TMS wrote:

sebstar wrote:

TMS wrote:right, i don't doubt his integrity about the 2010 clearing cap plan... it's just some of his other inconsistencies that i doubt... we use a pick on a player who he seemingly is high on & a few months later we end up dumping him with other assets to clear cap... if we were trying to dump Fishlips contract last year don't u think a #8 lottery pick would have been more than enough to get it done w/o having to deal away future picks in the process? i do.

A number 8 pick has got value. Hill does not.

dude, can u get off the trashing Jordan Hill kick for just a second & consider the fact that if Donnie had been proactive last year about dumping Fishlips' contract that we likely could have gotten it done without having to give up such a heavy price?

Bro, you keep bristling anytime somebody rags on Hill, but in essence you keep answering the same question you keep asking.

You constantly ask why we had to throw in more assets on top of Hill --- essentially wondering why Hill wasn't enough to get the deal done. It's because Hill is a borderline prospect at best and I'm being nice.

Hill was considered a top 5 lock in the draft until GM's looked at him a bit closer and his stock sunk like a rock. I suspect that had Walsh not drafted him, Hill would have dropped out of the lottery.

It reminds me of Lampe a few years ago. Remember? Lampe was a lottery pick on all the mock drafts, then, during the draft, he free fell all the way to the second round. They blamed it on his contract issues, but that had nothing to do with it as the Knicks were able to bring him over with ease. GM's caught on and knew he sucked.

I suspect that had Walsh not drafted him, Hill would have dropped out of the lottery.

that's silly talk... kid was top 5 on every draft board i saw all the way leading up to draft night... Jay Bilas had him ranked #5 BPA over Tyreke Evans... not saying he was right on that projection, but assuming he would have fallen out of the lottery if we passed on him is an unreasonable assumption.

sebstar wrote:

TMS wrote:

I suspect that had Walsh not drafted him, Hill would have dropped out of the lottery.

that's silly talk... kid was top 5 on every draft board i saw all the way leading up to draft night... Jay Bilas had him ranked #5 BPA over Tyreke Evans... not saying he was right on that projection, but assuming he would have fallen out of the lottery if we passed on him is an unreasonable assumption.

It reminds me of Lampe a few years ago. Remember? Lampe was a lottery pick on all the mock drafts, then, during the draft, he free fell all the way to the second round. They blamed it on his contract issues, but that had nothing to do with it as the Knicks were able to bring him over with ease. GM's caught on and knew he sucked

.

Hill got murked in summer league...

dunno what you're talking about... Hill put up respectable stats in SL.

14.4 pts / 8.2 reb / 1 blk in 30 min over 5 games

just where does that indicate his bust potential?

first ur saying his stock plummetted in the weeks leading up to the draft when that wasn't the case, now you're saying he stunk in Summer League when he put up solid #'s... it's ok not to have liked the pick but let's not make things up to strengthen our arguments.

TMS wrote:

sebstar wrote:

TMS wrote:

I suspect that had Walsh not drafted him, Hill would have dropped out of the lottery.

that's silly talk... kid was top 5 on every draft board i saw all the way leading up to draft night... Jay Bilas had him ranked #5 BPA over Tyreke Evans... not saying he was right on that projection, but assuming he would have fallen out of the lottery if we passed on him is an unreasonable assumption.

It reminds me of Lampe a few years ago. Remember? Lampe was a lottery pick on all the mock drafts, then, during the draft, he free fell all the way to the second round. They blamed it on his contract issues, but that had nothing to do with it as the Knicks were able to bring him over with ease. GM's caught on and knew he sucked

.

Hill got murked in summer league...

dunno what you're talking about... Hill put up respectable stats in SL.

14.4 pts / 8.2 reb / 1 blk in 30 min over 5 games

just where does that indicate his bust potential?

first ur saying his stock plummetted in the weeks leading up to the draft when that wasn't the case, now you're saying he stunk in Summer League when he put up solid #'s... it's ok not to have liked the pick but let's not make things up to strengthen our arguments.

14 pts? Cats that dont even make it to the league routinely average 20 pts a game in those glorified pick up games.

He didnt look good in summer league. I remember that. He was getting pushed around, he was clumsy
--- basically he was a mess outside of a few flashes. Everybody around here was concerned about him after his summer league performances. I think he might have had one or two decent games, but nowhere near what you would expect from a lottery pick. Especially one projected as a top 5. If he were an invite he wouldnt have made the roster, I suspect.

I dont know why you keep fighting the fact that Hill is a very flawed prospect.

I cant really speak on Jennings --- perhaps he was looking to work on certain aspects of his game outside of scoring. Whatever he did in SL it prompted the Bucks to give him major minutes out the gate, so he did his thing.

The point I was trying to make is that anybody can put up numbers in summer league.

But for Hill, I know he largely looked God awful. That was the consensus. Check it, Hill was a questionable prospect that was booed out of the building on draft night. Looked pitiful in summer league and then couldnt get off the bench in the regular season. What is his value going to be around the league? Jeffries has damn near more value, lol.

Really a waste of a season. I really question D'Antoni as a coach... oops, getting off tangent.

Uptown wrote:

TMS wrote:right, i don't doubt his integrity about the 2010 clearing cap plan... it's just some of his other inconsistencies that i doubt... we use a pick on a player who he seemingly is high on & a few months later we end up dumping him with other assets to clear cap... if we were trying to dump Fishlips contract last year don't u think a #8 lottery pick would have been more than enough to get it done w/o having to deal away future picks in the process? i do.

Walsh clearly missed the boat on the Sac-town deal last year. I think it was do or die at the deadline. The window was closing on his 2010 dreams and he was forced to give perhaps a little more than he wanted (2012 draft pick, and Hill) in order to keep the 2010 plan alive. I wasn't happy we included the pick, but Walsh felt compelled to do it.

Houston called Walsh's bluff and he flinched. Personally, I would told Houston that I will give the Hill and a pick swap, or a pick swap and a top-5-7 protected 2012 pick, but there was no way I was giving up Hill and the picks. I think Houston would have caved in the end, because after they traded Landry, they needed some long bodies. Walsh really planned this all wrong and the only way he makes it right is to get Lebron and Bosh.