TMS wrote:

iSergio wrote:I'm just glad Donnie Walsh doesn't operate with this dooms day paranoia like some of you. If you're scared of failure, stay home. Come strong or don't come at all. There is a chance of failure in almost every scenario. But you have to look at the variables and weigh the possibilities. With room to sign 2 MAX FA's, the chances of getting shut out and ending up in the lottery are almost impossible. Did you guys forget where we play? Did you forget what arena we play in? Did you forget the media? This is not Milwaukee or that dump in Jersey. This is New York. FA's are going to line up to sign here. Trust me.

i don't operate with doomsday paranoia... this is a legitimate concern that we won't land Lebron & Wade or Bosh this offseason... ur a fool if you think this is a done deal... u can't operate any successful business on such gambles & expect longterm gains... sooner or later you're going to crash & burn taking such risks... based on this franchise's history there's really nothing for people to feel confident about at the current moment... stop letting the false euphoria of the moment cloud your reason & take a step back & see this trade for what it is... it's a HUGE gamble & one we could very well be left regretting for the next decade or more.

a gamble is a gamble. but what people are doing in here isn't gambling. they're running around screaming that the sky is falling before anything happened yet. there's a difference between being completely negative and hopeless and just take this and having some hope that it will turn out well. people here have already made up their minds on what will happen and that the picks will be in the lottery and that we will suck for eternity. this means you already thought this before the trade. which means that you planned to suck till 2012 and beyond. why are we watching then if there is no hope for the future of this franchise?

TMS wrote:

Childs2Dudley wrote:

TMS wrote:

iSergio wrote:I'm just glad Donnie Walsh doesn't operate with this dooms day paranoia like some of you. If you're scared of failure, stay home. Come strong or don't come at all. There is a chance of failure in almost every scenario. But you have to look at the variables and weigh the possibilities. With room to sign 2 MAX FA's, the chances of getting shut out and ending up in the lottery are almost impossible. Did you guys forget where we play? Did you forget what arena we play in? Did you forget the media? This is not Milwaukee or that dump in Jersey. This is New York. FA's are going to line up to sign here. Trust me.

i don't operate with doomsday paranoia... this is a legitimate concern that we won't land Lebron & Wade or Bosh this offseason... ur a fool if you think this is a done deal... u can't operate any successful business on such gambles & expect longterm gains... sooner or later you're going to crash & burn taking such risks... based on this franchise's history there's really nothing for people to feel confident about at the current moment... stop letting the false euphoria of the moment cloud your reason & take a step back & see this trade for what it is... it's a HUGE gamble & one we could very well be left regretting for the next decade or more.

a gamble is a gamble. but what people are doing in here isn't gambling. they're running around screaming that the sky is falling before anything happened yet. there's a difference between being completely negative and hopeless and just take this and having some hope that it will turn out well. people here have already made up their minds on what will happen and that the picks will be in the lottery and that we will suck for eternity. this means you already thought this before the trade. which means that you planned to suck till 2012 and beyond. why are we watching then if there is no hope for the future of this franchise?

there is not 1 person on this forum that isn't HOPEFUL that Donnie didn't royally fug up by making this trade, not even the most ardent opponents of this trade... u can classify the doubters as chickens running around w/their heads cut off claiming the sky is falling, but the same analogy can be used to describe everyone who's celebrating this trade like we just won a damn championship when no one even knows what Lebron's plans are this summer to begin with... seems to me you've already made up your mind that this trade will reap us the fruit we're all hoping for this summer... i wish i could have on the rose colored glasses, it makes life a lot easier... but i'm a realist & i always weigh the potential negatives along w/the potential positives.

no need to brand me as anything. i didn't make up my mind on anything. but i can at least be more hopeful than repeating the same old "we gave 2 lottery picks" line over and over again. we keep talking about that. i ask again...if we were planning to be the in the lottery in 2011 and 2012 before this trade then why are we still watching this team?

