fishmike wrote:wow... lot of optimism. Man I just dont see it. I would have loved a matchup with the Heat as I honestly think we can beat them. Of all the top 4 seeds I think this is the WORST matchup for us. Rondo kills our PGs on defense. While Amare has his moments and will KG always seems to win in the end. I dont care how good or bad the Celtics play, they are an elite team and have the ability to clamp down and find ways to win. I hate this matchup. Sorry boys... I know the Knicks are hot and the Celts are not but this smells like a 4-1 Celtics win and that one win is probably a game 4 meaningless win where the Celtics get complacent.

I hope like hell I'm wrong... but this was the nightmare matchup I wanted to avoid. Against the Heat, Magic, evem Bulls... I felt good, like we at least have a gunslingers chance. Celtics are too good and that chemistry those 4 guys have in crunchtime (Rondo, Pierce, KG, Ray) is uncanny and I dont see us breaking that down.

Walsh said you find out what you have and dont have come playoffs. I'm sure that will reveal itself, but I'm not optimistic.

The playoffs are a grind. If a team is fortunate to survive a series into seven games the fatigue factor is significant. Scores in the eighties are not uncommon. Over the course of a series, the Celtics will expose whatever flaws the Knicks have and exploit them with fierce focus. If any one Knicks player is determined to be a weak link on defense, expect the Celtics to pursue that advantage until D'Antoni is forced to make a change. The Celtics have 5 guys who are 6'11 or taller. The Knicks have one and that one is Jared Jeffries.

That math should make the most optimistic Knicks fans uncomfortable.

The key is not the obvious frontline matchups within the first 4-6, but at the seventh, eighth and ninth spots off the bench. Here is where Boston has a significant advantage.

Garnett will be a problem. Not for his scoring or rebounding, but his bullying theatrics, which play well in Boston. The Knicks do not have ANY size or quality depth off the bench. It will require an outstanding cameo performance from a Derrick Brown or a Shelden (yeah I said it) Williams for our squad to have a shot at the series. Toney Douglas needs to answer the volatile Delonte West, who is a pest. 6'9 Jeff Green is superior to anything we have on the second line. Even 7' Nenad Krstic could be a matchup problem among NYK reserves.

Win one in Boston.

loweyecue wrote:

SupremeCommander wrote:Defensively I'd focus on Ray Allen. I think Pierce/Melo is a wash. Same with KG/Garnett. I don't think Billups is better than Rondo, but I'd rather Billups shoot that Rondo, so I'll say that's a wash. Allen vs. Fields/TD is where the team falls short.

Then there is the matter of the Knicks bench versus Boston's. Glen Davis and Jeff Greena re better than any Knicks combination. Jermaine O'Neal had a big night last night too. He should be rested headed into the playoffs.

This is a bad matchup for the Knicks

Yeah KG/Garnett is definitely a wash.

LOL

I meant KG/Garnett/Amear/Amar'e is a wash

JrZyHuStLa wrote:

fishmike wrote:wow... lot of optimism. Man I just dont see it. I would have loved a matchup with the Heat as I honestly think we can beat them. Of all the top 4 seeds I think this is the WORST matchup for us. Rondo kills our PGs on defense. While Amare has his moments and will KG always seems to win in the end. I dont care how good or bad the Celtics play, they are an elite team and have the ability to clamp down and find ways to win. I hate this matchup. Sorry boys... I know the Knicks are hot and the Celts are not but this smells like a 4-1 Celtics win and that one win is probably a game 4 meaningless win where the Celtics get complacent.

I hope like hell I'm wrong... but this was the nightmare matchup I wanted to avoid. Against the Heat, Magic, evem Bulls... I felt good, like we at least have a gunslingers chance. Celtics are too good and that chemistry those 4 guys have in crunchtime (Rondo, Pierce, KG, Ray) is uncanny and I dont see us breaking that down.

Walsh said you find out what you have and dont have come playoffs. I'm sure that will reveal itself, but I'm not optimistic.

