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Knicks1969
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1/15/2015  10:00 AM
mreinman wrote:
Knicks1969 wrote:Clyde said it best about Fisher and THJ; "pull him off the court? Immediately approach him to tell him what he did wrong." Clyde even said early in his career, one of his coaches did him just like Fisher is treating Hardaway; and he was not too happy about that

so fisher is doing a good job with hardaway?

The contrary

Thank God Fisher is no longer our coach, now let's get Calderon out of here:)
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fishmike
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1/15/2015  10:13 AM
lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
mreinman
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1/15/2015  11:23 AM
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
fishmike
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1/15/2015  11:44 AM
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
knicks1248
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1/15/2015  12:37 PM
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

Do they look like their developing, all of the commentators say the same thing about fish, he yanks players and doesnt say jack to them, Most good coaches will say something before the player sits, or sits the player next to him and explain what he was doing wrong..I remember Larry brown use to that with A I all the time.

I see the same exact mistakes game after game after game, nothing is changing, so no ones developing or getting better

ES
fishmike
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1/15/2015  12:49 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

Do they look like their developing, all of the commentators say the same thing about fish, he yanks players and doesnt say jack to them, Most good coaches will say something before the player sits, or sits the player next to him and explain what he was doing wrong..I remember Larry brown use to that with A I all the time.

I see the same exact mistakes game after game after game, nothing is changing, so no ones developing or getting better

So... 30 NBA games, give or take is enough sample size for you to make that call?
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
mreinman
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1/15/2015  12:58 PM
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

he will get some credit IF they develop (which they have not yet done) and he will get discredit for all the players that he made worse.

I just don't have that much confident in him since I have never been a fan of how he played the game (effort aside).

so here is what phil is thinking ....
smackeddog
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1/15/2015  12:58 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/15/2015  12:58 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

Do they look like their developing, all of the commentators say the same thing about fish, he yanks players and doesnt say jack to them, Most good coaches will say something before the player sits, or sits the player next to him and explain what he was doing wrong..I remember Larry brown use to that with A I all the time.

This isn't actually true- coaches usually have better things to do than explain their every move to players. He can always explain what they did wrong after the game, or in practice- Do you think Pat Riley and JVG explained to every player every time they benched them in a game?

mreinman
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1/15/2015  12:59 PM
fishmike wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

Do they look like their developing, all of the commentators say the same thing about fish, he yanks players and doesnt say jack to them, Most good coaches will say something before the player sits, or sits the player next to him and explain what he was doing wrong..I remember Larry brown use to that with A I all the time.

I see the same exact mistakes game after game after game, nothing is changing, so no ones developing or getting better

So... 30 NBA games, give or take is enough sample size for you to make that call?

30 games @ 5-25 will make some of us start doubting very heavily. We would probably have more wins if the players coached themselves and there was nobody on the bench.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
WaltLongmire
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1/15/2015  1:22 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

Do they look like their developing, all of the commentators say the same thing about fish, he yanks players and doesnt say jack to them, Most good coaches will say something before the player sits, or sits the player next to him and explain what he was doing wrong.I remember Larry brown use to that with A I all the time.

I see the same exact mistakes game after game after game, nothing is changing, so no ones developing or getting better


Developing players within a "system" requires all the players on the team to be part of the system. If you have guys like Anthony, THJ, Amare, and JR playing the way they want to play, you will not see progress from the newer and younger players who look to the veterans for guidance on the court.

You also have no idea what kind of communication Fisher has with the younger players after the game or in practice. The Knicks also have other coaches besides Fisher who can talk to the younger players after they come out of the game- you can't have your head coach taking time during a game to have long talks with young players while the game is still going on.

EnySpree: Can we agree to agree not to mention Phil Jackson and triangle for the rest of our lives?
smackeddog
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1/15/2015  1:26 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/15/2015  1:26 PM
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

Do they look like their developing, all of the commentators say the same thing about fish, he yanks players and doesnt say jack to them, Most good coaches will say something before the player sits, or sits the player next to him and explain what he was doing wrong..I remember Larry brown use to that with A I all the time.

I see the same exact mistakes game after game after game, nothing is changing, so no ones developing or getting better

So... 30 NBA games, give or take is enough sample size for you to make that call?

30 games @ 5-25 will make some of us start doubting very heavily. We would probably have more wins if the players coached themselves and there was nobody on the bench.

I get the doubt, but I'm staying patient for now, like I said on another thread, look at how JKidd has improved in a short space of time. I know for me, I learn most from my mistakes and messing up- it's a great learning opportunity for Fish. If he hasn't shown any improvement by this time next season, then I'll start worrying more.

