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I predict that Melo will wave his no trade clause and wants out
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crzymdups
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12/8/2015  4:06 PM
I predict that Melo will average 30+ ppg in March and April like he almost always does and will keep the Knicks in contention for the 7th/8th seed til near the end of the season.
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Knixkik
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12/8/2015  4:10 PM
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:These threads start every time we lose and Melo doesn't shoot well. Nothing to see here.

while that may be happening way too often the last few years, this thread has nothing to do with just one game. Its just a prediction since I don't think that he is happy (enough) here, wants to win now, and may want out.

No need to get defensive for melo so easily.


You wouldn't have started this thread if we won the last 2 games for example, that is my point.

probably not because then Melo would not have sounded so defected and make those comments about NY.

The comments about NY were in reference to Dwill. Melo will not make a decision on his future in NY based on this game, or any other game. It is a decision that will be based on an entire year's worth of results, or multiple years, yet these topics start over each game or quote.

ChuckBuck
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12/8/2015  4:11 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/8/2015  4:11 PM
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:These threads start every time we lose and Melo doesn't shoot well. Nothing to see here.

while that may be happening way too often the last few years, this thread has nothing to do with just one game. Its just a prediction since I don't think that he is happy (enough) here, wants to win now, and may want out.

No need to get defensive for melo so easily.


You wouldn't have started this thread if we won the last 2 games for example, that is my point.

But it's been a constant the whole season. Melo hasn't played well the whole season.

KP's surpassed him already as Alpha on the team, rather easily I might add. His win shares is at .155 WS/48 while Melo's is slowly declining each game and currently at .129. Win or loss, if Melo shoots or plays well it's getting more uncommon.

And let's not start the "surgical knee repair getting back into shape" excuse now, it's been preseason and 22 games already. He is what he is at this point. Old, wrong side of prime, declining, albatross contract.

What does any of that have to do with him wanting to leave NY and waive his no-trade clause? Did you accidentally respond to the wrong quote, or are you just looking for anywhere you can possibly find to type some nonsense?

I'll take "Blind Homerism" for 1000, Alex.

I mean the writings on the wall, man. He's 31 with a ton of wear and tear, man. His game is predicated on 20 jab steps and rebounding his own misses while taking a ton of contact. He's breaking down before your eyes. Open them.

mreinman
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12/8/2015  4:11 PM
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:These threads start every time we lose and Melo doesn't shoot well. Nothing to see here.

while that may be happening way too often the last few years, this thread has nothing to do with just one game. Its just a prediction since I don't think that he is happy (enough) here, wants to win now, and may want out.

No need to get defensive for melo so easily.


You wouldn't have started this thread if we won the last 2 games for example, that is my point.

probably not because then Melo would not have sounded so defected and make those comments about NY.

The comments about NY were in reference to Dwill. Melo will not make a decision on his future in NY based on this game, or any other game. It is a decision that will be based on an entire year's worth of results, or multiple years, yet these topics start over each game or quote.

when I call AA anonymously I say that I have a friend that is really unhappy in his marriage because he drinks too much ...

so here is what phil is thinking ....
ChuckBuck
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12/8/2015  4:13 PM
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:These threads start every time we lose and Melo doesn't shoot well. Nothing to see here.

while that may be happening way too often the last few years, this thread has nothing to do with just one game. Its just a prediction since I don't think that he is happy (enough) here, wants to win now, and may want out.

No need to get defensive for melo so easily.


You wouldn't have started this thread if we won the last 2 games for example, that is my point.

probably not because then Melo would not have sounded so defected and make those comments about NY.

The comments about NY were in reference to Dwill. Melo will not make a decision on his future in NY based on this game, or any other game. It is a decision that will be based on an entire year's worth of results, or multiple years, yet these topics start over each game or quote.

when I call AA anonymously I say that I have a friend that is really unhappy in his marriage because he drinks too much ...

Yea...these threads only come up in losses...

Come on man! I've been talking about Melo waiving the No Trade Clause since before the season. I think even summer league...

DJMUSIC
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12/8/2015  4:15 PM
mreinman wrote:If any of you listened to his post game last night he was talking about why Deron looks so much better and happy.

He said:

"because he is not playing in NY. He looks much more at peace now"

Melo is getting fed up here and is starting to convince himself (possibly) that he can be happier and perhaps win somewhere else.

