reub wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

reub wrote:Millsap might be signing with Denver which I hope would knock them out of the running for George Hill. We might be the only ones left competing for him (plus Indiana).

I don't understans your mentality. Yes, Hill is a talented player but why are you trying to win ball games this upcoming season? We need to tank! And besides, with Hill's injury history, I want no part of him. I feel like he'll spend half the damn season injuried and the remaining half, giving us a great record.

I am not a tanker. Tanking is for losers and for cheaters. I'd rather go with a two track approach where we have a good core of veterans and another core of good young players and build a winning attitude. Losing begets losers. And George Hill would help us immediately as well as long term with his influence on young Frank.

Completely agree. Tanking is for losers. And what team has been built successfully on Tanking? Teams like golden State and San Antonio didn't tank to get curry, klay, green, kawhi etc. They drafted well later in the draft and focused on player development and building a winning culture. We need to do that. We have a core group. We need to find that mix of youth and vet leadership. Don't trade picks and add picks where possible.

NardDogNation wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

reub wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

reub wrote:Millsap might be signing with Denver which I hope would knock them out of the running for George Hill. We might be the only ones left competing for him (plus Indiana).

I don't understans your mentality. Yes, Hill is a talented player but why are you trying to win ball games this upcoming season? We need to tank! And besides, with Hill's injury history, I want no part of him. I feel like he'll spend half the damn season injuried and the remaining half, giving us a great record.

I am not a tanker. Tanking is for losers and for cheaters. I'd rather go with a two track approach where we have a good core of veterans and another core of good young players and build a winning attitude. Losing begets losers. And George Hill would help us immediately as well as long term with his influence on young Frank.

Completely agree. Tanking is for losers. And what team has been built successfully on Tanking? Teams like golden State and San Antonio didn't tank to get curry, klay, green, kawhi etc. They drafted well later in the draft and focused on player development and building a winning culture. We need to do that. We have a core group. We need to find that mix of youth and vet leadership. Don't trade picks and add picks where possible.

San Antonio most certainly did tank to get Tim Duncan and through him, everything else they did was made possible. As for the Warriors, they are the exception to the rule. Name me another team composed of middling picks that have had their success? Champions of the past have almost exclusively been headed by top 5 picks in the draft that became superstars e.g. Shaq, KG, Duncan, Jordan, Bird, Magic, Isiah Thomas, etc. Your strategy for building a contender has been incredibly rare.

reub wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

reub wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

reub wrote:Millsap might be signing with Denver which I hope would knock them out of the running for George Hill. We might be the only ones left competing for him (plus Indiana).

I don't understans your mentality. Yes, Hill is a talented player but why are you trying to win ball games this upcoming season? We need to tank! And besides, with Hill's injury history, I want no part of him. I feel like he'll spend half the damn season injuried and the remaining half, giving us a great record.

I am not a tanker. Tanking is for losers and for cheaters. I'd rather go with a two track approach where we have a good core of veterans and another core of good young players and build a winning attitude. Losing begets losers. And George Hill would help us immediately as well as long term with his influence on young Frank.

Completely agree. Tanking is for losers. And what team has been built successfully on Tanking? Teams like golden State and San Antonio didn't tank to get curry, klay, green, kawhi etc. They drafted well later in the draft and focused on player development and building a winning culture. We need to do that. We have a core group. We need to find that mix of youth and vet leadership. Don't trade picks and add picks where possible.

San Antonio most certainly did tank to get Tim Duncan and through him, everything else they did was made possible. As for the Warriors, they are the exception to the rule. Name me another team composed of middling picks that have had their success? Champions of the past have almost exclusively been headed by top 5 picks in the draft that became superstars e.g. Shaq, KG, Duncan, Jordan, Bird, Magic, Isiah Thomas, etc. Your strategy for building a contender has been incredibly rare.

Didn't the Spurs play badly that year because The Admiral was hurt? That's not the same as tanking.

Yup, completely different than tanking. You tank to get a player like porzingis anyways. We already have that player. Now you must focus on development and improving.

NardDogNation wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Lowry and Ibaka both go back to the Raptors. Taj went to Minny. Korver staying in Cleveland. The Cavs luxury tax bill will be 40 mil next year if they don't move some players.

Seems like Thibs seems intent on getting the crew from Chicago back together again. I wonder if he'd take on the balance of Noah's contract for Cole Aldrich. It'd be a major coupe for us, if so.

Knixkik wrote:

reub wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

reub wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

reub wrote:Millsap might be signing with Denver which I hope would knock them out of the running for George Hill. We might be the only ones left competing for him (plus Indiana).

