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Melo's playoffs
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Knixkik
Posts: 35476
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USA
10/25/2013  8:41 PM
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
fishmike wrote:ESPN is garbage and hates NY sports, thats been well documented here and on the Giants, Jets, Yankees, Mets and Ranger sites as well. But sure... let that hold more water in your mind than MVP votes. Im sorry your not impressed with a scoring title, all star, the best season for the Knicks since Ewing and 3rd in MVP voting (as opposed say 13th, because while you might not be a math major Im willing to help you here 3 is much better than 13).

Your really good at the magical mix of players thats better than Melo, but you offer no other options that are even remotely better.

Would you split the $10mm between Gallo and Brandon Jennings? Who are these magical guys who are going put up the 50win seasons. Name them.

The whole argument is just "the grass is always greener." There is no alternate plan that makes us a better team, just a theory that flexibility, but nothing tangible, is a better option.

well I think it more than a theory... flexibility is always better, and there is more than enough evidence to show that you don't need carmelo to be a playoff team.... so wouldn't it be better to be just as good as we are now with flexibility?

Yes except for the fact that without him we would not have won a playoff series, won 54 games, or won the division. A broke down amare, gallo and Felton was not getting us there, and if you really believe that then I don't know what else to say.

you don't know that... Denver won 57 games after carmelo left... if you guys truly think we are a bad team without carmelo then this team needs to be blown up because you are never going to win without a good TEAM!!!

I don't care about 57 games and one playoff series..

give me 45 wins, youth, flexibility and a higher ceiling!!!


Fine you can have your 45 win team that will always have you excited for next season. I'll take a 54 win team that wins playoff series and has a better chance to compete for a title. Flexibility and youth doesn't get you wins, it just makes you giddy for all the possibilities of the future that may never happen.
AUTOADVERT
Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
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USA
10/25/2013  9:03 PM
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
fishmike wrote:ESPN is garbage and hates NY sports, thats been well documented here and on the Giants, Jets, Yankees, Mets and Ranger sites as well. But sure... let that hold more water in your mind than MVP votes. Im sorry your not impressed with a scoring title, all star, the best season for the Knicks since Ewing and 3rd in MVP voting (as opposed say 13th, because while you might not be a math major Im willing to help you here 3 is much better than 13).

Your really good at the magical mix of players thats better than Melo, but you offer no other options that are even remotely better.

Would you split the $10mm between Gallo and Brandon Jennings? Who are these magical guys who are going put up the 50win seasons. Name them.

The whole argument is just "the grass is always greener." There is no alternate plan that makes us a better team, just a theory that flexibility, but nothing tangible, is a better option.

well I think it more than a theory... flexibility is always better, and there is more than enough evidence to show that you don't need carmelo to be a playoff team.... so wouldn't it be better to be just as good as we are now with flexibility?

Yes except for the fact that without him we would not have won a playoff series, won 54 games, or won the division. A broke down amare, gallo and Felton was not getting us there, and if you really believe that then I don't know what else to say.

you don't know that... Denver won 57 games after carmelo left... if you guys truly think we are a bad team without carmelo then this team needs to be blown up because you are never going to win without a good TEAM!!!

I don't care about 57 games and one playoff series..

give me 45 wins, youth, flexibility and a higher ceiling!!!


Fine you can have your 45 win team that will always have you excited for next season. I'll take a 54 win team that wins playoff series and has a better chance to compete for a title. Flexibility and youth doesn't get you wins, it just makes you giddy for all the possibilities of the future that may never happen.

Compete for a title? Now you're stand up comedian?
Knixkik
Posts: 35476
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Member: #11
USA
10/25/2013  9:17 PM
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
fishmike wrote:ESPN is garbage and hates NY sports, thats been well documented here and on the Giants, Jets, Yankees, Mets and Ranger sites as well. But sure... let that hold more water in your mind than MVP votes. Im sorry your not impressed with a scoring title, all star, the best season for the Knicks since Ewing and 3rd in MVP voting (as opposed say 13th, because while you might not be a math major Im willing to help you here 3 is much better than 13).

Your really good at the magical mix of players thats better than Melo, but you offer no other options that are even remotely better.

Would you split the $10mm between Gallo and Brandon Jennings? Who are these magical guys who are going put up the 50win seasons. Name them.

The whole argument is just "the grass is always greener." There is no alternate plan that makes us a better team, just a theory that flexibility, but nothing tangible, is a better option.

well I think it more than a theory... flexibility is always better, and there is more than enough evidence to show that you don't need carmelo to be a playoff team.... so wouldn't it be better to be just as good as we are now with flexibility?

