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martin
Posts: 74856
Alba Posts: 108
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
12/9/2017  10:54 PM
reub wrote:Is this a sports site or a political site?

If you don’t have anything to add to a thread, please skip

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Cartman718
Posts: 29068
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 10/12/2007
Member: #1694
12/9/2017  11:15 PM
TPercy wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:
Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns
Thank the NRA
Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?
Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.

exactly what it is

You are against the 2nd Amendment? Why?

Because the second amendment was written at a time when no one fathomed 3 things:
1. How easily one would be able to get guns in future America.
2. What a police state and lobbying in government would look like
3. That there would be automatic weapons capable of killing hundreds in seconds effectively tilting the battle in favor of an indiscriminate weapon holder.

I’ll draw a parallel in concept. When Barack Obama’s parents had him, interracial marriage was illegal, at least in the state where he was born.

At one point, women were not allowed to vote until they finally did.

To say that a law should not be reversed just because it was the 2nd amendment may not be the broadest way of thinking.

Just because it was the 2nd amendment doesn’t mean we can’t or shouldn’t revisit it. Laws need to keep up with the state of the masses. Same gender loving people can get married today or serve in the military. None of the founding fathers ever thought that would happen either.

Nixluva is posting triangle screen grabs, even when nobody asks - Fishmike. LOL So are we going to reference that thread like the bible now? "The thread of Wroten Page 14 post 9" - EnySpree
TPercy
Posts: 28010
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/5/2014
Member: #5748
12/9/2017  11:16 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:

Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns

Thank the NRA

Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?

Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.


The NRA, both in terms of membership and finances, arn't strong...they arn't even top 100.

They have a great deal of influence, ask any member of congress.


Of course members of Congress on the opposing side of the aisle are going to blame the NRA for everything.

They write legislation for politicians, then pay them to front it.

Try again. The NRA dosen't have that much money or the membership to actually buyout politicians.

LOL did you laugh as much as I did when you wrote that?

OMG the level of ignorance is staggering

Seriously, this is just from 24 hours ago..

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/12/08/nra-hijacked-bipartisan-common-sense-gun-bill-john-feinblatt-column/930862001/

Not sure what this proves? Where does it reference how the NRA buying out politicians caused the stalling of a flawed bill?

The Future is Bright!
TPercy
Posts: 28010
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/5/2014
Member: #5748
12/9/2017  11:19 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/9/2017  11:23 PM
Cartman718 wrote:
TPercy wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:
Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns
Thank the NRA
Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?
Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.

exactly what it is

You are against the 2nd Amendment? Why?

Because the second amendment was written at a time when no one fathomed 3 things:
1. How easily one would be able to get guns in future America.
2. What a police state and lobbying in government would look like
3. That there would be automatic weapons capable of killing hundreds in seconds effectively tilting the battle in favor of an indiscriminate weapon holder.

I'll draw a parallel in concept. When Barack Obama's parents had him, interracial marriage was illegal, at least in the state where he was born.

At one point, women were not allowed to vote until they finally did.

To say that a law should not be reversed just because it was the 2nd amendment may not be the broadest way of thinking.

Just because it was the 2nd amendment doesn't mean we can't or shouldn't revisit it. Laws need to keep up with the state of the masses. Same gender loving people can get married today or serve in the military. None of the founding fathers ever thought that would happen either.


So because a law was made under different circumstances than it was today, its relevance is invalid? You can make that claim for basically every single development in history since the founding fathers.
The Future is Bright!
GustavBahler
Posts: 42187
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186
12/9/2017  11:38 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/9/2017  11:44 PM
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:

Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns

Thank the NRA

Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?

Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.


The NRA, both in terms of membership and finances, arn't strong...they arn't even top 100.

They have a great deal of influence, ask any member of congress.


Of course members of Congress on the opposing side of the aisle are going to blame the NRA for everything.

They write legislation for politicians, then pay them to front it.

Try again. The NRA dosen't have that much money or the membership to actually buyout politicians.

LOL did you laugh as much as I did when you wrote that?

OMG the level of ignorance is staggering

Seriously, this is just from 24 hours ago..

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/12/08/nra-hijacked-bipartisan-common-sense-gun-bill-john-feinblatt-column/930862001/

Not sure what this proves? Where does it reference how the NRA buying out politicians caused the stalling of a flawed bill?


The conceal carry bill was their baby. You really think they give this much money a year to politicians and expect nothing in return? C'mon Man.

https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/totals.php?id=D000000082

Edit: More accurate link..

https://www.opensecrets.org/outsidespending/detail.php?cycle=2016&cmte=National+Rifle+Assn
meloshouldgo
Posts: 26565
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/3/2014
Member: #5801
12/9/2017  11:52 PM
martin wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:

Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns

Thank the NRA

Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?

Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.


The NRA, both in terms of membership and finances, arn't strong...they arn't even top 100.

They have a great deal of influence, ask any member of congress.


Of course members of Congress on the opposing side of the aisle are going to blame the NRA for everything.

They write legislation for politicians, then pay them to front it.

Try again. The NRA dosen't have that much money or the membership to actually buyout politicians.

LOL did you laugh as much as I did when you wrote that?

OMG the level of ignorance is staggering

He is a perfect example of a Trump voter - as much as it's hard to comprehend half the country is actually this stupid.

I cannot teach anybody anything. I can only try to make them think - Socrates
TPercy
Posts: 28010
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/5/2014
Member: #5748
12/9/2017  11:53 PM
meloshouldgo wrote:
martin wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:

Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns

Thank the NRA

Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?

Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.


The NRA, both in terms of membership and finances, arn't strong...they arn't even top 100.

They have a great deal of influence, ask any member of congress.


Of course members of Congress on the opposing side of the aisle are going to blame the NRA for everything.

They write legislation for politicians, then pay them to front it.

Try again. The NRA dosen't have that much money or the membership to actually buyout politicians.

LOL did you laugh as much as I did when you wrote that?

OMG the level of ignorance is staggering

He is a perfect example of a Trump voter - as much as it's hard to comprehend half the country is actually this stupid.


I voted for Evan Mcmullin you ****ing *******.
The Future is Bright!
TPercy
Posts: 28010
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/5/2014
Member: #5748
12/9/2017  11:57 PM
martin wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:

Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns

Thank the NRA

Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?

Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.


The NRA, both in terms of membership and finances, arn't strong...they arn't even top 100.

They have a great deal of influence, ask any member of congress.


Of course members of Congress on the opposing side of the aisle are going to blame the NRA for everything.

They write legislation for politicians, then pay them to front it.

Try again. The NRA dosen't have that much money or the membership to actually buyout politicians.

LOL did you laugh as much as I did when you wrote that?

OMG the level of ignorance is staggering


Martin. It is a known fact that the NRA is not financially strong nor is it that huge membership wise, so logically speaking, the NRA can't exactly be buying out politicians. Would you make the argument that Democrats are in the pockets of Unions who spend far far far more than they do?
The Future is Bright!
GustavBahler
Posts: 42187
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186
12/10/2017  12:06 AM
TPercy wrote:
martin wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:

Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns

Thank the NRA

Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?

Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.


The NRA, both in terms of membership and finances, arn't strong...they arn't even top 100.

They have a great deal of influence, ask any member of congress.


Of course members of Congress on the opposing side of the aisle are going to blame the NRA for everything.

They write legislation for politicians, then pay them to front it.

Try again. The NRA dosen't have that much money or the membership to actually buyout politicians.

LOL did you laugh as much as I did when you wrote that?

OMG the level of ignorance is staggering


Martin. It is a known fact that the NRA is not financially strong nor is it that huge membership wise, so logically speaking, the NRA can't exactly be buying out politicians. Would you make the argument that Democrats are in the pockets of Unions who spend far far far more than they do?

4 million members not big enough? They spent almost 60 million dollars during the last election cycle. Do facts matter?

They are heavily funded by gunmakers and the Koch Brothers.
TPercy
Posts: 28010
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/5/2014
Member: #5748
12/10/2017  12:15 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:

Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns

Thank the NRA

Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?

Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.


The NRA, both in terms of membership and finances, arn't strong...they arn't even top 100.

They have a great deal of influence, ask any member of congress.


Of course members of Congress on the opposing side of the aisle are going to blame the NRA for everything.

They write legislation for politicians, then pay them to front it.

Try again. The NRA dosen't have that much money or the membership to actually buyout politicians.

LOL did you laugh as much as I did when you wrote that?

OMG the level of ignorance is staggering

Seriously, this is just from 24 hours ago..

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/12/08/nra-hijacked-bipartisan-common-sense-gun-bill-john-feinblatt-column/930862001/

Not sure what this proves? Where does it reference how the NRA buying out politicians caused the stalling of a flawed bill?


The conceal carry bill was their baby. You really think they give this much money a year to politicians and expect nothing in return? C'mon Man.

https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/totals.php?id=D000000082

Edit: More accurate link..

https://www.opensecrets.org/outsidespending/detail.php?cycle=2016&cmte=National+Rifle+Assn


Bruh...those numbers are like pennies compared to what other groups are spending. Priorities USA and the Democratic senatorial committeee out spent almost 5 times as much they did.
The Future is Bright!
GustavBahler
Posts: 42187
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186
12/10/2017  12:17 AM
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:

Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns

Thank the NRA

Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?

Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.


The NRA, both in terms of membership and finances, arn't strong...they arn't even top 100.

They have a great deal of influence, ask any member of congress.


Of course members of Congress on the opposing side of the aisle are going to blame the NRA for everything.

They write legislation for politicians, then pay them to front it.

Try again. The NRA dosen't have that much money or the membership to actually buyout politicians.

LOL did you laugh as much as I did when you wrote that?

OMG the level of ignorance is staggering

Seriously, this is just from 24 hours ago..

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/12/08/nra-hijacked-bipartisan-common-sense-gun-bill-john-feinblatt-column/930862001/

Not sure what this proves? Where does it reference how the NRA buying out politicians caused the stalling of a flawed bill?


The conceal carry bill was their baby. You really think they give this much money a year to politicians and expect nothing in return? C'mon Man.

https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/totals.php?id=D000000082

Edit: More accurate link..

https://www.opensecrets.org/outsidespending/detail.php?cycle=2016&cmte=National+Rifle+Assn


Bruh...those numbers are like pennies compared to what other groups are spending. Priorities USA and the Democratic senatorial committeee out spent almost 5 times as much they did.

A group that can spend 60 million dollars in one election cycle has a great deal of influence. Look at the second link I posted, and their success rate in electing and defeating politicians.
TPercy
Posts: 28010
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/5/2014
Member: #5748
12/10/2017  12:39 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:

Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns

Thank the NRA

Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?

Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.


The NRA, both in terms of membership and finances, arn't strong...they arn't even top 100.

They have a great deal of influence, ask any member of congress.


Of course members of Congress on the opposing side of the aisle are going to blame the NRA for everything.

They write legislation for politicians, then pay them to front it.

Try again. The NRA dosen't have that much money or the membership to actually buyout politicians.

LOL did you laugh as much as I did when you wrote that?

OMG the level of ignorance is staggering

Seriously, this is just from 24 hours ago..

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/12/08/nra-hijacked-bipartisan-common-sense-gun-bill-john-feinblatt-column/930862001/

Not sure what this proves? Where does it reference how the NRA buying out politicians caused the stalling of a flawed bill?


The conceal carry bill was their baby. You really think they give this much money a year to politicians and expect nothing in return? C'mon Man.

https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/totals.php?id=D000000082

Edit: More accurate link..

https://www.opensecrets.org/outsidespending/detail.php?cycle=2016&cmte=National+Rifle+Assn


Bruh...those numbers are like pennies compared to what other groups are spending. Priorities USA and the Democratic senatorial committeee out spent almost 5 times as much they did.

A group that can spend 60 million dollars in one election cycle has a great deal of influence. Look at the second link I posted, and their success rate in electing and defeating politicians.

As I said, when you compare how much the NRA spent on the election to other groups, its not that much. Furthermore, the fact that they don't even make up the top 50(maybe 100) on lobbying hinders your point that the NRA is buying out politicians. NRA is strong, but money isn't the reason

The Future is Bright!
GustavBahler
Posts: 42187
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186
12/10/2017  1:02 AM
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:

Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns

Thank the NRA

Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?

Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.


The NRA, both in terms of membership and finances, arn't strong...they arn't even top 100.

They have a great deal of influence, ask any member of congress.


Of course members of Congress on the opposing side of the aisle are going to blame the NRA for everything.

They write legislation for politicians, then pay them to front it.

Try again. The NRA dosen't have that much money or the membership to actually buyout politicians.

LOL did you laugh as much as I did when you wrote that?

OMG the level of ignorance is staggering

Seriously, this is just from 24 hours ago..

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/12/08/nra-hijacked-bipartisan-common-sense-gun-bill-john-feinblatt-column/930862001/

Not sure what this proves? Where does it reference how the NRA buying out politicians caused the stalling of a flawed bill?


The conceal carry bill was their baby. You really think they give this much money a year to politicians and expect nothing in return? C'mon Man.

https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/totals.php?id=D000000082

Edit: More accurate link..

https://www.opensecrets.org/outsidespending/detail.php?cycle=2016&cmte=National+Rifle+Assn


Bruh...those numbers are like pennies compared to what other groups are spending. Priorities USA and the Democratic senatorial committeee out spent almost 5 times as much they did.

A group that can spend 60 million dollars in one election cycle has a great deal of influence. Look at the second link I posted, and their success rate in electing and defeating politicians.

