Posted by Swishfm3:

...and you all would flip if you knew how much of OUR money is being wasted here.

Posted by Swishfm3:

I'm in Iraq right now...and you all would flip if you knew how much of OUR money is being wasted here.

and although I do believe that our presence here is what's preventing the Iraqis from killing each other for control of the countries oil (not to mention Turkey from invading), I think its time we start letting these people fend for themselves.

Posted by arkrud:


I have no words... just listen:

[quote]"What we've got here is failure to
communicate.
Some men you just can't reach...
So, you get what we had here last week,
which is the way he wants it!
Well, he gets it!
N' I don't like it any more than you men."

Look at your young men fighting
Look at your women crying
Look at your young men dying
The way they've always done before

Look at the hate we're breeding
Look at the fear we're feeding
Look at the lives we're leading
The way we've always done before

My hands are tied
The billions shift from side to side
And the wars go on with brainwashed pride
For the love of God and our human rights
And all these things are swept aside
By bloody hands time can't deny
And are washed away by your genocide
And history hides the lies of our civil wars

D'you wear a black armband
When they shot the man
Who said "Peace could last forever"
And in my first memories
They shot Kennedy
I went numb when I learned to see
So I never fell for Vietnam
We got the wall of D.C. to remind us all
That you can't trust freedom
When it's not in your hands
When everybody's fightin'
For their promised land

And
I don't need your civil war
It feeds the rich while it buries the poor
Your power hungry sellin' soldiers
In a human grocery store
Ain't that fresh
I don't need your civil war

Look at the shoes your filling
Look at the blood we're spilling
Look at the world we're killing
The way we've always done before
Look in the doubt we've wallowed
Look at the leaders we've followed
Look at the lies we've swallowed
And I don't want to hear no more

My hands are tied
For all I've seen has changed my mind
But still the wars go on as the years go by
With no love of God or human rights
'Cause all these dreams are swept aside
By bloody hands of the hypnotized
Who carry the cross of homicide
And history bears the scars of our civil wars

"WE PRACTICE SELECTIVE ANNIHILATION OF MAYORS AND GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS
FOR EXAMPLE TO CREATE A VACUUM
THEN WE FILL THAT VACUUM
AS POPULAR WAR ADVANCES
PEACE IS CLOSER" **

I don't need your civil war
It feeds the rich while it buries the poor
Your power hungry sellin' soldiers
In a human grocery store
Ain't that fresh
And I don't need your civil war
I don't need your civil war
I don't need your civil war
Your power hungry sellin' soldiers
In a human grocery store
Ain't that fresh
I don't need your civil war
I don't need one more war

I don't need one more war
Whaz so civil 'bout war anyway

Posted by 4949:

Posted by izybx:

I support the war, I support the troops.

Wars are sort of a natural extermination mechanism when you really think about it. We all live on a planet of 6.something billion people. When the planet starts to become over populated, especially with life forms that pollute, then eventually, a lot of people have to die. Either by natual-natural cuases or a natural cause like going to war. It's human nature and un-avoidable. It's sad, but it's something that has to be done. We are some of the fortunate few who aren't directly affected by the tragedy's on a world level. At least not yet, so count your blessings and pray for those who don't make it.

That's what I think of war. Who voted for it or who didn't vote for it doesn't really matter, when you think of it in these terms. Because to me, when you try to make it political, it becomes futile.

[Edited by - 4949 on 03-27-2008 12:28 PM]

Posted by toodarkmark:

Posted by 4949:

Posted by izybx:

I support the war, I support the troops.

Wars are sort of a natural extermination mechanism when you really think about it. We all live on a planet of 6.something billion people. When the planet starts to become over populated, especially with life forms that pollute, then eventually, a lot of people have to die. Either by natual-natural cuases or a natural cause like going to war. It's human nature and un-avoidable. It's sad, but it's something that has to be done. We are some of the fortunate few who aren't directly affected by the tragedy's on a world level. At least not yet, so count your blessings and pray for those who don't make it.

That's what I think of war. Who voted for it or who didn't vote for it doesn't really matter, when you think of it in these terms. Because to me, when you try to make it political, it becomes futile.

[Edited by - 4949 on 03-27-2008 12:28 PM]

To an extent I agree with you, that human conflict is just human, and extermination is a natural order and that natural disasters, famine, disease and war are nature's way of "cleaning up".

But I will say Al Gore would have never gone into Iraq. Nor would he have allowed the CIA and FBI information that Osama Bin Ladin was going to attack America be ignored, like the Bush Admin did in August of 2001. And he would never have allowed the VP to take control over fighter airplanes during a hijacking sitation in the summer of 2001 such as Dick Cheney did. Well then again maybe Liberman would have waited 36 minutes instead of the legal 10 minutes to deploy fighter airplanes that day, cause Liberman is a warhawk himself.

That's a very good point about the deployment of fighter jets that day, but it all looks like it was staged to fail anyway. So maybe the whole thing was' planned afterall. There's all kinds of evidence to suggest such a thing. Engineers in the basement areas of the Towers that day said there where explosions underground, before' the planes hit. Maybe the administration knew more than we think. Whatever happened that day on 9/11, and by whom remains a mystery and all we're left with is an official report by the administartion. There is an official documentary on the market to back me up on that one too, whether anyone wants to believe it or not. I posted it over on Off Topic Forum some time ago.

It certainly isn't impossible. It is now' a well known fact that an old administartion ordered a U.S. military ship blown up to start the Vietnam war, after they denied it for years and said the communist did it. People in many administartions used to be like many of us. Ordinary citizens and now look what all of that power did to them. Like I said. It's a natural mechanism. Nobody's immune to it. For many of us, it's more like a game.