Yes except for the fact that without him we would not have won a playoff series, won 54 games, or won the division. A broke down amare, gallo and Felton was not getting us there, and if you really believe that then I don't know what else to say.

you don't know that... Denver won 57 games after carmelo left... if you guys truly think we are a bad team without carmelo then this team needs to be blown up because you are never going to win without a good TEAM!!!

I don't care about 57 games and one playoff series..

give me 45 wins, youth, flexibility and a higher ceiling!!!


Fine you can have your 45 win team that will always have you excited for next season. I'll take a 54 win team that wins playoff series and has a better chance to compete for a title. Flexibility and youth doesn't get you wins, it just makes you giddy for all the possibilities of the future that may never happen.

Compete for a title? Now you're stand up comedian?

All I said is better chance, as in better than a team led by gallo with flexibility as the 6th man.

CrushAlot
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10/25/2013  10:05 PM
I would love to see a post chronicling melo's teammates playoff performance since he has been in ny versus their regular season performance.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
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10/26/2013  12:21 AM    LAST EDITED: 10/26/2013  12:26 AM
Knixkik wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
fishmike wrote:ESPN is garbage and hates NY sports, thats been well documented here and on the Giants, Jets, Yankees, Mets and Ranger sites as well. But sure... let that hold more water in your mind than MVP votes. Im sorry your not impressed with a scoring title, all star, the best season for the Knicks since Ewing and 3rd in MVP voting (as opposed say 13th, because while you might not be a math major Im willing to help you here 3 is much better than 13).

Your really good at the magical mix of players thats better than Melo, but you offer no other options that are even remotely better.

Would you split the $10mm between Gallo and Brandon Jennings? Who are these magical guys who are going put up the 50win seasons. Name them.

The whole argument is just "the grass is always greener." There is no alternate plan that makes us a better team, just a theory that flexibility, but nothing tangible, is a better option.

well I think it more than a theory... flexibility is always better, and there is more than enough evidence to show that you don't need carmelo to be a playoff team.... so wouldn't it be better to be just as good as we are now with flexibility?

Yes except for the fact that without him we would not have won a playoff series, won 54 games, or won the division. A broke down amare, gallo and Felton was not getting us there, and if you really believe that then I don't know what else to say.

you don't know that... Denver won 57 games after carmelo left... if you guys truly think we are a bad team without carmelo then this team needs to be blown up because you are never going to win without a good TEAM!!!

I don't care about 57 games and one playoff series..

give me 45 wins, youth, flexibility and a higher ceiling!!!


Fine you can have your 45 win team that will always have you excited for next season. I'll take a 54 win team that wins playoff series and has a better chance to compete for a title. Flexibility and youth doesn't get you wins, it just makes you giddy for all the possibilities of the future that may never happen.

Compete for a title? Now you're stand up comedian?

All I said is better chance, as in better than a team led by gallo with flexibility as the 6th man.

Well you can get almost another max contract player just for the salary difference between Melo and Gallo.

And, even among those who wanted to keep Gallo, people weren't talking about him being the leader of the team. I kept talking about trading for and building around Harden, for example.

tkf
Posts: 36487
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Member: #87
10/26/2013  12:47 AM
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
fishmike wrote:ESPN is garbage and hates NY sports, thats been well documented here and on the Giants, Jets, Yankees, Mets and Ranger sites as well. But sure... let that hold more water in your mind than MVP votes. Im sorry your not impressed with a scoring title, all star, the best season for the Knicks since Ewing and 3rd in MVP voting (as opposed say 13th, because while you might not be a math major Im willing to help you here 3 is much better than 13).

Your really good at the magical mix of players thats better than Melo, but you offer no other options that are even remotely better.

Would you split the $10mm between Gallo and Brandon Jennings? Who are these magical guys who are going put up the 50win seasons. Name them.

The whole argument is just "the grass is always greener." There is no alternate plan that makes us a better team, just a theory that flexibility, but nothing tangible, is a better option.

well I think it more than a theory... flexibility is always better, and there is more than enough evidence to show that you don't need carmelo to be a playoff team.... so wouldn't it be better to be just as good as we are now with flexibility?

Yes except for the fact that without him we would not have won a playoff series, won 54 games, or won the division. A broke down amare, gallo and Felton was not getting us there, and if you really believe that then I don't know what else to say.

you don't know that... Denver won 57 games after carmelo left... if you guys truly think we are a bad team without carmelo then this team needs to be blown up because you are never going to win without a good TEAM!!!

