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If obama doesnt take hillary as his running mate he will get blown out
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holfresh
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8/21/2008  5:35 PM
It's time this country move on from the Bush's and Clintons...They have been in control of this country over the last 20 years...This isn't a republic, it's a democracy...The Clintons has proven to be all about the Clintons... They are all about self promotion..Evidence by the fact that they negotiated a roll call in Hilary's honor on what should had been Obama's day in the sun...They won't let it go either...Billiary arrogance cost them the election...Bill cannot bring himself to this day to say that Obama would be a good President...Obama pisses me off as well being nice to these people...

Obama needs a hard hitting running mate with foreign policy cred that trumps McCain...Enters Wesley Clark...Clark has already dissed McCain on his qualifications on being a foreign policy strategist...Clark has already said being shot down does not qualify you to lead a country...It's the heart of McCain's campaign...Clark is a man of much more military credentials than McCain..McCain has no comeback to Clark because Clark has served at a higher level than McCain in the military...

The Clinton reminds me of Steph Marbury...Billiary and Marbs had all the talent and could have been one of the better Presidents/players in the history of this country, had they not veered off on a selfish course that ultimately undermined his Presidency/team...In the face of his own wrongdoing, he was defiant...Both Billiary and Marbury still thinks they are the best and someone owes them something...They can't wait to insert a foot into their own mouths at any given interview...They both still think they should lead when the country/team is well ready to move on without them...They are still trying to reinvent themselves to play more even though it obvious their careers/white house run is over...Enough, they are both poisonous and need to be retired for the collected good of the country/team...The time has come!!!..Move On!!!
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EnySpree
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8/21/2008  5:39 PM
Posted by Elite:

wow you guys are nuts, stick to basketball. If he doesn't take Hillary he will get blown out?? you can't be serious. What a joke LOL

Personally, I think political lingo is non-sense. Everyone wants to be down wit it.

Above all I said was "I'm an independant thinker.......am I even allowed to vote?" just joking and I offended 2 people.

Politics is non-sense.......how bout just do the right thing by the people?
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BigC
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8/21/2008  5:54 PM
What are people going to say if Obama wins?
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Markji
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8/21/2008  5:58 PM
If Obama we regoing to take Hillary as VP, he would have announced it long ago. He is thinking of someone else. While Hillary will help with the female vote and help the election, she(with Bill) and Obama aren't close. Obama wants to distance himself from them and start his own "change" in US governance, not bring back the old.

I like Richardson, as stated earlier, but Bagh is the frontrunner, and from a larger, crucial state.
The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
Bonn1997
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8/21/2008  6:09 PM
Posted by EnySpree:
Posted by Elite:

wow you guys are nuts, stick to basketball. If he doesn't take Hillary he will get blown out?? you can't be serious. What a joke LOL

Personally, I think political lingo is non-sense. Everyone wants to be down wit it.

Above all I said was "I'm an independant thinker.......am I even allowed to vote?" just joking and I offended 2 people.

Politics is non-sense.......how bout just do the right thing by the people?

You didn't offend me. I (apparently mistakenly) thought that I had offended you.
Paladin55
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8/21/2008  6:42 PM
Posted by BigC:

What are people going to say if Obama wins?

It is about time!
No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
EnySpree
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8/21/2008  6:46 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by EnySpree:
Posted by Elite:

wow you guys are nuts, stick to basketball. If he doesn't take Hillary he will get blown out?? you can't be serious. What a joke LOL

Personally, I think political lingo is non-sense. Everyone wants to be down wit it.

Above all I said was "I'm an independant thinker.......am I even allowed to vote?" just joking and I offended 2 people.

Politics is non-sense.......how bout just do the right thing by the people?

You didn't offend me. I (apparently mistakenly) thought that I had offended you.

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Elite
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8/21/2008  7:11 PM
i was responding to briggs mostly.......
playa2
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8/21/2008  8:57 PM
Posted by BigC:

What are people going to say if Obama wins?

He will need 24 hrs a day police protection and bullet proof pajamas.

This is still america. If JFK and Martin Luther King didn't make it with the neo-cons Obama won't stand a chance without being assasinated.

JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
Elite
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8/21/2008  11:57 PM
Posted by playa2:
Posted by BigC:

What are people going to say if Obama wins?

He will need 24 hrs a day police protection and bullet proof pajamas.

This is still america. If JFK and Martin Luther King didn't make it with the neo-cons Obama won't stand a chance without being assasinated.


Times are changing, if that were to happen I think there would be a civil war in America.... Poeple would NOT stand for it if Obama got hurt the LA Rodney King Riots x 500000000

u heard nas... "KKK is like what the ****??? loadin they guns up... Loadin up mines too... ready to ride cuz im ridin wit my crew, he dies we die too."

By the way..... McCain is senial. Anyone who thinks he can win is delusional.

majorleads
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8/22/2008  12:14 AM

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GKFv2
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8/22/2008  12:59 AM
Wasn't presidential material? LOL.

So I'm guessing you're rooting for John "Bush II" McCain to win this election?
Thank you, Rick Brunson.
Elite
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8/22/2008  1:59 AM
this is a little depressing.......... I sincerely thought the only people in america not voting for Obama were racist.
playa2
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8/22/2008  5:51 AM
If you choose to vote for mccain in the up coming election, you are basically alluding to Bush and his policies are good enough for you with 4 more yrs of the same under mccain.

JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
TheSage
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8/22/2008  7:54 AM
Posted by playa2:

If you choose to vote for mccain in the up coming election, you are basically alluding to Bush and his policies are good enough for you with 4 more yrs of the same under mccain.

That is is a totally inane statement. It completely disregards McCain's substantial record in the Senate and has no factual basis. Now let's look at the Obama record-oh-there is no record. His campaign suggests a series of backtracking every time he takes a position that is shown to be disastrous, He has 3 years on the national scene with NO significant contribution. he is a wonderful orator without substance.

If I may quote a truly great leader let us judge a man by the content of his character, not the color of his skin-on that basis there is only one who has the charater and background to lead and it is not Mr. Obama. Take out the historically disproportionate support he is receiving from African Americans and MCain would be the clear leader in the polls. I don't agree with many of Mr. Mc Cain stated positions (some of which have been asserted to pacify certain groups within his party) but I would not not pick an intern to perform surgery and that is exactly what Mr. Obama is in national politics-an intern.



PresIke
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8/22/2008  7:59 AM
The Candidate We Still Don’t Know

By FRANK RICH

AS I went on vacation at the end of July, Barack Obama was leading John McCain by three to four percentage points in national polls. When I returned last week he still was. But lo and behold, a whole new plot twist had rolled off the bloviation assembly line in those intervening two weeks: Obama had lost the election!

The poor guy should be winning in a landslide against the despised party of Bush-Cheney, and he’s not. He should be passing the 50 percent mark in polls, and he’s not. He’s been done in by that ad with Britney and Paris and by a new international crisis that allows McCain to again flex his Manchurian Candidate military cred. Let the neocons identify a new battleground for igniting World War III, whether Baghdad or Tehran or Moscow, and McCain gets with the program as if Angela Lansbury has just dealt him the Queen of Hearts.

Obama has also been defeated by racism (again). He can’t connect and “close the deal” with ordinary Americans too doltish to comprehend a multicultural biography that includes what Cokie Roberts of ABC News has damned as the “foreign, exotic place” of Hawaii. As The Economist sums up the received wisdom, “lunch-pail Ohio Democrats” find Obama’s ideas of change “airy-fairy” and are all asking, “Who on earth is this guy?”

It seems almost churlish to look at some actual facts. No presidential candidate was breaking the 50 percent mark in mid-August polls in 2004 or 2000. Obama’s average lead of three to four points is marginally larger than both John Kerry’s and Al Gore’s leads then (each was winning by one point in Gallup surveys). Obama is also ahead of Ronald Reagan in mid-August 1980 (40 percent to Jimmy Carter’s 46). At Pollster.com, which aggregates polls and gauges the electoral count, Obama as of Friday stood at 284 electoral votes, McCain at 169. That means McCain could win all 85 electoral votes in current toss-up states and still lose the election.

