Vmart wrote:

crzymdups wrote:As far as Melo and scoring: In Denver's best season, 08-09, when they advanced to the WCF, Melo averaged 22ppg on 44% shooting, some of the lowest numbers of his career.

I think he does have more in common with Tracy McGrady and someone like Glenn Robinson - great scorers, but it's questionable whether they do enough in other areas to really win it all. If you're at SF, you have to be a playmaker and a defender. Look at Paul Pierce and Scottie Pippen - two of the best small forwards in the last 20 years and some of the only guys to be MAJOR cogs on championship team from the SF position.

He had an injury plagued year 08-09. But come the playoffs he upped his numbers to: ppg 27.2. reb 5.8 assists 4.1. That year he went toe to toe with Kobe and if it hadn't been for a few key steals by Ariza Denver might have won that series. Everyone here knows that Denver isn't as stacked as the Lakers.

it seems that people have forgotten how Melo played against Kobe in that series... i gained a ton of respect for his ability after that WCF... you need go to guys like that to win playoff games, especially in crunchtime... i love Gallo & i am very interested in seeing what AR can become... trading both of them would be something i wouldn't do, but how do you pass up trading at least 1 of them to get your hands on a top 3 scorer in the NBA & someone who can average 31 ppg on 46% shooting in the playoffs last year? those were better numbers than Kobe... & yes, better than Kevin Durant's playoff production too last year, but somehow he's not even close to being in his league to some of the guys around here? come on now.

TMS wrote:

Vmart wrote:

crzymdups wrote:As far as Melo and scoring: In Denver's best season, 08-09, when they advanced to the WCF, Melo averaged 22ppg on 44% shooting, some of the lowest numbers of his career.

I think he does have more in common with Tracy McGrady and someone like Glenn Robinson - great scorers, but it's questionable whether they do enough in other areas to really win it all. If you're at SF, you have to be a playmaker and a defender. Look at Paul Pierce and Scottie Pippen - two of the best small forwards in the last 20 years and some of the only guys to be MAJOR cogs on championship team from the SF position.

He had an injury plagued year 08-09. But come the playoffs he upped his numbers to: ppg 27.2. reb 5.8 assists 4.1. That year he went toe to toe with Kobe and if it hadn't been for a few key steals by Ariza Denver might have won that series. Everyone here knows that Denver isn't as stacked as the Lakers.

it seems that people have forgotten how Melo played against Kobe in that series... i gained a ton of respect for his ability after that WCF... you need go to guys like that to win playoff games, especially in crunchtime... i love Gallo & i am very interested in seeing what AR can become... trading both of them would be something i wouldn't do, but how do you pass up trading at least 1 of them to get your hands on a top 3 scorer in the NBA & someone who can average 31 ppg on 46% shooting in the playoffs last year? those were better numbers than Kobe... & yes, better than Kevin Durant's playoff production too last year, but somehow he's not even close to being in his league to some of the guys around here? come on now.

Just goes to show you how good Melo is. Usually people 'round here want guys on the team then start saying how much they suck after they get here. Melo got guys skipping steps.

TMS wrote:it seems that people have forgotten how Melo played against Kobe in that series... i gained a ton of respect for his ability after that WCF... you need go to guys like that to win playoff games, especially in crunchtime... i love Gallo & i am very interested in seeing what AR can become... trading both of them would be something i wouldn't do, but how do you pass up trading at least 1 of them to get your hands on a top 3 scorer in the NBA & someone who can average 31 ppg on 46% shooting in the playoffs last year? those were better numbers than Kobe... & yes, better than Kevin Durant's playoff production too last year, but somehow he's not even close to being in his league to some of the guys around here? come on now.

Melo has been a BEAST since he stepped into a league. Unfortunately for him he is in the same draft class as Wade and Lebron. Wade with scrubs has been getting bumped in the first round. Melo has made the playoffs EVERY year in the West but gets bumped in the first round and people act like he is chopped liver. The guy took a garbage Denver team and took them to the playoffs his first year. Kevin Durant hasn't even done that.