As I said, when you compare how much the NRA spent on the election to other groups, its not that much. Furthermore, the fact that they don't even make up the top 50(maybe 100) on lobbying hinders your point that the NRA is buying out politicians. NRA is strong, but money isn't the reason

There are exponentially more guns in the US than anywhere else in the world. This happened for one reason, the NRA spending hundreds of millions of dollars over the years to keep any serious gun control legislation from emerging.

You really think they didnt play a big part? I could have Wayne LePierre tell you how successful they are and you would find a way to rationalize it. Just because they arent the biggest, doesnt mean they arent wildly successful, look at the results. Think about how much more they are spending than gun control advocates.
Cartman718
Posts: 29068
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 10/12/2007
Member: #1694
12/10/2017  3:20 PM
TPercy wrote:
Cartman718 wrote:
TPercy wrote:
meloshouldgo wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:
Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns
Thank the NRA
Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?
Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.

exactly what it is
You are against the 2nd Amendment? Why?
Because the second amendment was written at a time when no one fathomed 3 things:
1. How easily one would be able to get guns in future America.
2. What a police state and lobbying in government would look like
3. That there would be automatic weapons capable of killing hundreds in seconds effectively tilting the battle in favor of an indiscriminate weapon holder.

I'll draw a parallel in concept. When Barack Obama's parents had him, interracial marriage was illegal, at least in the state where he was born.

At one point, women were not allowed to vote until they finally did.

To say that a law should not be reversed just because it was the 2nd amendment may not be the broadest way of thinking.

Just because it was the 2nd amendment doesn't mean we can't or shouldn't revisit it. Laws need to keep up with the state of the masses. Same gender loving people can get married today or serve in the military. None of the founding fathers ever thought that would happen either.

So because a law was made under different circumstances than it was today, its relevance is invalid? You can make that claim for basically every single development in history since the founding fathers.

Nice try but you are not dodging this one unless you simply choose to not reply. I never said that a law is invalid or irrelevant because it was made under different circumstances or time.

My statement was...
Just because it was the 2nd amendment doesn't mean we can't or shouldn't revisit it. Laws need to keep up with the state of the masses.

In other words, it may be invalid today it may not be but you have to have open dialogue about it and revisit controversial laws periodically. And I don’t mean just talk about it. Put it up to the people to vote on in a primary or presidential election or online vote by social security number. In the case of the 2nd amendment yes I believe it is now invalid.

We are talking about controversial laws not every law and bill that founding fathers passed.

Nixluva is posting triangle screen grabs, even when nobody asks - Fishmike. LOL So are we going to reference that thread like the bible now? "The thread of Wroten Page 14 post 9" - EnySpree
Cartman718
Posts: 29068
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 10/12/2007
Member: #1694
12/10/2017  3:22 PM
And by the way TPercy please note that in just that one statement it shows that these laws were written by a bunch of white men. Pretty sure minority or women opinions were not taken into account when writing them
Nixluva is posting triangle screen grabs, even when nobody asks - Fishmike. LOL So are we going to reference that thread like the bible now? "The thread of Wroten Page 14 post 9" - EnySpree
TPercy
Posts: 28010
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/5/2014
Member: #5748
12/10/2017  6:54 PM
@Cartman718 and Gustav I don't want to get into a long winded debate on this topic at the moment(because I know that it is heading in that direction and I only have the stomach for 1 of these off-topic debates on this forum)

Just know that all I am saying is that in order to be intellectually consistent, when you use the date and the circumstances surrounding a law to apply it to current times you have to apply it to all developments that exist today that were permitted under the laws of the same era you are referencing.

The Future is Bright!
TPercy
Posts: 28010
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 2/5/2014
Member: #5748
12/10/2017  6:57 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:

Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns

Thank the NRA

Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?

Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.


The NRA, both in terms of membership and finances, arn't strong...they arn't even top 100.

They have a great deal of influence, ask any member of congress.


Of course members of Congress on the opposing side of the aisle are going to blame the NRA for everything.

They write legislation for politicians, then pay them to front it.

Try again. The NRA dosen't have that much money or the membership to actually buyout politicians.

LOL did you laugh as much as I did when you wrote that?

OMG the level of ignorance is staggering

Seriously, this is just from 24 hours ago..

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/12/08/nra-hijacked-bipartisan-common-sense-gun-bill-john-feinblatt-column/930862001/

Not sure what this proves? Where does it reference how the NRA buying out politicians caused the stalling of a flawed bill?


The conceal carry bill was their baby. You really think they give this much money a year to politicians and expect nothing in return? C'mon Man.

https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/totals.php?id=D000000082

Edit: More accurate link..

https://www.opensecrets.org/outsidespending/detail.php?cycle=2016&cmte=National+Rifle+Assn


Bruh...those numbers are like pennies compared to what other groups are spending. Priorities USA and the Democratic senatorial committeee out spent almost 5 times as much they did.