TMS wrote:if u don't like to be branded then i'd appreciate if you'd return the favor & not cast false assumptions about my opinions & intentions when i pose a legitimate concern that i have about this trade... if u don't like listening to repetitive posts about this then stop asking the same repetitive questions.

didn't brand anyone anything. i wasn't talking to you at all. i just quoted your post that had to do with the subject i was discussing. maybe you need to learn not to get offended so easily. as for my questions, you didn't answer them. questions usually need an answer. but they weren't for you. other people are free to answer as well. thanks for your time tho.

Your obviously in the minority, and you do bring a logic to the maddness we call NY Knicks. This franchise a few years ago when its cap was like 120,000,000 and pay a tax of 60,000,000 all while Anucha gate was happening I thought was the biggest failure in the history of professonal sports from both a financial and winning % perspective.

This is a big gamble or Walsh has been forwarned that having this cap room, and they will come.

Its bold, its epic and its NY Knicks!

Your not by any measure out of line! Redundant perhaps, but no crime in that!

"I thought it was a good bet, but I'm not going to limit it to just this year. In other words, this puts the franchise in a position where it can build a contending team. That's what the goal was."

"Where we got it to [before the McGrady trade] I thought was realistic, but to add this onto it is a little more than I thought we could do. I never said we were after two max [players], and I didn't know if it would add up to that, but this could now, I guess."

"I don't know who is going to be out there. I know what the free agent list is, and as soon as we get to it, we'll be prepared," Walsh said, "and if you don't get 'em this year, then maybe I won't be here but it'll be better for the guy coming in next."

From http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/13615/walsh-exceeded-his-own-cap-clearing-expectations

So all I'm saying is that if you are getting hyped for this "2 Max FA" plan we supposedly all want, we are getting hyped off of words that aren't coming out of Donnie's mouth.

Markji wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:But while we are all focusing on these big names, Donnie supposedly isn't concentrating on these names. It's all about flexibility. So all I'm saying is if everybody else is fixated on LeBron, Wade or bust, then we aren't listening to the words Donnie's saying:

"I thought it was a good bet, but I'm not going to limit it to just this year. In other words, this puts the franchise in a position where it can build a contending team. That's what the goal was."

"Where we got it to [before the McGrady trade] I thought was realistic, but to add this onto it is a little more than I thought we could do. I never said we were after two max [players], and I didn't know if it would add up to that, but this could now, I guess."

"I don't know who is going to be out there. I know what the free agent list is, and as soon as we get to it, we'll be prepared," Walsh said, "and if you don't get 'em this year, then maybe I won't be here but it'll be better for the guy coming in next."

From http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/13615/walsh-exceeded-his-own-cap-clearing-expectations

So all I'm saying is that if you are getting hyped for this "2 Max FA" plan we supposedly all want, we are getting hyped off of words that aren't coming out of Donnie's mouth.

If we don't get the 2 max top FA in 2010, then we didn't need to trade Jeffries. His contract expires next year....as does Curry's. We could have kept Hill and all of our draft picks. This seemed like the smarter way to have gone at the deadline since the other teams were demanding way above market price. Jeffries has only 1 freaking year left at $6.8 mil.

Also, I am concerned with Donnie's remark that

"if you don't get 'em this year, then maybe I won't be here..."

Why would he leave when he was signed for 4 years and has only been here less than 2 years?
IMO, I think Dolan was involved in pushing to accept the Jeffries trade at any cost, and Donnie is fed up with Dolan. Just speculation but Donnie is known to be conservative - he isn't an "All in" type of guy gambling with giving picks with virtually no protection. Anyway, it is done so now we can only hope and pray.