I don't care about 57 games and one playoff series..

give me 45 wins, youth, flexibility and a higher ceiling!!!


Fine you can have your 45 win team that will always have you excited for next season. I'll take a 54 win team that wins playoff series and has a better chance to compete for a title. Flexibility and youth doesn't get you wins, it just makes you giddy for all the possibilities of the future that may never happen.

you just don't get it.. enjoy fantasy land, this team doesn't have a chance at a title and if you believe that, then you really don't understand basketball.. I will leave it at that..

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
tkf
Posts: 36487
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Joined: 8/13/2001
Member: #87
10/26/2013  12:48 AM
Knixkik wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
fishmike wrote:ESPN is garbage and hates NY sports, thats been well documented here and on the Giants, Jets, Yankees, Mets and Ranger sites as well. But sure... let that hold more water in your mind than MVP votes. Im sorry your not impressed with a scoring title, all star, the best season for the Knicks since Ewing and 3rd in MVP voting (as opposed say 13th, because while you might not be a math major Im willing to help you here 3 is much better than 13).

Your really good at the magical mix of players thats better than Melo, but you offer no other options that are even remotely better.

Would you split the $10mm between Gallo and Brandon Jennings? Who are these magical guys who are going put up the 50win seasons. Name them.

The whole argument is just "the grass is always greener." There is no alternate plan that makes us a better team, just a theory that flexibility, but nothing tangible, is a better option.

well I think it more than a theory... flexibility is always better, and there is more than enough evidence to show that you don't need carmelo to be a playoff team.... so wouldn't it be better to be just as good as we are now with flexibility?

Yes except for the fact that without him we would not have won a playoff series, won 54 games, or won the division. A broke down amare, gallo and Felton was not getting us there, and if you really believe that then I don't know what else to say.

you don't know that... Denver won 57 games after carmelo left... if you guys truly think we are a bad team without carmelo then this team needs to be blown up because you are never going to win without a good TEAM!!!

I don't care about 57 games and one playoff series..

give me 45 wins, youth, flexibility and a higher ceiling!!!


Fine you can have your 45 win team that will always have you excited for next season. I'll take a 54 win team that wins playoff series and has a better chance to compete for a title. Flexibility and youth doesn't get you wins, it just makes you giddy for all the possibilities of the future that may never happen.

Compete for a title? Now you're stand up comedian?

All I said is better chance, as in better than a team led by gallo with flexibility as the 6th man.

this is where I know you are losing it.. and it is getting to you.. why are you are you talking about gallo.. His team won 57 games.... whats the problem with that? you are giddy about 54 wins, they won 57

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
tkf
Posts: 36487
Alba Posts: 6
Joined: 8/13/2001
Member: #87
10/26/2013  12:49 AM
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
fishmike wrote:ESPN is garbage and hates NY sports, thats been well documented here and on the Giants, Jets, Yankees, Mets and Ranger sites as well. But sure... let that hold more water in your mind than MVP votes. Im sorry your not impressed with a scoring title, all star, the best season for the Knicks since Ewing and 3rd in MVP voting (as opposed say 13th, because while you might not be a math major Im willing to help you here 3 is much better than 13).

Your really good at the magical mix of players thats better than Melo, but you offer no other options that are even remotely better.

Would you split the $10mm between Gallo and Brandon Jennings? Who are these magical guys who are going put up the 50win seasons. Name them.

The whole argument is just "the grass is always greener." There is no alternate plan that makes us a better team, just a theory that flexibility, but nothing tangible, is a better option.

well I think it more than a theory... flexibility is always better, and there is more than enough evidence to show that you don't need carmelo to be a playoff team.... so wouldn't it be better to be just as good as we are now with flexibility?

Yes except for the fact that without him we would not have won a playoff series, won 54 games, or won the division. A broke down amare, gallo and Felton was not getting us there, and if you really believe that then I don't know what else to say.

you don't know that... Denver won 57 games after carmelo left... if you guys truly think we are a bad team without carmelo then this team needs to be blown up because you are never going to win without a good TEAM!!!

I don't care about 57 games and one playoff series..

give me 45 wins, youth, flexibility and a higher ceiling!!!


Fine you can have your 45 win team that will always have you excited for next season. I'll take a 54 win team that wins playoff series and has a better chance to compete for a title. Flexibility and youth doesn't get you wins, it just makes you giddy for all the possibilities of the future that may never happen.

Compete for a title? Now you're stand up comedian?

All I said is better chance, as in better than a team led by gallo with flexibility as the 6th man.

Well you can get almost another max contract player just for the salary difference between Melo and Gallo.

