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this team is so unorganized, so poorly coached with mosh posh talent
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tkf
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10/16/2003  4:15 PM
Posted by playa2:

I support the youth movement and understand what you are saying. But looky here partna rookies 22-23 years old can make impact by seasons end if they got game. 18 yr olds don't! I don't see lampe as a guy who can compete with grown men. If you have an 18 year old that played only in a junior league, played a perimeter position or game, why try and teach him to play the post in the NBA against the worlds biggest and baddest PF and Centers in the world. Lampe is two slow likely to play SF, and not enough power to play PF just yet, CMON MAN LETS BE REAL I'M TALKING REGULAR SEASON PLAY.

playa when do fans like you expect the knicks to take their lumps, you have to play these rooks in order for them to get better, even if you make a point to get them in there for 10 minutes, this knick team is not a playoff team that will take a step back if they do so, we are a lottery team that should be developing talent for the future. It is this same thinking that prompted Layden to trade for Dice, now nene is quickly developing a game and I would love to have him on our frontline this year.... We are going to have to take our lumps man, we can't let these guys rot on the bench, not for Knight, Doleac, and Anderson, and sure as hell not spoon!!
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
AUTOADVERT
playa2
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10/16/2003  4:26 PM
TKF you play them when you have to TEAMS LIKE CHICAGO, are taking their lumps and playing them, because they had Jordan and crew win a few titles. But the problem is teams take on that losing mentality playing all those youngbloods, when do they learn how to win? How many excuses do you have to make until they grow up and compete AND START WINNING night in and night out? It back fired in Chicago's face, unless you consider highlite films of dunks and alley oops as learning how to win.
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
dodger78
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10/16/2003  6:07 PM
Thanks tkf!

Playa when you say that our rookies should ride the pine, that means that you think they cant produce the way Knight, Spoon, Eisley etc. can, right? And thats the point im sure they would even in their rookie season produce min. that much!!!
And if they did, there would be no difference in the outcome of the season other than us having developed some talent while getting the same output instead of letting them rot and playing "save" by keeping our "veteran" roster!

Like there was said before nobodys crazy enough to want them to get minutes from our good players, but we sure as hell dont have many of those!!!
Vmart
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10/16/2003  6:16 PM
You have to get the rooks to play at least 10 minutes a game. No more or no less. Garbage minutes excluded of course. These guys need the experience for the better. I don't want to see another Frank Williams case. He should have played regualarly for sure last year at least 10 minutes a game. This year he would have been ready to do damage. I don't like people talkin about a player age that a moot point. These guys are built like they are 25 years old. Just have to look to last year and see player make impacts that were in their teens. Nene, Amare and before that Parker he played well for SA last year and year before that and he was what 19. You have to play them riding them on the bench is a waste of their NBA life because you don't learn to deal with a cross over watching from the bench. If watching is the way to get experience then I'm the Jordan of basketball.
tkf
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10/16/2003  7:42 PM
Posted by playa2:

TKF you play them when you have to TEAMS LIKE CHICAGO, are taking their lumps and playing them, because they had Jordan and crew win a few titles. But the problem is teams take on that losing mentality playing all those youngbloods, when do they learn how to win? How many excuses do you have to make until they grow up and compete AND START WINNING night in and night out? It back fired in Chicago's face, unless you consider highlite films of dunks and alley oops as learning how to win.

Playa I disagree, the chicago rookies are improving and soon they will be good players and still very young, not every team had the success of the Bulls with Jordan but I ask you, what does NY gain by playing Anderson, spoon and Knight and by sitting Lampe and sweetney?

Answer that!!
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
playa2
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10/16/2003  10:33 PM
You keep saying they are improving , but do they know how to win while they are improving? NO. Who are you talking to man ? Spoon and Anderson plays better defense than 2 sweetney's and 4 lampes. In the nba guys learn how to win because they play defense, most rookies couldn't guard a wall.The game is faster the guys are stronger and nobody respects you anymore you're not the big senior on campus. Lampe played on a "JUNIOR TEAM" this is the NBA MAN.
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
knickgeek
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10/16/2003  10:53 PM
I think you missed the point, No one wants to sit Houston and Dice for Vranes, come on man, those are our best players, but what we want to do is sit the marginally talented overpaid scrubs we have and play sweetney and Lampe, that is what other organizations who have a firm grasp and understanding of their talent level do...