Phil I am sure will listen intently to offers but the market and value may not be there. Phil should have traded him right when he took over when his value was through the roof. Spilled milk ...

Melo actually gave a very good honest post game interview and this is not a thread to knock him. This is about what may be best for all parties.

I happen to agree with you,

Also not a knock on Melo you stated, I hear ya on that too
may be best ..or semi-win win if he can be dealth someplace, I am a Melo fan but realist.

However in NY he will be villanized by many , maybe in the past he brought some of it on himself
but Melo $$$ getting paid and all been a guy whom gave his best and also put NY Knicks on map again
in brief playoff success in first few seasons without a legit#2 star/superstar

So the fact is
Phil J. wont be able to trade his contract $$ easily cause NY will have to eat
some part of any deal, which s_cks,

This point isnt Melo fault, Phil J offered him $$$ as a Dolan draw
the newer direction NYK wanted to go in few short seasons ago, Phil J/Dolan made mistake of this contract $$$

Fans whom dislike Melo cannot blame him for that contract $$$
since MSG/guru's thinking about Gate profits for MSG business more than building a team
without Melo which is the point of all where we r at presently.

Team
needs now to be built around Kristos P.,
Good Luck with that !

The coaching situation is worse than MELO being here.
Other than $$$ no one can convince DJ that coach Fisher wants to be here for NBA success versus contract$ he received.
Is reason why Fisher let all his personal trash issues /marriage come into fold of a new team. *Only in NY ! egads !

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blkexec
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12/8/2015  4:21 PM
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:These threads start every time we lose and Melo doesn't shoot well. Nothing to see here.

while that may be happening way too often the last few years, this thread has nothing to do with just one game. Its just a prediction since I don't think that he is happy (enough) here, wants to win now, and may want out.

No need to get defensive for melo so easily.


You wouldn't have started this thread if we won the last 2 games for example, that is my point.

But it's been a constant the whole season. Melo hasn't played well the whole season.

KP's surpassed him already as Alpha on the team, rather easily I might add. His win shares is at .155 WS/48 while Melo's is slowly declining each game and currently at .129. Win or loss, if Melo shoots or plays well it's getting more uncommon.

And let's not start the "surgical knee repair getting back into shape" excuse now, it's been preseason and 22 games already. He is what he is at this point. Old, wrong side of prime, declining, albatross contract.

What does any of that have to do with him wanting to leave NY and waive his no-trade clause? Did you accidentally respond to the wrong quote, or are you just looking for anywhere you can possibly find to type some nonsense?

I'll take "Blind Homerism" for 1000, Alex.

I mean the writings on the wall, man. He's 31 with a ton of wear and tear, man. His game is predicated on 20 jab steps and rebounding his own misses while taking a ton of contact. He's breaking down before your eyes. Open them.

Fish, I know you think Melo was taking Mathews down low last game. But look how hard he has to work these days, just to get a bucket late in the game. His first step is slower and it's not getting any faster. Now I'm not saying trade Melo, I'm just saying put him in a better position to succeed. Melo will destroy slower and stronger players. Melo will have to put in too much work against strong but quicker SF's....J.Winslow is a rookie.....a freakin rookie.....Melo had problems against him. Winslow / Mathews / any other SF on any team is going to be tough for Melo. The triangle should help, but when push comes to shove, Melo goes back to ISO ball......Well those ISO days of dominating is not going to work for a 31 year old. Especially when you have Phil in the stands watching and Fisher staring at a player "aka" veteran leader bailing on the triangle system, going back to ISO ball......It's a bad marriage and always been a bad marriage from day one. But it's a marriage that can be fixed, if only we had the right managers around Melo.....That he respects and listens to. Hopefully Melo and Fisher will look at film and hold him accountable....We'll see next game!

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
bigbasketballs
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12/8/2015  4:21 PM
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:These threads start every time we lose and Melo doesn't shoot well. Nothing to see here.

while that may be happening way too often the last few years, this thread has nothing to do with just one game. Its just a prediction since I don't think that he is happy (enough) here, wants to win now, and may want out.

No need to get defensive for melo so easily.