And, even among those who wanted to keep Gallo, people weren't talking about him being the leader of the team. I kept talking about trading for and building around Harden, for example.

exactly!!

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
Knixkik
Posts: 35476
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10/26/2013  1:13 AM    LAST EDITED: 10/26/2013  1:14 AM
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
fishmike wrote:ESPN is garbage and hates NY sports, thats been well documented here and on the Giants, Jets, Yankees, Mets and Ranger sites as well. But sure... let that hold more water in your mind than MVP votes. Im sorry your not impressed with a scoring title, all star, the best season for the Knicks since Ewing and 3rd in MVP voting (as opposed say 13th, because while you might not be a math major Im willing to help you here 3 is much better than 13).

Your really good at the magical mix of players thats better than Melo, but you offer no other options that are even remotely better.

Would you split the $10mm between Gallo and Brandon Jennings? Who are these magical guys who are going put up the 50win seasons. Name them.

The whole argument is just "the grass is always greener." There is no alternate plan that makes us a better team, just a theory that flexibility, but nothing tangible, is a better option.

well I think it more than a theory... flexibility is always better, and there is more than enough evidence to show that you don't need carmelo to be a playoff team.... so wouldn't it be better to be just as good as we are now with flexibility?

Yes except for the fact that without him we would not have won a playoff series, won 54 games, or won the division. A broke down amare, gallo and Felton was not getting us there, and if you really believe that then I don't know what else to say.

you don't know that... Denver won 57 games after carmelo left... if you guys truly think we are a bad team without carmelo then this team needs to be blown up because you are never going to win without a good TEAM!!!

I don't care about 57 games and one playoff series..

give me 45 wins, youth, flexibility and a higher ceiling!!!


Fine you can have your 45 win team that will always have you excited for next season. I'll take a 54 win team that wins playoff series and has a better chance to compete for a title. Flexibility and youth doesn't get you wins, it just makes you giddy for all the possibilities of the future that may never happen.

Compete for a title? Now you're stand up comedian?

All I said is better chance, as in better than a team led by gallo with flexibility as the 6th man.

this is where I know you are losing it.. and it is getting to you.. why are you are you talking about gallo.. His team won 57 games.... whats the problem with that? you are giddy about 54 wins, they won 57

Losing was what got to me. We were a losing team before Melo. Maybe we won't win a title with him, but I enjoyed the success we had last season. I won't argue with you about it, I understand you will stick to your opinion. I will just enjoy any success we have because its the most we have had in a long time. Carmelo has made this team better, that can't be argued.

Papabear
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Member: #1414

10/26/2013  4:24 AM
tkf wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
fishmike wrote:ESPN is garbage and hates NY sports, thats been well documented here and on the Giants, Jets, Yankees, Mets and Ranger sites as well. But sure... let that hold more water in your mind than MVP votes. Im sorry your not impressed with a scoring title, all star, the best season for the Knicks since Ewing and 3rd in MVP voting (as opposed say 13th, because while you might not be a math major Im willing to help you here 3 is much better than 13).

Your really good at the magical mix of players thats better than Melo, but you offer no other options that are even remotely better.

Would you split the $10mm between Gallo and Brandon Jennings? Who are these magical guys who are going put up the 50win seasons. Name them.

The whole argument is just "the grass is always greener." There is no alternate plan that makes us a better team, just a theory that flexibility, but nothing tangible, is a better option.

well I think it more than a theory... flexibility is always better, and there is more than enough evidence to show that you don't need carmelo to be a playoff team.... so wouldn't it be better to be just as good as we are now with flexibility?

Yes except for the fact that without him we would not have won a playoff series, won 54 games, or won the division. A broke down amare, gallo and Felton was not getting us there, and if you really believe that then I don't know what else to say.

you don't know that... Denver won 57 games after carmelo left... if you guys truly think we are a bad team without carmelo then this team needs to be blown up because you are never going to win without a good TEAM!!!

I don't care about 57 games and one playoff series..

give me 45 wins, youth, flexibility and a higher ceiling!!!


Fine you can have your 45 win team that will always have you excited for next season. I'll take a 54 win team that wins playoff series and has a better chance to compete for a title. Flexibility and youth doesn't get you wins, it just makes you giddy for all the possibilities of the future that may never happen.

Compete for a title? Now you're stand up comedian?

All I said is better chance, as in better than a team led by gallo with flexibility as the 6th man.

Well you can get almost another max contract player just for the salary difference between Melo and Gallo.

