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Are we improved?


Author Poll
Knixkik
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If we lose Lin, are we better than we were last season as of right now?

Lin, Fields, Jeffries out

Felton, Kidd, Camby, Thomas in

Yes
No
View Results


Author Thread
Jmpasq
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7/16/2012  4:11 PM
AnubisADL wrote:Knicks will come out hot and destroy the atlantic division.

Bully ball in effect.

We just need K Martin to sign now.

I agree these Butt hurt boys can either cheer on the Knicks or take a walk to Brooklyn or Houston. Knicks will take the Atlantic with or without Lin

Check out My NFL Draft Prospect Videos at Youtube User Pages Jmpasq,JPdraftjedi,Jmpasqdraftjedi. www.Draftbreakdown.com
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Jmpasq
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7/16/2012  4:15 PM
ChuckBuck wrote:
s3231 wrote:We can be improved but the fact that it is a question....after the deals we just made to get considerably older, means that this off-season is not going well (I'm assuming Lin is gone in this scenario).

If you mortgage your future, you need to make the roster considerably better and the way I see it, we just got worse at two key positions (PG and SG) while also getting better in the front-court (by adding Camby, re-signing Novak, etc.).

We lost depth at SG by losing Landry (might not have been a good starter but him and JR were ok LY whereas this year, it's basically just JR).

At PG, I don't feel that Kidd/Felton is an upgrade over Lin/Baron.

This off-season has been a failure. If we re-sign Lin....it becomes solid (not great, but definitely good).

You're joking about PG right? BD could barely walk up the court. Lin avg'ed 8 TOs a game for awhile while getting toasted repeatedly by marginal PGs on defense. Felton+Kidd=Less turnovers, more playoff experience, better defense, better shooting. If "Youtube Prigioni" gives us anything, it's net positive over Lin/BD/Bibby/TD.

Lin fans are so much like Tebow fans.
Check out My NFL Draft Prospect Videos at Youtube User Pages Jmpasq,JPdraftjedi,Jmpasqdraftjedi. www.Draftbreakdown.com
gunsnewing
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7/16/2012  4:25 PM
Jmpasq wrote:
AnubisADL wrote:Knicks will come out hot and destroy the atlantic division.

Bully ball in effect.

We just need K Martin to sign now.

I agree these Butt hurt boys can either cheer on the Knicks or take a walk to Brooklyn or Houston. Knicks will take the Atlantic with or without Lin


Love your enthusiasm but I disagree. My interest in this team is waning and ive been a fan for 18yrs
crzymdups
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7/16/2012  4:27 PM
gunsnewing wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
AnubisADL wrote:Knicks will come out hot and destroy the atlantic division.

Bully ball in effect.

We just need K Martin to sign now.

I agree these Butt hurt boys can either cheer on the Knicks or take a walk to Brooklyn or Houston. Knicks will take the Atlantic with or without Lin


Love your enthusiasm but I disagree. My interest in this team is waning and ive been a fan for 18yrs

I've been a fan for 21yrs. This is the stupidest thing the Knicks have ever done in my time as a fan, and that's saying something.

¿ △ ?
gunsnewing
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7/16/2012  4:28 PM
Agreed
Bonn1997
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7/16/2012  4:33 PM
crzymdups wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
AnubisADL wrote:Knicks will come out hot and destroy the atlantic division.

Bully ball in effect.

We just need K Martin to sign now.

I agree these Butt hurt boys can either cheer on the Knicks or take a walk to Brooklyn or Houston. Knicks will take the Atlantic with or without Lin


Love your enthusiasm but I disagree. My interest in this team is waning and ive been a fan for 18yrs

I've been a fan for 21yrs. This is the stupidest thing the Knicks have ever done in my time as a fan, and that's saying something.


20 years here and my interest has been steadily waning during the Dolan regime.
s3231
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7/16/2012  4:35 PM    LAST EDITED: 7/16/2012  4:36 PM
Jmpasq wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
s3231 wrote:We can be improved but the fact that it is a question....after the deals we just made to get considerably older, means that this off-season is not going well (I'm assuming Lin is gone in this scenario).

If you mortgage your future, you need to make the roster considerably better and the way I see it, we just got worse at two key positions (PG and SG) while also getting better in the front-court (by adding Camby, re-signing Novak, etc.).

We lost depth at SG by losing Landry (might not have been a good starter but him and JR were ok LY whereas this year, it's basically just JR).

At PG, I don't feel that Kidd/Felton is an upgrade over Lin/Baron.

This off-season has been a failure. If we re-sign Lin....it becomes solid (not great, but definitely good).

You're joking about PG right? BD could barely walk up the court. Lin avg'ed 8 TOs a game for awhile while getting toasted repeatedly by marginal PGs on defense. Felton+Kidd=Less turnovers, more playoff experience, better defense, better shooting. If "Youtube Prigioni" gives us anything, it's net positive over Lin/BD/Bibby/TD.

