Pharzeone wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

franco12 wrote:I'm not trying to be a smart azz - but can someone point out some examples- more than one- of players that left money to go elsewhere?

There arent any.

Joe Johnson went to ATL because Phoenix didnt want to pay him

Rashard Lewis went to ORL because Seattle didnt want to pay him

Rudy Gay will leave MEM because they dont want to pay him

And in those previous mentions, JJ finally went in a S&T. Same with Lewis. I also believe Gay will be in a S&T. It's all about the Bird Rights baby.

Yea because their teams did NOT want them so anything they get back is gravy. I'd also like to add Johnson was a Restricted free agent and the Suns could have matched which would have totally screwed Atlanta so that is why they included the pick and Diaw.

The pick they traded to Phoenix was like top 4 or 3 protected and ended up being Al Horford.

Pharzeone wrote:

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

franco12 wrote:I'm not trying to be a smart azz - but can someone point out some examples- more than one- of players that left money to go elsewhere?

There are examples of players who would not be signed by their own team who were involved in S+T. The CBA was much different went Shaq left to LA--other than that--there is little evidence of great players moving to take less--usually they have taken less to stay. Not for nothing--but Grant Hill and Jason Kidd could be playing in NY for the great MDA--they arent

That was a good point--where is the evidence of players offered more and leaving for less? I cant think of one

older players do it all the time. ALL the time. Didnt Malone and Payton take the min to try and get a ring with the Lakers?

and again... while the players would sign a contract for less Guarenteed money, they would only be EARNING $5mm over the 5 years less. I'm sorry but that doesnt matter. Not to them, not to me. Its about 5% less.

If I could work in a city or place I wanted to for 5% less I would move to take more.

This arguement is old. There are things we know Lebron wants and is driven by that you can get in NY that you cant get in Cle. Thats the bottom line. Shaq wanted to go to LA. Lebron has a lot of NY ties and isnt shy about them.

Other than being a Yankee fan and friends with Jay Z, I don't know of them. Thank God for YES and Skype.

Shaq went to LA but it was a reason for his departure from Orlando. The two main reasons was that his character was under attack by the Central Florida media and even owner of the team regarding his baby mama issues and the other was Penny Hardaway. Management wanted to make Penny the focal point of the offense rather than Shaq.

Yes Lebron is a Yankee fan and close w/ CC.
Lebron was a dissapointment w/ Nike. He didnt sell a lot of shoes and his contract w/ Nike is up. Cle metro area is 2.2mill. NY metro area is >20mill
Lebron is an avid investor and businessman. Wall street is in NY (at least the one he cares about)
Lebron has been outspoken about Cle NOT being his hometown. Thats Akron.

Lebron has a NY sized ego. Again... if he comes its going to be because he wants to first and foremost. Not for some reason that can be quantified on Ultimate Knicks.

BRIGGS wrote:

cooch2584 wrote:This something a real fan thinks??

Who cares--I was pirsed off at the trade--and with good reason. You can post it here 10000 times and I will still be 100 times the Knicks fan you are--I just don't wear rose colored glasses. You know how many Knick games I have missed in the last 30+ years---3. I just think the organization has become a joke.

there really is no reason to bash the direction of the knicks. they are finally going in the right direction, for the first time since ewing left. i just don't know how you can hate on the current administration? you used to praise isiah(remember the thread you created when we acquired Curry?) but bash walsh, who is 100 times better.

I am not saying it will happen. Just that it could happen.

EwingsGlass wrote:Don't European players often turn down more money to play in the NBA? Veteran's make decisions to play where they feel they can win, even if it means taking less money. We say it "never happened". Baron Davis walked away from 17m with the Warriors to go to LAC for $13M per. Never gave the Warriors the chance to negotiate. Brand turned down a comparable offer with LAC 5 years/$81M, and a larger offer with the Warriors 5 years/$90M to go to Philly for 5 years/$81M. What are you going to argue, that these players are not of the same caliber as the top three... who is? Ok. Garnett demanded a trade, Minny would have continued to pay him. Seattle didn't want to pay Rashard, but they assisted in the S&T. Otherwise, look st the size of the sample set. Max contracts are 5 or 6 years. This CBA has been around since 2005. How many "max" players are in the league? The CBA rules were completely compararable when McGrady and Hill left their respective teams to go to Orlando. Not under the current CBA? Just another excuse. What about Boozer leaving Cleveland? Not comparable cause it isn't a 'max' contract?