You wouldn't have started this thread if we won the last 2 games for example, that is my point.

probably not because then Melo would not have sounded so defected and make those comments about NY.

they were in reference to Deron and his inability to hack it here.

If you think Melo is waiving his no trade you have payed attention to nothing that player says and does. A grumpy post game interview does not translate to life changing decisions. Please. This is nothing more than Chuckbuck's normal day dreams around 420pm

this is not just about his post game comments. what are the chances that you think that he waves the NTC to go to a contender?

Not sure that they could ever pull off a deal but I believe that melo is definitely open to waving if its the right situation.

Some of us won't see this decline or ill fit until we are trading Ewing for Glenn Rice again.

Buy low, sell high.

Don't make claims you can't keep consistent for 2 pages.

First you claim it has nothing to do with one game and it's all about Melo's peace of mind. Then you switch gears and interject it about his decline and selling high, an obvious expression of YOU wanting to get rid of him.

Melo could be traded tomorrow for all I care. But you can't even keep your story straight for a few paragraphs.

Knixkik
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12/8/2015  4:23 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/8/2015  4:25 PM
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:These threads start every time we lose and Melo doesn't shoot well. Nothing to see here.

while that may be happening way too often the last few years, this thread has nothing to do with just one game. Its just a prediction since I don't think that he is happy (enough) here, wants to win now, and may want out.

No need to get defensive for melo so easily.


You wouldn't have started this thread if we won the last 2 games for example, that is my point.

But it's been a constant the whole season. Melo hasn't played well the whole season.

KP's surpassed him already as Alpha on the team, rather easily I might add. His win shares is at .155 WS/48 while Melo's is slowly declining each game and currently at .129. Win or loss, if Melo shoots or plays well it's getting more uncommon.

And let's not start the "surgical knee repair getting back into shape" excuse now, it's been preseason and 22 games already. He is what he is at this point. Old, wrong side of prime, declining, albatross contract.

What does any of that have to do with him wanting to leave NY and waive his no-trade clause? Did you accidentally respond to the wrong quote, or are you just looking for anywhere you can possibly find to type some nonsense?

I'll take "Blind Homerism" for 1000, Alex.

I mean the writings on the wall, man. He's 31 with a ton of wear and tear, man. His game is predicated on 20 jab steps and rebounding his own misses while taking a ton of contact. He's breaking down before your eyes. Open them.

Again, nothing to do with the topic. Really pathetic you need to try to pollute every conversation. Funny thing is i don't necessary disagree with you fully, but again, that wasn't the conversation and you look foolish just throwing this around everywhere.

ChuckBuck
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12/8/2015  4:30 PM
blkexec wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:These threads start every time we lose and Melo doesn't shoot well. Nothing to see here.

while that may be happening way too often the last few years, this thread has nothing to do with just one game. Its just a prediction since I don't think that he is happy (enough) here, wants to win now, and may want out.

No need to get defensive for melo so easily.


You wouldn't have started this thread if we won the last 2 games for example, that is my point.

But it's been a constant the whole season. Melo hasn't played well the whole season.

KP's surpassed him already as Alpha on the team, rather easily I might add. His win shares is at .155 WS/48 while Melo's is slowly declining each game and currently at .129. Win or loss, if Melo shoots or plays well it's getting more uncommon.

And let's not start the "surgical knee repair getting back into shape" excuse now, it's been preseason and 22 games already. He is what he is at this point. Old, wrong side of prime, declining, albatross contract.

What does any of that have to do with him wanting to leave NY and waive his no-trade clause? Did you accidentally respond to the wrong quote, or are you just looking for anywhere you can possibly find to type some nonsense?

I'll take "Blind Homerism" for 1000, Alex.

I mean the writings on the wall, man. He's 31 with a ton of wear and tear, man. His game is predicated on 20 jab steps and rebounding his own misses while taking a ton of contact. He's breaking down before your eyes. Open them.