Sangfroid
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1/15/2015  1:36 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

Do they look like their developing, all of the commentators say the same thing about fish, he yanks players and doesnt say jack to them, Most good coaches will say something before the player sits, or sits the player next to him and explain what he was doing wrong..I remember Larry brown use to that with A I all the time.

I see the same exact mistakes game after game after game, nothing is changing, so no ones developing or getting better

Shouldn't that lack be placed at the feet of Phil. After all, Fisher is his rookie project. 40 games into the season is really enough time to observe a coach's faults and not say something to him.

"We are playing a game. We are playing at not playing a game..."
fishmike
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1/15/2015  1:41 PM
Sangfroid wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

Do they look like their developing, all of the commentators say the same thing about fish, he yanks players and doesnt say jack to them, Most good coaches will say something before the player sits, or sits the player next to him and explain what he was doing wrong..I remember Larry brown use to that with A I all the time.

I see the same exact mistakes game after game after game, nothing is changing, so no ones developing or getting better

Shouldn't that lack be placed at the feet of Phil. After all, Fisher is his rookie project. 40 games into the season is really enough time to observe a coach's faults and not say something to him.

And the GM of the team has said its not the coaches fault. Obviously there is a motive behind that but the point is he's backed. He has all the tools to be a good coach and is widely respected by the players in the league. The GM was very forthcoming in why he DIDNT want an established guy. Maybe thats a mistake, maybe not. He certainly has alot of experience on the bench to help him. Its not like he's just winging it. Fisher's history of leadership is very good.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
mreinman
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1/15/2015  2:04 PM
fishmike wrote:
Sangfroid wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

Do they look like their developing, all of the commentators say the same thing about fish, he yanks players and doesnt say jack to them, Most good coaches will say something before the player sits, or sits the player next to him and explain what he was doing wrong..I remember Larry brown use to that with A I all the time.

I see the same exact mistakes game after game after game, nothing is changing, so no ones developing or getting better

Shouldn't that lack be placed at the feet of Phil. After all, Fisher is his rookie project. 40 games into the season is really enough time to observe a coach's faults and not say something to him.

And the GM of the team has said its not the coaches fault. Obviously there is a motive behind that but the point is he's backed. He has all the tools to be a good coach and is widely respected by the players in the league. The GM was very forthcoming in why he DIDNT want an established guy. Maybe thats a mistake, maybe not. He certainly has alot of experience on the bench to help him. Its not like he's just winging it. Fisher's history of leadership is very good.

Cleveland has given david Blatt a vote of confidence as well. That is meaningless and part of the process.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
fishmike
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1/15/2015  2:43 PM
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Sangfroid wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

Do they look like their developing, all of the commentators say the same thing about fish, he yanks players and doesnt say jack to them, Most good coaches will say something before the player sits, or sits the player next to him and explain what he was doing wrong..I remember Larry brown use to that with A I all the time.

I see the same exact mistakes game after game after game, nothing is changing, so no ones developing or getting better

Shouldn't that lack be placed at the feet of Phil. After all, Fisher is his rookie project. 40 games into the season is really enough time to observe a coach's faults and not say something to him.

And the GM of the team has said its not the coaches fault. Obviously there is a motive behind that but the point is he's backed. He has all the tools to be a good coach and is widely respected by the players in the league. The GM was very forthcoming in why he DIDNT want an established guy. Maybe thats a mistake, maybe not. He certainly has alot of experience on the bench to help him. Its not like he's just winging it. Fisher's history of leadership is very good.

Cleveland has given david Blatt a vote of confidence as well. That is meaningless and part of the process.

Who did that vote come from? When Phil Jackson says its not on the coach doesnt that carry some more weight? At least short term? That team has been super dysfunctional and right now the only thing covering up what a mess the franchise is is that Lebron wanted to come home. They have had incredibly high picks, drafted poorly, then packaged a large % of the talent on the roster for Kevin Love. They have a lot more assets than we do, but in some ways are even more dysfunctional. We complain about Melo's influence. Lebron appears to be literally running the thing and his PEDs are wearing off.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
knicks1248
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1/15/2015  3:08 PM
fishmike wrote:
Sangfroid wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

Do they look like their developing, all of the commentators say the same thing about fish, he yanks players and doesnt say jack to them, Most good coaches will say something before the player sits, or sits the player next to him and explain what he was doing wrong..I remember Larry brown use to that with A I all the time.

I see the same exact mistakes game after game after game, nothing is changing, so no ones developing or getting better

Shouldn't that lack be placed at the feet of Phil. After all, Fisher is his rookie project. 40 games into the season is really enough time to observe a coach's faults and not say something to him.

