|
Red1976
Posts: 20206
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 3/8/2013
Member: #4510
|
Bonn1997 wrote:Dagger wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Hersports85 wrote:holfresh wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:holfresh wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:holfresh wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:holfresh wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:holfresh wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:holfresh wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:Uptown wrote:yellowboy90 wrote:Before last night game he was avg 8 assist opportunities per game so its not like this is something new. Good stat. He's always been a willing passer but when's the last time Melo had a teammate that could knock down shots like Bargs? His presence will help in Melo's assist department but I think we all need to realize that Melo is a scoring forward, he's not Steve Nash....
Melo has had all-star, future HOF, and Olympian-calibre NBA teammates. It had no impact on his assist totals. Who were they and at what stage in their careers did they play with Melo..Sheed was an all star, Amare was an all star...Iverson was an all star...
Since 2006, he's had only season without a teammate appearing in the all-star game. Who are they and what year did they appear in any all star game..I bet none appeared post 2006...I loath the games we play to make a point...Chandler???..Melo should have been racking up the assist to Chandler...
No. He had at least one player appearing in the all-star game with him during the current season each year except one since 2006. I don't know if there's any clearer way to word it. You can look his teammates up on BBall reference and almost any other site can list all-star by season. And actually he should be able to get at least 1-2 assists a game to Chandler.
You can make it clearer by naming them...Most likely they aren't the type of players people would consider offensive players like Chandler...
You could do your own homework but I know you won't.
So it's Allen Iverson, Chauncey Billups, Amare Stoudemire, and Tyson Chandler.
I know you hate efficient scorers and offensive rebounding but, yes, having the league's leading offensive rebounder to grab your misses should take some pressure off. I know I'd feel less pressure if I knew there was a good chance my misses would be grabbed by my teammate. All with a caveat...Amare was an all star previously and a shell of himself when Melo arrived...
Chandler is far from an offensive weapon..
Iverson and Billup were both in decline...
All that don't matter tho, just want to prove a point that not really valid when u look at the evidence...enjoy the games... haha. I knew there would be an excuse for each one even though these players were all all-stars, Olympians, and in one case a top 5 MVP candidate during the actual seasons they played with Carmelo. Excuse??...Knicks have 2 max players, one can barely walk and that is an excuse??..Chandler is an Olympian, haha..tell that to Hibbert...Iverson top 5 MVP in 2000...Whatever... Actually, I meant Billups being a top 5 MVP candidate but you're right about Iverson too.
And that's an MVP candidate *while playing with Melo* not simply being an MVP in prime years before playing with Melo. (One correction is that he was top 6, not 5, with Melo though.)
Not many people have played with the number of Olympians, all-stars, and MVP candidates Melo has. Iverson nor Billups were in their primes when playing with Melo but that doesn't suit your argument...Chandler, your Olympian, is clumsy on offense at best and was on the Olympic team for his defense but that doesn't suit your argument as well...Why be honest and present the facts so we can draw a reasonable conclusion...Lets spin the facts to suit the ideals we are trying to support... I will have to agree with Fresh here. The only 3 names that are coming up are Billups and Iverson, both who played for my hometown team. We traded Billups because he was on the decline and when Iverson came here he was a pure shell of himself. Chandler can be named to the all star and USA team every year just because of the lack of centers. With the new format in the Allstar game he will not see many more. Seems like you, Bonn, are really trying to stretch the truth to prove your point. And lets be real.. aside from Billups, Iverson and Chandler simply made the allstar games based of their names. But i can't even take your argument serious since you had the nerve to add Stat to that list. Thought you were better than that.
No, way. None of those players made the all-star game based on their names. Billups was an MVP candidate *during the season he played with Melo* in Denver. He finished ahead of Melo in the MVP voting. And Iverson put up similar #s to what he had his whole career 25 points, 7 assists per game. I realize you'll never appreciate the value of scoring efficiency but just think about this - Chandler was producing 11 points a game while missing only 2 shots a game. Then he was giving 4 offensive rebounds a game. That's basically about 16 free points a game (at least 1 point per offensive rebound on average) with almost no cost (just 2 missed FAs and 1 TO per game). This is incorrect, you are trying to come up with the value of chandler's offensive efficiency by only considering the direct benefits and costs associated with his play. However, as in all circumstances in life where a value must be placed on an option, there is OPPORTUNITY COST to consider as well, and you cannot truly see the value of something without taking it into consideration. Chandler can score on 4/6 attempts every night and shoot 66%, but if his lack of offensive game is hurting the team by limiting the amount of options on the floor and leading to poor shots elsewhere, then clearly his FG% doesn't tell the whole story. You're trying to make chandler out to be an asset on offense when he is often a hindrance. He clogs up the lane and he is extremely predictable, he also has awful hands except on well-executed alley-oops but you didn't mention that either. I know this is off-topic, but Tyson is not much of an offensive tool.
Yeah, I'm not mentioning unsupported theory. You gotta do your homework and come up with some evidence for those claims. Can you provide evidence that the Knicks' offense is worse because of Chandler? Can you provide any evidence that what I said was wrong? It's quite easy to come up with theories suggesting what a person said is wrong. It's a lot harder to find evidence for the theories. are you really trying to defend the point that Chandler is a good (or great) offensive player ? I mean he is very limited and good in his limitations (thus hitting a good percent of his shots), but you are forgetting all about the context and just focusing on one aspect where he is good. At the maximum he is a specialist and good at it, but no way he is a threat on offense. If other players are not creating opportunities for him to score some baskets he won't ... I think you are a bit too much obsessed with "efficiency" above everything else. Statistics are not telling the whole story, reality is more complex than any model available ... Interpretation of results and statistics is a fine art. How many times in Sciences do we see the significant results of a case-control study being contradicted by another one, without good assessment by any of the authors on the potential limitations of their approach (be it sample size, design of the study, choice of the control and patients, and so on ...). I believe this is the same with statistics in sports, they won't tell the whole story. Between I really like Chandler. |
