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bitty41
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10/4/2007  1:06 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

If you run an office where you expect people to only talk about work for 8 hours a day I can tell you that you probably won't be able to keep people around too long


But seriously use some common sense.
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Solace
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10/4/2007  1:11 PM
Posted by bitty41:
Posted by Bippity10:

If you run an office where you expect people to only talk about work for 8 hours a day I can tell you that you probably won't be able to keep people around too long


But seriously use some common sense.

If people had common sense, there would be no Knicks fans.

Seriously, though, I see both sides. I agree with Bip and Killa in many ways that harassment accusations are often overdone. I've seen it happen to a coworker, but thankfully the claim was so ridiculous that nothing came of it. Some women are so sensitive to it that they will claim anything as sexual harassment. Then other women are very touchy feely with the guys. However, as a guy you can't say anything, because people won't take that seriously, so there certainly is a double standard.

That being said, I absolutely always avoid doing anything that is remotely questionable in the presence of others, unless I'm confident of the company I'm with and know that there's no chance of the wrong person overhearing.
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BasketballJones
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10/4/2007  1:25 PM
Hmm. I don't work in an office every day now, but I've never had a problem avoiding using the words "bitch" or "ho" in a professional setting.
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Solace
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10/4/2007  1:27 PM
Posted by BasketballJones:

Hmm. I don't work in an office every day now, but I've never had a problem avoiding using the words "bitch" or "ho" in a professional setting.

Yes, of course. Saying that in the work place is ridiculous and totally uncalled for.
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BasketballJones
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10/4/2007  1:33 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

If you run an office where you expect people to only talk about work for 8 hours a day I can tell you that you probably won't be able to keep people around too long

Just so long as they don't waste time posting on internet sports forums.
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bitty41
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10/4/2007  1:57 PM
Posted by Solace:
Posted by bitty41:
Posted by Bippity10:

If you run an office where you expect people to only talk about work for 8 hours a day I can tell you that you probably won't be able to keep people around too long


But seriously use some common sense.

If people had common sense, there would be no Knicks fans.

Seriously, though, I see both sides. I agree with Bip and Killa in many ways that harassment accusations are often overdone. I've seen it happen to a coworker, but thankfully the claim was so ridiculous that nothing came of it. Some women are so sensitive to it that they will claim anything as sexual harassment. Then other women are very touchy feely with the guys. However, as a guy you can't say anything, because people won't take that seriously, so there certainly is a double standard.

That being said, I absolutely always avoid doing anything that is remotely questionable in the presence of others, unless I'm confident of the company I'm with and know that there's no chance of the wrong person overhearing.


You don't have to tell me about women who abuse the system and not just in the work place. Some spend most of their day looking for some reason to create drama in office. And it only makes it harder for people who have legitimate complaints.

I think Bip and Killa are only highlighting one side of the issue. There are probably even more examples of people whose complaints of sexual harrassement were met with hostility, ignored, or swept under the rug.

In your case if someone whether its a woman or not; I don't understand why you wouldn't at least let her know that she needs to lay off the touching?
Solace
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10/4/2007  2:05 PM
Posted by bitty41:

In your case if someone whether its a woman or not; I don't understand why you wouldn't at least let her know that she needs to lay off the touching?

It's not always that simple. I find there are a significant amount of women who have been touchy-feely with me in the past, but one in particular I'll mention. In this one case, it was one of the senior developers at my last company in her early 40s. It didn't really bother me enough to complain or anything, but it did bug me just a little. We were working together and as she's looking over my shoulder, she's leaning with her hand on my thigh and leaning against me a bit. I didn't feel a need to complain though, because I didn't think it was that serious (even though her behavior was a bit inappropriate) and quite frankly, I didn't want to cause a stir. If it bothered me enough, I would've asked her to stop.