Fish, I know you think Melo was taking Mathews down low last game. But look how hard he has to work these days, just to get a bucket late in the game. His first step is slower and it's not getting any faster. Now I'm not saying trade Melo, I'm just saying put him in a better position to succeed. Melo will destroy slower and stronger players. Melo will have to put in too much work against strong but quicker SF's....J.Winslow is a rookie.....a freakin rookie.....Melo had problems against him. Winslow / Mathews / any other SF on any team is going to be tough for Melo. The triangle should help, but when push comes to shove, Melo goes back to ISO ball......Well those ISO days of dominating is not going to work for a 31 year old. Especially when you have Phil in the stands watching and Fisher staring at a player "aka" veteran leader bailing on the triangle system, going back to ISO ball......It's a bad marriage and always been a bad marriage from day one. But it's a marriage that can be fixed, if only we had the right managers around Melo.....That he respects and listens to. Hopefully Melo and Fisher will look at film and hold him accountable....We'll see next game!

Great post! Some great common sense on using what we're all actually seeing as opposed to what some fans "believe".

mreinman
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12/8/2015  4:35 PM
ChuckBuck wrote:
blkexec wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:These threads start every time we lose and Melo doesn't shoot well. Nothing to see here.

while that may be happening way too often the last few years, this thread has nothing to do with just one game. Its just a prediction since I don't think that he is happy (enough) here, wants to win now, and may want out.

No need to get defensive for melo so easily.


You wouldn't have started this thread if we won the last 2 games for example, that is my point.

But it's been a constant the whole season. Melo hasn't played well the whole season.

KP's surpassed him already as Alpha on the team, rather easily I might add. His win shares is at .155 WS/48 while Melo's is slowly declining each game and currently at .129. Win or loss, if Melo shoots or plays well it's getting more uncommon.

And let's not start the "surgical knee repair getting back into shape" excuse now, it's been preseason and 22 games already. He is what he is at this point. Old, wrong side of prime, declining, albatross contract.

What does any of that have to do with him wanting to leave NY and waive his no-trade clause? Did you accidentally respond to the wrong quote, or are you just looking for anywhere you can possibly find to type some nonsense?

I'll take "Blind Homerism" for 1000, Alex.

I mean the writings on the wall, man. He's 31 with a ton of wear and tear, man. His game is predicated on 20 jab steps and rebounding his own misses while taking a ton of contact. He's breaking down before your eyes. Open them.

Fish, I know you think Melo was taking Mathews down low last game. But look how hard he has to work these days, just to get a bucket late in the game. His first step is slower and it's not getting any faster. Now I'm not saying trade Melo, I'm just saying put him in a better position to succeed. Melo will destroy slower and stronger players. Melo will have to put in too much work against strong but quicker SF's....J.Winslow is a rookie.....a freakin rookie.....Melo had problems against him. Winslow / Mathews / any other SF on any team is going to be tough for Melo. The triangle should help, but when push comes to shove, Melo goes back to ISO ball......Well those ISO days of dominating is not going to work for a 31 year old. Especially when you have Phil in the stands watching and Fisher staring at a player "aka" veteran leader bailing on the triangle system, going back to ISO ball......It's a bad marriage and always been a bad marriage from day one. But it's a marriage that can be fixed, if only we had the right managers around Melo.....That he respects and listens to. Hopefully Melo and Fisher will look at film and hold him accountable....We'll see next game!

Great post! Some great common sense on using what we're all actually seeing as opposed to what some fans "believe".

yes. blkexec is actually using common sense understands the game.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
bigbasketballs
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12/8/2015  4:40 PM
mreinman wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
blkexec wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:These threads start every time we lose and Melo doesn't shoot well. Nothing to see here.

while that may be happening way too often the last few years, this thread has nothing to do with just one game. Its just a prediction since I don't think that he is happy (enough) here, wants to win now, and may want out.

No need to get defensive for melo so easily.


You wouldn't have started this thread if we won the last 2 games for example, that is my point.

But it's been a constant the whole season. Melo hasn't played well the whole season.

KP's surpassed him already as Alpha on the team, rather easily I might add. His win shares is at .155 WS/48 while Melo's is slowly declining each game and currently at .129. Win or loss, if Melo shoots or plays well it's getting more uncommon.

And let's not start the "surgical knee repair getting back into shape" excuse now, it's been preseason and 22 games already. He is what he is at this point. Old, wrong side of prime, declining, albatross contract.

What does any of that have to do with him wanting to leave NY and waive his no-trade clause? Did you accidentally respond to the wrong quote, or are you just looking for anywhere you can possibly find to type some nonsense?

I'll take "Blind Homerism" for 1000, Alex.