This is the logical post--thank you. There is multiple ways to make a team better--no matter what was going to happen--we were going to be involved heavily into FA in 2010 and 2011. What exactly was the panic to move Jefferies and not even attempt to give Hill a chance? I think you are right--I think this is a very similar deal that we did before with he picks---I would not even be surprised if Dolan was being counseled by Isiah on this. This was Dolan. It's not being negative when you rationale think we just gave up a potential landmine of high quality assets for what????????? 9mm more in cap space but guess what--even if we sign two FAS to max---were still in a huge bind. If Lebron really wanted to come here one spot was plenty--either he wants to come or he doesnt. I think there is 3/100 chance he comes here--thats it's. This team is just not good enough if you listen to what lebron says.
I mean being out of the 2010 draft--isnt that enough evidence NOT to do his--what if we could get Wall or Turner etc.. these guys are all star types right off the bat. Its too much were giving away.

I bet Walsh was embarrassed by this deal.

DrAlphaeus wrote:But while we are all focusing on these big names, Donnie supposedly isn't concentrating on these names. It's all about flexibility. So all I'm saying is if everybody else is fixated on LeBron, Wade or bust, then we aren't listening to the words Donnie's saying:

"I thought it was a good bet, but I'm not going to limit it to just this year. In other words, this puts the franchise in a position where it can build a contending team. That's what the goal was."

"Where we got it to [before the McGrady trade] I thought was realistic, but to add this onto it is a little more than I thought we could do. I never said we were after two max [players], and I didn't know if it would add up to that, but this could now, I guess."

"I don't know who is going to be out there. I know what the free agent list is, and as soon as we get to it, we'll be prepared," Walsh said, "and if you don't get 'em this year, then maybe I won't be here but it'll be better for the guy coming in next."

From http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/13615/walsh-exceeded-his-own-cap-clearing-expectations

So all I'm saying is that if you are getting hyped for this "2 Max FA" plan we supposedly all want, we are getting hyped off of words that aren't coming out of Donnie's mouth.

C'mon, fam. Of course he's not going to tip his hand. Why give people a heads up or flirt with tampering? No way he gives up all those picks if he wasnt trying to get two max free agents this summer. LOL at him playing stupid.

GM's know what he's up to, thats why Morey busted his balls. He knew Walsh had to make this deal

Markji wrote:So all I'm saying is that if you are getting hyped for this "2 Max FA" plan we supposedly all want, we are getting hyped off of words that aren't coming out of Donnie's mouth.
If we don't get the 2 max top FA in 2010, then we didn't need to trade Jeffries. His contract expires next year....as does Curry's. We could have kept Hill and all of our draft picks. This seemed like the smarter way to have gone at the deadline since the other teams were demanding way above market price. Jeffries has only 1 freaking year left at $6.8 mil.

Also, I am concerned with Donnie's remark that

"if you don't get 'em this year, then maybe I won't be here..."

Why would he leave when he was signed for 4 years and has only been here less than 2 years?
IMO, I think Dolan was involved in pushing to accept the Jeffries trade at any cost, and Donnie is fed up with Dolan. Just speculation but Donnie is known to be conservative - he isn't an "All in" type of guy gambling with giving picks with virtually no protection. Anyway, it is done so now we can only hope and pray.

Bold part is exactly on the mark and what I was going to say. You beat me to it.
Until today, I was ok with taking it slow. I was ok waiting till 2011 if need be.
But now Donnie shot his wad. There's no more 2011. The only reason to do today's trade
was to swing for the fences in 2010. If he doesn't come home with 2 worthy max contracts or
1 worthy max + 2 other very good players, he should be fired.

TMS wrote:

nixluva wrote:Hey you guys that are down on this have a blast sulking in the corner with each other, but don't expect the rest of us to not be happy about the very real chance to make a major improvements to this team. No matter what happens we are out of cap hell and we have Major options to improve the team from here. Not in the draft, but then we had to give up something for the chance to get the leagues best players, coming from where we were.

we were already out of cap hell... there was no need to go all in on a panic ass move like this & give up all our future assets for the 2 years... for everyone's sake, Lebron & Wade better end up in a Knicks' uniform this summer, that's all i gotta say.

or at least one of the two... you know with either guy, your team will get enough whistles from the refs to win you enough games to get into the playoffs..