Melo aka A super on the wing is worth 3 role players in the bush- FTW, before Stat starts to cool off...............

AnubisADL wrote:

GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:nixluva. I agree with you.

Anubis if you don't want me to put words in your mouth you gotta do better than what you're responding. The imaginary big I'm talking about is Andrew Bogut..right? What was that supposed to mean?

You just mentioned characteristics about a a player and made no mention of how to obtain this "player" or what player in the league fits that mold.

That's like me saying all we need a is a cant miss shooter who can create his own shot and defend at the SG spot.

ok. I still have no idea what you were talking about with that Andrew Bogut comment. Were you trying to say something like "those guys aren't easy to find" ?

Free Agent big men who could help the Knicks:

Marcus Camby
Tyson Chandler
Nene (has player option for next season)
Kenyon Martin
DeAndre Jordan (playing well now with Kaman out, check his past game)
Yao Ming (yuck but still a FA)
Fishlips (yuck also but still a FA)
Jeff Foster
Kris Humphries

Possible trade targets:

Birdman (maybe you add him to a Melo trade for instance)
Ben Wallace
Okafor (contract kinda sucks)

You can also scour for big men in Europe, South America, Asia, D League or use draft picks (unless we trade them all away for Melo as some have suggested) to get a big man.

Questions for you:

1. Do you believe we need a big who can defend/rebound?

If you do..obviously it's not easy. Does that mean you just throw your hands up and say screw it?

Hopefully Donnie Walsh gets paid millions because he won't do that and he'll get creative: Free Agency. Trades. International. Draft.

AnubisADL wrote:

Paladin55 wrote:Haven't some folks around here even advocated giving up Gallo, Chandler, and Fields, together, to pick up Anthony?

At what point do the Carmeloistas acknowledge that we are giving up too much in a hypothetical trade for Anthony?

And if we were to give up Gallo and Fields, for example...not only do we give up two of our major players on offense and defense, but we put ourselves in a position where we are depending on Chandler to resign with us next year, despite the fact that he can go somewhere else if the $$ is good.

The other issue I see is the versatility of Gallo, Fields, and Chandler, especially on defense. If, as some have talked about, MDA would have Melo at PF and Amare at C we would be getting killed defensively on a nightly basis, IMO.

I've had major arguments with Briggs in the past, but for me, he is on the right track. If Melo wants to come here, he can wait for a season- if not, so be it. Douglas seems to have a nagging injury problem, and Randolph seems to have a way to go before MDA trusts him enough to give him (or Mosguv, for that matter) serious minutes. I've been a supporter of Douglas, especially his D and his outside shooting, but until he is 100% we could really use another PG. We also need another Big.

Why destroy a team's chemistry for one player's greed and impatience?

- Amare has been MVP status during this win streak. Expecting him to maintain this pace for a complete season is unrealistic. If he does manage close to that pace it will come back to haunt him in the playoffs.

- Gallo and Fields are good players but Carmelo is simply a great player. Pierce ate BOTH of them up.

- Chandler is a RFA which means we would have a right to match any offer he gets.

- Defense? Come on now. Fields and Gallo's defense is nothing to boast about.

so do you think amare will just drop off the ledge in production? ok, so maybe he doesn't score 30+ per game, but 20-25 is very realistic.. and we still can win with that..

If carmelo is here, pierce eats his lunch as well.. gallo dropped 20 in the second half, so he was eating someone else on boston up as well..

If AR got his game together, I would not mind losing chandler at all...

I will take fields and gallos defensive effort over carmelo's bull fighting type defense..

AnubisADL wrote:

martin wrote:? The point is you dont get Melo and you do bring in a guy like Nene or Perkins. And then you also target someone like Mayo.

Nene/Mayo acquisitions would be my ideal without giving up core pieces.

Again I say if you sign a Nene you dont have cap space to sign Mayo. So you have to trade assets to get a Mayo type player. Easier said then done.

I am glad you said that last sentence. Now, can you stop using the Pau Gasol trade argument in you other posts? Cause it's completely the opposite thinking in regards to the above post.

iSergio wrote:If BRIGGS was our GM, our team would be CJ Watson, Anthony Morrow, Anthony Randolph, David Lee and Hassan Whiteside.

wtf did briggs give you a bad stock tip relax man, let briggs say his peace, lets not stifle discussion around here.

Andrew wrote:Whats the price for Mayo right now? TD and a 1st round pick? AR and a 1st round pick? TD, AR and a 1st?

I would jump all over any of those but I think they want Chandler.