I understand wanting to keep our young guys but thinking Denver is going to just give him away for 1 of our guys is just naive. Just like this past summer other teams will be falling over themselves to try to create a package that can land them Carmelo. This whole play it cool, Carmelo wants NY business is a joke. NY needs Melo more than Melo needs NY. Oh did I mention he is on 26 yrs old.

Moonangie wrote:Yet another Melo thread?

Yep, it's updated and started to talk about things some more whereas the other threads are basically dead.

AnubisADL wrote:

TMS wrote:it seems that people have forgotten how Melo played against Kobe in that series... i gained a ton of respect for his ability after that WCF... you need go to guys like that to win playoff games, especially in crunchtime... i love Gallo & i am very interested in seeing what AR can become... trading both of them would be something i wouldn't do, but how do you pass up trading at least 1 of them to get your hands on a top 3 scorer in the NBA & someone who can average 31 ppg on 46% shooting in the playoffs last year? those were better numbers than Kobe... & yes, better than Kevin Durant's playoff production too last year, but somehow he's not even close to being in his league to some of the guys around here? come on now.

Melo has been a BEAST since he stepped into a league. Unfortunately for him he is in the same draft class as Wade and Lebron. Wade with scrubs has been getting bumped in the first round. Melo has made the playoffs EVERY year in the West but gets bumped in the first round and people act like he is chopped liver. The guy took a garbage Denver team and took them to the playoffs his first year. Kevin Durant hasn't even done that.

I understand wanting to keep our young guys but thinking Denver is going to just give him away for 1 of our guys is just naive. Just like this past summer other teams will be falling over themselves to try to create a package that can land them Carmelo. This whole play it cool, Carmelo wants NY business is a joke. NY needs Melo more than Melo needs NY. Oh did I mention he is on 26 yrs old.

Mostly spot on, but again Melo's people have been leaking his and his wife's preference for NY. It doesn't mean the NJ isn't close enough geographically, but again they'd have to gut that 12 win team and all of it's top tier talent to land Melo and then he'd be in a worse situation than he is in Denver. I hate to point out that Orlando would be good for him, but it would suck for Knicks fans. I feel like he's too big a player for NY to miss out on again, but I understand the perspective of all of the folks that say wait and get him later (if he's still available).

Knixkik wrote:

joec32033 wrote:

TMS wrote:

Vmart wrote:

crzymdups wrote:As far as Melo and scoring: In Denver's best season, 08-09, when they advanced to the WCF, Melo averaged 22ppg on 44% shooting, some of the lowest numbers of his career.

I think he does have more in common with Tracy McGrady and someone like Glenn Robinson - great scorers, but it's questionable whether they do enough in other areas to really win it all. If you're at SF, you have to be a playmaker and a defender. Look at Paul Pierce and Scottie Pippen - two of the best small forwards in the last 20 years and some of the only guys to be MAJOR cogs on championship team from the SF position.

He had an injury plagued year 08-09. But come the playoffs he upped his numbers to: ppg 27.2. reb 5.8 assists 4.1. That year he went toe to toe with Kobe and if it hadn't been for a few key steals by Ariza Denver might have won that series. Everyone here knows that Denver isn't as stacked as the Lakers.

it seems that people have forgotten how Melo played against Kobe in that series... i gained a ton of respect for his ability after that WCF... you need go to guys like that to win playoff games, especially in crunchtime... i love Gallo & i am very interested in seeing what AR can become... trading both of them would be something i wouldn't do, but how do you pass up trading at least 1 of them to get your hands on a top 3 scorer in the NBA & someone who can average 31 ppg on 46% shooting in the playoffs last year? those were better numbers than Kobe... & yes, better than Kevin Durant's playoff production too last year, but somehow he's not even close to being in his league to some of the guys around here? come on now.

Just goes to show you how good Melo is. Usually people 'round here want guys on the team then start saying how much they suck after they get here. Melo got guys skipping steps.

This is exactly my thought as well. I really want to see what AR can become, but if we need to trade him to get Melo we must do it. Also, it is seeming less and less likely that Melo will make it to free agency, so i think people need to stop saying we should just wait to get him for nothing. It's not that simple. I'm all for being patient but if we lose him to the Nets it will not be a good situation. We know the Nets have the pieces to get him. The only thing we need to hope is that Melo will not sign long-term with a depleted Nets team after they trade everyone but Lopez to get him.

