. For every highlight dunk, there are highlights of him dribbling the air out of the ball for ill-advised fadeaway Js. He only shot over 45% from the field once in his career and he shot 43% overall.

meloshouldgo wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:https://www.mavsmoneyball.com/platform/amp/2019/2/2/18206290/the-unexpected-path-of-dennis-smith-jr-kristaps-porzingis-mavericks-nba-trade-deadline

Chemistry was an issue. Sometimes it just doesnt work out. Dont believe this is a situation where one side is to blame. Doncic is already one of the best P&R players in the league. Not that big a surprise that the focus had shifted to Doncic. Wether or not Smith jr. was pitch perfect, the lack of chemistry on the court made a change inevitable.

If Smith jr doesnt stick, dont believe its going to be because of his personality. More about what he does to round out his game. Im pretty sure he's got a huge chip on his shoulder at this point over this. Lets see how he responds.

You could be right about chemistry. Look ive made it known that im not a huge DSJ fan but there is no question he has offensive ability and is still very young. If we can somehow get him to work more on distribution and at least a little defense it could be a lot of fun.

I think this will turn out badly, but I'll still take Smith Jr's cost controlled contract over Mudiay. If we have to have one dimensional chuckers then I would want the least expensive and youngest one. Hoping he can be taught to play the right way but ZERO confidence in Fiz's ability to do so especially after a great caoch like Carlisle couldn't.

Carlisle was tough on Smith jr. characteristically tough. Never read anything about Carlisle suggesting that he was a problem. Believe Carlisle is too proud to apologize to Smith jr, if he didnt believe he could have handled the transition to Doncic better.

Smith jr was starting from day one, didnt get to ease into learning how to be a starting PG in the NBA.

NY will give Smithjr a great opportunity to run a team. Already has some experience to learn from. Not predicting anything, just glad he's here for the opportunity.

The idea that an accomplished coach has to apologize to an entitled 19 yr old, is why the NBA is falling apart at the seams. Opportunity wasn't lacking discipline was. Discipline more than talent is needed to succeed in the NBA. You can make it to the NBA on talent alone, because you now play only one year in college and may not have major weaknesses in your game exposed. Once you get here it's a different game and everyone elese is also faster, stronger and in a few cases smarter. A coach like Carlisle would have made him great if he had put in the effort sincerely opn both ends of teh floor. Fiz won't make him better, but may lead him to more highlight reels and short term foolishness.

I don't think he had to. I think he did so to reestablish Smith's trade value. They were probably getting crap low ball offers once the story broke and he decided to stay away from the team. They probably had the KP deal diagrammed with the Knicks at this time. As well as possible other deals.

Carlisle may have took one for the team (by apologizing).