[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

Let me speak my piece--why the knicks got burned
Author Thread
Nalod
Posts: 71374
Alba Posts: 155
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
1/9/2005  10:51 PM
Draging old posts? Playa, get a life man!

In retrospect, whom was right?

Did the test of one years time bring forth Briggs as being true?

AUTOADVERT
playa2
Posts: 34922
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 5/15/2003
Member: #407

1/10/2005  6:16 AM
Posted by fishmike:

either he bookmarks them or has way too much time on his hands. If you use a good search you can dig through forums, but mods hate it because it eats their bandwidth

..man, I just realized this post wasnt 2 days old, it was 365 + 2 days old.

If some of you would have a half a brain all you have to do is click on the # post it takes two seconds. Fish you are sounding resentful lately.
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
playa2
Posts: 34922
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 5/15/2003
Member: #407

1/10/2005  6:19 AM
Posted by Killa4luv:
Posted by playa2:

This is the thread that told it all. start with briggs.
what do you mean by that?

Read the 1st post duh
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
Killa4luv
Posts: 27769
Alba Posts: 51
Joined: 6/23/2002
Member: #261
USA
1/10/2005  6:48 AM
Posted by playa2:
Posted by Killa4luv:
Posted by playa2:

This is the thread that told it all. start with briggs.
what do you mean by that?

Read the 1st post duh
Am i supposed to be reading that first post and thinking-wow- how insightful? Because if so, How do you explain why I have read it and thought, wow, how off target. We got Crawford and JYD since then, and we are in a position to make some power moves. We are in a great place right now. Poised to take it to the next level with our expiring contracts and talent.

I guess I am going through that stage that everyone on this board has been through at one point or another-I am thinking what is wrong with playa?
Nalod
Posts: 71374
Alba Posts: 155
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
1/10/2005  9:11 AM
Time for playa to go back to double speacial probation!

martin
Posts: 76510
Alba Posts: 108
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
1/10/2005  9:15 AM
Posted by Nalod:

Time for playa to go back to double speacial probation!

I am almost inclined.
Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
raven
Posts: 22454
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 9/2/2002
Member: #316
Canada
1/10/2005  9:22 AM
playa, i found impressive to see a knick fan rooting for the team to loose so that you could "i told you so" the other fans...

but, wow.

I took me 3 minutes to undertsand how this theard came back.

Do you have a girlfriend or a job, or something ?
You're getting scary.
OldFan
Posts: 21456
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/24/2003
Member: #446
1/10/2005  9:28 AM
Posted by playa2:

Briggs I agree about the one thing Frank played the point position that was on the same speed as his teamates, He is the guy who could keep chemistry in tack. Mcdyess if he would have played last night wouldn't have allowed boozer to destory us in the paint last night, dice is stronger than that!

Please stop with Frank Williams. Last year I thought it was amazing that people were pumping this guy up based on almost no data. But to continue it this year is beyond ridiculus. The guys career stats are 3 pts, 2 assits and 35% shooting. You can't take a guys best 5 games out of 80+ games he's played and extrapulate that he is a great, good, average or less then average but occassionally useful scrub from that.

As far as the rest of the trades:

Lampe may at some point contribute something but so far he's done nothing.

Is Vujunic contributing somewhere?

Ward I always defended but as I recall 90% of the board bashed the guy and his HUGE contribution this year is 5.4 pts 3.1 assists and 31% shooting. I haven't seem him this year but I'm assuming at 34 with bad knees his defense ain't improving.

Antonio has played well but hardly been dominant and who knows how long he'll last.

It has gotten harder to build thru the draft. You have to draft with limited information. There are always quality players but most of the time teams are not going to get the best player available as unlike us monday morning cornerbacks they don't have the advantage of hindsite. And most of the players coming out have very short resumes. So to assume both that we would have a high draft pick and make the best use of it is assuming a lot.
Killa4luv
Posts: 27769
Alba Posts: 51
Joined: 6/23/2002
Member: #261
USA
1/10/2005  10:55 AM
Posted by OldFan:
Posted by playa2:

Briggs I agree about the one thing Frank played the point position that was on the same speed as his teamates, He is the guy who could keep chemistry in tack. Mcdyess if he would have played last night wouldn't have allowed boozer to destory us in the paint last night, dice is stronger than that!