Yet surely, we keep hearing, Obama should be running away with the thing. Even Michael Dukakis was beating the first George Bush by 17 percentage points in the summer of 1988. Of course, were Obama ahead by 17 points today, the same prognosticators now fussing over his narrow lead would be predicting that the arrogant and presumptuous Obama was destined to squander that landslide on vacation and tank just like his hapless predecessor.

The truth is we have no idea what will happen in November. But for the sake of argument, let’s posit that one thread of the Obama-is-doomed scenario is right: His lead should be huge in a year when the G.O.P. is in such disrepute that at least eight of the party’s own senatorial incumbents are skipping their own convention, the fail-safe way to avoid being caught near the Larry Craig Memorial Men’s Room at the Twin Cities airport.

So why isn’t Obama romping? The obvious answer — and both the excessively genteel Obama campaign and a too-compliant press bear responsibility for it — is that the public doesn’t know who on earth John McCain is. The most revealing poll this month by far is the Pew Research Center survey finding that 48 percent of Americans feel they’re “hearing too much” about Obama. Pew found that only 26 percent feel that way about McCain, and that nearly 4 in 10 Americans feel they hear too little about him. It’s past time for that pressing educational need to be met.

What is widely known is the skin-deep, out-of-date McCain image. As this fairy tale has it, the hero who survived the Hanoi Hilton has stood up as rebelliously in Washington as he did to his Vietnamese captors. He strenuously opposed the execution of the Iraq war; he slammed the president’s response to Katrina; he fought the “agents of intolerance” of the religious right; he crusaded against the G.O.P. House leader Tom DeLay, the criminal lobbyist Jack Abramoff and their coterie of influence-peddlers.

With the exception of McCain’s imprisonment in Vietnam, every aspect of this profile in courage is inaccurate or defunct.

McCain never called for Donald Rumsfeld to be fired and didn’t start criticizing the war plan until late August 2003, nearly four months after “Mission Accomplished.” By then the growing insurgency was undeniable. On the day Hurricane Katrina hit, McCain laughed it up with the oblivious president at a birthday photo-op in Arizona. McCain didn’t get to New Orleans for another six months and didn’t sharply express public criticism of the Bush response to the calamity until this April, when he traveled to the Gulf Coast in desperate search of election-year pageantry surrounding him with black extras.

McCain long ago embraced the right’s agents of intolerance, even spending months courting the Rev. John Hagee, whose fringe views about Roman Catholics and the Holocaust were known to anyone who can use the Internet. (Once the McCain campaign discovered YouTube, it ditched Hagee.) On Monday McCain is scheduled to appear at an Atlanta fund-raiser being promoted by Ralph Reed, who is not only the former aide de camp to one of the agents of intolerance McCain once vilified (Pat Robertson) but is also the former Abramoff acolyte showcased in McCain’s own Senate investigation of Indian casino lobbying.

Though the McCain campaign announced a new no-lobbyists policy three months after The Washington Post’s February report that lobbyists were “essentially running” the whole operation, the fact remains that McCain’s top officials and fund-raisers have past financial ties to nearly every domestic and foreign flashpoint, from Fannie Mae to Blackwater to Ahmad Chalabi to the government of Georgia. No sooner does McCain flip-flop on oil drilling than a bevy of Hess Oil family members and executives, not to mention a lowly Hess office manager and her husband, each give a maximum $28,500 to the Republican Party.

While reporters at The Post and The New York Times have been vetting McCain, many others give him a free pass. Their default cliché is to present him as the Old Faithful everyone already knows. They routinely salute his “independence,” his “maverick image” and his “renegade reputation” — as the hackneyed script was reiterated by Karl Rove in a Wall Street Journal op-ed column last week. At Talking Points Memo, the essential blog vigilantly pursuing the McCain revelations often ignored elsewhere, Josh Marshall accurately observes that the Republican candidate is “graded on a curve.”

