CrushAlot wrote:

nixluva wrote:What is all this crap about STAT and Melo as if we're talking about a PG and PF/C? Name the legendary SF/PF combos that have set records playing off each other on offense? WTF?

Look Melo anchors the strongside with Tyson as his pick man so that STAT can keep the floor balanced and play PnR with the PG. The only problem is we don't have an experienced PnR PG! Even CB wasn't that guy which is why STAT struggled. It has nothing to do with Melo!!! Learn the F'n game! Geez.

I think one of the points made in this thread is exactly what you are saying. The Knicks don't have a competent point guard. The other point being made is why would you do this to a coach like D'Antoni whose offense relies so much on a good point guard. I love the move to get Tyson and I think it was the right thing to do. However, if you have a coach that you know well and are familiar with and you know he needs a good point guard to make what he wants to do on offense successful you get a good point guard. D'Antoni has been seriously handcuffed this season with Douglas running the point and Melo playing point forward.

Yeah I agree with the notion that you need at least a decent PG that can run a PnR and setup a team. TD's horrid start was a shock cuz even tho we didn't think he was a good PG, I think the team felt he could at least hold his own for a while, but he's been far worse than his career avg's in every way. They didn't count on that. Had he even played at the level he did last year it would've been better than this.

My main beef is with the idea that STAT and Melo playing well together is supposed to look like the two of them getting into a two man game a lot. Once in a while OK, but you can't expect a steady diet of that and just in pure BB terms there's never been a great SF/PF scoring tandem. It's just silly to keep making this about the 2 of them playing well together, when it's not up to them to determine that. That's what your PG is there for.

If we can fault Walsh and Grunwald for anything it's that they didn't make sure to have a good backup PG just in case. Also they could've gone after another pick so they could take another PG in the draft. Many of us wanted them to add a 3rd pick and mainly cuz there would be few opportunities to get talent that cheap.

crzymdups wrote:

RonRon wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

crzymdups wrote:the people who are complaining about the nuggets trade are most likely the same people who complained about the shumpert pick. they have all the answers. most likely they'd be fine with this team if reggie miller and charles barkley, two knicks haters and marv albert (who has legitimate beef with the organization) hadn't shat on them on national tv. wounded pride equals - "nooooo we need to go back to the passsst"

what's the ceiling of that "fantasy" team with amar'e no longer beasting? and gallo is the leading scorer? what's the ceiling, i say.

First Round Sweep in the Playoffs

are you talking about the Knicks are Denver?

I would love to see the Knicks with everyone healthy play a seven game series with the Darlin' Nuggets. It wouldn't be pretty for the Nuggz.

Tyson is a nice addition and he compliments Amar'e but Amar'e and Carmelo do not compliment each other at all. They are the same player who play the same style of basketball and so far none of them has changed. They are ball-stoppers, not ball-movers. And in a system predicated on ball movement (and let's be honest, any offensive system is) that is a recipe for failure/underachievement. One will have to change his game to compliment the other or we're going to have to seriously consider trading one (particularly Stoudemire) this summer.

You can call me all the names in the book but so far (counting last season) these guys have not looked comfortable playing together at all. They are playing their best when one isn't on the court with the other. how are we going to succeed this way? I'll give it this season to see if anything changes but if we're still playing this way in the playoffs then not only will we go nowhere but we'll have to make a drastic change in personnel. And not just in coaching.

CrushAlot wrote:I think the coach adjusting to the roster has been a theme since he left Phoenix and Steve Nash. Diaw's praise for Nash after the first game with Charlotte convinced me that those mvps were well deserved. You are right about the Knicks not having a capable point guard right now. I think that is on management. You have a coach in place who is extremely reliant on a point guard to facilitate his offense. To start the season without that if you want him to have success is not fair. Any coach is handicapped by the lack of a competent point guard. If your philosophy as a coach is to out score your opponent, not being able to run an offense is going to limit your success.

Just to remind you that it is Nash himself that credits what he learned from MDA in unlocking more of his potential. Once he learned those things he was off to the races. It's statistically clear as day and Nash is the only guy that has significantly improved after 7 years in the league. Usually guys max out and are what they are by then. The clear jump came when he got with MDA and his system. Nash couldn't wait to get back to that style once they got rid of Terry Porter, so again that should tell you something.