Obama is right about one thing. The last of the old institutions are coming to an end and hanging onto whatever power they may have, for dear life. That includes this supreme court.

Posted by BRIGGS:

Posted by martin:

Posted by 4949:

Posted by martin:

Posted by 4949:

Posted by izybx:

I support the war, I support the troops.

Wars are sort of a natural extermination mechanism when you really think about it. We all live on a planet of 6.something billion people. When the planet starts to become over populated, especially with life forms that pollute, then eventually, a lot of people have to die. Either by natual-natural cuases or a natural cause like going to war. It's human nature and un-avoidable. It's sad, but it's something that has to be done. We are some of the fortunate few who aren't directly affected by the tragedy's on a world level. At least not yet, so count your blessings and pray for those who don't make it.

That's what I think of war. Who voted for it or who didn't vote for it doesn't really matter, when you think of it in these terms.

tell don't tell that to our service people who are over there or have been over there.

I thought I acknowledged that, by saying we are the forutnate few and to pray for those who don't make it, no matter who they are. It's a natural occurance is all I'm saying and is useless to make it political.

fair enough, but this war could have been avoided, no?

We don't know what Congress was told--they could've been told something that prompted almost everyone of them to vote for action.

Posted by toodarkmark:

Posted by bitty41:

Posted by Cosmic:

I would have supported this war if we would have just bombed the hell out of Iraq from a distance. There was no need to get suckered into this disaster of a guerrilla war. There was no need to put 160,000+ troops in harms way going on it's sixth year now resulting in the death of 4,000 of them and the destruction of their families. There was no reason to spend 600B+ fighting this war while watching our own economy go down the crapper.

Seriously, we made sophisticated long range weapons for this VERY REASON. So if there's a threat? We can deal with it from a distance.

This has been an epic joke the moment they put boots on the ground and it should never have played out that way.

What would be gained exactly from bombing a country back into the stone age or more importantly killing the same innocent civilians we are suppose to be liberating?

Toodmark

I posed the same exact response in one of my Political Science classes in college. We would not have been in this mess of the Supreme Court had not decided our President in 2000.

[Edited by - bitty41 on 03-27-2008 2:28 PM]

I was posing the questions to the cops in 2003 while they were spraying me in the face with pepper spray, but I disgress.

This war was a pathetic attempt by the PNAC (look them up on Google and who signed their mission statement in 1997) to take over the Middle East. What get's accomplished is control of natural resources. A war that evolved monkeys have been waging since they climbed out of the trees. We as humans feel we are somehow "civilized" when we are a worse cancer on this planet than any other organism. I digress again! Just look up the PNAC and see where this war came from and see that liberation is a nice word for occupation when it comes to our friends in the Right.

Even though cancer is a 'foreign' organism itself. We are only human ma man.

I have to look at what I value and the talk of liberation, to overhaul a democracy, that millions have fought and died for to put into the place, that is not the way to go. Something out of all of this has got to count. If you change it, you change it one piece at a time, you change it with the best thought possible. But you can't change it overnight. Not even in a few years. There's just too many institutions that are represented by people with a vast array of interests and they conflict with each other on a vast platform. Look at the candidates! What they have to go through to convince as many people to vote for them is incredible. They reflect that vast differences in this country. Some call it flip flopping, but anyone who can see, is willing to see, will understand.

Talk of revolutions and liberations, that's a nice way for some idiot to start a dictatorship (and I say that knowing that we have had idiots running our government). No thanks. It's not the system that sucks. it's the poeple running' the system. We have health care, we have support systems to help us all succeed to the best of our abilities (and remember, there's only so much room on each mountain), we have a food industry and system so that we may all eat, as well as many other systems to support each and everyone of us. We just need to demand better management of our systems (and you have to understand that you have to demand it) and when you have a bunch of people controlling our systems, to their own will, then you either vote those people back in or you vote them out. It's not a perfect system, but it's better than not' having anyting in place.

As someone like MIchael Moore pointed out, we have the highest death rate, becuase of things like guns and poor health care, but we don't have these deaths rates because of some revolutionary war or anything like that. I kind of like it that way. I think it's a good start and a good platform to make real change on. A platform that most anyone can use to contribute to the changes that are to come and for the greater good of family, all American's and eventually, the world.

Anyone with common sense knows what I mean.

Posted by Swishfm3:

I'm in Iraq right now...and you all would flip if you knew how much of OUR money is being wasted here.

and although I do believe that our presence here is what's preventing the Iraqis from killing each other for control of the countries oil (not to mention Turkey from invading), I think its time we start letting these people fend for themselves.

Posted by 4949:

Posted by Cosmic:

I would have supported this war if we would have just bombed the hell out of Iraq from a distance. There was no need to get suckered into this disaster of a guerrilla war. There was no need to put 160,000+ troops in harms way going on it's sixth year now resulting in the death of 4,000 of them and the destruction of their families. There was no reason to spend 600B+ fighting this war while watching our own economy go down the crapper.

Seriously, we made sophisticated long range weapons for this VERY REASON. So if there's a threat? We can deal with it from a distance.

This has been an epic joke the moment they put boots on the ground and it should never have played out that way.

puney little brain. No disrespect.

Really?

And, excuse me? Puny little brain? Are you for real? That is disrespectful.

Okay, so you like how it's been handled? Mission accomplished?

Explain your point of view...if you have one.