And, even among those who wanted to keep Gallo, people weren't talking about him being the leader of the team. I kept talking about trading for and building around Harden, for example.

exactly!!


Papabear Says

Listen!! Maybe you will learn something. Just because Hardin is doing well in Houston don't mean a thing. This is New York and a tough market. How many players in the past did we bring here and they folded with the pressure because of people like you and the press and the bright lights and party time. New York is a difficult market. We also have an owner who runs a yes man type of company. Look he wants to trade Shump because he got made at him.one of our best players so far. We kept Jr's brother who can't play. The team looks like they have no game plan. We are still fading in the third and fourth quarter and Woody can't change that. I wonder what they do at practice. The way Melo is playing now and if he don't change he won't get his 20 million and the fans and press will chase him out of New York and no one will be willing to pay him big money. The team looks like they never went to training camp.

Papabear
knickstorrents
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10/26/2013  7:46 AM
If Melo is a second option it would be good, but if he were a 3rd option then we're really talking championship level potential. He really underperforms BADLY when he is the primary option. Check out his performance in the Olympics. He played out of his mind when he didn't have to do much besides score. Ask anything more of him and the dude wilts.

This kind of player is not a max player, he's a guy you pickup in the offseason as the last piece of an already strong team. You do not build around a player like Melo if you want to win a championship.

Rose is not the answer.
Bonn1997
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10/26/2013  8:05 AM
knickstorrents wrote:If Melo is a second option it would be good, but if he were a 3rd option then we're really talking championship level potential. He really underperforms BADLY when he is the primary option. Check out his performance in the Olympics. He played out of his mind when he didn't have to do much besides score. Ask anything more of him and the dude wilts.

This kind of player is not a max player, he's a guy you pickup in the offseason as the last piece of an already strong team. You do not build around a player like Melo if you want to win a championship.


I agree. Third option would be best. Second could still work.
Bonn1997
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10/26/2013  8:07 AM    LAST EDITED: 10/26/2013  8:08 AM
Papabear wrote:
tkf wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
fishmike wrote:ESPN is garbage and hates NY sports, thats been well documented here and on the Giants, Jets, Yankees, Mets and Ranger sites as well. But sure... let that hold more water in your mind than MVP votes. Im sorry your not impressed with a scoring title, all star, the best season for the Knicks since Ewing and 3rd in MVP voting (as opposed say 13th, because while you might not be a math major Im willing to help you here 3 is much better than 13).

Your really good at the magical mix of players thats better than Melo, but you offer no other options that are even remotely better.

Would you split the $10mm between Gallo and Brandon Jennings? Who are these magical guys who are going put up the 50win seasons. Name them.

The whole argument is just "the grass is always greener." There is no alternate plan that makes us a better team, just a theory that flexibility, but nothing tangible, is a better option.

well I think it more than a theory... flexibility is always better, and there is more than enough evidence to show that you don't need carmelo to be a playoff team.... so wouldn't it be better to be just as good as we are now with flexibility?

Yes except for the fact that without him we would not have won a playoff series, won 54 games, or won the division. A broke down amare, gallo and Felton was not getting us there, and if you really believe that then I don't know what else to say.

you don't know that... Denver won 57 games after carmelo left... if you guys truly think we are a bad team without carmelo then this team needs to be blown up because you are never going to win without a good TEAM!!!

I don't care about 57 games and one playoff series..

give me 45 wins, youth, flexibility and a higher ceiling!!!


Fine you can have your 45 win team that will always have you excited for next season. I'll take a 54 win team that wins playoff series and has a better chance to compete for a title. Flexibility and youth doesn't get you wins, it just makes you giddy for all the possibilities of the future that may never happen.

Compete for a title? Now you're stand up comedian?

All I said is better chance, as in better than a team led by gallo with flexibility as the 6th man.

Well you can get almost another max contract player just for the salary difference between Melo and Gallo.

And, even among those who wanted to keep Gallo, people weren't talking about him being the leader of the team. I kept talking about trading for and building around Harden, for example.

exactly!!


Papabear Says

Listen!! Maybe you will learn something. Just because Hardin is doing well in Houston don't mean a thing. This is New York and a tough market. How many players in the past did we bring here and they folded with the pressure because of people like you and the press and the bright lights and party time. New York is a difficult market. We also have an owner who runs a yes man type of company. Look he wants to trade Shump because he got made at him.one of our best players so far. We kept Jr's brother who can't play. The team looks like they have no game plan. We are still fading in the third and fourth quarter and Woody can't change that. I wonder what they do at practice. The way Melo is playing now and if he don't change he won't get his 20 million and the fans and press will chase him out of New York and no one will be willing to pay him big money. The team looks like they never went to training camp.