Well, since you put it that way.... I would like to see Frank Williams as the backup point guard this year. And I gotta admit that Spoon, Knight, et al. are pretty uninspiring.
technomaster
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10/17/2003  12:52 AM
One thing the Knicks didn't do was add more athleticism. They added plenty of youth, but none of them are particularly athletic (as far as NBA players go, anyway).

We didn't add any speedy players, and with the loss of Sprewell... we'll have to rely on an efficient power game. We'll be okay if McDyess plays.. but without him, I don't think we're markedly better than last year. The additions of Lampe/Sweetney/FW/Vranes will likely affect us more a year or two from now.
“That was two, two from the heart.” - John Starks
tkf
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10/17/2003  1:12 AM
Posted by playa2:

You keep saying they are improving , but do they know how to win while they are improving? NO. Who are you talking to man ? Spoon and Anderson plays better defense than 2 sweetney's and 4 lampes. In the nba guys learn how to win because they play defense, most rookies couldn't guard a wall.The game is faster the guys are stronger and nobody respects you anymore you're not the big senior on campus. Lampe played on a "JUNIOR TEAM" this is the NBA MAN.

playa stop being foolish, the knicks are not winning with spoon and Anderson and quit the BS!! Spoon and Anderson can't guard anyone man!! That is foolish, you are right this is the NBA but you must score to win, period, Skill players win games not fat undersized PF's and not unskilled but athletic SF's either. I would play sweetney and Lampe over those two any day of the week,because the fact is that the knicks are not going any where with spoon and anderson, those guys suck man!!!
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
playa2
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10/17/2003  7:56 AM
TKF why do you think your opinion is better than everybody else? Listen up man you're hardheaded. With the knicks up by one with ten seconds to play with opposing team has the ball who do you want playing defense lampe or shandon anderson. See you aren't thinking man when all the knicks come back we have guys who can score Houston, KVH ,KT etc.., but do we have guys who can stop anyone. Techno hit it right on point, we didn't draft anybody quick or athletic. Your argument and whining is mute, Dolan and crew doesn't support your views because they are trying to win "THIS YR" not just 2 yrs down the road. Why is that so hard to understand? Without sweetney and Lampe we almost made the playoffs and now we add Mutumbo and Vanhorn +(hopefully) Dice and you think brass is gonna put trust in raw rookie in Lampe who played on a junior team overseas? I like his range for a big man, but having a understanding of knicks brass I won't even waste my breath trying to create some wild idea that a young guy who can only contribute on offense if that, is gonna play ahead of two way player Anderson. I like sweetney chances better than Lampe for this yr, I told you 18yr olds don't get run in the NBA unless they are Lebron James!
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
jazz74
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10/17/2003  8:29 AM
playa, you are right about lampe being a marginal defender. but anderson and eisley are'nt exactly defensive stoppers either. the fact remains that the best players should play period. we want to win. yeah, it will be nice to have lampe and sweetney playing significant minutes but it is not going to happen. is this a bad thing? no. i think them sitting on the pine and learning how to play post from mutumbo and dice will prepare tham for the future instead of throwing them in the deep end and seeing what happens. people are pointing to pheonix of last year and stoudamire. you think he would have had playing time if googs was'nt hurt? amare had an opportunity and made an immediate impact. this is rare. sweetney and lampe are more fundamentals. they are not athletic so they must learn the ins and outs of the game to be effective. with this team and their injuries, they will have their chance. we need to be patient and see what they will do with it.
playa2
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10/17/2003  9:33 AM
I couldn't have said it any better Jazz.

THANK YOU
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
tkf
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10/17/2003  12:18 PM
Posted by playa2:

I couldn't have said it any better Jazz.

