blkexec wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:I sorry for being insulting, and I know OK4 is not known for his jumpers... and I don't necessarily want OK4, BUT

some of you guy are totally ignorant about the drill he was being put through!

They are making him do the hesitation movement, that is why the shot is not pure.

He is supposed to be doing a quick fake to put an opponent off balance before he shoots. Dribble-stop-pump fake-shot. I'm 5'10" and used to do this all the time if I ever got close to the basket with a defender on me. Good way for me to get him off balance, and for a non-jumper like me, I had to do it a lot.

They are just making it more difficult for him than a simple jump shot. This is a drill designed to put him out of his comfort zone and see how he adjusts.

Still not great shooting, and a slow release, and I would have expected him to use the backboard shooting from the angle, BUT That is not the actual footwork/motion on his shot, children... not in this drill, anyway.

By the way, any of you guys actually play the game? Never played in a league, but I played in a lot of 5/5 full court games in my life, and even more half-court stuff.

Totally surprised that nobody else understood the drill and the awkwardness from the shot.

Try taking a foul shot that way, and see how less accurate you are than if you go through your regular shooting motion.

Some of you guys are letting your agendas influence what you see.

Ok....i agree that some of the guys on this site are not the best ballers in the park.....but i can speak up for the ballers......i have a very nice resume. And my hesitation from the free throw line is like a layup.

Unfortunately thats not the issue with ok4.....granted i only watch 1:10 due to my bad signal. But his foot work is what the issue is.....the reason is because hes a post player with a set shot. But in this video hes forced to be a jumpshooter off the dribble. Thats not his game. But as a set shot...he can hit that jay. Hes just not a jumpshooter. His feet and shooting motion are not in sink. Its like teaching my 9 yr old to shoot of the dribble.....he will look the same way.

Hes still a legit post man....just a pure old school version. Towns and wcs shoot like they used to be a guard then had a growth spurt. Ok4 was always a big dude.....

Remembered you saying that you played in college. Me...I wrestled in college, but I've been around BB a lot, so it was pretty easy to see the drill they put him through.

There was a time when you could always tell if a guy played organized ball because of the fundamentals they absorbed. Not sure you see that much any more, although the Europeans are a bit better than we are, I think.

Awkward shot for OK4, and probably something he's not used to, but to be honest, for a guy who is not a great leaper, it should be in the tool bag.

Not a very good arc on his shot, either. I think I understand why he uses the backboard so much now- always remember how Bill Walton had trouble from the foul line, but could really use the backboard well.

Saw Mosgov get blocked by Bogut trying to execute this shot up close. Bogut didn't go for the fake.

This is the kind of drill I want to see Winslow do, by the way- he might do poorly with this kind of shot.

BRIGGS wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

blkexec wrote:Briggs....i finally realized why you make so many threads.....you only read your damn threads. Youve done that to me before. But this iscrazy. Nix posted that video multiple times....lmao

he could give 2 shyts

Heck I thought it was something new at first.

Now I know why BRIGGS seems to be ignoring points we make. He may never have saw them. LOL.
What did he think we were talking about regarding WCS jumper?

:-)

and now he is giving himself a stein window

Hes going to be a 10-7-2 player--that what i said--I would NOT draft him 4 or 6etc.. He is below Towns Okafor Russell both Euros Winslow Kaminsky so youre talking 8 max. And then personally there are other scenarios where if I could trade down and get Mickey and Fuzaro for pick if I traded down to 7 or 8 or 9 and Kaminsky was gone etc... Id prefer it by a mile to Stein. Stein should be a decent player--but I have made it clear he is not my first or tenth choice.

I hear u....and i dont knock any body's favorite pick....i actually think its a 8 man tie for the 4th spot.....but it depends on how you prefer to build your team. Defense is more consistent than offense. Especially a player that relies on jump shots.

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

blkexec wrote:Briggs....i finally realized why you make so many threads.....you only read your damn threads. Youve done that to me before. But this iscrazy. Nix posted that video multiple times....lmao

he could give 2 shyts

Heck I thought it was something new at first.

Now I know why BRIGGS seems to be ignoring points we make. He may never have saw them. LOL.
What did he think we were talking about regarding WCS jumper?

