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Bucher: Ariza this year's Boris Diaw: NBA 15 Isiah 0
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holfresh
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1/3/2007  5:28 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by oohah:
Posted by nyk4ever:

Larry asked for Eric Snow and Theo Ratliff, amongst others of his previous players and didn't get one of them. All the sudden he asks for Steve Francis and Isiah gets him? I doubt it. Even before the Francis trade there was trail of sh!t deals that leads right to Isiah Thomas as GM and President of the New York Knicks. The Steve Francis deal was just another one.

It wasn't just that he asked for Francis. Don't forget, Ariza was the other half of the trade. Do you not believe that LB asked Isiah to "delete" Ariza?

Why would LB want Francis? To replace Marbury. He wanted Ariza out and he wanted a replacement for Marbury so he could "delete" Marbury. That makes sense when we look at the context does it not?

oohah

Thats fine oohah, I realize that this is going to be disputed on this forum for a long time and I don't think anyone will ever know who is right.

Personally, I just can't believe that with the type of coach that Brown is that he would want to have Francis on this team. I'm not ruling out the possibility that Brown could have ok'ed a Francis deal but I just dont think he would have wanted Francis on this team. Between that and Isiah's terrible trade-history and always wanting to make a big splash, I believe he wanted Francis and he made the trade.

You entire premise might have been right if Dolan didn't say Larry came to him requesting that particular trade... By the way, I didn't know you knew Brown personally...
AUTOADVERT
gunsnewing
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1/3/2007  5:29 PM
I think Brown was so down on Marbury that he did push for Francis. So I blame Larry more for that trade because eventhough Isiah was the GM Larry had the upperhand because of his track record. It was a desperate move at a desperate time...even the best make mistakes in desperation. Isiah just happens to make a million of them

[Edited by - gunsnewing on 01-03-2007 5:32 PM]
nyk4ever
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1/3/2007  5:34 PM
Posted by holfresh:


You entire premise might have been right if Dolan didn't say Larry came to him requesting that particular trade...
Again, James Dolan is a businessman and he is used to having to deal in Public Relations

Definitions of public relations on the Web:
any activities or events that help promote a favorable relationship between a company and its customers and prospects; activities used to influence the press to print stories that promote a favorable image of a company and its products or services.

By the way, I didn't know you knew Brown personally...

I think you need a couple new nicknames.

"Snit" and "Holfresh3PO"
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
gunsnewing
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1/3/2007  5:44 PM
forget that Larry Brown traded for Francis. Its in the past and its not the only mistake we've made under Isiah's reign. It's not an excuse for our current 13-21 record.
Silverfuel
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1/3/2007  5:50 PM
Posted by gunsnewing:

I think Brown was so down on Marbury that he did push for Francis. So I blame Larry more for that trade because eventhough Isiah was the GM Larry had the upperhand because of his track record. It was a desperate move at a desperate time
AGREED!!
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
crzymdups
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1/3/2007  5:58 PM
Anyone who acts like Ariza's career here ending had to do with anything other than a Brown ego trip is DELUSIONAL.
¿ △ ?
Solace
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1/3/2007  6:25 PM
Posted by MS:

Its good to see another one of Isiah's brilliant moves is working out nicely, although we shouldn't be suprised after he refuses to start David Lee and compares someone that is in the top 3 fg% in the NBA and again put up another double double last night, 16pts 15rbs 3rbs clearly there are a lot of power fowards out there putting up numbers like that.......

Isiah the genius that he is doesn't resign Ariza for a fraction of the price, put brings in Jefferies who maybe the worst starter outside of Jason Collins in the NBA (another cheap alternative steal)

Ariza's last 7 games

14pts 5rbs 2stls
16pts 10rbs 2stls
18pts 5rbs 3stls
11pts 6rbs 2stls
13pts 6rbs 2stls
23pts 6rbs 2stls
14pts

This is a guy we could have signed for under 3 million and would have fit a need instead we moved him for a player that will never play again and is owed 30 million.....

Isiah needs to be fired today, his coaching is horrendous and his salary status playing time is disgraceful. We are better out there with Balkman, but now he can't play because of Jefferies? Any guy that has a lineup of Jefferies, Rose, Lee, Collins on the floor at the same time should lose his job....

Good post. Reezy was a fan favorite on this board until the day he was traded. Because it was *Isiah* who traded him, suddenly most turned on him instantly (much like what happened to Keith Van Horn). Hey, Isiah's had good draft success. He's taken a few risks when drafting that paid off. Isiah's had terrible GMing success. He's taken many risks, most of them unnecessary, and almost all have backfired.

