You think OKC has bad luck and thats why they can't get over the hump, please, KD and westbrook are far from winning a championship despite playing on a talented team, same thing with The bulls and Rose..

knicks1248 wrote:

Nalod wrote:If Riles takes Melo and we get left with nothing Im gonna have to reup on my hate for him again.

Basically I hated "the decision" but thru the years the games become the forefront of whats important and Lebron evolution has been fun to watch.

Fanboy? No, just respect for what he is doing.

For melo to join "superfriends" would be taking it to another level.

What makes Lebron different than some others is he'd welcome Melo and distribute the ball accordingly. Michael Jordan was a different kind of Alpha in the vein of Kobe and not just wanted to be THE MAN, but was THE MAN. Lebron as distributer is ok with it. Fans call that as being soft but the reality is its a team game. Think back to some of JOrdans clutch moments, some of them was distributing in the finals to Wennington, or Paxon, or Kerr, etc..........this is the triangle and when Phil got into Jordans head is when Jordan got his greatness.

Bosh misses, Lebron is soft. Bosh hits the shot, Lebron is a unselfish superstar distributer. with Jordan, if you missed the shot, he'd yell at you!

I'd prefer we go the route of drafting our stars but if Lebron wants to be a knick, Im ok with that.

drafting our stars and waiting 10 yrs until they final get it

Drafting our stars is such a difficult process, with way too many variables. Drafting stars could involve recycling picks over and over for an unforseeable amount of time, like most teams who are rebuilding. If we don't resign Melo, 2015 is right here, and there will be plenty of attractive pieces available. The plan should be to add a couple of pieces, while leaving enough cap space open to add that one final piece sometime in the future.

knicks1248 wrote:It's amazing how some of you believe drafting is the way to a champioship, but won't pay attention to what kind of teams are in the finals..

You think OKC has bad luck and thats why they can't get over the hump, please, KD and westbrook are far from winning a championship despite playing on a talented team, same thing with The bulls and Rose..

Celtics draft picks and young assets got them KG and Allen. They already drafted Pierce. The glue was those "stars" pulling up Rondo who had potential to be a head case but was in the right situation as his leadershop was not there.

SAS has not had a lotto pick since Duncan. 17 years ago!!!!

Of course there are a number of teams that have build thru the draft and have not sniffed the finals!

Lets be real, you need to cultivate assets to be successful. Drafting well and then trading them is one way to accomplish this to get your stars.

I don't prescribe to the notion that we'd still have Gallo, Wilson, etc had we not done the trade. My imagination does not allow me to say otherwise how we could have done better, so I leave that alone. BUt I don't think we roll with that team for years on end., and if we did, we would have had some good draft picks and that alone changes the complextion of that roster.

If we had Aldridge and Noah, or actually played them and used them as appreciated trade bait you get far more in return.

SO my take is its not so black and white to try to build and say those that tried failed, yet its the good teams that have the stars that win. BTW, don't they become stars BECAUSE THEY WIN????

Kobe was a 13th pick!!! They traded Vlad for him. Hornets actually got a good trade for the 13th pick and Kobe said he would play abroad than in Charlotte so its never that simple, but Lakers were patient and had the gumption to go after Shaq. Can anyone see that Kobe on a team not as ambitious as the Lakers would be a "Melo" type perceived failure if they don't build around him? Or any coach not named Phil Jax is the coach?

What seperates Barkley, Karl, Stockton, Nash, Payton, etc........Are they not Melo type players? Played in teh finals (Nash semi's but was 2x MVP).

So chicken or the egg, doesn't winning kind of make you a "Star" player? Is Rudy Gay a "Star"? Is Melo a "Star"? These guys are but don't play deep enough in the playoffs frequently enough.

My take, Winning propels the star. Melo was an annointed star because of his Hype. He came out of Highschool with hype, Won with 'Cuse, and has been a big time scorer in Denver and NY. Whats missing? WINNING. I don't really blame him, few players can carry a franchise!

He does not need Lebron to win but if Lebron is out there and is able to keep a good enough team around him Melo and the knicks would have a hard time getting thru them. Like Mike and the BUlls. Melo is 30, time is ticking for him.

Build with assets. If Phil and his "Tree" can come in and enhance JR, Timmy JR, Bargs and Amare then its value added. Our problem is we don't have a trove of assets in the form of yoots or picks. Assets to get a Kevin Love!!!!!

Money can't buy you LOVE, but assets can be traded for it!!! Boston has 17 draft picks in the next 5 drafts.

Nalod wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:It's amazing how some of you believe drafting is the way to a champioship, but won't pay attention to what kind of teams are in the finals..

You think OKC has bad luck and thats why they can't get over the hump, please, KD and westbrook are far from winning a championship despite playing on a talented team, same thing with The bulls and Rose..

Celtics draft picks and young assets got them KG and Allen. They already drafted Pierce. The glue was those "stars" pulling up Rondo who had potential to be a head case but was in the right situation as his leadershop was not there.

SAS has not had a lotto pick since Duncan. 17 years ago!!!!

Of course there are a number of teams that have build thru the draft and have not sniffed the finals!

Lets be real, you need to cultivate assets to be successful. Drafting well and then trading them is one way to accomplish this to get your stars.

I don't prescribe to the notion that we'd still have Gallo, Wilson, etc had we not done the trade. My imagination does not allow me to say otherwise how we could have done better, so I leave that alone. BUt I don't think we roll with that team for years on end., and if we did, we would have had some good draft picks and that alone changes the complextion of that roster.

If we had Aldridge and Noah, or actually played them and used them as appreciated trade bait you get far more in return.