:-)

and now he is giving himself a stein window

Hes going to be a 10-7-2 player--that what i said--I would NOT draft him 4 or 6etc.. He is below Towns Okafor Russell both Euros Winslow Kaminsky so youre talking 8 max. And then personally there are other scenarios where if I could trade down and get Mickey and Fuzaro for pick if I traded down to 7 or 8 or 9 and Kaminsky was gone etc... Id prefer it by a mile to Stein. Stein should be a decent player--but I have made it clear he is not my first or tenth choice.

You still keep going on about his numbers but his real value is in how he impacts your teams defense. He's the kind of big you can build your defense around. That's his value.

WCS is up around 4-6 in mocks for a reason. Analysts feels teams right behind us are interested in WCS for his defense.

Yep, people keep saying trade down to take him, but I don't know if you can risk it- Magic and Kings have been linked to him AND you have to worry about the Celtics and Pacers trading up to get him (they could do a deal with the Magic, Kings, Nuggets or Pistons).

blkexec wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

blkexec wrote:Briggs....i finally realized why you make so many threads.....you only read your damn threads. Youve done that to me before. But this iscrazy. Nix posted that video multiple times....lmao

he could give 2 shyts

Heck I thought it was something new at first.

Now I know why BRIGGS seems to be ignoring points we make. He may never have saw them. LOL.
What did he think we were talking about regarding WCS jumper?

:-)

and now he is giving himself a stein window

Hes going to be a 10-7-2 player--that what i said--I would NOT draft him 4 or 6etc.. He is below Towns Okafor Russell both Euros Winslow Kaminsky so youre talking 8 max. And then personally there are other scenarios where if I could trade down and get Mickey and Fuzaro for pick if I traded down to 7 or 8 or 9 and Kaminsky was gone etc... Id prefer it by a mile to Stein. Stein should be a decent player--but I have made it clear he is not my first or tenth choice.

You still keep going on about his numbers but his real value is in how he impacts your teams defense. He's the kind of big you can build your defense around. That's his value.

WCS is up around 4-6 in mocks for a reason. Analysts feels teams right behind us are interested in WCS for his defense.

Yep, people keep saying trade down to take him, but I don't know if you can risk it- Magic and Kings have been linked to him AND you have to worry about the Celtics and Pacers trading up to get him (they could do a deal with the Magic, Kings, Nuggets or Pistons).

Do you trade down if you have ok4 sitting at 4?

My answer was yes.....and that was before his shooting video. That was during the hype of him being number 1. I think anybody 5 or below would give us the world for a chance at picking him that low. See who is willing to give up the farm.....There's another Dolan out there just waiting. But thats been my position from day 1 (before I knew we were drafting 4th).....Just because he drops doesn't change that for me. I rather have a combination of WCS and Kaminsky (just as an example) over ok4! Grant and Kaminsky....Payne and WCS.....Winslow and WCS......Winslow and Kaminsky.....We can play this game all day.....

Towns is the only exception.... I think he has HOF potential.

by all experts views, OK4 is "destined" to be a great. they talk about him the same way they talked about the Brow. if you have him at #4... so many people cant be wrong. you have to take him. WCS has a lower floor and so do Kaminsky and WCS... Okafor's ceiling IN ALL PROBABILITY may not be as high as Towns, but he's not going to be Oden. I am pretty sure after that and the Cleveland #1 pick debacle, teams are going to do their due diligence on all fronts... i.e. if he is picked at #4... it's because he deserved to be picked no lower than that.

fishmike wrote:First of all his handle is very good. Nice low dribble and protects the ball with his body.
Second of all the slow release is fine. He's 7'0 with a what? A 7'2 wingspan? Not a lot of dudes are making up that ground to block that shot. His biggest threat would be pesky guards like Nate Robinson sneaking behind him.
Third of all if he can hit a consistent jumper off a simple curl like that he deserves to the #4 pick.

WCS claim to fame is what? Defending the pick and roll. What single play is run more than any other combined in the NBA? The pick and roll. You combine him with another long defender who can switch.. a guy like Carroll put Galloway out there who can defend both guard spots and your on your way to a top flight defense.

Also WCS might be the best athlete in the draft. Look at the guys he's played with at KY. Every year he's been next to an all world big. Maybe he's been coasting, unchallenged. I don't know what drives this kid. I do know he's a little different and probably free spirited and often misunderstood. I don't know.... but sleeping on this guy might be a big mistake. This deserves a good long look.