Most Americans still don’t know, as Marshall writes, that on the campaign trail “McCain frequently forgets key elements of policies, gets countries’ names wrong, forgets things he’s said only hours or days before and is frequently just confused.” Most Americans still don’t know it is precisely for this reason that the McCain campaign has now shut down the press’s previously unfettered access to the candidate on the Straight Talk Express.

To appreciate the discrepancy in what we know about McCain and Obama, merely look at the coverage of the potential first ladies. We have heard too much indeed about Michelle Obama’s Princeton thesis, her pay raises at the University of Chicago hospital, her statement about being “proud” of her country and the false rumor of a video of her ranting about “whitey.” But we still haven’t been inside Cindy McCain’s tax returns, all her multiple homes or private plane. The Los Angeles Times reported in June that Hensley & Company, the enormous beer distributorship she controls, “lobbies regulatory agencies on alcohol issues that involve public health and safety,” in opposition to groups like Mothers Against Drunk Driving. The McCain campaign told The Times that Mrs. McCain’s future role in her beer empire won’t be revealed before the election.

Some of those who know McCain best — Republicans — are tougher on him than the press is. Rita Hauser, who was a Bush financial chairwoman in New York in 2000 and served on the Foreign Intelligence Advisory Board in the administration’s first term, joined other players in the G.O.P. establishment in forming Republicans for Obama last week. Why? The leadership qualities she admires in Obama — temperament, sustained judgment, the ability to play well with others — are missing in McCain. “He doesn’t listen carefully to people and make reasoned judgments,” Hauser told me. “If John says ‘I’m going with so and so,’ you can’t count on that the next morning,” she complained, adding, “That’s not the man we want for president.”

McCain has even prompted alarms from the right’s own favorite hit man du jour: Jerome Corsi, who Swift-boated John Kerry as co-author of “Unfit to Command” in 2004 and who is trying to do the same to Obama in his newly minted best seller, “The Obama Nation.”

Corsi’s writings have been repeatedly promoted by Sean Hannity on Fox News; Corsi’s publisher, Mary Matalin, has praised her author’s “scholarship.” If Republican warriors like Hannity and Matalin think so highly of Corsi’s research into Obama, then perhaps we should take seriously Corsi’s scholarship about McCain. In recent articles at worldnetdaily.com, Corsi has claimed (among other charges) that the McCain campaign received “strong” financial support from a “group tied to Al Qaeda” and that “McCain’s personal fortune traces back to organized crime in Arizona.”

As everyone says, polls are meaningless in the summers of election years. Especially this year, when there’s one candidate whose real story has yet to be fully told.
Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
Bonn1997
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8/22/2008  8:06 AM
Posted by TheSage:
Posted by playa2:

If you choose to vote for mccain in the up coming election, you are basically alluding to Bush and his policies are good enough for you with 4 more yrs of the same under mccain.

That is is a totally inane statement. It completely disregards McCain's substantial record in the Senate and has no factual basis. Now let's look at the Obama record-oh-there is no record. His campaign suggests a series of backtracking every time he takes a position that is shown to be disastrous, He has 3 years on the national scene with NO significant contribution. he is a wonderful orator without substance.

If I may quote a truly great leader let us judge a man by the content of his character, not the color of his skin-on that basis there is only one who has the charater and background to lead and it is not Mr. Obama. Take out the historically disproportionate support he is receiving from African Americans and MCain would be the clear leader in the polls. I don't agree with many of Mr. Mc Cain stated positions (some of which have been asserted to pacify certain groups within his party) but I would not not pick an intern to perform surgery and that is exactly what Mr. Obama is in national politics-an intern.
Can you list a few differences in economic policy between McCain and Bush? (If you can, that puts you one notch above McCain's surrogates!)

[Edited by - bonn1997 on 08-22-2008 08:07 AM]
PresIke
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8/22/2008  8:10 AM
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/206947.php
Out of general fondness, the Washington press corps (which is not just a phrase but a definable community of people) has for almost a decade graded John McCain on a curve, especially in the last eighteen months when he's slipped perceptibly. Now, in response to the bludgeoning and campaign of falsehoods his campaign has unleashed over the last ten days, a number of his longtime admirers in the punditocracy have written articles either claiming that they'd misjudged the man or lamenting his betrayal of his better self.