SO my take is its not so black and white to try to build and say those that tried failed, yet its the good teams that have the stars that win. BTW, don't they become stars BECAUSE THEY WIN????

Kobe was a 13th pick!!! They traded Vlad for him. Hornets actually got a good trade for the 13th pick and Kobe said he would play abroad than in Charlotte so its never that simple, but Lakers were patient and had the gumption to go after Shaq. Can anyone see that Kobe on a team not as ambitious as the Lakers would be a "Melo" type perceived failure if they don't build around him? Or any coach not named Phil Jax is the coach?

What seperates Barkley, Karl, Stockton, Nash, Payton, etc........Are they not Melo type players? Played in teh finals (Nash semi's but was 2x MVP).

So chicken or the egg, doesn't winning kind of make you a "Star" player? Is Rudy Gay a "Star"? Is Melo a "Star"? These guys are but don't play deep enough in the playoffs frequently enough.

My take, Winning propels the star. Melo was an annointed star because of his Hype. He came out of Highschool with hype, Won with 'Cuse, and has been a big time scorer in Denver and NY. Whats missing? WINNING. I don't really blame him, few players can carry a franchise!

He does not need Lebron to win but if Lebron is out there and is able to keep a good enough team around him Melo and the knicks would have a hard time getting thru them. Like Mike and the BUlls. Melo is 30, time is ticking for him.

Build with assets. If Phil and his "Tree" can come in and enhance JR, Timmy JR, Bargs and Amare then its value added. Our problem is we don't have a trove of assets in the form of yoots or picks. Assets to get a Kevin Love!!!!!

Money can't buy you LOVE, but assets can be traded for it!!! Boston has 17 draft picks in the next 5 drafts.

exactly, maybe we parlay gallo and one of our picks for a better young player, or more picks, maybe we make a trade for chris paul.. who knows, we had a lot going for us, young talent, picks, cap space.. not wanting to make the carmelo trade didn't mean we were not going to make any moves at all..

George Hill was the 26th player taken in the draft. In the System he thrived and actually put Tony Parker on the Bench!!!!

Traded to the Pacers they recieved the 15th pick and used that for Kwhai Leonard. He is only 22, think they can get a lottery pick for him now? I do.

Linsanity was born from point guard centric system. Lets say we do Linsanity but instead of off the waiver we took him the second round and kept him and he learned the system and had the benefit of not trying to survive and gettng cut for two years, but worked on his game. With a reasonable salary and his rights, we could have had a valuable player. Think Lin would have been worth a 10-15th draft pick?

Say you have that, and the 8th pick that year, with a player you might be able to trade those for a top 5 pick, or a damn good player!!!!!

Instead we trade them as picks as throw ins!!!!

Tiago Splitter is what is keeping Timmy Duncan youthful. Not many monster talented 7 footers in the league! 28th pick, 29 years old, seems to get better every year, gives you about 25 min a game, 8 pts, 6 rebs and with him gets you to the finals. Dude is not a "star" but SAS did not trade him or his rights while he got big and strong, and he is piece. Pieces add up!!! Straight up trade, he is worth a mid first round pick to a team that needs him. A few years service and appreciable asset. THats value.

Trade picks before you get them. Thats depreciable value.

George Karl was fired for not developing assets. Mosgove is the kind of player who a Splitter type player. We don't value yoots because of the "Melo" win now situation we put ourselves in. Now we are faced with a bare cubbard of assets and not much to show for it.

Not Melo's fault, just a lack of forethought as to "if we get melo, how will we surround him with tools to win"?

PHil and his Jedi's are in now. Lets hope for a change!

tkf wrote:

TeamBall wrote:

tkf wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:It's amazing how some of you believe drafting is the way to a champioship, but won't pay attention to what kind of teams are in the finals..

You think OKC has bad luck and thats why they can't get over the hump, please, KD and westbrook are far from winning a championship despite playing on a talented team, same thing with The bulls and Rose..

If they are far from winning then what are we?

Even further? Whats your point?

my point is, lets draft, it gets us closer to our goal... the thunder were already in the finals...

what was your point?

knicks1248 wrote:It's amazing how some of you believe drafting is the way to a champioship, but won't pay attention to what kind of teams are in the finals..

You think OKC has bad luck and thats why they can't get over the hump, please, KD and westbrook are far from winning a championship despite playing on a talented team, same thing with The bulls and Rose..

fitzfarm wrote:Melo also knows if he dose go to south beach he'll be one of the most hated figures in sports history. Just like Lebron and bosh. Wade not so much he's always been with the heat. The hate will always tarnish lebrons legacy because unlike Jordan or a lot of other champs out there lebron needs superstars to win, not just stars, superstars. Yes Jordan had pippen but pippen was a home grown draft pick. Lebron is a sell out and if melo goes to Miami he will be a sell out as well.... And sell out don't get any respect. Not now not ever... There careers will always be tarnished ... Ewing and Barkley will get more history written about them then Lebron.

As for Melo, I think the same will happen to him. Difference is he's already hated. Fans that were attached to the players we traded already hold that against him and the media in general has already put it in the casual fans mind that hes nothing but a fat, lazy chucker.

Lebron was a sellout leaving Clev no doubt.

Melo was not from Denver and really he just wanted to move on. He Left Denver in pretty good shape talent wise but he did Sell out his Denver fans to go to NYC!

To now be here less than 3 years and having cost us a boatload of assets to obtain him he would not be just a "Sell out" but a ****ing ManWhore piece of shyt. Granted, Knicks gladly bent over and took the trade and what ever else Denver wanted knicks to do!!!

I don't think it will Cost Melo too much as his endorsements don't seem that substancial as are some of the real stars of the NBA.