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Ariza trade set other moves in motion...NY Times
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kam77
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2/2/2007  1:30 PM
Regarding the MLE: First off, nobody wanted Ariza back on the knicks this year ANYWAY.

And if Isiah did bring him back, people would say we wasted the MLE on a guy who wouldn't be a starter. Or they'd ridicule him for lack of a 'plan' in trading for him and then 'wasting' the MLE on a guy we could have kept. All of the usual suspects here know they'd be doing that.

Plus TA sucked last year, and the great LB didn't do him any favors and practically destroyed the kid by calling him delusional. He's putting up some #s on a young Orlando team that no one took seriously at first and is now coming down to earth. He is beating out Hedo Turkoglu for minutes. But here he's be taking minutes from Craw, Q, Dlee.. we wouldnt have Balkman who i think is a better defensive talent...

What i think hurts is getting Francis. I wish we would have just let Penny expire in retrospect. But LB disliked TA, and wanted to get Marbury out. So the Francis trade has his DNA all over it. And when "THE DON" of the NBA coaching guild asks you to throw him a frikkin bone, you make the trade no ifs ands or butts.
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
AUTOADVERT
holfresh
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2/2/2007  1:40 PM
Nyk4ever, please be a man and act like you own a sack...You, Bip,DJ,Mart,Andrew,Nolad,Fish,Allan,Codeunknown,Isle's,MS,Briggs,Blueseats, and the rest of the Larry loving crew wanted Larry to have his pick of players...In your heart of hearts, you knew Larry was the orchestrator on this one...Why is it so difficult to just admit it...Why can't you just say we were wrong to support Larry on this because he is a MADMAN, and wanted players with no rhyme or reason...Is it so hard to say he forced Isiah's hand on this one trade...Doesn't the testosterone in you body compel you to own up to this one...

[Edited by - holfresh on 02-02-2007 1:41 PM]
BlueSeats
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2/2/2007  1:40 PM
My mom asked me what I wanted for Christmas. She likes hints, but then wants to surprise me, so I give her a short list to pick from. This was this years list:

Underwear
Amazon gift certificate
iPod armband
Bag of heroine

She got me the heroine. Her friends called her nuts, but what could she do, I asked for it.
djsunyc
Posts: 44929
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Member: #536
2/2/2007  1:43 PM
Posted by holfresh:

Nyk4ever, please be a man and act like you own a sack...You, Bip,DJ,Mart,Andrew,Nolad,Fish,Allan,Codeunknown,Isle's,MS,Briggs,Blueseats, and the rest of the Larry loving crew wanted Larry to have his pick of players...In your heart of hearts, you knew Larry was the orchestrator on this one...Why is it so difficult to just admit it...Why can't you just say we were wrong to support Larry on this because he is a MADMAN, and wanted players with no rhyme or reason...Is it so hard to say he forced Isiah's hand on this one trade...Doesn't the testosterone in you body compel you to own up to this one...

no...and it's going to continue to drive you crazy!!!!
djsunyc
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2/2/2007  1:44 PM
Posted by BlueSeats:

My mom asked me what I wanted for Christmas. She likes hints, but then wants to surprise me, so I give her a short list to pick from. This was this years list:

Underwear
Amazon gift certificate
iPod armband
Bag of heroine

She got me the heroine. Her friends called her nuts, but what could she do, I asked for it.

yeah...like the "bag of heroine" wasn't #1 on your list...
nyk4ever
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2/2/2007  1:51 PM
Posted by holfresh:

Nyk4ever, please be a man and act like you own a sack...You, Bip,DJ,Mart,Andrew,Nolad,Fish,Allan,Codeunknown,Isle's,MS,Briggs,Blueseats, and the rest of the Larry loving crew wanted Larry to have his pick of players...In your heart of hearts, you knew Larry was the orchestrator on this one...Why is it so difficult to just admit it...Why can't you just say we were wrong to support Larry on this because he is a MADMAN, and wanted players with no rhyme or reason...Is it so hard to say he forced Isiah's hand on this one trade...Doesn't the testosterone in you body compel you to own up to this one...

[Edited by - holfresh on 02-02-2007 1:41 PM]

"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
holfresh
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2/2/2007  1:53 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by holfresh:

Nyk4ever, please be a man and act like you own a sack...You, Bip,DJ,Mart,Andrew,Nolad,Fish,Allan,Codeunknown,Isle's,MS,Briggs,Blueseats, and the rest of the Larry loving crew wanted Larry to have his pick of players...In your heart of hearts, you knew Larry was the orchestrator on this one...Why is it so difficult to just admit it...Why can't you just say we were wrong to support Larry on this because he is a MADMAN, and wanted players with no rhyme or reason...Is it so hard to say he forced Isiah's hand on this one trade...Doesn't the testosterone in you body compel you to own up to this one...