THANK YOU

playa, again you show your foolishness, you are a sucker if you believe that this is a playoff team, and are you just satisfied with making the playoffs and exiting early? come on man, there is no reason why Sweetney and Lampe should not be playing, then you get someone to agree with you that they are better served riding the bench behind KVH and Mutombo, Damn you are so dense, what are they going to learn from these two guys on the bench, that they can't learn playing on the floor. Playa it is not a matter or opinion, these last two years have shown me everything I need to know, and that is that we need to start now developing players. How long are we going to continue with this game of trying to win on the fly? of trying to build the foundation of a playoff team with aging players with aging skills.....
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
NYK8
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10/17/2003  8:41 PM
Wait a second this team right now IS a playoff team.A healthy Dice would put the Knicks in the 4-5 spots and with out 7-8 spots.I believe Houston will be a top 10 scoring threat in the league.Thats all you really need with a good supporting staff.Mutombo looks like he hasn't lost a step cuz he was knockin down them hook shots with one eyes closed.I dont have to say nothin about his "D".So there goes #1 supporting staff.Thomas and his toughness is all we need.He wont be scoring like he did last year but his "D" n rebs help.There is ur #2.KVH let me see,he's been playing a respectable game and what i've been exspecting of him really ur #3.I cant say nothin about Dice due to injury but if he can contribute forget it.We up there in the playoffs.Now on behalf of the rookies.We all want to see them play and givin the opportunity to step up there game but i dont see it not this year.The organization and MSG wants to make money.That would happen buy winning.The rooks aren't there yet.If the rookies get the playing time u guys would like to see.MSG attendence would look like a preseason game.MSG is not having it.We losing now cuz were not a complete team out there and without our team leader to take control.The teams that the Knicks faced did.The only way i see the rookies playing and getting the proper minutes is if Dice gets hurt or Thomas is traded simple.F.Will should be our backup we can settle with him cuz he's played the bench routine and shows hes ready.Besides i think Eisley is a BUMMMMM.Which i say Sweetney and Lampe should have the bench roll,at least for 1yr.Im not sayin dont play them at all so dont get it twisted.
!!!Knicks!!!
tkf
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10/17/2003  11:21 PM
You see there are a lot of ifs in your post NYK: If Houston has another career year, If Dice returns to his old self, the latter is a big if, the knicks need depth and a bench, and if the rooks are not playing how can they contribute? without all these things falling into place we are not a playoff team!!! period!!

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
playa2
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10/17/2003  11:33 PM
TKF write a letter to Dolan , maybe he can send you some tickets and bring you up from Atlanta so you can come watch a game live. I wanna hear you when NY PLAYS WELL THIS YR.
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
tkf
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10/18/2003  10:56 AM
Posted by playa2:

TKF write a letter to Dolan , maybe he can send you some tickets and bring you up from Atlanta so you can come watch a game live. I wanna hear you when NY PLAYS WELL THIS YR.

playa don't be stupid, I want the knicks to win, but you need depth to do that and I rather see our dept consist of sweetney, and Lampe, rather than the scrubs knight, spoon, and anderson...
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
OldFan
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10/18/2003  10:37 PM
I like our draft picks - but I don't think you can expect much from them this year.

Lampe - is 18 has no experience against players any where near NBA level. Kobe only played 15 minutes a night his first year and he was far more developed as a player then Lampe. Playing him when he is totally over matched is as likely to hurt his development as help it.

Sweeney - I had more hope for but he has not shown it so far - you have to earn playing time.

F. Williams - He is essentially a rookie. Very few low first round point guards contribute much early in there careers. If he shows it fine - but he hasn't. At this point Ward and Eisley are better then he is.

As for our current role players - they're not great but KT, Ward, Eisley, Spoon and Anderson have all managed to get playing times on teams much better then the current Knicks. Are some of them vastly overpaid yes - but they're not that bad. The problem is they are role players - not major contributers and the last few years they've been asked to be major contributers because all that we had was Spree and Houston.

If Motumbo and Dice can return and play good enough to start then KT, Spoon and Anderson will be in roles they can handle. Neither Ward or Eisely is a starter at this point and I'd Love to see F. Williams beat one of them (or my some miracle) both of them out - but I think it's unlikely.

this team is so unorganized, so poorly coached with mosh posh talent

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