I mean the writings on the wall, man. He's 31 with a ton of wear and tear, man. His game is predicated on 20 jab steps and rebounding his own misses while taking a ton of contact. He's breaking down before your eyes. Open them.

Fish, I know you think Melo was taking Mathews down low last game. But look how hard he has to work these days, just to get a bucket late in the game. His first step is slower and it's not getting any faster. Now I'm not saying trade Melo, I'm just saying put him in a better position to succeed. Melo will destroy slower and stronger players. Melo will have to put in too much work against strong but quicker SF's....J.Winslow is a rookie.....a freakin rookie.....Melo had problems against him. Winslow / Mathews / any other SF on any team is going to be tough for Melo. The triangle should help, but when push comes to shove, Melo goes back to ISO ball......Well those ISO days of dominating is not going to work for a 31 year old. Especially when you have Phil in the stands watching and Fisher staring at a player "aka" veteran leader bailing on the triangle system, going back to ISO ball......It's a bad marriage and always been a bad marriage from day one. But it's a marriage that can be fixed, if only we had the right managers around Melo.....That he respects and listens to. Hopefully Melo and Fisher will look at film and hold him accountable....We'll see next game!

Great post! Some great common sense on using what we're all actually seeing as opposed to what some fans "believe".

yes. blkexec is actually using common sense understands the game.

In a thread you claim has nothing to with the topic.

You guys just aren't very skilled at this.

CrushAlot
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12/8/2015  6:10 PM
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:These threads start every time we lose and Melo doesn't shoot well. Nothing to see here.

while that may be happening way too often the last few years, this thread has nothing to do with just one game. Its just a prediction since I don't think that he is happy (enough) here, wants to win now, and may want out.

No need to get defensive for melo so easily.

THanks for posting his comments. I was curious what he had to say because the KNicks didn't meet with the press for quite awhile after the game last night. I think he is frustrated with losing and not getting calls. Not sure how you came up with your prediction based on the interview. Are you sure this isn't a wish?
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
mreinman
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12/8/2015  6:18 PM
CrushAlot wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:These threads start every time we lose and Melo doesn't shoot well. Nothing to see here.

while that may be happening way too often the last few years, this thread has nothing to do with just one game. Its just a prediction since I don't think that he is happy (enough) here, wants to win now, and may want out.

No need to get defensive for melo so easily.

THanks for posting his comments. I was curious what he had to say because the KNicks didn't meet with the press for quite awhile after the game last night. I think he is frustrated with losing and not getting calls. Not sure how you came up with your prediction based on the interview. Are you sure this isn't a wish?

I would rather him stay and buy in. We can't get the value for him that would make it worth it.

As always, I still hold out hope that phil can't actually changes him and make him a better / smarter player. I see signs but not enough to make me a believer.

I am the biggest fan of olympic melo and I think that if melo had a lowry he would be great like he was when he played with billups.

He wasted many years here with the wrong personnel and he is just not the guy who is going to or wants to facilitate.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
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12/8/2015  6:23 PM
I'm a Phil Jackson fan - so I've seen many of his teams.
This team eerily resembles the team that Kobe had late in his Laker career.
There's tremendous upside. Melo would be foolish to leave the Knicks just when things are starting to look better for the future - and it's an immediate future. There's capspace next season AND the year after that if they want. And the guys on this team are young and improving.

Melo has length, athleticism inside - and a lot of guys he can get help from.
Unfortunately for Melo, I fear he isn't a best player on a championship team type like a Kobe or Jordan etc.
I'm really hoping Porzingis can become that, because as we saw last night, when Porzingis hits his stride on O (he may be a year or two or three from that) he can be absolutely unstoppable. Most important, he is efficient, which I feel often Melo isn't.

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12/8/2015  6:31 PM
There's nothing about the offense that forces Melo to take the shots he's taking. If he wants to score in other ways in this offense they are FULLY open to him. He can have his teammates set a down screen for him to get a catch and shoot, work off curls, PnR etc. There's just no end to the options any player has in this offense. I'm tired of people talking about this as if there are hard and fast rules on how a player has to score in this offense. That's not how it works. By now as teammates they should be adding to the offense on their own. It's not like Fish is calling every set like he's JVG. The Triangle isn't that kind of offense. Players are supposed to observe what the defense is doing and know what to do in order to use that against them and beat that defense. This part takes time.