Lin fans are so much like Tebow fans.

Dude, don't even patronize me like that, I'm here making an argument that statisically, Lin is better and have not appealed to emotions at all.

Nevermind that I've been on these forums a hell of a lot longer than you and a diehard Knicks fan my whole life.....but I've also been a season ticket holder over the past 4 years and have a subscription to synergy where I dissect videos/stats in my spare time (not only looking at Knicks, but many other teams as well)....add to that the fact that I've spent countless hours reading about the CBA and I probably know that better than 95% of the fans that post on here (and the fans that post on here obviously know more than the average fan). When I say Lin is a better player than Felton, I'm making a very educated opinion and not just saying "OMG, we can't lose LIN! He beat Kobe!"

You are in no position to question my fandom after the thousands of $ I've spent supporting this franchise (through tickets, jerseys, etc.) and the countless hours I've spent on Martin and Andrew's fantastic site. I've been a diehard Knicks fan though the 90s, through the Isiah years, and through the Walsh/Grunwald years now. I'm not a bandwagon Lin fan that you can compare to freaking Tim Tebow.

"This is a very cautious situation that we're in. You have to be conservative in terms of using your assets and using them wisely. We're building for the future." - Zeke (I guess not protecting a first round pick is being conservative)
mrKnickShot
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7/16/2012  4:36 PM
Yankee fans of the 80's felt the same way. Winning cures everything - if we continue to lose, there will be more "waning". If we start winning, the kvetching will (hopefully) cease.
Bonn1997
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7/16/2012  4:37 PM
s3231 wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
s3231 wrote:We can be improved but the fact that it is a question....after the deals we just made to get considerably older, means that this off-season is not going well (I'm assuming Lin is gone in this scenario).

If you mortgage your future, you need to make the roster considerably better and the way I see it, we just got worse at two key positions (PG and SG) while also getting better in the front-court (by adding Camby, re-signing Novak, etc.).

We lost depth at SG by losing Landry (might not have been a good starter but him and JR were ok LY whereas this year, it's basically just JR).

At PG, I don't feel that Kidd/Felton is an upgrade over Lin/Baron.

This off-season has been a failure. If we re-sign Lin....it becomes solid (not great, but definitely good).

You're joking about PG right? BD could barely walk up the court. Lin avg'ed 8 TOs a game for awhile while getting toasted repeatedly by marginal PGs on defense. Felton+Kidd=Less turnovers, more playoff experience, better defense, better shooting. If "Youtube Prigioni" gives us anything, it's net positive over Lin/BD/Bibby/TD.

Lin fans are so much like Tebow fans.

Dude, don't even patronize me like that, I'm here making an argument that statisically, Lin is better and have not appealed to emotions at all.

Nevermind that I've been on these forums a hell of a lot longer than you and a diehard Knicks fan my whole life.....but I've also been a season ticket holder over the past 4 years and have a subscription to synergy where I dissect videos/stats in my spare time (not only looking at Knicks, but many other teams as well)....add to that the fact that I've spent countless hours reading about the CBA and I probably know that better than 95% of the fans that post on here (and the fans that post on here obviously know more than the average fan). When I say Lin is a better player than Felton, I'm making a very educated opinion and not just saying "OMG, we can't lose LIN! He beat Kobe!"

You are in no position to question my fandom after the thousands of $ I've spent supporting this franchise (through tickets, jerseys, etc.) and the countless hours I've spent on Martin and Andrew's fantastic site. I've been a diehard Knicks fan though the 90s, through the Isiah years, and through the Walsh/Grunwald years now. I'm not a bandwagon Lin fan that you can compare to freaking Tim Tebow.


Well put. Thumbs down for the newbie JMP
s3231
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7/16/2012  4:40 PM    LAST EDITED: 7/16/2012  4:42 PM
JamesLin wrote:
s3231 wrote:We can be improved but the fact that it is a question....after the deals we just made to get considerably older, means that this off-season is not going well (I'm assuming Lin is gone in this scenario).

If you mortgage your future, you need to make the roster considerably better and the way I see it, we just got worse at two key positions (PG and SG) while also getting better in the front-court (by adding Camby, re-signing Novak, etc.).

We lost depth at SG by losing Landry (might not have been a good starter but him and JR were ok LY whereas this year, it's basically just JR).

At PG, I don't feel that Kidd/Felton is an upgrade over Lin/Baron.

This off-season has been a failure. If we re-sign Lin....it becomes solid (not great, but definitely good).

We've already mortgaged our future for the past few years... didn't you see the draft picks? Oh yeah, this past year we had none too... and look where it took us. We couldn't even pass the first round. However, injuries and dramas does have factor in this..


I'm not disagreeing with you as I was one of the posters on here that said we were giving up too much for a guy we could grab in free agency (Melo). However, with Lin and Shumpert you would at least have a future back-court of top prospects under 25. You let Lin walk for nothing and you are down to just Shumpert as your only prospect.