Its pretty much a matter of picking your poison. Playing Wade and James while they're hitting their stride isn't exactly the most easiest of an opponent either.

It sucks because I think we could have beaten Bulls, Magic or Heat in first round, or at least make them win game 6 in MSG. I dont see that with the Celtics. They strike me as the perfect team to counter all the things we do well. I dont see a lot of tricks MDA can pull out of his hat here. Maybe a steady dose of Billups at SG and TD pushing the ball a bit more. One thing we did well last game was totally play off Rondo and FORCE him to shoot the 18 footer because when he's in the paint its easy basket after easy basket.

I hope I'm proven differently but of ALL the teams in the East this is the one I would least prefer to play.

fishmike wrote:
Its always is... but the Heat were good for a few reasons. 1) they have no answer for Amare, and to boot I think everyone agree Amare will flat out destroy Bosh. If Bosh has a big game its because he's hitting a bunch of jumpers. Not so scary. Melo would force James to guard him and Melo has that crazy good record vs. Lebron. Yes... Wade is a monster and usually has monster games vs the Knicks. He truly is a top 5 player but the Heat cant push us around, and their role players are actually worse than ours. The Heat have chinks you can attack. So do the Bulls and Magic. What are the Celtics chinks in the armor? I dont see any. With the other teams we have areas we can attack. With the Celtics your hoping they are too old, wear down, beat themseves, etc etc. I dont see it happening.

It sucks because I think we could have beaten Bulls, Magic or Heat in first round, or at least make them win game 6 in MSG. I dont see that with the Celtics. They strike me as the perfect team to counter all the things we do well. I dont see a lot of tricks MDA can pull out of his hat here. Maybe a steady dose of Billups at SG and TD pushing the ball a bit more. One thing we did well last game was totally play off Rondo and FORCE him to shoot the 18 footer because when he's in the paint its easy basket after easy basket.

I hope I'm proven differently but of ALL the teams in the East this is the one I would least prefer to play.

I agree with this... somewhat. I do think the Celtics are a bad matchup, though I think Orlando would have been the worst. We have ZERO answer for Dwight Howard. ZERO.

For Paul Pierce, we have Melo. For KG, we have Amar'e. For Rondo, we have Toney and maybe Jeffries. For Ray Allen, we have Landry and Billups. Heck, for Glen Davis, we have Shelden who practiced against the guy and maybe knows his foibles.

I think it's a tough matchup because the Celtics have been through the wars together. But Pierce is 34, KG is 35. Melo is 26 and Amar'e is 28. Those years will start to add up in the Knicks favor in a long, grinding series.

That said, Pierce LOVES to kill the Knicks. This series is going to have to be about Melo stepping up on D a lot. He forced Pierce into foul trouble in the last game at MSG and the Knicks were looking great until the wheels came off on their offense. But they didn't have Billups that game, and he's a key to the wheels not coming off. Melo wasn't comfortable in the offense and Mike has actually done a good job integrating what Melo likes to do with what the Knicks need to do since that point.

And Amar'e CAN kill KG. He destroyed KG in the first game at the Garden, absolutely destroyed him.

I can see what you're saying - this could be a horrible matchup, a veteran team picking the Knicks apart. BUT, this Knicks team is not made up of young guys anymore - they are young, battle-tested veterans. Melo is playing some of the best ball he's ever played. The wild card for me in this series is Amar'e. Will he look fresh after a week and a half of rest? Will he be rusty? He's and Melo are the keys, as obvious as that sounds. Melo has to beat Pierce convincingly. Amar'e has to beat KG. They can win if these things happen. Toney Douglas on Rondo is a huge key, too.

I don't think it's a blow out - I think it's a hard fought series that goes at least 6 games. Melo has his swagger back. The team believes in him. Work Amar'e back into that and the team can win.

fishmike wrote:wow... lot of optimism. Man I just dont see it. I would have loved a matchup with the Heat as I honestly think we can beat them. Of all the top 4 seeds I think this is the WORST matchup for us. Rondo kills our PGs on defense. While Amare has his moments and will KG always seems to win in the end. I dont care how good or bad the Celtics play, they are an elite team and have the ability to clamp down and find ways to win. I hate this matchup. Sorry boys... I know the Knicks are hot and the Celts are not but this smells like a 4-1 Celtics win and that one win is probably a game 4 meaningless win where the Celtics get complacent.