I am not saying it will happen. Just that it could happen.

Boozer took more money than what Cleveland was offering after agreeing that he would take less then expected for his market value if he was let out of his contract. Okur that same year took more money from the Jazz than what Detroit was willing to give him to bring him back. Brand took equal money.

I guess what people are talking about if a FA is being offer more money would they still leave. Davis is a good example for 'it is not just about the money' because he was tricked by Brand into leaving GS. Although he went home basically so he took the hometown discount. Brand even admitted that he wanted to get closer to home so he took the equal money. I agree though it could happen but it is unlikely because these guys don't often like to leave money on the table. It should be interesting to see this summer though.

TMS wrote:

Pharzeone wrote:Well it was the summer of 96 and 04. Teams cleared cap space for those guys. I think the situation is similar. Two big names up top and a bunch of guys that are riding the coat tails. Teams were going nuts about clearing cap space for Kobe in 04 including Phoenix which was their original plan. Nash and Rasheed were right behind him.

& Orlando cleared everything in the hopes of uniting Tim Duncan, T-Mac & Grant Hill... Duncan decided to stay in SA but they went ahead & signed the other 2 guys (Grant Hill in a sign & trade for Big Ben & Chucky Atkins)... Grant Hill went down w/an injury & the rest is history... T-Mac had productive individual seasons but both guys ended up being an albatross on their cap eventually & they traded T-Mac for Steve Francis & Grant Hill was never the same player he was before they signed him.

All of the same is true. It could happen similarly for the Knicks. With John Gabriel working in the front office (like he did in Orlando), you have to believe that this is part of the game plan. In consideration of their Big Three plan, I wouldn't be surprised if they tried to unite the big three here also (assuming some combination of players and picks could get one of the teams to take back Curry in an S&T, as I argued against in another thread. Doubt that could happen.

TMS wrote:

EwingsGlass wrote:

TMS wrote:

Pharzeone wrote:Well it was the summer of 96 and 04. Teams cleared cap space for those guys. I think the situation is similar. Two big names up top and a bunch of guys that are riding the coat tails. Teams were going nuts about clearing cap space for Kobe in 04 including Phoenix which was their original plan. Nash and Rasheed were right behind him.

& Orlando cleared everything in the hopes of uniting Tim Duncan, T-Mac & Grant Hill... Duncan decided to stay in SA but they went ahead & signed the other 2 guys (Grant Hill in a sign & trade for Big Ben & Chucky Atkins)... Grant Hill went down w/an injury & the rest is history... T-Mac had productive individual seasons but both guys ended up being an albatross on their cap eventually & they traded T-Mac for Steve Francis & Grant Hill was never the same player he was before they signed him.

All of the same is true. It could happen similarly for the Knicks. With John Gabriel working in the front office (like he did in Orlando), you have to believe that this is part of the game plan. In consideration of their Big Three plan, I wouldn't be surprised if they tried to unite the big three here also (assuming some combination of players and picks could get one of the teams to take back Curry in an S&T, as I argued against in another thread. Doubt that could happen.

that plan is not a possibility for NY... u can't fit all 3 guys & still field a viable team... you're talking about 3 max contracts on the books & 9 minimum salary players... that's even assuming the fact we could land 1 of the big 3 using Lee, Gallo, Wilson & Curry's expiring, which is also highly unlikely... we can't trade our 2011 pick until we actually draft someone next season so that can't be used as an asset, & we no longer own our 2012 pick.

i think signing Lebron & someone else like T-Mac & making a S&T run at someone like Amare might be the best possible plan... we probably will be able to hold onto at least Gallo & that will leave u with enough cap space to sign some good role players to fill out the roster as well.

Not to be argumentative, but you are wrong. It is possible to have 3 max players with 9 minimimum capholds, particulary if you have two signed first year 2nd round players. After signing the top three, you can use the Veteran's Exception to give an unlimited number minimum contracts to whomever you wish. McGrady wants 1.488M? Deal? Eddie House wants 1.389? Deal. Bender wants 984k? Deal. It is pretty much exactly what Boston did.