i think u have to trade Jamal whether he chooses to opt out or not... can't just let a 20 ppg scorer leave for nothing in return... at the very least u can still get a decent draft pick for a guy like Jamal... he can help a lot of teams that may be looking to add another scorer.

i wouldn't mind holding onto him if we can make moves in other areas to bring in a shotblocking C either.

Posted by TMS:

i think u have to trade Jamal whether he chooses to opt out or not... can't just let a 20 ppg scorer leave for nothing in return... at the very least u can still get a decent draft pick for a guy like Jamal... he can help a lot of teams that may be looking to add another scorer.

i wouldn't mind holding onto him if we can make moves in other areas to bring in a shotblocking C either.

It's got to be 2010 contracts coming back at the most and the addition of a draft pick and/or a nice young player. Otherwise I don't see the benefit of forcing a deal. I kind of liken Jamal potentially opting out and walking away for nothing the way I view Malik or Marbury being allowed to expire. Unless you're getting a golden opportunity in return there shouldn't be any trade.

I like Crawford but I know that he isn't a reliable pure shooter and that for the direction we are going and the goal we have we need a different player. That means you have to try to either trade him at some point or work a sign- and-trade if he opts out. We definitely need to get value out of him, preferably a young player not so far away to contribute at an NBA level. And remember that in this system pure shooters are vital, so somehow, somewhere we would need to find a good shooting guard.

Posted by jaydh:

Posted by crzymdups:

if jamal leaves, we better get a volume scorer in the draft or thru another trade or something, because this team would be horrendous without him. as much as people are giving zach credit, jamal has been the mvp this season.

nate can/will replace JC easily.

I seriously doubt that. Nate has yet to see a double team like Jamal nor had the best defender on each team try to guard him. Jamal has score against the best defenders in the league. Nate has yet to be challenged like that.

i don't think Nate can create his own shot the way Jamal can... he's quick & he's hard to guard but he isn't nearly as good shooting off the dribble as Jamal is... he's much better coming off screens, penetrating into the lane & spotting up for open J's.

Posted by BRIGGS:

That is the whole gig--we can't let Crawford walk. You cant let a 20 point scorer go like that if you want to attract a big time fa. If they have a plan it should be Chris Bosh--that should be the target player for this team. We need to keep many of the players we have and add that 7 footer type who can give us the defense in the middle as well.

I think you trade him before you let him walk. But you do not resign him if he opts out. He is a deadly scorer, but his defense sucks balls. Abd he is a streaky shooter. I think he is the captain of this team, but I do not believe he is a franchise player. This team is playing itself into cap space in 2010.

Crawford opts out.
A playoff bound team will put together a package for Randolph
Curry + Lee = tradeable.
Jeffries + Nate might be tradeable.
Voila... no more 2010 salary beyond rookie contracts.

Give Utah this year's pick...
develop chandler and gallo next year at the sf and pf positions.
Then play FA Frenzy in 2010. you have room for 2 top free agents and a lottery pick. fill in the team with however many vets you need who want to win a ring... vets minimum.

Posted by EwingsGlass:

Posted by BRIGGS:

That is the whole gig--we can't let Crawford walk. You cant let a 20 point scorer go like that if you want to attract a big time fa. If they have a plan it should be Chris Bosh--that should be the target player for this team. We need to keep many of the players we have and add that 7 footer type who can give us the defense in the middle as well.

I think you trade him before you let him walk. But you do not resign him if he opts out. He is a deadly scorer, but his defense sucks balls. Abd he is a streaky shooter. I think he is the captain of this team, but I do not believe he is a franchise player. This team is playing itself into cap space in 2010.

Crawford opts out.
A playoff bound team will put together a package for Randolph
Curry + Lee = tradeable.
Jeffries + Nate might be tradeable.
Voila... no more 2010 salary beyond rookie contracts.

Give Utah this year's pick...
develop chandler and gallo next year at the sf and pf positions.
Then play FA Frenzy in 2010. you have room for 2 top free agents and a lottery pick. fill in the team with however many vets you need who want to win a ring... vets minimum.

There are a couple of things the Knicks can do with Jamal--there is no doubt about it--there is no way an agent would be doing his job by leaving him with only 19mm in guaranteed cash[assuming he is healthy and has a solid year--meaning 21-22 points 44-45% 4-5 a-3 r


A. They can approach him with an extension to his contract. They can say we want to add 4 years 34mm with a team option with a 1 mm dollar buyout on the last year giving him basically a 5 year 45mm$ contract[as i said probably fair value] . Getting Jamal at an average of 9mm for 5 years is probably his value on the light side if he continues his play


B We can S+T him looking for multiple assets


C We can rip up the contract and sign him to a whole new one


D We can let him go for nothing.



Don't listen to anyone saying he won't opt out of 19mm unless he is injured[Jamal might not admit it but if he came to this forum and was being honest he would say it's a no-brainer as well sans injury--if he has even close to a solid year--he wont sit with 19mm guaranteed--no one would. He is better than an MLE player--so his value will end up in the 8-11 range imho. If we can get him for 9 for 5 3 years concurrent to his existing--not bad. There is no way--no how this franchise can just allow
JC to walk

If we allow him to walk--that puts the franchise back 20 pegs. We have waited on his development for 3 years+ and now he is looking like he has entered his prime in a great system for us. The coach will not go for it unless something very interesting was coming back.


Also--Jamal is a number already accounted for on the cap in 2010. We could also re-do his deal like I said above where we front load the contract and his 10mm 2010 contract could be alleviated to roughly 7 knocking off 3mm$

i.e 6 years 54mm with team option on the last year with a 1mm $ buyout. You can front load 25%
so it would look something like 12 7 8 9 9 9 6 yrs 54$


[Edited by - BRIGGS on 11-14-2008 10:25 AM]

Posted by jazz74:

look, there is a big possiblity that crawford can still be in the top 20 in scoring by the end of the year and avg. over 20ppg. that is valuable for a club that maybe one piece away from contending with the need for outside shooting ( philly?). so, if his stats hold, yeah, crawford should opt out.

just like everyone will be wanting stephen jackson and his 20+ppg....oh yea, he's shooting less than 40%. crawford has had a nice stretch, but its only 8 games into the season. Who have the knicks really played of any significance? 8 seasons of the same, but a good 8 game stretch to start season 9 and all of a sudden he's a better shooter than allan houston.....

I mean you really have to ask yourself.. where will we ever find another guy to shoot 20 jumpers a game?

Posted by BRIGGS:

Posted by EwingsGlass:

Posted by BRIGGS:

That is the whole gig--we can't let Crawford walk. You cant let a 20 point scorer go like that if you want to attract a big time fa. If they have a plan it should be Chris Bosh--that should be the target player for this team. We need to keep many of the players we have and add that 7 footer type who can give us the defense in the middle as well.

I think you trade him before you let him walk. But you do not resign him if he opts out. He is a deadly scorer, but his defense sucks balls. Abd he is a streaky shooter. I think he is the captain of this team, but I do not believe he is a franchise player. This team is playing itself into cap space in 2010.

Crawford opts out.
A playoff bound team will put together a package for Randolph
Curry + Lee = tradeable.
Jeffries + Nate might be tradeable.
Voila... no more 2010 salary beyond rookie contracts.

Give Utah this year's pick...
develop chandler and gallo next year at the sf and pf positions.
Then play FA Frenzy in 2010. you have room for 2 top free agents and a lottery pick. fill in the team with however many vets you need who want to win a ring... vets minimum.

There are a couple of things the Knicks can do with Jamal--there is no doubt about it--there is no way an agent would be doing his job by leaving him with only 19mm in guaranteed cash[assuming he is healthy and has a solid year--meaning 21-22 points 44-45% 4-5 a-3 r


A. They can approach him with an extension to his contract. They can say we want to add 4 years 34mm with a team option with a 1 mm dollar buyout on the last year giving him basically a 5 year 45mm$ contract[as i said probably fair value] . Getting Jamal at an average of 9mm for 5 years is probably his value on the light side if he continues his play


B We can S+T him looking for multiple assets


C We can rip up the contract and sign him to a whole new one


D We can let him go for nothing.



Don't listen to anyone saying he won't opt out of 19mm unless he is injured[Jamal might not admit it but if he came to this forum and was being honest he would say it's a no-brainer as well sans injury--if he has even close to a solid year--he wont sit with 19mm guaranteed--no one would. He is better than an MLE player--so his value will end up in the 8-11 range imho. If we can get him for 9 for 5 3 years concurrent to his existing--not bad. There is no way--no how this franchise can just allow
JC to walk

If we allow him to walk--that puts the franchise back 20 pegs. We have waited on his development for 3 years+ and now he is looking like he has entered his prime in a great system for us. The coach will not go for it unless something very interesting was coming back.


Also--Jamal is a number already accounted for on the cap in 2010. We could also re-do his deal like I said above where we front load the contract and his 10mm 2010 contract could be alleviated to roughly 7 knocking off 3mm$

i.e 6 years 54mm with team option on the last year with a 1mm $ buyout. You can front load 25%
so it would look something like 12 7 8 9 9 9 6 yrs 54$


[Edited by - BRIGGS on 11-14-2008 10:25 AM]

I guess I am in the category of folks who doubt Crawford brings enough to the table to re-sign him. MikeD's system can make Raja Bell look good. But, I think the better he plays, the more assets the Knicks can get if they pawn him off to a contender. I like the logic of restructuring his contract, if you are going to commit to him as part of the big picture... I just don't know if he is the guy we want at the 2... I think there are lots of players who are just as capable.