If you keep Lin, you at least have a chance to be very good at the PG position.....with Felton, you are truly mortgating your future by saying "we're ok with just being decent at the 1....we feel confident enough about our other positions that we can win a title."

I don't know about you guys, but I don't feel confident enough in the other positions with this team going up against Miami.

"This is a very cautious situation that we're in. You have to be conservative in terms of using your assets and using them wisely. We're building for the future." - Zeke (I guess not protecting a first round pick is being conservative)
gunsnewing
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7/16/2012  4:40 PM    LAST EDITED: 7/16/2012  4:41 PM
mrKnickShot wrote:Yankee fans of the 80's felt the same way. Winning cures everything - if we continue to lose, there will be more "waning". If we start winning, the kvetching will (hopefully) cease.

Knicks aren't winning anything for the next 20yrs unless they get paul and they have no shot without lin and draft picks

mrKnickShot
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7/16/2012  4:48 PM
gunsnewing wrote:
mrKnickShot wrote:Yankee fans of the 80's felt the same way. Winning cures everything - if we continue to lose, there will be more "waning". If we start winning, the kvetching will (hopefully) cease.

Knicks aren't winning anything for the next 20yrs unless they get paul and they have no shot without lin and draft picks

Nobody thoughts the Gmen could beat the pats and they did it twice.

Dallas was not that great and they won.

Anything is possible in sports - much of it is lotto - if Lebron decides on NY than we could have been celebrating.

CRAPSHOOT

The knicks don't have to win it all but be as competitive as the 90's for fans to chill.

gunsnewing
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7/16/2012  4:51 PM
Football is different than baseball is different than basketball. In basketball you win with elite talent unless you are the pistons in a weak post jordan nba
mrKnickShot
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7/16/2012  4:54 PM
gunsnewing wrote:Football is different than baseball is different than basketball. In basketball you win with elite talent unless you are the pistons in a weak post jordan nba

Yes. and like the Bulls, MIA is elite and everyone else is at least a very distant second. Lebron comes to NY and NY is the front runner.

Other than the Heat, the knicks are right up there with the other distant second teams

ChuckBuck
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7/16/2012  4:56 PM
gunsnewing wrote:Football is different than baseball is different than basketball. In basketball you win with elite talent unless you are the pistons in a weak post jordan nba

The 2004 Pistons did beat the Lakers with Shaq and Kobe in their prime.

gunsnewing
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7/16/2012  5:00 PM
ChuckBuck wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:Football is different than baseball is different than basketball. In basketball you win with elite talent unless you are the pistons in a weak post jordan nba

The 2004 Pistons did beat the Lakers with Shaq and Kobe in their prime.

Yes they were a great team emphasis on team but who besides the pistons have won without a megastar?

JamesKPolk
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7/16/2012  5:01 PM
ChuckBuck wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:Football is different than baseball is different than basketball. In basketball you win with elite talent unless you are the pistons in a weak post jordan nba

The 2004 Pistons did beat the Lakers with Shaq and Kobe in their prime.

I wouldn't say Shaq was in his prime.

"Peace, plenty, and contentment reign throughout our borders, and our beloved country presents a sublime moral spectacle to the world." - James K Polk
crzymdups
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7/16/2012  5:03 PM
JamesKPolk wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:Football is different than baseball is different than basketball. In basketball you win with elite talent unless you are the pistons in a weak post jordan nba

The 2004 Pistons did beat the Lakers with Shaq and Kobe in their prime.

I wouldn't say Shaq was in his prime.

That Lakers team practically self-destructed on the court. Phil was already composing his book in his head.

Most years, you need a top 5 player or two top ten players if you want to win a title.

Knicks don't have that with or without Lin. It'd just be more fun with Lin and the team would be better and we'd actually have a young player capable of improving instead of declining with age like the rest of our old ass roster.

¿ △ ?
mrKnickShot
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7/16/2012  5:04 PM
gunsnewing wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:Football is different than baseball is different than basketball. In basketball you win with elite talent unless you are the pistons in a weak post jordan nba

The 2004 Pistons did beat the Lakers with Shaq and Kobe in their prime.

Yes they were a great team emphasis on team but who besides the pistons have won without a megastar?

Who played better than the Knicks down the stretch (w/o a PG)? Nobody!

I am very optimistic that we will be a very solid and competitive team this year. We are better than we were with the 18-6 team - a lot better.

Will we win it all? No. Miami will, but I hope to give them a tougher series with a healthier team.

Woody from the onset will be a breath of fresh air

mrKnickShot
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7/16/2012  5:06 PM
JamesKPolk wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:Football is different than baseball is different than basketball. In basketball you win with elite talent unless you are the pistons in a weak post jordan nba

The 2004 Pistons did beat the Lakers with Shaq and Kobe in their prime.

I wouldn't say Shaq was in his prime.

He did go and win in Miami after he left and then Miami sucked when he left. So he still was pretty damn elite.

Are we improved?

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