A group that can spend 60 million dollars in one election cycle has a great deal of influence. Look at the second link I posted, and their success rate in electing and defeating politicians.

As I said, when you compare how much the NRA spent on the election to other groups, its not that much. Furthermore, the fact that they don't even make up the top 50(maybe 100) on lobbying hinders your point that the NRA is buying out politicians. NRA is strong, but money isn't the reason

There are exponentially more guns in the US than anywhere else in the world. This happened for one reason, the NRA spending hundreds of millions of dollars over the years to keep any serious gun control legislation from emerging.

You really think they didnt play a big part? I could have Wayne LePierre tell you how successful they are and you would find a way to rationalize it. Just because they arent the biggest, doesnt mean they arent wildly successful, look at the results. Think about how much more they are spending than gun control advocates.


Or maybe Americans just love their guns? Although gun ownership is at a low almost 40% of adults own a gun. Thats a lot.
The Future is Bright!
Cartman718
Posts: 29068
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 10/12/2007
Member: #1694
12/11/2017  1:06 AM
TPercy wrote:@Cartman718 and Gustav I don't want to get into a long winded debate on this topic at the moment(because I know that it is heading in that direction and I only have the stomach for 1 of these off-topic debates on this forum)

Just know that all I am saying is that in order to be intellectually consistent, when you use the date and the circumstances surrounding a law to apply it to current times you have to apply it to all developments that exist today that were permitted under the laws of the same era you are referencing.

you are somehow suggesting (correct me if i am wrong), that if the circumstances of the time allowed great developments that exist today, that
a. It is somehow the best path with no room for improvement
b. That if they (founding fathers) got some things right, then they must have gotten all things right.

Nixluva is posting triangle screen grabs, even when nobody asks - Fishmike. LOL So are we going to reference that thread like the bible now? "The thread of Wroten Page 14 post 9" - EnySpree
GustavBahler
Posts: 42187
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186
12/11/2017  12:44 PM
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TPercy wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
Gudris wrote:

Yes part of United States is horrible. True. Guns sck I hate guns

Thank the NRA

Ignorance at its finest. Is the NRA killing all those people?

Is this some lame variation on "Guns dont kill people, people kill people"?

They fight every piece of gun control legislation, no matter how sensible. They are are nothing but a shill for gun manufacturers, that wasnt always the case.


The NRA, both in terms of membership and finances, arn't strong...they arn't even top 100.

They have a great deal of influence, ask any member of congress.


Of course members of Congress on the opposing side of the aisle are going to blame the NRA for everything.

They write legislation for politicians, then pay them to front it.

Try again. The NRA dosen't have that much money or the membership to actually buyout politicians.

LOL did you laugh as much as I did when you wrote that?

OMG the level of ignorance is staggering

Seriously, this is just from 24 hours ago..

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/12/08/nra-hijacked-bipartisan-common-sense-gun-bill-john-feinblatt-column/930862001/

Not sure what this proves? Where does it reference how the NRA buying out politicians caused the stalling of a flawed bill?


The conceal carry bill was their baby. You really think they give this much money a year to politicians and expect nothing in return? C'mon Man.

https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/totals.php?id=D000000082

Edit: More accurate link..

https://www.opensecrets.org/outsidespending/detail.php?cycle=2016&cmte=National+Rifle+Assn


Bruh...those numbers are like pennies compared to what other groups are spending. Priorities USA and the Democratic senatorial committeee out spent almost 5 times as much they did.

A group that can spend 60 million dollars in one election cycle has a great deal of influence. Look at the second link I posted, and their success rate in electing and defeating politicians.

As I said, when you compare how much the NRA spent on the election to other groups, its not that much. Furthermore, the fact that they don't even make up the top 50(maybe 100) on lobbying hinders your point that the NRA is buying out politicians. NRA is strong, but money isn't the reason

There are exponentially more guns in the US than anywhere else in the world. This happened for one reason, the NRA spending hundreds of millions of dollars over the years to keep any serious gun control legislation from emerging.

You really think they didnt play a big part? I could have Wayne LePierre tell you how successful they are and you would find a way to rationalize it. Just because they arent the biggest, doesnt mean they arent wildly successful, look at the results. Think about how much more they are spending than gun control advocates.


Or maybe Americans just love their guns? Although gun ownership is at a low almost 40% of adults own a gun. Thats a lot.

Americans would love their RPGs, if they were legal too.

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