I've also had other women in the office over the years pinching my cheeks or placing their hands on me as they talk. I don't usually mind unless it's excessive, but I do notice it as a little peculiar.
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bitty41
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10/4/2007  2:20 PM
Posted by Solace:
Posted by bitty41:

In your case if someone whether its a woman or not; I don't understand why you wouldn't at least let her know that she needs to lay off the touching?

It's not always that simple. I find there are a significant amount of women who have been touchy-feely with me in the past, but one in particular I'll mention. In this one case, it was one of the senior developers at my last company in her early 40s. It didn't really bother me enough to complain or anything, but it did bug me just a little. We were working together and as she's looking over my shoulder, she's leaning with her hand on my thigh and leaning against me a bit. I didn't feel a need to complain though, because I didn't think it was that serious (even though her behavior was a bit inappropriate) and quite frankly, I didn't want to cause a stir. If it bothered me enough, I would've asked her to stop.

I've also had other women in the office over the years pinching my cheeks or placing their hands on me as they talk. I don't usually mind unless it's excessive, but I do notice it as a little peculiar.


Damn I need to work with you because I'll at least sexually harrass you properly. No in all seriousness the whole hand on the thigh I wouldn't call fair game but thats just me. Yea there are some men that I work that are touchy feely and one guy in particular who has clammy hands ugh so I told him that some of his touching was a bit overboard. I said it very conversationally and we're still cool with one another. But I can totally understand what you mean about women if a guy tells a woman that her touching is making him feel uncomfortable some don't exactly take the high road. But at the end of the day no one should have to be subjected to behavior or language that makes them feel uncomfortable.

[Edited by - bitty41 on 10-04-2007 2:21 PM]
Bippity10
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10/4/2007  2:22 PM
Posted by bitty41:
Posted by Solace:
Posted by bitty41:
Posted by Bippity10:

If you run an office where you expect people to only talk about work for 8 hours a day I can tell you that you probably won't be able to keep people around too long


But seriously use some common sense.

If people had common sense, there would be no Knicks fans.

Seriously, though, I see both sides. I agree with Bip and Killa in many ways that harassment accusations are often overdone. I've seen it happen to a coworker, but thankfully the claim was so ridiculous that nothing came of it. Some women are so sensitive to it that they will claim anything as sexual harassment. Then other women are very touchy feely with the guys. However, as a guy you can't say anything, because people won't take that seriously, so there certainly is a double standard.

That being said, I absolutely always avoid doing anything that is remotely questionable in the presence of others, unless I'm confident of the company I'm with and know that there's no chance of the wrong person overhearing.


You don't have to tell me about women who abuse the system and not just in the work place. Some spend most of their day looking for some reason to create drama in office. And it only makes it harder for people who have legitimate complaints.

I think Bip and Killa are only highlighting one side of the issue. There are probably even more examples of people whose complaints of sexual harrassement were met with hostility, ignored, or swept under the rug.

In your case if someone whether its a woman or not; I don't understand why you wouldn't at least let her know that she needs to lay off the touching?

Bitty not ignoring it at all just covering one topic at a time. When you say there are more examples of people whose complaints are swept under the rug I agree with you. I think the frivolous cases contribute to this. That's what I meant when I said they are stealing the power and meaning from true cases. Everyone in our society is looking for a reason to be outraged. Some of those reasons are 100% valid adn some aren't. Unfortunately we are giving to much credence to those that aren't.

Again as a human resource consultant I hear some pretty scary things. Things that would make you think twice about even raising your eye at a co-worker. Intent is no longer the issue. If a co-worker misinterprates your lazy eye it could end up in your report. Follow that up with a "whoops I forgot where I was comment to one of your friends in the office" and you can have a perfectly respectful nice person, like anyone on this site, ruined. It isn't somehting that people should be paranoid about at this point, but be aware it could happen very easily.
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djsunyc
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10/4/2007  2:22 PM
it seems to me that this is basically a thread for eny and solace to brag about how women like to touch them at work.
Solace
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10/4/2007  2:29 PM
Posted by bitty41:

Damn I need to work with you because I'll at least sexually harrass you properly.