23 year old, highly versatile star on only $14 mil a season? I'd take those odds. We've only won 1 playoff series in 3 years (7 of 21 playoff games) in this Melo era anyway. There's no reason to gamble on a 10 year vet who only does one thing well.

Knixkik
Posts: 35476
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10/26/2013  8:42 AM
Bonn1997 wrote:
Papabear wrote:
tkf wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
fishmike wrote:ESPN is garbage and hates NY sports, thats been well documented here and on the Giants, Jets, Yankees, Mets and Ranger sites as well. But sure... let that hold more water in your mind than MVP votes. Im sorry your not impressed with a scoring title, all star, the best season for the Knicks since Ewing and 3rd in MVP voting (as opposed say 13th, because while you might not be a math major Im willing to help you here 3 is much better than 13).

Your really good at the magical mix of players thats better than Melo, but you offer no other options that are even remotely better.

Would you split the $10mm between Gallo and Brandon Jennings? Who are these magical guys who are going put up the 50win seasons. Name them.

The whole argument is just "the grass is always greener." There is no alternate plan that makes us a better team, just a theory that flexibility, but nothing tangible, is a better option.

well I think it more than a theory... flexibility is always better, and there is more than enough evidence to show that you don't need carmelo to be a playoff team.... so wouldn't it be better to be just as good as we are now with flexibility?

Yes except for the fact that without him we would not have won a playoff series, won 54 games, or won the division. A broke down amare, gallo and Felton was not getting us there, and if you really believe that then I don't know what else to say.

you don't know that... Denver won 57 games after carmelo left... if you guys truly think we are a bad team without carmelo then this team needs to be blown up because you are never going to win without a good TEAM!!!

I don't care about 57 games and one playoff series..

give me 45 wins, youth, flexibility and a higher ceiling!!!


Fine you can have your 45 win team that will always have you excited for next season. I'll take a 54 win team that wins playoff series and has a better chance to compete for a title. Flexibility and youth doesn't get you wins, it just makes you giddy for all the possibilities of the future that may never happen.

Compete for a title? Now you're stand up comedian?

All I said is better chance, as in better than a team led by gallo with flexibility as the 6th man.

Well you can get almost another max contract player just for the salary difference between Melo and Gallo.

And, even among those who wanted to keep Gallo, people weren't talking about him being the leader of the team. I kept talking about trading for and building around Harden, for example.

exactly!!


Papabear Says

Listen!! Maybe you will learn something. Just because Hardin is doing well in Houston don't mean a thing. This is New York and a tough market. How many players in the past did we bring here and they folded with the pressure because of people like you and the press and the bright lights and party time. New York is a difficult market. We also have an owner who runs a yes man type of company. Look he wants to trade Shump because he got made at him.one of our best players so far. We kept Jr's brother who can't play. The team looks like they have no game plan. We are still fading in the third and fourth quarter and Woody can't change that. I wonder what they do at practice. The way Melo is playing now and if he don't change he won't get his 20 million and the fans and press will chase him out of New York and no one will be willing to pay him big money. The team looks like they never went to training camp.

23 year old, highly versatile star on only $14 mil a season? I'd take those odds. We've only won 1 playoff series in 3 years (7 of 21 playoff games) in this Melo era anyway. There's no reason to gamble on a 10 year vet who only does one thing well.

Yes Harden would have been a great option. Problem is there were many other teams competing for his services. Odds of us having a package to entice okc above all others are slim to none. Only reason we got Melo was because of the situation he put Denver in. They preferred Brooklyn's package of players, that was clear.

RonRon
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10/26/2013  9:00 AM
Despite the loss vs the Bobcats, I like the way Melo was looking to get other players involved
He often looked to get players involved, like in football it is very important to establish our players confidence and to see how to opponents DEF would react/defend
I hope he can realize, he doesn't need to throw cross court passes for a stat *assist*, giving it to a player that has the better angle/decision to make

The team looked very unselfish, just like the way we started last season with Kidd on the roster
JR was also doing the same and was shooting very impressive for not playing BBALL activity all summer

Once again, I personally thought we looked best with Kmart at C because he moves without the ball so well for picks or fake picks then rolls before the DEF can recover
Despite the lack of size, the mobility was effective on both ends of the floor, it won't work vs some of the bigger teams/match ups with good DEF though
Amare looked great except for the moving screens and illegal screens