So my question is, do they and the top editors who with them define the tone of coverage, keep grading McCain on the curve that has so aided him over the last year?

Let's be frank. On the campaign trail this cycle, McCain frequently forgets key elements of policies, gets countries' names wrong, forgets things he's said only hours or days before and is frequently just confused. Any single example is inevitable for someone talking so constantly day in and day out. But the profusion of examples shows a pattern. Some of this is probably a matter of general unseriousness or lack of interest in policy areas like the economy that he doesn't care much about. But for any other politician who didn't have the benefit of years of friendship or acquaintance with many of the reporters covering him, this would be a major topic of debate in the campaign. It's whispered about among reporters. And it's evidenced in his campaign's increasing effort to keep him away from the freewheeling conversations with reporters that defined his 2000 candidacy. But it's verboten as a topic of public discussion.

The other point that again goes almost totally undiscussed is McCain's two reinventions of himself over the last decade. From a mainline conservative Republican to progressive reform candidate to Bush Republican. The reporters who have been covering him for the last decade know that there is virtually no public policy issue of note which McCain hasn't made a 180 degree change of position on in the last half dozen years. An ideological shift of that magnitude is far from unprecedented. And such turnabouts or transformations can be a product of searching insights into the changing terrain of American governance. But two such shifts in the course of a decade strongly suggest either instability or opportunism.

Neither of these points are lost on the people in the press most in a position to push key questions to the forefront of the campaign conversation. But for the moment the curve remains firmly in place -- even for those reporters now publicly washing their hands of their former affections for the man.
Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
franco12
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8/22/2008  8:38 AM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by TheSage:
Posted by playa2:

If you choose to vote for mccain in the up coming election, you are basically alluding to Bush and his policies are good enough for you with 4 more yrs of the same under mccain.

That is is a totally inane statement. It completely disregards McCain's substantial record in the Senate and has no factual basis. Now let's look at the Obama record-oh-there is no record. His campaign suggests a series of backtracking every time he takes a position that is shown to be disastrous, He has 3 years on the national scene with NO significant contribution. he is a wonderful orator without substance.

If I may quote a truly great leader let us judge a man by the content of his character, not the color of his skin-on that basis there is only one who has the charater and background to lead and it is not Mr. Obama. Take out the historically disproportionate support he is receiving from African Americans and MCain would be the clear leader in the polls. I don't agree with many of Mr. Mc Cain stated positions (some of which have been asserted to pacify certain groups within his party) but I would not not pick an intern to perform surgery and that is exactly what Mr. Obama is in national politics-an intern.
Can you list a few differences in economic policy between McCain and Bush? (If you can, that puts you one notch above McCain's surrogates!)

[Edited by - bonn1997 on 08-22-2008 08:07 AM]

And while you are at that Sage- I agree that McCain has had a nice run in the senete, but why when he became a presidential contender, has he suddenly shifted on many positions to better appeal to the right wing of the party?

If this was McCain of 2000, I would say good.

But the McCain of 2008 has dumped his people for the Bushies- the same people that smeared him in 2000.

He said he was going to run a positive campaign, that it would be different- but all we have gotten out of him is more of the same.

He has 7 homes and flies around in a private jet wears $500 shoes- yet he says obama is out of touch with americans?

He fumbles his geography when talking about important areas like the middle east.

Sorry, but for president, I want someone with a bit more up in between the ears besides senility.

Oh, and what is up with his flip flopping on MLK day?
Cartman718
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8/22/2008  9:02 AM
Posted by playa2:

If you choose to vote for mccain in the up coming election, you are basically alluding to Bush and his policies are good enough for you with 4 more yrs of the same under mccain.

If you vote McCain, you're voting McSame. Mr Maverick is behaving like a puppet already.

[Edited by - cartman718 on 08-22-2008 09:03 AM]
Nixluva is posting triangle screen grabs, even when nobody asks - Fishmike. LOL So are we going to reference that thread like the bible now? "The thread of Wroten Page 14 post 9" - EnySpree
If obama doesnt take hillary as his running mate he will get blown out

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