Rrrrrawrrr!!!
Posted by bitty41:

No in all seriousness the whole hand on the thigh I wouldn't call fair game but thats just me. Yea there are some men that I work that are touchy feely and one guy in particular who has clammy hands ugh so I told him that some of his touching was a bit overboard. I said it very conversationally and we're still cool with one another. But I can totally understand what you mean about women if a guy tells a woman that her touching is making him feel uncomfortable some don't exactly take the high road. But at the end of the day no one should have to be subjected to behavior or language that makes them feel uncomfortable.

I hear you on that. I can't honestly say that I've ever gone home upset about it. There's so many other annoying things at work (at least with my previous jobs), that I usually didn't care much. In a way, it's sort of flattering. Plus then I would tell my girlfriend (at the time) and she'd get a little jealous.
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Solace
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10/4/2007  2:29 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

it seems to me that this is basically a thread for eny and solace to brag about how women like to touch them at work.

Don't forget that the men like to touch bitty. She's bragging too.
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djsunyc
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10/4/2007  2:31 PM
Posted by Solace:
Posted by djsunyc:

it seems to me that this is basically a thread for eny and solace to brag about how women like to touch them at work.

Don't forget that the men like to touch bitty. She's bragging too.

bitty is a professional stripper...it's a little different in her case.
BlueSeats
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10/4/2007  2:32 PM
All this harassment talk is getting me horny. Where's my better 'ho?
Solace
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10/4/2007  2:32 PM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by Solace:
Posted by djsunyc:

it seems to me that this is basically a thread for eny and solace to brag about how women like to touch them at work.

Don't forget that the men like to touch bitty. She's bragging too.

bitty is a professional stripper...it's a little different in her case.

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Solace
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10/4/2007  2:32 PM
Posted by BlueSeats:

All this harassment talk is getting me horny. Where's my better 'ho?

She's currently looking for a house in Italy.
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bitty41
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10/4/2007  2:37 PM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by Solace:
Posted by djsunyc:

it seems to me that this is basically a thread for eny and solace to brag about how women like to touch them at work.

Don't forget that the men like to touch bitty. She's bragging too.

bitty is a professional stripper...it's a little different in her case.


And DJ remember a dollar tip does not equal the "back room special"
TMS
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10/4/2007  2:39 PM
Posted by Solace:

We were working together and as she's looking over my shoulder, she's leaning with her hand on my thigh and leaning against me a bit. I didn't feel a need to complain though, because I didn't think it was that serious (even though her behavior was a bit inappropriate) and quite frankly, I didn't want to cause a stir.

Either that, or you didn't want to disturb the stir that was going on in your fruit o'the looms.
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Solace
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10/4/2007  2:40 PM
Posted by TMS:

Either that, or you didn't want to disturb the stir that was going on in your fruit o'the looms.

LOL!
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Killa4luv
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10/4/2007  2:44 PM
Posted by bitty41:

I think Bip and Killa are only highlighting one side of the issue. There are probably even more examples of people whose complaints of sexual harrassement were met with hostility, ignored, or swept under the rug.
No I'm pretty clear on that. Women could bankrupt the country if there was a case filed for every instance of harassment. I just know from my moms workload that there are many people who lose their jobs and then file cases of discrimination, which are totally meritless, or at least mainly meritless. The type of job my mother has exposes you to alot of the unbalanced people in society, who file case after case after case, with nothing to substantiate the cases. But let me be really clear on where I stand, people in general may abuse the system, women may abuse the system and there is a double standard in favor of women in terms of how the rules are applied, but that is totally justified because men have been and mainly still are in positions of power and women have a lot to go through just trying to be respected in certain settings.

The double standard favoring women ought to exist. Men dont have to sleep with a woman for a promotion, or to keep their jobs, because men are usually the people in power. I'm sure women would love to reverse the double standard if men are willing to reverse the power relationships in society.
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