Posted by Allanfan20:

But if you can't accept the fact that his game is shooting, and creatiing shots, then that's your problem.

Its unfortunately not just my problem but its the knicks problem and it kills the team. We actually tried to run an offense around him. Thank god Marbury is here.

I get so much grief from fans of different teams about Houston. I am sick of sticking up for him. I cannot believe how biased Knick fans are when it comes to Houston. Its like most of us are wearing blindfolds. I never believed people when they said Knick fans are delusional about over valuing their players but now I really understand.

And like I said, he doesn't refuse to do anything else. At least he does try on defense now, and he certainly does pass. He's a solid passer at that.

We must be watching 2 completely different players because I dont see him play or try to play defense and or pass that much.

You're stating the same arguement over and over again. It's getting old.

I was afraid of that but there is nothing I can do. I say everything at once. Maybe I should post everything in small groups which might make it easier to comprehend.

The thing about Allan Houston is that while he's built like the prototypical SG, but he lacks the quickness to be truly elite. He doesn't have quick hands or quick feet.

I don't think it's that he doesn't try. His defense has improved quite a bit over the years, but he doesn't have the innate instincts to be great at it.

It's like Patrick Ewing's bad hands. As great as he was, every game he'd knock a rebound out of bounds and fumble a pass or two, resulting in extra TOs, fewer rebounds, and fewer points. It's the thing that limited him from being truly great and kept him just below the level of Hakeem.

No matter how much he'd work on the simple art of catching, you'd see these misplays.

Houston isn't as good as Ray Allen... and never was clearly better than Reggie Miller until Miller got old. However, pure shooters w/ moves remain a rarity in the NBA-- making a healthy Houston a valuable commodity.

Allan's defense has gotten worse. He's never was good at it but after the knee problems he's been terrible.

I think Allan will be a sixth man by next year, but for this upcoming season, I think he'll start. Allan doesn't get enough credit. Yes, of course he's flawed and he's not a complete player, but he is good on offense and his defense has improved (he doesn't have the quickness to play great defense, but he's got the smarts and most of the time he tries which is more than most players)...

Up until his injuries slowed him down, Allan was the one Knicks player who I felt like was still champion caliber. Not to say that he could do it by himself, but if you put him on a team like the Kings, Pistons, Lakers, Spurs or Pacers, he'd get plenty of time and make them all a lot better. The reason we've all grown to hate Allan (well not ALL of us), is that his contract makes him immovable. But have no illusions, he's a very good player and Jamal will be hard pressed to beat him out. I'd like to see Jamal try to guard Allan in practice, that will be a bit of an eye-opener.

Don't underestimate Allan's value. The same people who do this are the ones who underestimated Ewing and Oakley all those years and claimed that Starks and Mason were the future because they were more exciting. Allan is very productive, and as this thread started off by saying, as the Olympics, the NBA Finals and basketball in general has always shown: guys who can hit shots are extremely valuable and not as easy to find as you might think. Long live Allan.

I agree. Mark this down...Houston will be done after 25 games then crawford will start so it's a mute point.

Posted by Bonn1997:

Allanfan, this has gotten to a silly, very repetitive argument with one person who has a serious problem with Houston taking on anyone who says anything remotely positive about Houston. I see no point in continuing the discussion (beyond my current reply).

This is the second time you have said "silly" but you continue to keep posting on this thread. I get insulted when you call it silly. I actually feel very strongly about this. I am not going to let it go, just like I didn't let it go when people tried to tell me that the Heat had a better team than the Knicks. If you think its "silly", stop replying to me.

You want to say something remotely positive, go ahead but keep it remotely positive. Don't make Houston out to be someone he is not. Not a franchise player. Not a 2nd option either because he is too much of a 1 dimensional player. A 3rd option.

crzymdups: Most of what you said is right except the part where you said the same people underestimated Ewing and Oakley. I for one didn't give Ewing any problems. I still think Ewing was Top 3 or Top 5 greatest centers in the league. Ewing was a franchise. Houston is a 3rd option on an offense. Comparing them would be "SILLY". I would never do this.

We actually tried building an offense around Houston and his flawed game. It isn't a coincidence that this was the year the Knicks missed the playoffs for the first time in a decade plus. I blame Houston because he was the "main man" and the leading scorer and recognized as the main man.

I am very glad Marbury is here. I know for a fact that nothing will depend on Houston anymore and I am glad. I am glad to know he is going to be a 2nd or 3rd option. I am glad that this is Marbury's team now. Win or Lose, I know my favorite team in the NBA is being lead by a player with real skills.

[Edited by - Silverfuel on 08/17/2004 08:12:08]