Please stop with Frank Williams. Last year I thought it was amazing that people were pumping this guy up based on almost no data. But to continue it this year is beyond ridiculus. The guys career stats are 3 pts, 2 assits and 35% shooting. You can't take a guys best 5 games out of 80+ games he's played and extrapulate that he is a great, good, average or less then average but occassionally useful scrub from that.

As far as the rest of the trades:

Lampe may at some point contribute something but so far he's done nothing.

Is Vujunic contributing somewhere?

Ward I always defended but as I recall 90% of the board bashed the guy and his HUGE contribution this year is 5.4 pts 3.1 assists and 31% shooting. I haven't seem him this year but I'm assuming at 34 with bad knees his defense ain't improving.

Antonio has played well but hardly been dominant and who knows how long he'll last.

It has gotten harder to build thru the draft. You have to draft with limited information. There are always quality players but most of the time teams are not going to get the best player available as unlike us monday morning cornerbacks they don't have the advantage of hindsite. And most of the players coming out have very short resumes. So to assume both that we would have a high draft pick and make the best use of it is assuming a lot.

Good post.

It hurt me to see charlie go, not like he was great, but he would do some important things in key moments in a game and he could bang the open 3. I did miss him

But about the draft you're right. There are very few impact players in the draft period. And there really isn't a reliable way of telling who will or wont be an impact player. Lebron and Carmello of course are the exceptions to the rule. But if there were a reliable way, guys like Kobe, Amare, Wayde, and so on would have beeen picked higher, or even first. There are usually 2 or 3 players you know what their gonna do and then the rest is guess work.

And when it comes to big men they mostly take time to develop anyway. No one would have said to take Amare over Yao, but right now, everyone would. Go figure, I think it is better to trade for players who are almost there, like Isiah did with Crawford. You can see he is on his way to stardom in this league and that is a safer bet than some guy who played in college or High School.
Marv
Posts: 35540
Alba Posts: 69
Joined: 9/2/2002
Member: #315
1/10/2005  11:06 AM
Posted by Nalod:

Time for playa to go back to double speacial probation!

Double special secret probation!
Nalod
Posts: 71374
Alba Posts: 155
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
1/10/2005  1:04 PM
Posted by Marv:
Posted by Nalod:

Time for playa to go back to double speacial probation!

Double special secret probation!

Rats!
Nalod
Posts: 71374
Alba Posts: 155
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
1/10/2005  1:26 PM
Posted by OldFan:
Posted by playa2:

Briggs I agree about the one thing Frank played the point position that was on the same speed as his teamates, He is the guy who could keep chemistry in tack. Mcdyess if he would have played last night wouldn't have allowed boozer to destory us in the paint last night, dice is stronger than that!

Please stop with Frank Williams. Last year I thought it was amazing that people were pumping this guy up based on almost no data. But to continue it this year is beyond ridiculus. The guys career stats are 3 pts, 2 assits and 35% shooting. You can't take a guys best 5 games out of 80+ games he's played and extrapulate that he is a great, good, average or less then average but occassionally useful scrub from that.

As far as the rest of the trades:

Lampe may at some point contribute something but so far he's done nothing.

Is Vujunic contributing somewhere?

Ward I always defended but as I recall 90% of the board bashed the guy and his HUGE contribution this year is 5.4 pts 3.1 assists and 31% shooting. I haven't seem him this year but I'm assuming at 34 with bad knees his defense ain't improving.

Antonio has played well but hardly been dominant and who knows how long he'll last.

It has gotten harder to build thru the draft. You have to draft with limited information. There are always quality players but most of the time teams are not going to get the best player available as unlike us monday morning cornerbacks they don't have the advantage of hindsite. And most of the players coming out have very short resumes. So to assume both that we would have a high draft pick and make the best use of it is assuming a lot.

YOu have to consider we gave up $30 million in salary and took back $130 in return.

I hate freaking Penny also. He will make 17mil next year! Ok, it was a necessary evil, but can't not throw it in.

Frank is a creature we created from desperation and low (fan) self esteem. At the same emotion, we have elevated Marbury to an Ikon. Actually, he has done it for us.

Fans have little objectivity when we want our players to do well. When we read articles that seem to bash (our emotions) we take it personal and think they are idiots.

Coming off Layden, we worshipped Isiah and love the buzz he has created, and feel will continue to feed up with all kinds of trades.

Isiah might have hit a spending wall. The buzz was self suffiecient as it offsets some of the spending for TT and Penny. But in the long run, Isiah must deliver. I doubt we keep ramping up our salary going forward.