I don't understans your mentality. Yes, Hill is a talented player but why are you trying to win ball games this upcoming season? We need to tank! And besides, with Hill's injury history, I want no part of him. I feel like he'll spend half the damn season injuried and the remaining half, giving us a great record.

I am not a tanker. Tanking is for losers and for cheaters. I'd rather go with a two track approach where we have a good core of veterans and another core of good young players and build a winning attitude. Losing begets losers. And George Hill would help us immediately as well as long term with his influence on young Frank.

Completely agree. Tanking is for losers. And what team has been built successfully on Tanking? Teams like golden State and San Antonio didn't tank to get curry, klay, green, kawhi etc. They drafted well later in the draft and focused on player development and building a winning culture. We need to do that. We have a core group. We need to find that mix of youth and vet leadership. Don't trade picks and add picks where possible.

San Antonio most certainly did tank to get Tim Duncan and through him, everything else they did was made possible. As for the Warriors, they are the exception to the rule. Name me another team composed of middling picks that have had their success? Champions of the past have almost exclusively been headed by top 5 picks in the draft that became superstars e.g. Shaq, KG, Duncan, Jordan, Bird, Magic, Isiah Thomas, etc. Your strategy for building a contender has been incredibly rare.

Didn't the Spurs play badly that year because The Admiral was hurt? That's not the same as tanking.

Yup, completely different than tanking. You tank to get a player like porzingis anyways. We already have that player. Now you must focus on development and improving.

You sure about that?

1996-97 Boston Celtics

One of the most notorious years for tanking was 1997. It’s widely believed that the San Antonio Spurs tanked the season by holding out David Robinson longer than necessary to secure a higher draft pick, which became the most coveted player available, Tim Duncan. In fact, to many, this is one of the most incredibly successful tank jobs in NBA history, in part because the Spurs were already a very good team, and they have won four titles and counting with Duncan leading the way. But to our knowledge, no one involved has admitted that the Spurs were tanking.

http://www.espn.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/40780/when-tankers-tell-the-truth

And we're not sure what KP can and will become. Even if he is a transcedent player, he'll need another star player next to him to form a true contender. The best way to get that caliber of player and build a sustainable winner is through the draft. And the most likely place to find that type of talent is at the top of the draft, which requires a losing record, hence the tank. I'm not saying lose games for losing sake: the idea is to give the youth as much opportunity as possible to play through their mistakes and develop skills in the process. Losing is a symptom of that but yields big returns down the line. If you recall, Kevin Durant had one of the worst plus-minus stats in the league in his first two seasons in the league....but I'm sure every team in the league wishes they had him then and now.

NardDogNation wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

reub wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

reub wrote:Millsap might be signing with Denver which I hope would knock them out of the running for George Hill. We might be the only ones left competing for him (plus Indiana).

I don't understans your mentality. Yes, Hill is a talented player but why are you trying to win ball games this upcoming season? We need to tank! And besides, with Hill's injury history, I want no part of him. I feel like he'll spend half the damn season injuried and the remaining half, giving us a great record.

I am not a tanker. Tanking is for losers and for cheaters. I'd rather go with a two track approach where we have a good core of veterans and another core of good young players and build a winning attitude. Losing begets losers. And George Hill would help us immediately as well as long term with his influence on young Frank.

Completely agree. Tanking is for losers. And what team has been built successfully on Tanking? Teams like golden State and San Antonio didn't tank to get curry, klay, green, kawhi etc. They drafted well later in the draft and focused on player development and building a winning culture. We need to do that. We have a core group. We need to find that mix of youth and vet leadership. Don't trade picks and add picks where possible.

San Antonio most certainly did tank to get Tim Duncan and through him, everything else they did was made possible. As for the Warriors, they are the exception to the rule. Name me another team composed of middling picks that have had their success? Champions of the past have almost exclusively been headed by top 5 picks in the draft that became superstars e.g. Shaq, KG, Duncan, Jordan, Bird, Magic, Isiah Thomas, etc. Your strategy for building a contender has been incredibly rare.

Yes the spurs most definitely tanked to get Tim Duncan, pop knew that Timmy was going to change the face of the franchise. He told David Robinson to take the season to recover from his injury. Pop lost games intentionally benching starters in the 4th.

As for the warriors it all starts with curry and they sucked pretty bad to get that 6th pick and also got lucky to draft Thompson,dray

The fact is every contender started with high draft picks EVERY CONTENDER. Even Cleveland drafted Kyrie. And Cleveland would not be contenders with out kyrie.