At any time any player who has the ball and the desire to run a certain action can call for it from his teammates. The guards are the ones that make the initial decision on which actions the team will get into. If Jerian wants a Drag Screen set he can signal for it at any time. Yes there are certain Automatics based on what the defense does, but there is tons of freedom to do things differently. When bringing the ball up court the guards can instruct the rest of the team as to what they want to do and Melo has that same kind of Green Light. KOQ might not be able to make that kind of decision but the guards and Melo in particular do have that kind of freedom. Problem is that they aren't always making the right decisions.

The biggest factor is the limitations on some of our players actual skills and habits. Jose COULD do a lot more than he actually does. That's 100% on Jose. It's not any limitation on the offense. So Melo can't claim to be unhappy with his role in this system. Melo quite often breaks plays and calls his own number. He literally can do whatever he wants. If he's failing or struggling it's 100% on him. He can simply chose to do some different things rather than bang his head on the wall doing the same things that aren't working for him. Personally I don't believe he feels it's the offense that is the problem but rather he's just missing shots and sometimes he's forcing shots rather than playing smart and passing the ball to an open teammate.

mreinman
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12/8/2015  6:56 PM
nixluva wrote:There's nothing about the offense that forces Melo to take the shots he's taking. If he wants to score in other ways in this offense they are FULLY open to him. He can have his teammates set a down screen for him to get a catch and shoot, work off curls, PnR etc. There's just no end to the options any player has in this offense. I'm tired of people talking about this as if there are hard and fast rules on how a player has to score in this offense. That's not how it works. By now as teammates they should be adding to the offense on their own. It's not like Fish is calling every set like he's JVG. The Triangle isn't that kind of offense. Players are supposed to observe what the defense is doing and know what to do in order to use that against them and beat that defense. This part takes time.

At any time any player who has the ball and the desire to run a certain action can call for it from his teammates. The guards are the ones that make the initial decision on which actions the team will get into. If Jerian wants a Drag Screen set he can signal for it at any time. Yes there are certain Automatics based on what the defense does, but there is tons of freedom to do things differently. When bringing the ball up court the guards can instruct the rest of the team as to what they want to do and Melo has that same kind of Green Light. KOQ might not be able to make that kind of decision but the guards and Melo in particular do have that kind of freedom. Problem is that they aren't always making the right decisions.

The biggest factor is the limitations on some of our players actual skills and habits. Jose COULD do a lot more than he actually does. That's 100% on Jose. It's not any limitation on the offense. So Melo can't claim to be unhappy with his role in this system. Melo quite often breaks plays and calls his own number. He literally can do whatever he wants. If he's failing or struggling it's 100% on him. He can simply chose to do some different things rather than bang his head on the wall doing the same things that aren't working for him. Personally I don't believe he feels it's the offense that is the problem but rather he's just missing shots and sometimes he's forcing shots rather than playing smart and passing the ball to an open teammate.

probably why kobe called it a square.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
knicks1248
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12/8/2015  7:25 PM
nixluva wrote:There's nothing about the offense that forces Melo to take the shots he's taking. If he wants to score in other ways in this offense they are FULLY open to him. He can have his teammates set a down screen for him to get a catch and shoot, work off curls, PnR etc. There's just no end to the options any player has in this offense. I'm tired of people talking about this as if there are hard and fast rules on how a player has to score in this offense. That's not how it works. By now as teammates they should be adding to the offense on their own. It's not like Fish is calling every set like he's JVG. The Triangle isn't that kind of offense. Players are supposed to observe what the defense is doing and know what to do in order to use that against them and beat that defense. This part takes time.