I thought the combination of Chandler, AB, and Melo was once gain largely ineffective on both ends, they are just slow, not very mobile, and not a good defensive team unit on top of it
Then again, AB had a horrible game, hopefully he gets his confidence/ rhythm/ legs and NBA shape after the phenomena....
The lack of speed, interior game, and poor DEF was just a poor fit

But overall, I like the way we played, and think this would generally be Woodson's rotation if everyone is healthy with JR getting more mins and Amare slightly more *if possible*

Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 2/2/2004
Member: #581
USA
10/26/2013  9:17 AM    LAST EDITED: 10/26/2013  9:40 AM
Knixkik wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Papabear wrote:
tkf wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
tkf wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
fishmike wrote:ESPN is garbage and hates NY sports, thats been well documented here and on the Giants, Jets, Yankees, Mets and Ranger sites as well. But sure... let that hold more water in your mind than MVP votes. Im sorry your not impressed with a scoring title, all star, the best season for the Knicks since Ewing and 3rd in MVP voting (as opposed say 13th, because while you might not be a math major Im willing to help you here 3 is much better than 13).

Your really good at the magical mix of players thats better than Melo, but you offer no other options that are even remotely better.

Would you split the $10mm between Gallo and Brandon Jennings? Who are these magical guys who are going put up the 50win seasons. Name them.

The whole argument is just "the grass is always greener." There is no alternate plan that makes us a better team, just a theory that flexibility, but nothing tangible, is a better option.

well I think it more than a theory... flexibility is always better, and there is more than enough evidence to show that you don't need carmelo to be a playoff team.... so wouldn't it be better to be just as good as we are now with flexibility?

Yes except for the fact that without him we would not have won a playoff series, won 54 games, or won the division. A broke down amare, gallo and Felton was not getting us there, and if you really believe that then I don't know what else to say.

you don't know that... Denver won 57 games after carmelo left... if you guys truly think we are a bad team without carmelo then this team needs to be blown up because you are never going to win without a good TEAM!!!

I don't care about 57 games and one playoff series..

give me 45 wins, youth, flexibility and a higher ceiling!!!


Fine you can have your 45 win team that will always have you excited for next season. I'll take a 54 win team that wins playoff series and has a better chance to compete for a title. Flexibility and youth doesn't get you wins, it just makes you giddy for all the possibilities of the future that may never happen.

Compete for a title? Now you're stand up comedian?

All I said is better chance, as in better than a team led by gallo with flexibility as the 6th man.

Well you can get almost another max contract player just for the salary difference between Melo and Gallo.

And, even among those who wanted to keep Gallo, people weren't talking about him being the leader of the team. I kept talking about trading for and building around Harden, for example.

exactly!!


Papabear Says

Listen!! Maybe you will learn something. Just because Hardin is doing well in Houston don't mean a thing. This is New York and a tough market. How many players in the past did we bring here and they folded with the pressure because of people like you and the press and the bright lights and party time. New York is a difficult market. We also have an owner who runs a yes man type of company. Look he wants to trade Shump because he got made at him.one of our best players so far. We kept Jr's brother who can't play. The team looks like they have no game plan. We are still fading in the third and fourth quarter and Woody can't change that. I wonder what they do at practice. The way Melo is playing now and if he don't change he won't get his 20 million and the fans and press will chase him out of New York and no one will be willing to pay him big money. The team looks like they never went to training camp.

23 year old, highly versatile star on only $14 mil a season? I'd take those odds. We've only won 1 playoff series in 3 years (7 of 21 playoff games) in this Melo era anyway. There's no reason to gamble on a 10 year vet who only does one thing well.

Yes Harden would have been a great option. Problem is there were many other teams competing for his services. Odds of us having a package to entice okc above all others are slim to none. Only reason we got Melo was because of the situation he put Denver in. They preferred Brooklyn's package of players, that was clear.

We had plenty. Fields had won Rookie of the Month where he averaged 12 and 7 as an SG. He was being this productive on the small salary of a 2nd round pick. Gallo was a lottery pick already playing at a high level. And we had several picks to offer. Felton was averaging 17 and 9. Instead OKC only got 1 functional player (Kevin Martin) who stayed for 1 season, and some picks.

Uptown
Posts: 31325
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Member: #1883

10/26/2013  9:40 AM
smackeddog wrote:
fishmike wrote:So I was on basketball-reference.com and went through all his playoff game logs. I kept my criteria simple. 40% Shooting.

Folks have always said Melo's had to play tough teams, the West was loaded, cant hold him accountable for not beating the Spurs and Lakers etc when nobody was... we have been through it ad nauseum

I knew this year would show it pretty clearly but other years paint the same picture when you combine them.