[Edited by - holfresh on 02-02-2007 1:41 PM]


Yeah...this is my Al Gore moment...
TMS
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2/2/2007  2:02 PM
Posted by BlueSeats:

My mom asked me what I wanted for Christmas. She likes hints, but then wants to surprise me, so I give her a short list to pick from. This was this years list:

Underwear
Amazon gift certificate
iPod armband
Bag of heroine

She got me the heroine. Her friends called her nuts, but what could she do, I asked for it.

bring some of that out to the next UK outing... maybe we'll hallucinate enough during the game to actually enjoy it this time.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
fishmike
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2/2/2007  2:05 PM
Posted by holfresh:

Nyk4ever, please be a man and act like you own a sack...You, Bip,DJ,Mart,Andrew,Nolad,Fish,Allan,Codeunknown,Isle's,MS,Briggs,Blueseats, and the rest of the Larry loving crew wanted Larry to have his pick of players...In your heart of hearts, you knew Larry was the orchestrator on this one...Why is it so difficult to just admit it...Why can't you just say we were wrong to support Larry on this because he is a MADMAN, and wanted players with no rhyme or reason...Is it so hard to say he forced Isiah's hand on this one trade...Doesn't the testosterone in you body compel you to own up to this one...

[Edited by - holfresh on 02-02-2007 1:41 PM]
I'm sure if we had given Larry the winner the 14 years it takes to fixed Layden's mess that you insist Isiah the loser deserves deserves he would get it turned around.

Larry, has after all won everywhere he's been. Right Holfresh?

Anyway sarcasm aside, Isiah would NEVER add players with no ryhme or reason would he?

It must really pain you to be a fan of Isiah and watch this team everynight. You do watch dont you?
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
nyk4ever
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2/2/2007  2:08 PM
He doesn't watch Fish, he sits in between his Frye poster and Isiah cardboard cutout and just talks with them. On the DL, I hear the Isiah cutout told him that Brown forced him to trade for Francis. Keep that on the dl though.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
kam77
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2/2/2007  2:13 PM
Larry, has after all won everywhere he's been. Right Holfresh?

Except the Olympics.
My take? LB won the title finally in 2004, lost his mind. Thought he was jesus and could walk on water. Then lost the olympic team, lost his piston squad who played 'in spite' of him, and presided over the worst W-L record in Knick history. The major (not the only) reason to fire Isiah is because he hired a guy who set this franchise back.
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
nyk4ever
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2/2/2007  2:14 PM
Posted by kam77:
Larry, has after all won everywhere he's been. Right Holfresh?

Except the Olympics.
My take? LB won the title finally in 2004, lost his mind. Thought he was jesus and could walk on water. Then lost the olympic team, lost his piston squad who played 'in spite' of him, and presided over the worst W-L record in Knick history. The major (not the only) reason to fire Isiah is because he hired a guy who set this franchise back.

It all makes so much sense now!
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
djsunyc
Posts: 44929
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2/2/2007  2:17 PM
Posted by kam77:
Larry, has after all won everywhere he's been. Right Holfresh?

Except the Olympics.
My take? LB won the title finally in 2004, lost his mind. Thought he was jesus and could walk on water. Then lost the olympic team, lost his piston squad who played 'in spite' of him, and presided over the worst W-L record in Knick history. The major (not the only) reason to fire Isiah is because he hired a guy who set this franchise back.

all of that may be true but what has happened since lb left those ventures:

1. olympic team still only won the bronze playing the guys that everyone felt lb slighted

2. detroit did not make it back to the finals and the players were upset with flip too, where he lost his main defensive cog

3. the knicks are currently 8 games under .500

so despite lb and the difficulty of working with him, so far, neither the olympic team nor the pistons have done better without him. knicks are still in process...
kam77
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2/2/2007  2:19 PM
HAVE WE HAD ANOTHER OLYMPICS? Get yer facts straight that was the World Championships, sheesh! Do you watch the games man??

The preceding was delivered tongue-in cheek
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
Allanfan20
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2/2/2007  2:21 PM
Nyk4ever, please be a man and act like you own a sack...You, Bip,DJ,Mart,Andrew,Nolad,Fish,Allan,Codeunknown,Isle's,MS,Briggs,Blueseats, and the rest of the Larry loving crew wanted Larry to have his pick of players

See, it's dumb statements like this that make people say "I'm not taking this poster seriously, he must be 15."

I don't know one poster here who loved Larry Brown after the end of last season. I've said on numerous occasions that he should even be fired, as long as Isiah and Marbury as well as every player on the team. but obviously it's not Larry's fault if the players quit (Something I don't blame Isiah for either. Just for bringing them in.)

