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martin
Posts: 76269 Alba Posts: 108 Joined: 7/24/2001 Member: #2 USA |
12/14/2010 10:46 PM
BlueSeats wrote:Well you confuse me when you keep talking about price and maneuverability, as if you're saving up for something. OK, forget about price, maneuverability, Iggy. Does a core of Felton, Amare, Melo get you past any of Lakers, Boston, Miami, San Antonio over the next 2 years? My thought is no, so I would move in a different direction than Melo. Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
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TMS
Posts: 60684 Alba Posts: 617 Joined: 5/11/2004 Member: #674 USA |
12/14/2010 11:06 PM
TymeLessKnicks wrote:TMS wrote:knicks1248 wrote:TMS wrote: i actually don't much care for his attitude or his smugness during games... i still think he's a punk for that sucker punch on Mardy Collins & he can be very lazy on defense as the clip shows... i've acknowledged all of that many times... but there's no denying this guy's talent & i think he adds something we don't have, which is a go to scorer that takes a ton of pressure off of Amare's shoulders... in the playoffs Amare's going to be facing a ton of double teams by the elite defenses in the NBA, & having a proven top 3 scorer like Melo on your team that has proven over his entire career that he's capable of scoring on anyone would be a great weapon to have as insurance... this franchise has NEVER had as potent a tandem as Melo & Amare on their roster in all the years i've been watching them... i would love to see how it could work out... of course there's risk in Melo not fitting in just like there was risk that Amare wouldn't work out w/o Steve Nash... u never know if something will or won't work out until u give it a try & see what happens... right now our team is playing great but i still don't get the feeling we're good enough to defeat the top teams in the NBA in a playoff series... that's just my personal opinion... i could be wrong just like everyone who hates the idea of Melo coming here could be wrong... like i said, u never know til it happens one way or the other. anyway, we won't need him to be a leader on this team, that's the best part... all we would need him to do is what he does best, & that's just be that go to scorer on the perimeter to complement Amare's game... Amare & Felton provide all the leadership this team needs... i believe Melo is fully prepared to come in here & work hard if the deal gets done... before we signed Amare, people were posting similar concerns about his weak defense & not giving full effort on that end of the floor too if u recall... i think the culture HAS been changed in NY thanks to DW & the leadership brought in by Amare & Ray Felton... MDA has played his part as well this year & the team has responded. After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
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BlueSeats
Posts: 27272 Alba Posts: 41 Joined: 11/6/2005 Member: #1024 |
12/14/2010 11:23 PM
martin wrote:BlueSeats wrote:Well you confuse me when you keep talking about price and maneuverability, as if you're saving up for something. That core competes with those teams, and really that's all you can ask for. Conversely, please tell me, who does put Felton/Amare over those teams and are they available? Otherwise, who/what are we waiting on? |
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knickstorrents
Posts: 21121 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 1/23/2010 Member: #3050 Hong Kong |
12/14/2010 11:26 PM
BlueSeats wrote:I think that's easy to say with Amare scoring 30+ per game going up against some of the weaker teams of the league, but I don't think it will be the case against the big boys packing the middle. How does Melo help against the zone? He does not have a good 3 point shot, he doesn't move the ball, etc. Rose is not the answer.
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tkf
Posts: 36487 Alba Posts: 6 Joined: 8/13/2001 Member: #87 |
12/14/2010 11:30 PM
BlueSeats wrote:tkf wrote:you see, this is why I am going to try and ignore your post.. I was all against getting melo and have stuck by this for months, and then here you come, with these thought provoking post, and damn, I would love to say they don't make sense, but you have some good points... so I will just retreat and think of a rebuttal.. because now, you have me stumped and frustrated..
I do agree, it is not only great to care again, but to be somewhat relevant... Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser...............
TKF
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tkf
Posts: 36487 Alba Posts: 6 Joined: 8/13/2001 Member: #87 |
12/14/2010 11:30 PM
martin wrote:BlueSeats wrote:tkf wrote:you see, this is why I am going to try and ignore your post.. I was all against getting melo and have stuck by this for months, and then here you come, with these thought provoking post, and damn, I would love to say they don't make sense, but you have some good points... so I will just retreat and think of a rebuttal.. because now, you have me stumped and frustrated.. thanks, and I hope you enjoy.. Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser...............