Now did we suck for KP yea and he will be the face of our franchise yes quite possibly the face of the NBA in 2 to three years . How long was Steph in the NBA before they became contenders 4-5 years?

It's all about patience KP is just a kid, Willy is just I kid, frank is just a kid. All have all star potential KP has superstar potential. One more bad year and we get another top three pick and pick doncic . We'll prob be a playoff contender give it two more years after this one and KP will be at the top of his gave dominating the NBA with a star cast in Willy,frank,doncic... and by then the top tier vets will be waiting at the front door of msg .

The word for the next two years is patience !!!

fitzfarm wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

reub wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

reub wrote:Millsap might be signing with Denver which I hope would knock them out of the running for George Hill. We might be the only ones left competing for him (plus Indiana).

I don't understans your mentality. Yes, Hill is a talented player but why are you trying to win ball games this upcoming season? We need to tank! And besides, with Hill's injury history, I want no part of him. I feel like he'll spend half the damn season injuried and the remaining half, giving us a great record.

I am not a tanker. Tanking is for losers and for cheaters. I'd rather go with a two track approach where we have a good core of veterans and another core of good young players and build a winning attitude. Losing begets losers. And George Hill would help us immediately as well as long term with his influence on young Frank.

Completely agree. Tanking is for losers. And what team has been built successfully on Tanking? Teams like golden State and San Antonio didn't tank to get curry, klay, green, kawhi etc. They drafted well later in the draft and focused on player development and building a winning culture. We need to do that. We have a core group. We need to find that mix of youth and vet leadership. Don't trade picks and add picks where possible.

San Antonio most certainly did tank to get Tim Duncan and through him, everything else they did was made possible. As for the Warriors, they are the exception to the rule. Name me another team composed of middling picks that have had their success? Champions of the past have almost exclusively been headed by top 5 picks in the draft that became superstars e.g. Shaq, KG, Duncan, Jordan, Bird, Magic, Isiah Thomas, etc. Your strategy for building a contender has been incredibly rare.

Yes the spurs most definitely tanked to get Tim Duncan, pop knew that Timmy was going to change the face of the franchise. He told David Robinson to take the season to recover from his injury. Pop lost games intentionally benching starters in the 4th.

As for the warriors it all starts with curry and they sucked pretty bad to get that 6th pick and also got lucky to draft Thompson,dray

The fact is every contender started with high draft picks EVERY CONTENDER. Even Cleveland drafted Kyrie. And Cleveland would not be contenders with out kyrie.

Now did we suck for KP yea and he will be the face of our franchise yes quite possibly the face of the NBA in 2 to three years . How long was Steph in the NBA before they became contenders 4-5 years?

It's all about patience KP is just a kid, Willy is just I kid, frank is just a kid. All have all star potential KP has superstar potential. One more bad year and we get another top three pick and pick doncic . We'll prob be a playoff contender give it two more years after this one and KP will be at the top of his gave dominating the NBA with a star cast in Willy,frank,doncic... and by then the top tier vets will be waiting at the front door of msg .

The word for the next two years is patience !!!

EXACTLY! I'm not even sure why people are interested in "winning now" with the Cavs being what they are. All we'd be getting is some bull**** consolation prize and more opportunities (via the playoffs) to potentially have one of our youth dealt a devastating injury. The focus now, like you said, should be on building through the draft and giving our youth the opportunity to hone their craft by actually playing!

And to be honest, I don't even think we are that far away from rounding our a very good core. Should Ntilikina pan out, we'd need just one hit on a top 5 caliber talent to become a looming threat in this league. If we find that guy, then I'm all for adding the types of veterans that provide more than just rest and culture for our young players. Unfortunately though, we are not in position just yet but that doesn't mean we should rush the process.....we should trust the process, lol.

NardDogNation wrote:

reub wrote:"It's this simple: for most teams, when your star player gets injured and your core players get old, you're out of luck. In the Spurs case, this happened during a year when they had a shot at grabbing Tim Duncan. In that next year, David Robinson came back as good as old, and the rest is history. However, history seems to remember this tale as a brilliant strategy, and not a connection of bad luck that compounded and resulted in a lucky outcome. Luckily, you readers now know the truth, and won't make the same mistake....right?"

http://www.boxscoregeeks.com/articles/the-myth-of-the-tanking-spurs

...they were so old in fact that the same guys on that team like David Robinson, Avery Johnson, Sean Elliot, Will Purdue, Monty Williams, Vinny Del Negro and Carl Herrera were all brought back and only won a measily 56 games the following season and a NBA title afterward, right?

But they had ROY Duncan then plus a healthy Admiral.