Holfresh, no offense, but when you and others start calling people haters and lovers based on absolutely nothing, I get the impression that you know absolutely nothing about basketball. Sorry, now I'll get back to posting about basketball.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
holfresh
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2/2/2007  2:21 PM
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by holfresh:

Nyk4ever, please be a man and act like you own a sack...You, Bip,DJ,Mart,Andrew,Nolad,Fish,Allan,Codeunknown,Isle's,MS,Briggs,Blueseats, and the rest of the Larry loving crew wanted Larry to have his pick of players...In your heart of hearts, you knew Larry was the orchestrator on this one...Why is it so difficult to just admit it...Why can't you just say we were wrong to support Larry on this because he is a MADMAN, and wanted players with no rhyme or reason...Is it so hard to say he forced Isiah's hand on this one trade...Doesn't the testosterone in you body compel you to own up to this one...

[Edited by - holfresh on 02-02-2007 1:41 PM]
I'm sure if we had given Larry the winner the 14 years it takes to fixed Layden's mess that you insist Isiah the loser deserves deserves he would get it turned around.

Larry, has after all won everywhere he's been. Right Holfresh?

Anyway sarcasm aside, Isiah would NEVER add players with no ryhme or reason would he?

It must really pain you to be a fan of Isiah and watch this team everynight. You do watch dont you?

How was Larry the winner last year??...How is Larry the winner doing this year in Philly..I know you don't pay much attention but this roster needed a complete overhaul...I think you were explaining the virtues of keeping KHV and Doleac in another post...How was that going to help our future...Unless you like winning 35-38 games a year...It is not logical to expect winning results immediately from the roster Isiah inherited...Thats not Isiah loving, that's plain being honest with the situation we currently...Fact is the Knicks are playing about .500 ball after a poor start..Now they are searching for consistency...Thats better footing than we have been on in about 6 years...Yeah I do watch and think this team is alot more fun to watch than the KVH and Doleac teams of the past....
fishmike
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2/2/2007  2:47 PM
How was Larry the winner last year??...
I think about 4-5 games worse than Isiah was the year before... or the year after for that matter
How is Larry the winner doing this year in Philly
well, by Isiah standards great. As for the wins and losses its 4 years too early to tell
I think you were explaining the virtues of keeping KHV and Doleac in another post
then you didnt read what I wrote. I said it was Isiah's COACH that asked him NOT to trade those two because they were both playing well and the Knicks were WINNING.

But your right... a future of KVH and Doleac isnt NEARLY as exciting or as bright as a future with Tim Thomas and Nazr Mohammed (how many wins did that team get?)
It is not logical to expect winning results immediately from the roster Isiah inherited
Why not? Other teams have made dramatic turn arounds in recent years. Those teams havent had the luxury of spending $400mm on players and coaches either. And your wrong.. we arent a .500 team after a slow start. We havent had a .500 month once this year.

Im glad you think we are fun to watch. I personally dont find losing as a result of poor effort and coaching fun to watch, but to each his own
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Allanfan20
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2/2/2007  2:54 PM
I have a friend who's a Net fan who says the Knicks are more fun to watch that the Knicks. He apparently is lucky by watching maybe every 4th game where the Knicks actually show up.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
holfresh
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2/2/2007  3:29 PM
Posted by fishmike:
How was Larry the winner last year??...
I think about 4-5 games worse than Isiah was the year before... or the year after for that matter
How is Larry the winner doing this year in Philly
well, by Isiah standards great. As for the wins and losses its 4 years too early to tell
I think you were explaining the virtues of keeping KHV and Doleac in another post
then you didnt read what I wrote. I said it was Isiah's COACH that asked him NOT to trade those two because they were both playing well and the Knicks were WINNING.

But your right... a future of KVH and Doleac isnt NEARLY as exciting or as bright as a future with Tim Thomas and Nazr Mohammed (how many wins did that team get?)
It is not logical to expect winning results immediately from the roster Isiah inherited
Why not? Other teams have made dramatic turn arounds in recent years. Those teams havent had the luxury of spending $400mm on players and coaches either. And your wrong.. we arent a .500 team after a slow start. We havent had a .500 month once this year.

Im glad you think we are fun to watch. I personally dont find losing as a result of poor effort and coaching fun to watch, but to each his own

What are you talking about Tim Thomas and Nazr being our future...Where are they now..The Knicks are one game under .500 the last two months after a 5-11 start...

Larry brown was so great that the same roster could possibly win more games by the all star break than he had in an entire season....

Show me the team that made the dramatic turn around in recent years with it's core 23 to 26 yr olds...Scratch that, just show me the GM that has made a dramatic turn around in three years after inheriting 7 guys who was out of the league in 2 to 3 years...The best player that Isiah inherited was Kurt Thomas...Think about that...But you was wondering why we are not contending now....
islesfan
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2/2/2007  3:47 PM
Larry brown was so great that the same roster could possibly win more games by the all star break than he had in an entire season....

That's nice. Are the players quitting like they so obviously did last year? Did Marbury miss extended time like he did last year?

34 wins and you'll think this season was a huge success, right?
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
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Ariza trade set other moves in motion...NY Times
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