TKF
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tkf
Posts: 36487 Alba Posts: 6 Joined: 8/13/2001 Member: #87 |
12/14/2010 11:31 PM LAST EDITED: 12/14/2010 11:32 PM
martin wrote:BlueSeats wrote:martin wrote:BlueSeats wrote:tkf wrote:you see, this is why I am going to try and ignore your post.. I was all against getting melo and have stuck by this for months, and then here you come, with these thought provoking post, and damn, I would love to say they don't make sense, but you have some good points... so I will just retreat and think of a rebuttal.. because now, you have me stumped and frustrated.. haha.. I do, maybe, I will do a copy and past sometimes if you guys don't mind.. After I am done dealing with some those guys over there, I am exausted..... haha Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser...............
TKF
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martin
Posts: 76269 Alba Posts: 108 Joined: 7/24/2001 Member: #2 USA |
12/14/2010 11:35 PM
tkf wrote:martin wrote:BlueSeats wrote:martin wrote:BlueSeats wrote:tkf wrote:you see, this is why I am going to try and ignore your post.. I was all against getting melo and have stuck by this for months, and then here you come, with these thought provoking post, and damn, I would love to say they don't make sense, but you have some good points... so I will just retreat and think of a rebuttal.. because now, you have me stumped and frustrated.. Dont mind? I would insist. Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
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TMS
Posts: 60684 Alba Posts: 617 Joined: 5/11/2004 Member: #674 USA |
12/14/2010 11:35 PM
knickstorrents wrote:BlueSeats wrote:I think that's easy to say with Amare scoring 30+ per game going up against some of the weaker teams of the league, but I don't think it will be the case against the big boys packing the middle. i'm sure we'll be able to work in a player that has led his teams to the playoffs in a tough WC every year he's been in the NBA... if there's one thing MDA can never be questioned on, it's his ability to get his players shot opportunities in this offense. After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
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knickstorrents
Posts: 21121 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 1/23/2010 Member: #3050 Hong Kong |
12/14/2010 11:35 PM
BlueSeats wrote:That core competes with those teams, and really that's all you can ask for. Conversely, please tell me, who does put Felton/Amare over those teams and are they available? Otherwise, who/what are we waiting on? Just because a move is the 'best move available' doesn't mean it's a move you should make. Everyone agrees the ultimate goal is a championship. Sometimes you just have to be realistic and be patient until some more players free up that can bring you over the top. I'd rather wait a year and make the right move, rather than make a move because it's the 'best move available'. Having Melo occupy a max slot (a slot that will cost more than Lebron or D-Wade) locks you in long term to a volume shooting, 1 way player that does not help us in an area of need. That is not doing the smart thing. The smart thing is to continue to build assets and look to improve the team in unexpected ways (Landry Fields, Timo, Chandler). Lebron/Wade is definitely worth a max slot, but Melo... I'll pass on that. Compare Melo to Allan Houston. Houston spaces the floor better, Melo rebounds better, but both are max players who played little defense. Houston was a better leader but with those types of players occupying the max, you are digging the team into a hole. The only max worthy players in my mind have to play two ways. End of story. Rose is not the answer.
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BlueSeats
Posts: 27272 Alba Posts: 41 Joined: 11/6/2005 Member: #1024 |
12/14/2010 11:35 PM
knickstorrents wrote:BlueSeats wrote:I think that's easy to say with Amare scoring 30+ per game going up against some of the weaker teams of the league, but I don't think it will be the case against the big boys packing the middle. How many teams play 48 mins of zone? The Lakers use Fisher to bust the zone, the Spurs used Horry/Bowen. You don't need your best player to break the zone. In fact if your best player is a three point specialist you're probably not a very good team. |
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BlueSeats
Posts: 27272 Alba Posts: 41 Joined: 11/6/2005 Member: #1024 |
12/14/2010 11:43 PM
knickstorrents wrote: I'd rather wait a year and make the right move, rather than make a move because it's the 'best move available'.