I hope like hell I'm wrong... but this was the nightmare matchup I wanted to avoid. Against the Heat, Magic, evem Bulls... I felt good, like we at least have a gunslingers chance. Celtics are too good and that chemistry those 4 guys have in crunchtime (Rondo, Pierce, KG, Ray) is uncanny and I dont see us breaking that down.

Walsh said you find out what you have and dont have come playoffs. I'm sure that will reveal itself, but I'm not optimistic.

Either way, you have to face Boston. I would rather face them now when we are hot and they are struggling.

MaTT4281 wrote:So it's official, Knicks vs. Celtics in the first round. Gets me all the more nervous for Wednesday's game.

Absolutely want to put up a fight and end the season strong, but I'm worried about giving the C's extra motivation in the series if we take the game in Boston.

i'm the opposite, i would rest our guys. I'm sure Doc will be resting his squad, what would be the point, beating in the last game means nothing.

we have the other games this season to go from.

NYKBocker wrote:

fishmike wrote:wow... lot of optimism. Man I just dont see it. I would have loved a matchup with the Heat as I honestly think we can beat them. Of all the top 4 seeds I think this is the WORST matchup for us. Rondo kills our PGs on defense. While Amare has his moments and will KG always seems to win in the end. I dont care how good or bad the Celtics play, they are an elite team and have the ability to clamp down and find ways to win. I hate this matchup. Sorry boys... I know the Knicks are hot and the Celts are not but this smells like a 4-1 Celtics win and that one win is probably a game 4 meaningless win where the Celtics get complacent.

I hope like hell I'm wrong... but this was the nightmare matchup I wanted to avoid. Against the Heat, Magic, evem Bulls... I felt good, like we at least have a gunslingers chance. Celtics are too good and that chemistry those 4 guys have in crunchtime (Rondo, Pierce, KG, Ray) is uncanny and I dont see us breaking that down.

Walsh said you find out what you have and dont have come playoffs. I'm sure that will reveal itself, but I'm not optimistic.

Either way, you have to face Boston. I would rather face them now when we are hot and they are struggling.

fishmike wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

fishmike wrote:wow... lot of optimism. Man I just dont see it. I would have loved a matchup with the Heat as I honestly think we can beat them. Of all the top 4 seeds I think this is the WORST matchup for us. Rondo kills our PGs on defense. While Amare has his moments and will KG always seems to win in the end. I dont care how good or bad the Celtics play, they are an elite team and have the ability to clamp down and find ways to win. I hate this matchup. Sorry boys... I know the Knicks are hot and the Celts are not but this smells like a 4-1 Celtics win and that one win is probably a game 4 meaningless win where the Celtics get complacent.

I hope like hell I'm wrong... but this was the nightmare matchup I wanted to avoid. Against the Heat, Magic, evem Bulls... I felt good, like we at least have a gunslingers chance. Celtics are too good and that chemistry those 4 guys have in crunchtime (Rondo, Pierce, KG, Ray) is uncanny and I dont see us breaking that down.

Walsh said you find out what you have and dont have come playoffs. I'm sure that will reveal itself, but I'm not optimistic.

Either way, you have to face Boston. I would rather face them now when we are hot and they are struggling.

yes but the Knicks arent built to compete for a title this year. We just dont have the ponies. I think getting past the first round means something and means something big.

