crzymdups wrote:You ever have a boss that send you text messages? I have. The micro-manage-y kind.

You ever have a boss that tells you how to do your job? I have. The micro-manage-y kind.

What do you think telling Fisher he has to run the Triangle and listen to Phil's assistants vs Fisher's own OKC assistants equals.

It's micro-management. Still waiting to hear how that's not micro-management.

But here's the thing I think you're missing.

I was hired for a computer programming contract once.

I thought I was being hired to do . . . programming.

So I went about doing . . . programming.

I then started getting the equivalent of your "micro-management".

And it had nothing to do with programming. In fact, it was interfering with programming.

It was obvious that programming wasn't actually what they were fundamentally most interested in.

So I left and went somewhere else . . . and lived happily ever after.

Fisher apparently thought he was being hired to do one thing. Jackson thought he was being hired to do another.

Jackson wasn't "micro-managing" Fisher.

If anything . . . he was "macro-managing" Fisher to try to get him going in the OVERALL direction that Jackson had in mind.

crzymdups wrote:

wargames wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

wargames wrote:I'll say this if the plan is to tank next season Rambis makes a ton of sense. If the plan is to go to the playoffs then Vogel makes a lot of sense.

On another note

If Phil get KP and he gets Vogel I legit think we as a fanbase need to stfu going forward. I say this as a fan whose complained with the best of them. If Phil brings KP and Vogel (who fits Phil's system) to NY. While showing he is not going to panic and trade first round picks away to chase a low seed playoff run (like last trade line) is not what we normally get from our GM's. It should in the grand picture make Phil the best Knicks GM..... since Grunfeld by default.

If Phil hires Vogel, I'll stfu.

If Phil hires Rambis and the plan is to try to win games, I'm vocally opposed.

Part of having a good coach comes to attracting Free Agents, too. Rambis isn't going to bring a single guy through the door.

Free Agents want to go to a team they believe they can win with. Having a good coach is part of the sales pitch. It also helps win.

If Phil's plan is to tank again and miss the playoffs for the fourth straight season... ok. He's a patient mastermind if that's his plan.

If the plan is to tank we fans can complain while tanking though....

If the plan is to win though, yeah KP and Vogel...... That is a lot better than his peers who are trying to do the same thing in a lot of ways. I mean I mentioned Grunfeld who is currently trying to pull a Hail Mary GM play by signing Brooks probably to try and attract Durant. If Phil gets Vogel that means he got a top coach that does what Phil feels he needs from a coach..... while on vacation. He would have all the NY Media eating crow if he pulled that for the whole season.

If Phil hires Vogel from Montana, I will literally kill and eat a crow.

Why do people concern themselves with where Phil is physically? He can work from anywhere. I'm pretty sure Mills is the one who will call and set up any meetings. The franchise isn't at full stop just cuz Phil isn't in the building.

crzymdups wrote:

nixluva wrote:

callmened wrote:yep I heard. vogel is VERY old school. DEFENSE first and he likes having bigs

hey I would love it. to me hes a top 10 coach, from NJ and can handle the media. im just not sure if he wants a someone telling him what to do

Phil isn't going to be micro managing Vogel. Besides Vogel respects Phil and actually WANTS to learn from him. It's IMO a perfect match!!!

???? Where are you getting that from.

Fisher was fired because he didn't let Phil micro-manage him enough. This is on the record.

Where has Vogel said he wants to learn from Phil.

The word micro-manage is not a word that was used and i don't think ever wanted to micro-manage anyone, he just wanted to communicate with his head coach and have his head coach communicate back with him so saying he wanted to micro-manage him is absolutely ridiculous and there is no records saying he did.....at least not out of his mouth any way.

callmened wrote:yep I heard. vogel is VERY old school. DEFENSE first and he likes having bigs

hey I would love it. to me hes a top 10 coach, from NJ and can handle the media. im just not sure if he wants a someone telling him what to do

old school is not a good thing, and he has mentioned that he has a lot to learn and is going through that process.

crzymdups wrote:

martin wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Hope Phil has cell phone service in Montana.

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/daldridgetnt/status/728248569379979264

Does Phil know what cell phones are?

Well, I hope he can at least reach Charley Rosen by carrier pigeon so Charley can write an article about Vogel is a backstabbing careerist like he did for Jeff Van Gundy so we don't get mad when Vogel gets the Rockets job without so much as an interview from the Knicks.

lmao...you guys are too much

ChuckBuck wrote:Dam...Vogel practically begged to stay on too:

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/Rachel__Nichols/status/728240394174144513

Good dude, he won't have trouble landing on his feet.