I agree.....but he's in the category of high risk...high reward. Similar to Mudiay, but not as much of a bust potential. For example, if Mudiay is a bust, what does he bring to your team? If WCS is a bust, at least you know he would still be that help defender we missed since 40 year old Camby or Kenyon Martin. And you saw how they impacted our defense. OK....if he's a bust, it would've been a stretch at 4....but not by much. Now look at the opposite end....if he's a star, he has the potential to be one of the best in the draft. What if he can guard Towns, OK4 and most of the guards in the league.....On top of that, can knock down a mid range jumper, while Melo and Monroe are in the paint. Stein's upside is very high, as a solid 2way player at the most critical position in basketball....

So I agree with you....Winslow is another great option because he brings more offense.....But I'm not sure if he would impact the TEAM defense like WCS......Both will be great players and Winslow is slightly ahead right now due to his already established two way game. But if Stein improves his overall game, he will be a beast on both ends. Any improvement on offense, and you are looking at a legit NBA star in Stein. Sure, you can say this about anybody in the 1st round, but guys like Winslow, Stein, WCS, even Grant....they have that agility to impact the game at the next level, with their instincts, energy and intangles. For all the Kaminsky fans, you can put him in this same boat, as far as potential. It's a deep draft, so you can really pick and chose who to build around, without it being a reach.

crzymdups wrote:

fishmike wrote:First of all his handle is very good. Nice low dribble and protects the ball with his body.
Second of all the slow release is fine. He's 7'0 with a what? A 7'2 wingspan? Not a lot of dudes are making up that ground to block that shot. His biggest threat would be pesky guards like Nate Robinson sneaking behind him.
Third of all if he can hit a consistent jumper off a simple curl like that he deserves to the #4 pick.

WCS claim to fame is what? Defending the pick and roll. What single play is run more than any other combined in the NBA? The pick and roll. You combine him with another long defender who can switch.. a guy like Carroll put Galloway out there who can defend both guard spots and your on your way to a top flight defense.

Also WCS might be the best athlete in the draft. Look at the guys he's played with at KY. Every year he's been next to an all world big. Maybe he's been coasting, unchallenged. I don't know what drives this kid. I do know he's a little different and probably free spirited and often misunderstood. I don't know.... but sleeping on this guy might be a big mistake. This deserves a good long look.

Yeah, I agree completely.

Man, I keep going back and forth between he and Winslow at this point. I think I'd be good with either.

me too. I am ok with either one of them.

nixluva wrote:

fishmike wrote:if I had more of a team I would take Winslow, but his role is much much easier to add Ariza, Iggy, Carroll.. There are a lot of athletic wings who can play D that can be had for money. I would like to come out with an impact big or a playmaking guard from this draft. WCS is a safe pick because you know his downside of 30mpg starter who is out there to defend and run the break

YUP! WCS is my pick because he simply impacts the team the most without having to have the ball in his hands. People seem to not fully understand how important that is. While it is important to be able to score efficiently and in the flow of the offense, what separates teams in the post season is their defense. I want Phil to build the best defensive team he can. We can always add offense, but there are very few elite defensive players like WCS. He immediately plugs a lot of holes on the defense. In Free Agency we can find 2 way Wings and a scoring big to play next to him.

I don't know too many 7 ft Kenyon Martins in the draft, or available free agents.

It's all about supply and demand.

You use your supply to build around the demand.

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:why are we so interested in the guy shooting jumpers, i mean it's nice to have that in his game, but the last thing we want is not another 7 footer living on the perimeter..You don't impact the game shooting long jumpers

Well that's not all we expect him to do, but when he doesn't have the ball in his hands and teams focus on stopping our other scorers it helps if he can be an effective scorer outside of just dunks. He'll get some post touches too. It's all about WCS having a more well rounded offensive game, which makes him more dangerous in the Triangle. If he can hit a jumper defenders will have to get closer and then he can drive around them easier.

But the big men that have won championpships in phils triangle never lived on the perimeter, Shaq couldn't shoot beyond 6 ft, gasol was a solid shooter, but he lived in the paint like shaq, and longly was ok, but he to was more like 10 feet from the basket not 18 .

I also think this is a guy who's going to need a very good PG, or guards that penetrate at will and are playmakers like Jordan and kobe. In other words if you draft a player like WCS, you should already have his supporting cast in place, he's not good enough to build around