CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Was Pete Newell getting Ewing last Jordan?

Did Pete Newell get Hakeem and Shaq past Jordan? No

Knicks are 94 champions if not for Starks

shaq and hakeem were better, more accomplished centers than ewing-- that is a fact.

so far as 1994 that is open to debate but there can be no doubt that if ewing actually worked to improve his footwork in the low post that he would have been a better center than he was and stark's shooting would have not have been an issue. as it was ewing preferred the baseline fadeaway that took him away from rebounding. it was a thing of beauty but it turned him into a 7-foot jumpshooting small forward and reduced if not removed an element of dominance that the truly great players possess. that idiosyncrasy held him and his teams back.

don nelson had the right idea.

Its fun to watch those shows where the peers of ewing are asked who the toughest guy they had to play against was. Every time they say Ewing. Never heard the buck passed from starks in his 3-18 performance to Ewing because he didn't work on his footwork.

you are talking about a grocery bagger from the d-league versus a number one pick in the draft and putative franchise player.

who bears the greater responsibility for coming up short of the two?

there was a parable jesus taught, about two people giving alms, one a wealthy man and the other a poor old woman. she gave half of her money which was all of two farthings, while the wealthy man gave a very small fraction of his wealth, which, although greater than what the woman gave in gross terms, was not deemed as great a gift as what the woman gave.

dk7th wrote:

holfresh wrote:

dk7th wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Nalod wrote:

holfresh wrote:Nelson ever made it to the finals?..Did Van Gundy made it to the finals?

Van gundy did a hell of a job, can't take that away.

The notion that Ewing is a warrior saint is not accurate.

Maybe if were proactive in change sooner we could have made other moves.

Donnie Nelson was the architect of the Dallas team that did win with MVP dirk. Just saying that had we let ewing walk, or traded him for shaq imagine the possibilities?

Instead we resigned Ewing past his prime. The rest we know.

Thinking we could get Shaq was pure fantasy...Donnie and Ewing had issues..Donnie thought Ewing should play something other than center..Can't side with Donnie on that...Then he hooked up his son in Dallas, not sure if he was qualified..We should have let Ewing's contract expire later or rode with Ernie Grunfeld vision over Van Gundy...Ernie wanted to go younger with Camby and Spree...No great player want to concede their leading role...Blame Van Gundy too...

"no great player want to concede their leading role" yet the smart ones do whether they want to or not-- again for the sake of their teams. it's a team game. ewing's ego and pride kept wisdom and discretion at bay. that was a turnoff for a lot of knicks fans... as well it should be.

Like David Robinson did with Tim Duncan...Who was Tim Duncan in Ewing's case??

this is an interesting rhetorical question but instead of having one player supplanted by another-- since that is what you think happened in san antonio-- i would say that when a player had lost as much as ewing then a novel approach where there is more speed is not a bad thing. that ewing was unwilling says volumes. a wiser player would have given the coach a chance but ewing was not known for being wise or clever-- and this may have a lot to do with his being passed over for head coaching jobs too. i see a connection.

just a thought....

The fast game wasn't Ewing's game..U are asking him to except his move out of NY..Did you think we had a shot at Shaq?

holfresh wrote:

dk7th wrote:

holfresh wrote:

dk7th wrote:

holfresh wrote:

Nalod wrote:

holfresh wrote:Nelson ever made it to the finals?..Did Van Gundy made it to the finals?

Van gundy did a hell of a job, can't take that away.

The notion that Ewing is a warrior saint is not accurate.

Maybe if were proactive in change sooner we could have made other moves.

Donnie Nelson was the architect of the Dallas team that did win with MVP dirk. Just saying that had we let ewing walk, or traded him for shaq imagine the possibilities?

Instead we resigned Ewing past his prime. The rest we know.

Thinking we could get Shaq was pure fantasy...Donnie and Ewing had issues..Donnie thought Ewing should play something other than center..Can't side with Donnie on that...Then he hooked up his son in Dallas, not sure if he was qualified..We should have let Ewing's contract expire later or rode with Ernie Grunfeld vision over Van Gundy...Ernie wanted to go younger with Camby and Spree...No great player want to concede their leading role...Blame Van Gundy too...

"no great player want to concede their leading role" yet the smart ones do whether they want to or not-- again for the sake of their teams. it's a team game. ewing's ego and pride kept wisdom and discretion at bay. that was a turnoff for a lot of knicks fans... as well it should be.