Wow, what d*** move by Bird- why tell the media Vogel begged for his job? Personally I think Bird did a bad job with the roster in the offseason and I think Vogel got them to over achieve.

crzymdups wrote:

martin wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

martin wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

nixluva wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

nixluva wrote:

callmened wrote:yep I heard. vogel is VERY old school. DEFENSE first and he likes having bigs

hey I would love it. to me hes a top 10 coach, from NJ and can handle the media. im just not sure if he wants a someone telling him what to do

Phil isn't going to be micro managing Vogel. Besides Vogel respects Phil and actually WANTS to learn from him. It's IMO a perfect match!!!

???? Where are you getting that from.

Fisher was fired because he didn't let Phil micro-manage him enough. This is on the record.

Where has Vogel said he wants to learn from Phil.

Regarding Fish, he was a rookie and needed help. Also Phil didn't really go crazy if he wasn't popping up at practice but was only sending him emails.

As for Vogel there are a lot of hints that Vogel has a good view of Phil and wants to learn from him. You should know that I don't just make **** up!

As Marc Berman of the New York Post notes, Vogel and Knicks president of basketball operations Phil Jackson have some history together. Vogel was an advanced scout for the Los Angeles Lakers during the 2005-2006 season, though he says he only met Jackson once at a shootaround. In a 2013 interview, Vogel praised Jackson while talking about then-Pacers assistant Brian Shaw.

“From the standpoint of studying the NBA game, I was always a big fan of Phil Jackson and his approach,” Vogel said at the time. “Obviously, he had great players, but there were a lot of coaches with great players that didn’t win at the level he did. That was a big reason why I hired Brian Shaw. He was as close to Phil as anyone could be, and I thought I could rely on that experience, and it’s been awesome.”

To make matters more interesting, Berman spoke to a source close to Vogel who said there “could be intrigue in coaching the Knicks,” as Vogel grew up in New Jersey and some of his family members attend all of the Knicks’ home games.

http://larrybrownsports.com/basketball/frank-vogel-knicks/303304

I think he has a positive view of Phil and that could definitely help.

But we don't have much evidence that Phil doesn't micro-manage, in fact we have evidence to the contrary.

I am cautiously optimistic that it's a good fit, but I'm not gonna say Phil wants this quite yet.

If he does this, my faith will be restored in him quite a bit. We'll see what he does though.

We do? I don't remember that

See Derek Fisher who was fired for "responding to texts in one word answers," "not listening to input," "not listening to certain assistant coaches enough"

Phil said this. It's on the record. Video on knicks.com. I'm not making this up.

Fisher was fired because he didn't fall in line as a Triangle soldier enough. Phil and Rambis have said this over and over and over.

Somehow the Phil supporters here think that isn't true even though Phil has explicitly said this multiple times

Oh I've heard all of that and seen the tapes and Phil's acknowledgement of it. Still awaiting the micro-manage part.

You ever have a boss that send you text messages? I have. The micro-manage-y kind.

You ever have a boss that tells you how to do your job? I have. The micro-manage-y kind.

What do you think telling Fisher he has to run the Triangle and listen to Phil's assistants vs Fisher's own OKC assistants equals.

It's micro-management. Still waiting to hear how that's not micro-management.

You're way off on what micro-managing means. If your boss simply asks you questions about the job he hired you for isn't micro-managing. I think you're pretty much doing what the New York media does and making something that isn't that big a deal look like it's soooooooooo much more than it really is.

newyorker4ever wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

martin wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

martin wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

nixluva wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

nixluva wrote:

callmened wrote:yep I heard. vogel is VERY old school. DEFENSE first and he likes having bigs

hey I would love it. to me hes a top 10 coach, from NJ and can handle the media. im just not sure if he wants a someone telling him what to do

Phil isn't going to be micro managing Vogel. Besides Vogel respects Phil and actually WANTS to learn from him. It's IMO a perfect match!!!

???? Where are you getting that from.

Fisher was fired because he didn't let Phil micro-manage him enough. This is on the record.

Where has Vogel said he wants to learn from Phil.

Regarding Fish, he was a rookie and needed help. Also Phil didn't really go crazy if he wasn't popping up at practice but was only sending him emails.

As for Vogel there are a lot of hints that Vogel has a good view of Phil and wants to learn from him. You should know that I don't just make **** up!

As Marc Berman of the New York Post notes, Vogel and Knicks president of basketball operations Phil Jackson have some history together. Vogel was an advanced scout for the Los Angeles Lakers during the 2005-2006 season, though he says he only met Jackson once at a shootaround. In a 2013 interview, Vogel praised Jackson while talking about then-Pacers assistant Brian Shaw.