Diaw knows nothing except that when he got to PHX, it was MDA that unlocked his potential too and he got there after MDA had already helped Nash to be Nash the MVP. Nash was always very good, but he became great under MDA's guidance. How many players does MDA have to help get big contracts before people give him some credit for helping to improve players games.

If you've got talent he can help bring out more. The thing with STAT and Melo isn't that they are the same player, cuz historically that's not true. STAT was NEVER a ball stopper. He was a fluid and devastating FINISHER. He only started going ISO a lot here in NY due to a lack of competent PG play. He started to get back to his game with Felton, but then he was gone and with it all that chemistry. Then we had to start from scratch yet again with CB.

If we had a PG in this system for a couple of years it would make such a huge difference. The fact that MDA has had to coach up several PG's since he's been here and then lose them all is a big deal. No coach would want to go thru that. Then you give him TD, roll the ball out and say "go get'em coach". That's grimey. Thank God Shump shows real potential and maybe Davis comes back and helps.

Bonn1997 wrote:

Childs2Dudley wrote:I mentioned this in another thread but I'll re-post it here.

Tyson is a nice addition and he compliments Amar'e but Amar'e and Carmelo do not compliment each other at all. They are the same player who play the same style of basketball and so far none of them has changed. They are ball-stoppers, not ball-movers. And in a system predicated on ball movement (and let's be honest, any offensive system is) that is a recipe for failure/underachievement. One will have to change his game to compliment the other or we're going to have to seriously consider trading one (particularly Stoudemire) this summer.

You can call me all the names in the book but so far (counting last season) these guys have not looked comfortable playing together at all. They are playing their best when one isn't on the court with the other. how are we going to succeed this way? I'll give it this season to see if anything changes but if we're still playing this way in the playoffs then not only will we go nowhere but we'll have to make a drastic change in personnel. And not just in coaching.

Are there any players in this league that Carmelo has complimented well?

Ouchie.

Uptown wrote:Amare and Melo do not have the same game or rather they shouldn't. Amare is a pick-n-roll power forward who flourished playing this way in Phoenix. He's not playing the same way this year as is seems the coach has asked Amare to clear the paint for Chandler to run pick-n-roll which is why Amare added the 3 point shot in the off seaon.

Instead of adding a 3 point shot, Amare needs to work on back to the basket moves in the post. Melo is a face up wing player. Amare and Melo can work but they need a philosphy change and a coach who likes to pound the rock in the paint as opposed to opening the paint up for penetration that is never coming.

Jvg would be a good coach for this team......phil also......one thing phil would do is demand we get a veteran coach.

markvmc wrote:

nixluva wrote:

My main beef is with the idea that STAT and Melo playing well together is supposed to look like the two of them getting into a two man game a lot. Once in a while OK, but you can't expect a steady diet of that and just in pure BB terms there's never been a great SF/PF scoring tandem. It's just silly to keep making this about the 2 of them playing well together, when it's not up to them to determine that. That's what your PG is there for.

Who said that? The two of them playing well together would preferably create opportunities for the other three guys on the floor.

Again, everything might get resolved with a good pg, but at the moment that's just an article of faith.

Bonn1997 wrote:

Childs2Dudley wrote:I mentioned this in another thread but I'll re-post it here.

Tyson is a nice addition and he compliments Amar'e but Amar'e and Carmelo do not compliment each other at all. They are the same player who play the same style of basketball and so far none of them has changed. They are ball-stoppers, not ball-movers. And in a system predicated on ball movement (and let's be honest, any offensive system is) that is a recipe for failure/underachievement. One will have to change his game to compliment the other or we're going to have to seriously consider trading one (particularly Stoudemire) this summer.

You can call me all the names in the book but so far (counting last season) these guys have not looked comfortable playing together at all. They are playing their best when one isn't on the court with the other. how are we going to succeed this way? I'll give it this season to see if anything changes but if we're still playing this way in the playoffs then not only will we go nowhere but we'll have to make a drastic change in personnel. And not just in coaching.

Are there any players in this league that Carmelo has complimented well?

I'll let you know once he has played for the other 28 teams.

I really wish people would stop assuming that they know more than MDA about offense. He's proven over and over again that he knows what he's doing. He may not always have the best tools for what he's trying to do, but he's been able to get his teams to score.

Last year this team was 2nd in scoring and 7th in offensive efficiency. Despite the trade drama and subsequent trade. So far this team has struggled. The most important thing this team has worked on is it's defense and tho it isn't perfect, it's much better and that should eventually serve this team well, once the offense gets going.