These last playoffs:
Melo shoots +40%: Knicks are 5-1
Melo shoots -40%: Knicks are 1-5

Wow. I certainly blame JR's abysmal shooting as well, and I especially kill Chandler for gettig mowed over by Hibbert but when you look at the best player on the team hard to ignore that.

His career?
Melo shoots +40%: his teams are 15-17
Melo shoots -40%: his teams are 7-24

What is uterly shocking is that in 66 playoff games Melo has failed to shoot over 40% in 34 of them.

Melo had a monster year last year and Im hoping he picks up where he left off in that regard. But come post season something needs to give if the Knicks wants to have any chance of competing.

To me the only saving grace is defense. If we build a defensive monster we can still win regardless of this. In 2009 when Melo was playing with KMart, Nene, Billups and Dante Jones they had the formula to make it work.

Can Chandler, MWP, Shump and Felton match the defense those Denver guys were able to grind out?

Hard to see this team ever sustain a playoff run without an elite caliber defense...

Melo's playoff performances as a Knick have been really disappointing. I thought these most recent playoffs it might be different, given his career year, but sure enough he played pretty much like he did in the other two playoffs.

In fairness, and putting it into context, year 1 Amar'e AND Billups went down (leaving us with complete crap!), so the defense could zero in on Melo. But then again, game 1 he played poorly and that was before those two got injured.

Year 2 we lost Lin, Baron Davis, Shump, Amar'e and Tyson was ill. And we were playing the Heat.

Year 3 we were playing a top defense in the Pacers, Melo was injured, and Amar'e, Tyson, and JR were shadows of their former selves. Man, i hate injuries! Can't we have a playoffs when we're at full strength?!- even going back to the time before that Tim Thomas and marbury got injured.

So I get that the context. But like your stats show, Melo seems to have been the same playoff performer regardless of the circumstances. He just hasn't played at an elite level in the playoffs. Sure he has a game or two where he goes into beast mode, but that usually seems to fall just short (Boston series, and Pacers series). It does make me wonder.

I'd like to see what happens if another Knick can step up and carry the scoring load, but I'm not sure we have someone capable of it.

When are Fish and the rest of the Stat-Geeks ever fair and put anything into context when it comes to Melo?

Uptown
Posts: 31325
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Joined: 4/1/2008
Member: #1883

10/26/2013  9:43 AM
tkf wrote:
holfresh wrote:
RonRon wrote:when your shot is not hitting, you can choose to exert your energy on DEF, facilitating, REBOUNDS, setting picks, fighting for position, etc

but

for Melo, he would rather shoot his way out of it and try to be the hero in any given scenario, that is what he loves
Yes, he had injuries that may have bothered his abilities but he chose to continue to force shots, even if it was well defended and on a tough defenders
Is that on Woodson or Melo?


For these reasons that is why DK and some posters don't buy in to him and believe in his abilities to be our #1 option but get called as HATERS

Some one has to shoot the ball..So who in your opinion shoould have been shooting instead of Melo??

how about open players who happen to shoot a better percentage than carmelo...

You mean like when Landry Feilds had the wide open jumper from the corner, game 2 against the Celts and air balled a potential game winner?

Uptown
Posts: 31325
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Joined: 4/1/2008
Member: #1883

10/26/2013  9:44 AM
CrushAlot wrote:I would love to see a post chronicling melo's teammates playoff performance since he has been in ny versus their regular season performance.

Get on it, Crush!!!

Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
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10/26/2013  9:44 AM
Uptown wrote:
tkf wrote:
holfresh wrote:
RonRon wrote:when your shot is not hitting, you can choose to exert your energy on DEF, facilitating, REBOUNDS, setting picks, fighting for position, etc

but

for Melo, he would rather shoot his way out of it and try to be the hero in any given scenario, that is what he loves
Yes, he had injuries that may have bothered his abilities but he chose to continue to force shots, even if it was well defended and on a tough defenders
Is that on Woodson or Melo?


For these reasons that is why DK and some posters don't buy in to him and believe in his abilities to be our #1 option but get called as HATERS

Some one has to shoot the ball..So who in your opinion shoould have been shooting instead of Melo??

how about open players who happen to shoot a better percentage than carmelo...

You mean like when Landry Feilds had the wide open jumper from the corner, game 2 against the Celts and air balled a potential game winner?

What? Are you trying to say that Carmelo has never shot an airball?
What's a higher percentage shot, uptown? A contested shot by Melo or an open layup by our 12th man?

Melo's playoffs

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