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tkf
Posts: 36487 Alba Posts: 6 Joined: 8/13/2001 Member: #87 |
12/14/2010 11:45 PM
knickstorrents wrote:BlueSeats wrote:I think that's easy to say with Amare scoring 30+ per game going up against some of the weaker teams of the league, but I don't think it will be the case against the big boys packing the middle. yea, and that bothers me a bit. getting melo will do a couple of things... One is that it will put chandler and or gallo on the bench, depending if one or both are not gone. the key is to get amare back at PF, and melo is a SF, so there goes both gallo and chandler, or whichever one is here... coming off the bench.. there will be a lot of things to think about in this possible melo deal. I often thing back to when we had bernard king. I was just a kid starting HS, and I can remember bernard not having enough help.. so the knicks went out started trying to get these washed up former stars to pair with bernard.. one that came to mind was truck robinson. when truck came here, his game fell off the map, he could not shoot or score anymore.. just seemed uncomfortable out there. Not sure if it was NY, because he was a real quiet guy( I met him once) or maybe his game just clashed with bernard, I mean both guys operated out of the post and Bernard was the MAN... truch had to try to fit in.. I even remember bill russel commentating a knick game trying to explain the problems truch was having holding the ball.. it was just pathetic.
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser...............
TKF
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tkf
Posts: 36487 Alba Posts: 6 Joined: 8/13/2001 Member: #87 |
12/14/2010 11:46 PM
martin wrote:tkf wrote:martin wrote:BlueSeats wrote:martin wrote:BlueSeats wrote:tkf wrote:you see, this is why I am going to try and ignore your post.. I was all against getting melo and have stuck by this for months, and then here you come, with these thought provoking post, and damn, I would love to say they don't make sense, but you have some good points... so I will just retreat and think of a rebuttal.. because now, you have me stumped and frustrated..
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser...............
TKF
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martin
Posts: 76269 Alba Posts: 108 Joined: 7/24/2001 Member: #2 USA |
12/14/2010 11:51 PM
BlueSeats wrote:martin wrote:BlueSeats wrote:Well you confuse me when you keep talking about price and maneuverability, as if you're saving up for something. I just don't see that core competing against those teams in 7 game series. Not enough defense. For me Chandler/Gallo do enough at the 3 position but it is also necessary for them to continue to grow as players. This is definitely a projection thing and part of the cost I was referring to earlier (cost, as in, would Knicks lose one of Chandler/Gallo or maybe both and AR or Fields or whatever). MDA's offensive system has proven to us that it can compete with the very best. So why are we not targeting C's and/or upgrade in defense defense? Like Kendrick Perkins: $8-9M. He would add rebounding, toughness, and protection for Amare. In this scenario you keep Turiaf, AR, Moz and guy like Chandler moves to bench to provide scoring there. And maybe you have ~$3M left to upgrade TD. Perkins, Amare, Gallo, Fields, Felton. Turiaf, Chandler, AR, Moz, TD. More of a Detroit style team than anything. And if MDA prefers to play 8-9 only, you use trades to combine and upgrade talent after that. Size, offense, better defense, depth. If you trade for Melo what are you giving up? And what do you have to replace that you just gave up? And have you just handcuffed your team (maneuverability). I am all for adding Melo in offseason and think it's possible while keeping Chandler and Turiaf with a little creativity; that would also be an ideal situation for the Knicks. Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
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knickstorrents
Posts: 21121 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 1/23/2010 Member: #3050 Hong Kong |
12/14/2010 11:59 PM
BlueSeats wrote:knickstorrents wrote: I'd rather wait a year and make the right move, rather than make a move because it's the 'best move available'. These guys are all up next year according to Hoopshype. None are max players (well Yao might be but I wouldn't give it to him). Gasol and Nene are especially interesting to me. Marc Gasol Rose is not the answer.
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