--->The only thing we need to hope is that Melo will not sign long-term with a depleted Nets team after they trade everyone but Lopez to get him.

Not for nothing but without draft picks(what the Nets do have) we would be giving up much much more than the Nets. If what J Rothenstein said was true--it was Favors and Harris + 3 1s. Think about 5 assets that the Nuggets would want from us--let me try for you Randolph Mosgov Chandler Gallinari Fields--and well take Curry and you throw in the 3mm to cover his trade kicker. You say NJ depleted---come on--NY would be stripped for 5 years and stuck in mediocrity. Denver is to not going to say in 2 weeks this is a lost cause lets take whatever the Knicks give us. If I was a billionaire owner I would say F that. Well take OUR offer that we want--the best offer--or Im going into these nBA negotiations trying to make sure we come out with a new franchise player rule and try to win this year. This guy is not going to be backed into a corner in some fans fantasies--this is real life. They haev those CBA negotiations in THEIR pocket and my bet is owners will want some new rule after the LBJ gig.

foosballnick wrote:Buy Low / Sell High

Was non existent in the Isiah Years and look at the results. Walsh got away from this equation during some of the gutting and the Lebron Hunt by trying to dump salary. However he recovered nicely with the Lee Trade and we at least seem to have hope back.

Regarding Melo - right now his price is most likely too high. Denver will not give him away at this point. It will take 3 Chips at least and perhaps more.....say Gallo, AR and Chandler as the base. Just not willing to give these pieces and here's why:

1) Will we be a Championship Team with Melo this year by giving up the above and potentially more? Probably not

2) AR/Gallo have not reached their potential. Will their individual ceiling be as high as Melo? Probably not. However will their combined ceiling be as high as Melo...most likely. Further - by holding on to them they will most likely have increased trade value in the future either individually or packaged

3) If we bring in Melo and deplete almost everything else - this still does not address our relative lack of draft picks and the ability to build around Melo and Amare in the near term.

4) Chandler may be a trade chip at the end of the season ala Lee. Although not an allstar - he does have some coveted skillsets and is still relatively young

5) Melo's price will still be high for other teams right now. For instance, considering the rumor of what the Nets will give up.....Melo and Lopez is not a championship core and they will have depleted picks to build around them. They will then have to wait/hope for CP3 further down the line.

6) Melo is a FA after this season. Have to continue to work under that assumption. Other teams know this as well. Do not panic and overpay in a trade unless Denver makes the first Panic move which will lower the price.

7) Melo wants to come to NY. Does this guarantee he will be here or will this be a deciding factor? NO. But it does give some further ammunition as for the Knicks not to panic and overpay.

8) Tony Parker also wants to come to NY. Backup FA plan.

- The David Lee trade was good for us because we could have lost Lee for nothing. Lets not act like we swindled Golden State into giving us Randolph. They have seen him play for 2 yrs yet decided to include him in a deal for David Lee. David Lee is CONSISTENT but has obvious short comings. Anthony Randolph is currently erratic and is just alot of potential.

- Melo price is always going to be high because he is a STUD. Of course when he is old and washed up his value with be low.

1- Melo and Amare makes us contenders in the east at least.

2- AR and Gallo may never reach their ceiling and may never be half as good as Carmelo is right now. Randolph and Gallo may also not make a quantum leap this year and see their trade value decrease.

3- If we have Amare, Melo, and Felton we can surround them with overpaid role players.

4- David Lee improved his game every year. Chandler too me is the same player. He is also injured at the end of every season. I dont see a huge demand for slightly above average SF's in the league either.

5- We dont know what other teams are offering. Other teams seem to do a better job of keeping negotiations secret. Denver appears to still be in denial.

6- Melo is a FA which means he can end up anywhere. We NEED him in NY and with Amare eating up max cap space we cant afford to waste an opportunity to compete.

7- Lebron wanted to come to NY too. So that means nothing.

8- See above. Everyone wants to come to NY until they get paid by their home team or someone else. To be quite honest we might not have gotten Amare is another team was willing to pay him the max for 5 years.