“From the standpoint of studying the NBA game, I was always a big fan of Phil Jackson and his approach,” Vogel said at the time. “Obviously, he had great players, but there were a lot of coaches with great players that didn’t win at the level he did. That was a big reason why I hired Brian Shaw. He was as close to Phil as anyone could be, and I thought I could rely on that experience, and it’s been awesome.”

To make matters more interesting, Berman spoke to a source close to Vogel who said there “could be intrigue in coaching the Knicks,” as Vogel grew up in New Jersey and some of his family members attend all of the Knicks’ home games.

http://larrybrownsports.com/basketball/frank-vogel-knicks/303304

I think he has a positive view of Phil and that could definitely help.

But we don't have much evidence that Phil doesn't micro-manage, in fact we have evidence to the contrary.

I am cautiously optimistic that it's a good fit, but I'm not gonna say Phil wants this quite yet.

If he does this, my faith will be restored in him quite a bit. We'll see what he does though.

We do? I don't remember that

See Derek Fisher who was fired for "responding to texts in one word answers," "not listening to input," "not listening to certain assistant coaches enough"

Phil said this. It's on the record. Video on knicks.com. I'm not making this up.

Fisher was fired because he didn't fall in line as a Triangle soldier enough. Phil and Rambis have said this over and over and over.

Somehow the Phil supporters here think that isn't true even though Phil has explicitly said this multiple times

Oh I've heard all of that and seen the tapes and Phil's acknowledgement of it. Still awaiting the micro-manage part.

You ever have a boss that send you text messages? I have. The micro-manage-y kind.

You ever have a boss that tells you how to do your job? I have. The micro-manage-y kind.

What do you think telling Fisher he has to run the Triangle and listen to Phil's assistants vs Fisher's own OKC assistants equals.

It's micro-management. Still waiting to hear how that's not micro-management.

You're way off on what micro-managing means. If your boss simply asks you questions about the job he hired you for isn't micro-managing. I think you're pretty much doing what the New York media does and making something that isn't that big a deal look like it's soooooooooo much more than it really is.

If you hire someone to do a job and then don't trust them to do the job, you did a bad job hiring and managing that person. This is on Phil. Whether you want to call it micro-managing or simply not managing well, Phil didn't do a good job.

That doesn't even get into the fact that Phil may or may not have been in NY at all for large parts of the season last year.

crzymdups wrote:If you hire someone to do a job and then don't trust them to do the job, you did a bad job hiring and managing that person. This is on Phil. Whether you want to call it micro-managing or simply not managing well, Phil didn't do a good job.

Fish hiring and firing is definitely on Phil, no one will dispute you about that.

crzymdups wrote:That doesn't even get into the fact that Phil may or may not have been in NY at all for large parts of the season last year.

Why would you follow up something that may or may not be completely and utterly made up by you and unrelated to anything but your distaste for something you disagree with?

I just don't want everyone to get their hopes up that we could get Vogel just to get disappointed when it doesn't happen even though it sounds like everyone's hopes are already up for that to happen. I would love to get him and it sure does seem like he would fit in New York being from Jersey and having a lot of family still there that all come to the games when the Pacers come to the Garden. It's just that i could see Phil not even interviewing him because he doesn't fit any of the criteria that Phil said he wants and we all know how stubborn Phil is.

Hopefully Phil will at the very least give the guy an interview which would mean he's at least somewhat interested. Maybe we could get Vogel, Shaw, Rambis and Blatt....lol.

Highlights:
Frank Vogel has a winning record as a Head coach. Led Pacers to the playoffs 5 out of 6 years, including two trips to the conference finals. They were knocked out 3 of those times by the big 3 Miami Heat teams. (2 of those went on to win the title) Given the sheer talent of the opponent, we can't hold it against him - on the 3rd go-around, the Pacers pushed a game 7.
* Led top-10 defensive teams each year.
* Never played in the NBA - made his mark as an advance scout and video assistant.
* Worked with Rick Pitino at Kentucky.
* Hired Brian Shaw (Phil/triangle disciple) as his lead assistant when he got the Pacer job.
* Advance Scout with the Lakers while Phil was winning championships there.
* Helped develop young Paul George and Roy Hibbert into all-stars. (Lance Stephenson was a close snub)
* Coached 2014 all star game.

Do not disappoint me. ‪#‎frankvogel‬ ‪#‎gonygonygo‬ ‪#‎nyknicks‬ ‪#‎triangle‬