And the GM of the team has said its not the coaches fault. Obviously there is a motive behind that but the point is he's backed. He has all the tools to be a good coach and is widely respected by the players in the league. The GM was very forthcoming in why he DIDNT want an established guy. Maybe thats a mistake, maybe not. He certainly has alot of experience on the bench to help him. Its not like he's just winging it. Fisher's history of leadership is very good.

1) It's a No brainer for phil to take the blame, he's not going to throw his hand pick coach under the bus for running a system he wants to run. None of the coaching staff have had success at being head coaches, or else they would still be head coaches, especially Rambis

2)Do you every see fisher call a play, you run a triangle system, read and react. The players can't even run a fast break because they are thinking, "oh god, I got wait for the rest of my teammates to set up, so we can run our triangle, by the 3rd quarter(you wonder why that's our worst quarter) the opposing defense knows everything your going to do, and you'll see 6 or 7 straight TO's and the players lose all confidence and hope.

3)fisher may have the tools, but he is 5 yrs away from being a real head coach, just like THJ is 4 or 5 yrs away from being a real deal NBA player

4)what's the absolute worst part of all this, 85% of the damn roster will be gone, why the fck are we running a system that won't benefit anyone, Once melo sits for the last 30 games, the only players that have the slimmest chance of returning is Amare, and THJ.

40 games FISHMIKE, and we are getting worse and worse by the game. Before we were losing by single digits, now it's down right embarrassing. The losing is expected, the players believe they are going to lose, which is exactly what PHIL saw 20 games ago, and anyone who is not stuck on ping pong balls, can see, this is not the way you develop a winning mentality.


So if fisher fails Mid way through next season, your going to fire him then and start all over, cmon dude, somethings gotta give..

ES
mreinman
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1/15/2015  3:13 PM
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Sangfroid wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

Do they look like their developing, all of the commentators say the same thing about fish, he yanks players and doesnt say jack to them, Most good coaches will say something before the player sits, or sits the player next to him and explain what he was doing wrong..I remember Larry brown use to that with A I all the time.

I see the same exact mistakes game after game after game, nothing is changing, so no ones developing or getting better

Shouldn't that lack be placed at the feet of Phil. After all, Fisher is his rookie project. 40 games into the season is really enough time to observe a coach's faults and not say something to him.

And the GM of the team has said its not the coaches fault. Obviously there is a motive behind that but the point is he's backed. He has all the tools to be a good coach and is widely respected by the players in the league. The GM was very forthcoming in why he DIDNT want an established guy. Maybe thats a mistake, maybe not. He certainly has alot of experience on the bench to help him. Its not like he's just winging it. Fisher's history of leadership is very good.

Cleveland has given david Blatt a vote of confidence as well. That is meaningless and part of the process.

Who did that vote come from? When Phil Jackson says its not on the coach doesnt that carry some more weight? At least short term? That team has been super dysfunctional and right now the only thing covering up what a mess the franchise is is that Lebron wanted to come home. They have had incredibly high picks, drafted poorly, then packaged a large % of the talent on the roster for Kevin Love. They have a lot more assets than we do, but in some ways are even more dysfunctional. We complain about Melo's influence. Lebron appears to be literally running the thing and his PEDs are wearing off.

PED's hahaha. Everybody is saying that now. I just can't buy into it (for now).

Hey ... its just my own feeling about Fisher. I don't know why he got the job and I do think that he is doing a bad job and that he will not be a good coach in this league. I remember when he played and I always use to yell at the screen with his horrendous shot selection. He was NOT a smart player in my opinion. He was a respected teammate and was probably a good peoples person. NOT A UNIQUE / ADVANCED basketball mind at all!

I pity that Kerr just used Phil to get to GS. I was really hoping that it was for real but he probably had very little interest in this stupid triangle.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
Knicks1969
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1/15/2015  3:17 PM
fishmike wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:lets blame an inconsistent player on the coach. Hell, Im still pissed Riley didnt turn Hubert Davis into the next Reggie Miller. It happens. Sigh

well ... I am no fisher fan but yes. Hardaway stinks on his own account.

Whether or not Fisher can coach will not be determined by this season.. jury is out on him. But devil's advocate asks you this: Its a lost season. Lets say despite the losses Early, Galloway and Acy are keepers and turn into good rotation players. Does Fisher get any credit for their development?

Do they look like their developing, all of the commentators say the same thing about fish, he yanks players and doesnt say jack to them, Most good coaches will say something before the player sits, or sits the player next to him and explain what he was doing wrong..I remember Larry brown use to that with A I all the time.

I see the same exact mistakes game after game after game, nothing is changing, so no ones developing or getting better

So... 30 NBA games, give or take is enough sample size for you to make that call?

Hell yeah

Thank God Fisher is no longer our coach, now let's get Calderon out of here:)

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