I agree. I think any success we have this year is found money. Next year is going to be big assuming Walsh is still in place.

fishmike wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

fishmike wrote:
Its always is... but the Heat were good for a few reasons. 1) they have no answer for Amare, and to boot I think everyone agree Amare will flat out destroy Bosh. If Bosh has a big game its because he's hitting a bunch of jumpers. Not so scary. Melo would force James to guard him and Melo has that crazy good record vs. Lebron. Yes... Wade is a monster and usually has monster games vs the Knicks. He truly is a top 5 player but the Heat cant push us around, and their role players are actually worse than ours. The Heat have chinks you can attack. So do the Bulls and Magic. What are the Celtics chinks in the armor? I dont see any. With the other teams we have areas we can attack. With the Celtics your hoping they are too old, wear down, beat themseves, etc etc. I dont see it happening.

It sucks because I think we could have beaten Bulls, Magic or Heat in first round, or at least make them win game 6 in MSG. I dont see that with the Celtics. They strike me as the perfect team to counter all the things we do well. I dont see a lot of tricks MDA can pull out of his hat here. Maybe a steady dose of Billups at SG and TD pushing the ball a bit more. One thing we did well last game was totally play off Rondo and FORCE him to shoot the 18 footer because when he's in the paint its easy basket after easy basket.

I hope I'm proven differently but of ALL the teams in the East this is the one I would least prefer to play.

I agree with this... somewhat. I do think the Celtics are a bad matchup, though I think Orlando would have been the worst. We have ZERO answer for Dwight Howard. ZERO.

For Paul Pierce, we have Melo. For KG, we have Amar'e. For Rondo, we have Toney and maybe Jeffries. For Ray Allen, we have Landry and Billups. Heck, for Glen Davis, we have Shelden who practiced against the guy and maybe knows his foibles.

I think it's a tough matchup because the Celtics have been through the wars together. But Pierce is 34, KG is 35. Melo is 26 and Amar'e is 28. Those years will start to add up in the Knicks favor in a long, grinding series.

That said, Pierce LOVES to kill the Knicks. This series is going to have to be about Melo stepping up on D a lot. He forced Pierce into foul trouble in the last game at MSG and the Knicks were looking great until the wheels came off on their offense. But they didn't have Billups that game, and he's a key to the wheels not coming off. Melo wasn't comfortable in the offense and Mike has actually done a good job integrating what Melo likes to do with what the Knicks need to do since that point.

And Amar'e CAN kill KG. He destroyed KG in the first game at the Garden, absolutely destroyed him.

I can see what you're saying - this could be a horrible matchup, a veteran team picking the Knicks apart. BUT, this Knicks team is not made up of young guys anymore - they are young, battle-tested veterans. Melo is playing some of the best ball he's ever played. The wild card for me in this series is Amar'e. Will he look fresh after a week and a half of rest? Will he be rusty? He's and Melo are the keys, as obvious as that sounds. Melo has to beat Pierce convincingly. Amar'e has to beat KG. They can win if these things happen. Toney Douglas on Rondo is a huge key, too.

I don't think it's a blow out - I think it's a hard fought series that goes at least 6 games. Melo has his swagger back. The team believes in him. Work Amar'e back into that and the team can win.

I'm not saying we wont be competitive. There is NO WAY with the talent we have that we wont be competitive, and MDA has won his fair share of playoff games as well. But you nailed it when you talked about a veteran championship caliber team who can pick us apart. The Celtics are truly great in my opinion as they find ways to win like great teams do. That last game with all the blood at the garden is the perfect example. Sure the wheels came off the offense but its always something right?

You never know in sports... I mean I would be suprised if the Knicks won the series but not shocked. We have players who can take over and hit huge shots. Its not so hard to believe that come crunch time we hit just as many big shots as they do.

I HATE the Celtics... man do I. Only my respect for Doc Rivers keeps me from declaring jihad on them outright.

Walsh talked about "seeing what you have" come playoffs. One series doesnt write a book but its an important first chapter. We have seen Amare have monster playoff series and win against tough opponents. Lets see if Melo can do the same. Lets see if Billups has gas left in the tank. Lets see how Douglas scores in BIG games. All these guys have something to prove. Hoping like hell they make us happy!

Melo has had plentyof monster playoff games and has won playoff series'. Albeit in one year but he has won in the playoffs before.