At any time any player who has the ball and the desire to run a certain action can call for it from his teammates. The guards are the ones that make the initial decision on which actions the team will get into. If Jerian wants a Drag Screen set he can signal for it at any time. Yes there are certain Automatics based on what the defense does, but there is tons of freedom to do things differently. When bringing the ball up court the guards can instruct the rest of the team as to what they want to do and Melo has that same kind of Green Light. KOQ might not be able to make that kind of decision but the guards and Melo in particular do have that kind of freedom. Problem is that they aren't always making the right decisions.[/

The biggest factor is the limitations on some of our players actual skills and habits. Jose COULD do a lot more than he actually does. That's 100% on Jose. It's not any limitation on the offense. So Melo can't claim to be unhappy with his role in this system. Melo quite often breaks plays and calls his own number. He literally can do whatever he wants. If he's failing or struggling it's 100% on him. He can simply chose to do some different things rather than bang his head on the wall doing the same things that aren't working for him. Personally I don't believe he feels it's the offense that is the problem but rather he's just missing shots and sometimes he's forcing shots rather than playing smart and passing the ball to an open teammate.

ya know, i agree with everything you said, but in regards to the coaching staff. There's no reason on for calderon to be a limited player, that's on the coaches(like film room one on one breaking down his flaws). He's the first one down court with the ball almost every time, in a lot of cases he can get by his (back peddling) man for a lay up or a foul. But what he does is pull up and wait for his teammates to all get in place (if they can figure out where the fck their suppose to be) so they can run the triangle, that leads to another mid range shot, not to mention the defense is set. Calderon has started and finish a fast break O times this season. Thats bad coaching.

Despite the many options the triangle has, it's also a very passive system, it's a quick thinking system, and with limited skill players, and limited practice time, you can not run that sht 80% of the game and only getting it right 50% of the time, which is why we only play 2 qtrs good most games, and were a close to 500. team

The shooting % is down for almost every individual player on the team just like last season roster. The system is limiting the players, and the players are limiting the system. It's like do we have a plan B during times when plan A is failing miserably.

If melo didn't ISO and bully his way to the basket sometimes, we have even less FTA. This system turns players into jump shooters, and AA said it in a interview the other day HE said "[b]I HAVE TO REMIND MYSELF TO BE MORE AGGRESSIVE BECAUSE YOU FALL IN LOVE WITH THE MID RANGE SHOT, AND YOU ENDED UP NEVER TAKING FT, AND I NEED TO LEAD BY EXAMPLE SO I CAN SHOW THE YOUNGER GUYS

Is this on the player or the coaching staff?

ES
nyknickzingis
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12/8/2015  7:30 PM
The thing with Melo is that he's not as good a passer as MJ/Kobe. He's playing the same role, but Kobe/MJ were able to get 6-7 assists on many nights and play the point guard type of role as well. Melo's more of a pure scoring wing, and while he's trying to pass, it's critical for the Knicks offense to be able to get a 3rd guy in there - a top 3 option who can score/create his own shot and also make plays for teammates. Our top 3 options in Melo/Porzingis/Afflalo are all wings who don't really like to play point forward or pass. If you want to make the Tri work, you need a player that can play the point forward role. It's the biggest thing missing on this team right now.

A Nicolas Batum via FA next summer would be OUTSTANDING for us.

mreinman
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12/8/2015  7:30 PM
bigbasketballs wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:These threads start every time we lose and Melo doesn't shoot well. Nothing to see here.

while that may be happening way too often the last few years, this thread has nothing to do with just one game. Its just a prediction since I don't think that he is happy (enough) here, wants to win now, and may want out.

No need to get defensive for melo so easily.


You wouldn't have started this thread if we won the last 2 games for example, that is my point.

probably not because then Melo would not have sounded so defected and make those comments about NY.

they were in reference to Deron and his inability to hack it here.

If you think Melo is waiving his no trade you have payed attention to nothing that player says and does. A grumpy post game interview does not translate to life changing decisions. Please. This is nothing more than Chuckbuck's normal day dreams around 420pm

this is not just about his post game comments. what are the chances that you think that he waves the NTC to go to a contender?

Not sure that they could ever pull off a deal but I believe that melo is definitely open to waving if its the right situation.

Some of us won't see this decline or ill fit until we are trading Ewing for Glenn Rice again.

Buy low, sell high.

Don't make claims you can't keep consistent for 2 pages.

First you claim it has nothing to do with one game and it's all about Melo's peace of mind. Then you switch gears and interject it about his decline and selling high, an obvious expression of YOU wanting to get rid of him.

Melo could be traded tomorrow for all I care. But you can't even keep your story straight for a few paragraphs.

If you don't like my posts or my consistency, just ignore and move on.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
I predict that Melo will wave his no trade clause and wants out

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