Uptown wrote:
Champs: 87 & 88 Lakers (Magic, Worthy, Kareem HOF super stars)
Champs: 89 &90 Pistons (Isiah and Dumars HOF stars. Rodman might be HOF when its all said and done)
Champs: 91-93 Bulls (Jordan and Pippen)
Champs: 94-95 Rockets (Hakeem and Drexler. 94 was an exception since the team the Rockets beat in the finals also only had one HOF'er in Ewing. However Hakeem was just flat out better)
Champs: 96-98 Bulls (Jordan and Pippen)
Champs: 99 Spurs (Robinson and Duncan)
Champs: 00- 02 Lakers (Shaq and Kobe)
ETC................................................. I'll give you the Larry brown Pistons but that was 1 out of the last 25 years. That Laker team was poorly put together as well. Unless STAT can average 35 a game in the playoffs, we will have a very tough time competing with the elite.

Good Post. Really.

Lets look a bit into this.

Kareems record with Lakers before Showtime:

1975 40 wins.
1976 53 wins (4-7 in playoffs)Draft Norm Nixon
1977 45 wins (1-2 in playoffs)Draft Michael cooper
1978 47 wins (3-5 in playoffs)Draft Magic Johnson
1979 60 wins (12-4 playoffs)(ist chip with Paul Westhead)
1980 54 wins (1-2 in playoffs)
1981 50 wins (12-2 in playffs) 2nd chip but with Riley Then Draft Worth!
1982 58 wins 8-7 in playoffs)

So basically Kareem don't win with lakes until 5 SEASON. They won two championships BEFORE they draft Worthy!!

5 seasons is patience. They rebuild around Kareem with draft and used good vet role players to fill. Look at the rosters back then. Mcadoo, Spencer Haywood, Jamall wilks, Rambis, Kuptchak, chones, . Got Byron Scott by trading for Norm Nixon.

Isiah and Dumars: Drafted
Jordan and pippen: Drafted
Hakeem: Drafted. Drexler was at tail end of career and traded reasonable.
Robinson and Duncan: Drafted
Kobe: Traded for Vlade. Shaq was Free agent.

What is always lost on the above is just how deep and how good the role players were! Bulls roler players were the difference and until Michael learned to trust them is when they started winning.

I don't doubt that you need players but how you get them and at what price is the difference. If you do Gallo-CHandler-Fields your going to have to rebuild around Amare and Melo.

Miami will win only if its role players and bench step up.

5 years it took the Lakers to rebuild after trading for Kareem until they won. They did it thru trading for picks.

BRIGGS wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:We cant simply add a backup PG and defensive center and play like we are now.

Defensive Center means Fields, Gallo, or Chandler get sent to the bench.

We are successful right now because we are playing small ball and Amare's superb play is forcing teams to go small with us.

Amare 6-10
Gallo 6-10
chandler 6-8
Fields6-7

thats not small

yes we need another big who can score and 6th man type who might also be able to take on some ball handling responsibilities. but this is not a small team we just dont play 2 big--we cant

I agree with you that we need another big and a Pg.

But we are a small team. I think it's more a matter of strength and skill set then height. None of our starting front line players are good post defenders. The bigger front lines push them around. I want a big who can provide some rebounding and muscle.

BRIGGS wrote:

Uptown wrote:Briggs, you continue to combine the numbers of Gallo and Chandler and claim that Melo cant equal the two of them. By this same idiotic logic, if you combine Harrington and Lee's numbers from last year that avaraged 38 pts and 17 rbs. Those averages trump Stoudemire's numbers so accoding to your logic, we should have kept David and Al over Amare.

Cpome on Briggs, your better than that. Obviuosly Amares impact is deeper than that numbers as wold Melos impact be on this club. I agree, I dont wnat to give up the farm, but yes, if want to be one of the top 2-3 teams in the east and a championship contender, Melo is very necessary.

No my logic is spot on--we need a bench rehab. If we trade Fields Gallo and Chandler for Carmelo Anhony we will be a much worse team. While Melo can replace one(although we dont know what will happen with chemistry) he cant replace even 2 and if its 3 we wont win 40 games. And we are alse caped out--no I like chandler and Gallo better. We just need a legit 6th man and another big who can score when amare takes a much needed rest of is able to play big big for some minutes.

I agree with Briggs here.....

Melo could only offer us scoring..... Period

He does nothing else so it fair to compare the out going points for the incoming scoring.

Lee and Al combined may add up to more then Amare in stats but combined couldnt hold Amare's
Jock .........

Amare changes how a defense has to play....... Lee and AL are pretty much played 1 on 1