Like David Robinson did with Tim Duncan...Who was Tim Duncan in Ewing's case??

this is an interesting rhetorical question but instead of having one player supplanted by another-- since that is what you think happened in san antonio-- i would say that when a player had lost as much as ewing then a novel approach where there is more speed is not a bad thing. that ewing was unwilling says volumes. a wiser player would have given the coach a chance but ewing was not known for being wise or clever-- and this may have a lot to do with his being passed over for head coaching jobs too. i see a connection.

just a thought....

The fast game wasn't Ewing's game..U are asking him to except his move out of NY..Did you think we had a shot at Shaq?

a shot at shaq? don't know. do you? nelson certainly did. he was a networker and gladhander in spite of his drinking problems. oh and in case you forgot: he also was a five-time champion with the celtics.

the fast game was not ewing's game since he was a plodder as he entered his 30s but that does not immediately mean you are punching his ticket out of new york. as it is he had far more influence on the franchise than nelson. but having a louder voice does not mean you are the wiser voice.

dk7th wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Was Pete Newell getting Ewing last Jordan?

Did Pete Newell get Hakeem and Shaq past Jordan? No

Knicks are 94 champions if not for Starks

shaq and hakeem were better, more accomplished centers than ewing-- that is a fact.

so far as 1994 that is open to debate but there can be no doubt that if ewing actually worked to improve his footwork in the low post that he would have been a better center than he was and stark's shooting would have not have been an issue. as it was ewing preferred the baseline fadeaway that took him away from rebounding. it was a thing of beauty but it turned him into a 7-foot jumpshooting small forward and reduced if not removed an element of dominance that the truly great players possess. that idiosyncrasy held him and his teams back.

don nelson had the right idea.

Its fun to watch those shows where the peers of ewing are asked who the toughest guy they had to play against was. Every time they say Ewing. Never heard the buck passed from starks in his 3-18 performance to Ewing because he didn't work on his footwork.

you are talking about a grocery bagger from the d-league versus a number one pick in the draft and putative franchise player.

who bears the greater responsibility for coming up short of the two?

there was a parable jesus taught, about two people giving alms, one a wealthy man and the other a poor old woman. she gave half of her money which was all of two farthings, while the wealthy man gave a very small fraction of his wealth, which, although greater than what the woman gave in gross terms, was not deemed as great a gift as what the woman gave.

holfresh wrote:Ewing was a great Knick..We didn't win it all but it was a great ride...I would give anything to get this team back to that ..Can't diss Ewing for the sake of Don Nelson...Ewing didn't always do what best for the team but I don't see Jeter conceding SS for the Yanks either...Ewing footwork camp??, Think I heard it all..

Agreed. Nitpicking what was an era we all yearn for now. Deep into the playoffs for over a decade straight

Finally, Ewing is the root of the Hoyas' family tree of centers. "This wouldn't have happened without Patrick," Thompson says. "He's the one who would call when he was on the road with the Knicks and ask, 'Coach, how's Zo doing? You want me to give him a call?' One of the things that is sometimes missed about Patrick is his enthusiasm for others' performances." Asked to assess Mourning's and Mutombo's NBA progress, Ewing sounds like a mentor. "They've made me proud," he says.

"You don't usually think of centers this way, but Patrick is really a gym rat," Mourning says. "He's the one that sets the tone for the rest of us, because he's always playing, always working on his game. You know that turnaround jumper he has that's so automatic now? Well, I remember when it wasn't. That shot is the result of who knows how many hours of hard work that Patrick put in after he turned pro, after he had the big contract. That's the kind of thing that makes people around here respect him so much."

Mourning and Mutombo both arrived in the NBA with surprisingly polished offensive games, thanks in part to their summer workouts during their student years against Ewing and against each other. Says Thompson, "I remember Patrick saying to me the summer before Alonzo's rookie season, 'Coach, people are going to be surprised at Zo.' I said, 'Shhh.' " Sure enough, Mourning averaged 21 points in his first pro season. Though he lost to Shaquille O'Neal in Rookie of the Year voting, some felt he was the best newcomer by season's end.

The imagine of Ewing holding his hands up in the Garden towards the New York crowd truly resembles everything Ewing was about. It was all about winning one for New York and from fans like myself perspective it was win one for Pat