Isiah's recent comments kinda supports this. We are who we are and in time we can make it better with draft picks, and some creative trades. We cannot assume we replace the salary that comes off the books, or use the MLE in full.

If Trevor and Azira are for real, they will too need to be paid.

It is important that you draft kids that can be evaluated in the first 3 years properly. IT hurts to over pay for a bust, and let fulfilling potential be filled for a different team!
bigpimpin
Posts: 22176
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 11/17/2004
Member: #801
USA
1/10/2005  1:31 PM

this is still a slow overpaid jump shooting team with an engine that doesnt fit the car.

i love this team, damn what you talking bout

Go KNICKS!!!!

look me in my eyes and tell me that we aren't a dangerous team come playoff time
"Anyone who sits around waiting to hit the lottery, whether basketball or real life, in order to better their position is a loser."
eViL
Posts: 25412
Alba Posts: 9
Joined: 1/21/2004
Member: #561
USA
1/10/2005  1:50 PM
Maybe we can be this year's version of last year's Miami. They were unimpressive until the final few months of the season and then they became a real threat. That's highly optimistic. At worst, we will make the playoffs and compete. No way we get swept out of the first round this year.
check out my latest hip hop project: https://soundcloud.com/michaelcro http://youtu.be/scNXshrpyZo
Masterplan
Posts: 21571
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 12/9/2002
Member: #362
1/10/2005  2:04 PM
we've come a good ways since we traded for marbury a year ago. guys who play with energy and athleticism have been sought and added, JYD ariza nazr and crawford fit in nicely, and TT could have been a part of that but he looks like trade fodder in the near future. we have a roster that benefits greatly from marbury, nazr the prime example. how many easy shots does he get? blaming IT is foolish, he got marbury and made the kinds of changes to suit his talents. if we can get healthy, we'll be a threat no question. there are options out there to upgrade the roster. we do need to give it time. the same guys who say they're good enough fans to wait out a total rebuilding process aren't patient enough for one season of gradual improvement.

[Edited by - Masterplan on 01/10/2005 14:04:53]
fishmike
Posts: 53867
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
1/10/2005  2:32 PM
why cant we still build through the draft? We will either have to trade up or really execute but so far so good. geeze, look at last years draft. Tell me 10 guys you would rather have over Ariza right now. Every year there are 2 guys that come out of the 2nd round and can really play. Right now Duhon and Ariza look like those guys. Maybe the Bralizian kid also.

The Knicks have never used the draft well, but there is no reason we cant use it too add players. So far so good. Ariza really has a lot of substance. Do I expect a guy like him from round 2 every year? Of course not, but getting one from round 1 isnt a impossible.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
fishmike
Posts: 53867
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
1/10/2005  2:42 PM
Isiah's tenure and the Marbury trade are still a big to be determined. If Isiah can some good horses around Marbury for an extended run deep into the playoffs it was worth it. If we are an overpriced rag tag group thats a one and done every postseason then obviously it was a waste.

Overall I like the players we have added. Marbury, Crawford, JYD, Nazr, Ariza are good and I like Isiah's thinking. Penny, TT and Lampe were the price for adding those players. So far I'm ok with all of this.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
playa2
Posts: 34922
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 5/15/2003
Member: #407

1/10/2005  3:40 PM
FISHY WE KNOW YOU HAVE stil IN YOUR BACK ROOM

Thats how you turned into a "KOOL-AIDAHOLIC" Keep drinking Im gonna call AA on ya.
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
newyorknewyork
Posts: 30169
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #541
1/10/2005  4:54 PM
Frank is a creature we created from desperation and low (fan) self esteem. At the same emotion, we have elevated Marbury to an Ikon. Actually, he has done it for us.



LOL!! Frank was solid though. He wasn't a guy who would put up stats but he was great at creating great ball movement and a rhythem on offense. But there was no way we could depend on him because he was injury prone and inconsistant. In the 4 games he started though we had 4 wins by blowout. But because he was injury prone he got injured again.
https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
teslawlo
Posts: 21482
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 7/13/2004
Member: #699
USA
1/10/2005  7:35 PM
wow I JUST realized that it was 01/07/2004, not 2005. It's interesting to revisit the trade but it may still be too early. It may be that we can only look at this trade and evaluate it when lampe has retired and the picks have long retired too.
http://allknicks.com
Let me speak my piece--why the knicks got burned

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy