tkf wrote:

misterearl wrote:Basketball is a young mans game.

You need veterans to provide maturity and a steady voice to locker room. The most poised veteran is Tyson Chandler (31), and the only one with a ring. He stays.

Toure (24) had 11 points and 6 assists and plays with passion.

Tim Hardaway Jr (21) shoots an efficient 48 per cent from the field and only needs a full season of experience.

Tyler (22) has played six games for Erie, averaging 18 points and 10 rebounds No savior, but willing to do the blue collar work that we desperately miss.

Andrea Bargnani (28) is what he is, a glorified shooting guard who has never been in a fight. He would benefit from a Summer at Rucker Park. He stays. Just because he is 7'.

That is a core of five to keep.

Everyone else can take a hike.

Everyone.

I agree basketball is a young mans game.. after that we differ

Toure murray is BLAH!!.. plays with passion? is that the best you have.. kind of like saying the ugly girl is "real nice"..

Tim Hardaway.. decent 6th man one day... not a bad player so far...

Tyler? who the heck is that dude?

Bargs is a joke..

This is not a core, and certainly not one to keep. I can pick out a better core five by randomly throwing darts at various NBA and NBDL rosters...

CrushAlot wrote:

tkf wrote:

misterearl wrote:Basketball is a young mans game.

You need veterans to provide maturity and a steady voice to locker room. The most poised veteran is Tyson Chandler (31), and the only one with a ring. He stays.

Toure (24) had 11 points and 6 assists and plays with passion.

Tim Hardaway Jr (21) shoots an efficient 48 per cent from the field and only needs a full season of experience.

Tyler (22) has played six games for Erie, averaging 18 points and 10 rebounds No savior, but willing to do the blue collar work that we desperately miss.

Andrea Bargnani (28) is what he is, a glorified shooting guard who has never been in a fight. He would benefit from a Summer at Rucker Park. He stays. Just because he is 7'.

That is a core of five to keep.

Everyone else can take a hike.

Everyone.

I agree basketball is a young mans game.. after that we differ

Toure murray is BLAH!!.. plays with passion? is that the best you have.. kind of like saying the ugly girl is "real nice"..

Tim Hardaway.. decent 6th man one day... not a bad player so far...

Tyler? who the heck is that dude?

Bargs is a joke..

This is not a core, and certainly not one to keep. I can pick out a better core five by randomly throwing darts at various NBA and NBDL rosters...

Well in regards to Murry, Clyde said that he reminded him of himself and he has improved every game he has played. Tyler is a physical freak and was considered the top player in his class after his junior year. His going overseas and skipping his senior in high school and college looks like a big mistake now. However, the guy does have talent and is an incredible physical specimen. He has a 7'5" wing span. I think you have to hope the Knicks continue in their ability to identify guys outside of the draft that can come in and contribute like Cope, Pablo, Shawne, Moz, Lin etc. All guys other than Shawne that were not drafted and ended up being contributors on the Knicks. There are plenty of areas where you can criticize the Knicks. This is one area where I think they do a really good job. I also think Grunwald was ahead of others in his plan to use the dleague and get guys that were rated very high out of high school but didn't have the anticipated success in college like C.J. Leslie.

BUT THESE guys seem like fringe players at best.. not core guys..

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

tkf wrote:

misterearl wrote:Basketball is a young mans game.

You need veterans to provide maturity and a steady voice to locker room. The most poised veteran is Tyson Chandler (31), and the only one with a ring. He stays.

Toure (24) had 11 points and 6 assists and plays with passion.

Tim Hardaway Jr (21) shoots an efficient 48 per cent from the field and only needs a full season of experience.

Tyler (22) has played six games for Erie, averaging 18 points and 10 rebounds No savior, but willing to do the blue collar work that we desperately miss.

Andrea Bargnani (28) is what he is, a glorified shooting guard who has never been in a fight. He would benefit from a Summer at Rucker Park. He stays. Just because he is 7'.

That is a core of five to keep.

Everyone else can take a hike.

Everyone.

I agree basketball is a young mans game.. after that we differ

Toure murray is BLAH!!.. plays with passion? is that the best you have.. kind of like saying the ugly girl is "real nice"..

Tim Hardaway.. decent 6th man one day... not a bad player so far...

Tyler? who the heck is that dude?

Bargs is a joke..

This is not a core, and certainly not one to keep. I can pick out a better core five by randomly throwing darts at various NBA and NBDL rosters...

Well in regards to Murry, Clyde said that he reminded him of himself and he has improved every game he has played. Tyler is a physical freak and was considered the top player in his class after his junior year. His going overseas and skipping his senior in high school and college looks like a big mistake now. However, the guy does have talent and is an incredible physical specimen. He has a 7'5" wing span. I think you have to hope the Knicks continue in their ability to identify guys outside of the draft that can come in and contribute like Cope, Pablo, Shawne, Moz, Lin etc. All guys other than Shawne that were not drafted and ended up being contributors on the Knicks. There are plenty of areas where you can criticize the Knicks. This is one area where I think they do a really good job. I also think Grunwald was ahead of others in his plan to use the dleague and get guys that were rated very high out of high school but didn't have the anticipated success in college like C.J. Leslie.

BUT THESE guys seem like fringe players at best.. not core guys..

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

tkf wrote:

misterearl wrote:Basketball is a young mans game.

You need veterans to provide maturity and a steady voice to locker room. The most poised veteran is Tyson Chandler (31), and the only one with a ring. He stays.

Toure (24) had 11 points and 6 assists and plays with passion.

Tim Hardaway Jr (21) shoots an efficient 48 per cent from the field and only needs a full season of experience.

Tyler (22) has played six games for Erie, averaging 18 points and 10 rebounds No savior, but willing to do the blue collar work that we desperately miss.

Andrea Bargnani (28) is what he is, a glorified shooting guard who has never been in a fight. He would benefit from a Summer at Rucker Park. He stays. Just because he is 7'.

That is a core of five to keep.

Everyone else can take a hike.

Everyone.

I agree basketball is a young mans game.. after that we differ

Toure murray is BLAH!!.. plays with passion? is that the best you have.. kind of like saying the ugly girl is "real nice"..

Tim Hardaway.. decent 6th man one day... not a bad player so far...

Tyler? who the heck is that dude?

Bargs is a joke..

This is not a core, and certainly not one to keep. I can pick out a better core five by randomly throwing darts at various NBA and NBDL rosters...

Well in regards to Murry, Clyde said that he reminded him of himself and he has improved every game he has played. Tyler is a physical freak and was considered the top player in his class after his junior year. His going overseas and skipping his senior in high school and college looks like a big mistake now. However, the guy does have talent and is an incredible physical specimen. He has a 7'5" wing span. I think you have to hope the Knicks continue in their ability to identify guys outside of the draft that can come in and contribute like Cope, Pablo, Shawne, Moz, Lin etc. All guys other than Shawne that were not drafted and ended up being contributors on the Knicks. There are plenty of areas where you can criticize the Knicks. This is one area where I think they do a really good job. I also think Grunwald was ahead of others in his plan to use the dleague and get guys that were rated very high out of high school but didn't have the anticipated success in college like C.J. Leslie.

BUT THESE guys seem like fringe players at best.. not core guys..

They are not supposed to be core guys and neither were the guys mentioned. They are supposed to guys found for the minimum that could blow up. The Knicks have had a lot of luck with that.

did you read what the OP stated? he is talking core guys..

these guys are marginal finds at best.. as I said, we could have had DJ augustine for peanuts.. look at his numbers since he came to chicago.. impressive..

knicks have done pretty well finding guys like copeland, lin and novak.. but a poor job keeping them, instead we seem to keep the wrong players..

guys like Torue whatever and this tyler guy are fringe NBA players, not sure if they are NBA talent, that is the truth.... we can't be talking core players with guys who are fringe NBA talent..

CrushAlot wrote:

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

tkf wrote:

misterearl wrote:Basketball is a young mans game.

You need veterans to provide maturity and a steady voice to locker room. The most poised veteran is Tyson Chandler (31), and the only one with a ring. He stays.

Toure (24) had 11 points and 6 assists and plays with passion.

Tim Hardaway Jr (21) shoots an efficient 48 per cent from the field and only needs a full season of experience.

Tyler (22) has played six games for Erie, averaging 18 points and 10 rebounds No savior, but willing to do the blue collar work that we desperately miss.

Andrea Bargnani (28) is what he is, a glorified shooting guard who has never been in a fight. He would benefit from a Summer at Rucker Park. He stays. Just because he is 7'.

That is a core of five to keep.

Everyone else can take a hike.

Everyone.

I agree basketball is a young mans game.. after that we differ

Toure murray is BLAH!!.. plays with passion? is that the best you have.. kind of like saying the ugly girl is "real nice"..

Tim Hardaway.. decent 6th man one day... not a bad player so far...

Tyler? who the heck is that dude?

Bargs is a joke..

This is not a core, and certainly not one to keep. I can pick out a better core five by randomly throwing darts at various NBA and NBDL rosters...

Well in regards to Murry, Clyde said that he reminded him of himself and he has improved every game he has played. Tyler is a physical freak and was considered the top player in his class after his junior year. His going overseas and skipping his senior in high school and college looks like a big mistake now. However, the guy does have talent and is an incredible physical specimen. He has a 7'5" wing span. I think you have to hope the Knicks continue in their ability to identify guys outside of the draft that can come in and contribute like Cope, Pablo, Shawne, Moz, Lin etc. All guys other than Shawne that were not drafted and ended up being contributors on the Knicks. There are plenty of areas where you can criticize the Knicks. This is one area where I think they do a really good job. I also think Grunwald was ahead of others in his plan to use the dleague and get guys that were rated very high out of high school but didn't have the anticipated success in college like C.J. Leslie.

BUT THESE guys seem like fringe players at best.. not core guys..

They are not supposed to be core guys and neither were the guys mentioned. They are supposed to guys found for the minimum that could blow up. The Knicks have had a lot of luck with that.

did you read what the OP stated? he is talking core guys..

these guys are marginal finds at best.. as I said, we could have had DJ augustine for peanuts.. look at his numbers since he came to chicago.. impressive..

knicks have done pretty well finding guys like copeland, lin and novak.. but a poor job keeping them, instead we seem to keep the wrong players..

guys like Torue whatever and this tyler guy are fringe NBA players, not sure if they are NBA talent, that is the truth.... we can't be talking core players with guys who are fringe NBA talent..

They are not marginal guys. Leslie and Tyler were thought to be first round picks and Tyler was a guy that probably would have gone top 5 if circumstances were different. Leslie was ranked as the 11th best player in his senior class in high school. Bringing them in on rookie league mini deals is no risk. Cope was fringe talent. Shawne was never supposed to make the team after his difficulties. Lin was cut by the rockets and told not to have his car shipped to NY by D'Antoni. Lin and Shawne went for the money which was the right thing for them. The Knicks prioritized and decided not to keep Cope. Novak was kept.

We give opportunity to players on the outside looking in because we have to. But with the exception of Lin, non of those "core" guys are solid in rotation starting players.

CJ was not drafted. What you see as a top H.S. prospect and VALUE is actually a player who really did not get that much better in college. It happens. Tyler could have been a top recruit, but he wasn't. Now they have been on the outside looking in. SOmetimes injury, sometimes maturity, sometimes lack of work ethic.

The romantic notion that guys like Shawne and Cope can make a difference is a nice story. reality is there are decent ROLE players that can be picked up from time to time IF they can get with the right coach/system. Novak in his role with MDA to spread the floor out was a great fit. With other teams he rides the pine into obscurity.

What we HOPE for with Tyler, and CJ is they can step up and fill in our need for low priced youth as we don't have much in picks.

The fan (homer) in us hopes for the best, and lighting can strike. Problem is if it does the system allows players to go to teams with cap space easier than it would be for us to hold them like Lin did. Thus we became a victim of our own success.

The solution is as plain as the goatee on Mike Woodson's chin. James Dolan, and his CAA informants, need to step aside and trust the Knicks General Manager/ President of Basketball Operations (one person) to do his job.

Committees are for sororities.

jrodmc wrote:

EnySpree wrote:I get the impression a lot of you are just superstar groupies and really don't give a damn about being a knicks fan

+1 -- signature line gold.

Do you have a sig line invention? Or an idea to improve an existing sig line?
We have been helping sig line inventors for almost 10 years!

I think I will change it in a few. Though I love my current one by rvwink lol.... don't remember him posting anymore after I made this my sig lol

misterearl wrote:What's at the core?

tkf - let me help you out. Core players are players who are unselfish, hard-working, driven and who listen without ego.

Core players are NOT me-first guys (Carmelo, JR) or guys who do not jump (*Bargnani, Stoudemire) or guys who shop their talents eagerly to the higher than highest bidder (Lin). Core players are team players who understand that wearing the uniform is a privilege (Toure Murry) and who hit the open man (THJr with reps). Core players can be trusted to be professional, no matter what, on and off the court (Pablo).

(*you cannot teach height, or the Euro step, so Bargs and Tyler get a 5 month free pass)

Everyone has talent. Core players squeeze the most from their ability. We miss core players like Chris Dudley, Charles Oakley and David Lee.

Core players make us proud and make us want them to succeed.

Give me core players or give me donuts.

that is not the definition of core players. Those are players who play the game the way you like, and I agree, but that does not make them core players... you can't build around any of these scrubs..

I find it funny. Gallo, chandler, moz, fields and picks, was not good enough for you guys... as most of you said, who wants to come play with them..

yet you are selling these scrubs as CORE players.. come on man, these guys are barely core players on a NBDL roster..

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

tkf wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

tkf wrote:

misterearl wrote:Basketball is a young mans game.

You need veterans to provide maturity and a steady voice to locker room. The most poised veteran is Tyson Chandler (31), and the only one with a ring. He stays.

Toure (24) had 11 points and 6 assists and plays with passion.

Tim Hardaway Jr (21) shoots an efficient 48 per cent from the field and only needs a full season of experience.

Tyler (22) has played six games for Erie, averaging 18 points and 10 rebounds No savior, but willing to do the blue collar work that we desperately miss.

Andrea Bargnani (28) is what he is, a glorified shooting guard who has never been in a fight. He would benefit from a Summer at Rucker Park. He stays. Just because he is 7'.

That is a core of five to keep.

Everyone else can take a hike.

Everyone.

I agree basketball is a young mans game.. after that we differ

Toure murray is BLAH!!.. plays with passion? is that the best you have.. kind of like saying the ugly girl is "real nice"..

Tim Hardaway.. decent 6th man one day... not a bad player so far...

Tyler? who the heck is that dude?

Bargs is a joke..

This is not a core, and certainly not one to keep. I can pick out a better core five by randomly throwing darts at various NBA and NBDL rosters...

Well in regards to Murry, Clyde said that he reminded him of himself and he has improved every game he has played. Tyler is a physical freak and was considered the top player in his class after his junior year. His going overseas and skipping his senior in high school and college looks like a big mistake now. However, the guy does have talent and is an incredible physical specimen. He has a 7'5" wing span. I think you have to hope the Knicks continue in their ability to identify guys outside of the draft that can come in and contribute like Cope, Pablo, Shawne, Moz, Lin etc. All guys other than Shawne that were not drafted and ended up being contributors on the Knicks. There are plenty of areas where you can criticize the Knicks. This is one area where I think they do a really good job. I also think Grunwald was ahead of others in his plan to use the dleague and get guys that were rated very high out of high school but didn't have the anticipated success in college like C.J. Leslie.

BUT THESE guys seem like fringe players at best.. not core guys..

They are not supposed to be core guys and neither were the guys mentioned. They are supposed to guys found for the minimum that could blow up. The Knicks have had a lot of luck with that.

did you read what the OP stated? he is talking core guys..

these guys are marginal finds at best.. as I said, we could have had DJ augustine for peanuts.. look at his numbers since he came to chicago.. impressive..

knicks have done pretty well finding guys like copeland, lin and novak.. but a poor job keeping them, instead we seem to keep the wrong players..

guys like Torue whatever and this tyler guy are fringe NBA players, not sure if they are NBA talent, that is the truth.... we can't be talking core players with guys who are fringe NBA talent..

They are not marginal guys. Leslie and Tyler were thought to be first round picks and Tyler was a guy that probably would have gone top 5 if circumstances were different. Leslie was ranked as the 11th best player in his senior class in high school. Bringing them in on rookie league mini deals is no risk. Cope was fringe talent. Shawne was never supposed to make the team after his difficulties. Lin was cut by the rockets and told not to have his car shipped to NY by D'Antoni. Lin and Shawne went for the money which was the right thing for them. The Knicks prioritized and decided not to keep Cope. Novak was kept.

dude they are not even NBA players I was generous calling them marginal, I don't care if they were all world in HS, that is meaningless when it comes to playing on the NBA level. I mean are you telling me we are that lucky to have a guy stashed in the D-league who is a top 5 player, yet no other team gave him a shot, and he is just waiting there for the knicks to cut JR smith brother to finally get a NBA shot? come on man...