Too many mistakes... it's unacceptable. The fact is, maybe a different GM wouldn't have drafted Reezy, but that same GM definitely wouldn't have turned it around and traded for Steve Francis when we already had Marbury, Crawford, and Nate. We have now have four point guards who can't play point guard. Um... w00t?
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
djsunyc
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1/3/2007  6:30 PM
another thing nobody has mentioned is that we had 24 year old qyntel woods here also, who was more skilled. so if lb wanted ariza gone, and lb returned, then qyntel probably would've returned as well.

where qyntel is right now, i have no clue. maybe he's blackballed?
Ask yourself: WHY WOULD ZEKE BRING IN FRANCIS if he already had Marbury?

not sure, but why did he waste a draft pick on nate, a 5'7 shooting guard replica of marbury?
why didn't he protect the picks when everybody and their mother didn't think we would finish with 23 wins?
why trade for mo taylor and give up a 2nd round pick and then waive him 1 year later?
why...
Anji
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1/3/2007  6:37 PM
Posted by crzymdups:

Anyone who acts like Ariza's career here ending had to do with anything other than a Brown ego trip is DELUSIONAL.

"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
crzymdups
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1/3/2007  6:39 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

another thing nobody has mentioned is that we had 24 year old qyntel woods here also, who was more skilled. so if lb wanted ariza gone, and lb returned, then qyntel probably would've returned as well.

where qyntel is right now, i have no clue. maybe he's blackballed?
Ask yourself: WHY WOULD ZEKE BRING IN FRANCIS if he already had Marbury?

not sure, but why did he waste a draft pick on nate, a 5'7 shooting guard replica of marbury?
why didn't he protect the picks when everybody and their mother didn't think we would finish with 23 wins?
why trade for mo taylor and give up a 2nd round pick and then waive him 1 year later?
why...

Qyntel is out of the league because he sucks. I don't get why anyone liked him more than Ariza? Because he had a jump shot? Ariza did everything else better.
¿ △ ?
djsunyc
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1/3/2007  6:43 PM
Posted by crzymdups:
Posted by djsunyc:

another thing nobody has mentioned is that we had 24 year old qyntel woods here also, who was more skilled. so if lb wanted ariza gone, and lb returned, then qyntel probably would've returned as well.

where qyntel is right now, i have no clue. maybe he's blackballed?
Ask yourself: WHY WOULD ZEKE BRING IN FRANCIS if he already had Marbury?

not sure, but why did he waste a draft pick on nate, a 5'7 shooting guard replica of marbury?
why didn't he protect the picks when everybody and their mother didn't think we would finish with 23 wins?
why trade for mo taylor and give up a 2nd round pick and then waive him 1 year later?
why...

Qyntel is out of the league because he sucks. I don't get why anyone liked him more than Ariza? Because he had a jump shot? Ariza did everything else better.

i don't think it's about liking him more than ariza but qyntel DID exhibit some skill. his defense was bad but he did have a much better offensive game than trevor.
Bonn1997
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1/3/2007  6:53 PM
Posted by Allanfan20:
Posted by djsunyc:

dolan goes on mike and the mad dog and defends sather like he's a genius and his patience paid off.

i would not be surprised if isiah is retained, even if we finish with 33 wins and miss the playoffs.

Yeah, but the Rangers aren't nearly as good as they were last season.

And why didn't he show that same patience with Layden? (Not that I think Layden should have stayed either.)

[Edited by - Allanfan20 on 01-03-2007 12:41 PM]

I thought Layden was here longer than Isiah's been
gunsnewing
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1/3/2007  7:00 PM

Good post. Reezy was a fan favorite on this board until the day he was traded. Because it was *Isiah* who traded him, suddenly most turned on him instantly (much like what happened to Keith Van Horn).

Most turned on Ariza because he did not make any progress he actually regressed last year. Of course with our luck he's doing well in Orlando. Brown haters can now use Ariza regressing to continue to dwell on Larry Brown while we continue to loss games to this day
Solace
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1/3/2007  8:05 PM
Posted by gunsnewing:
Good post. Reezy was a fan favorite on this board until the day he was traded. Because it was *Isiah* who traded him, suddenly most turned on him instantly (much like what happened to Keith Van Horn).

Most turned on Ariza because he did not make any progress he actually regressed last year. Of course with our luck he's doing well in Orlando. Brown haters can now use Ariza regressing to continue to dwell on Larry Brown while we continue to loss games to this day

Ariza didn't improve in the short sample we saw of him before he was traded, I'll agree. However, most of the board was still very high on him until the moment he was traded. That's not coincidence.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
arkrud
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1/3/2007  8:37 PM
IT this... LB that...
Who cares?
The only thing matters is when all sad and done IT failed miserably.
The product he produced like GM sucks big time.
The players we have have the worst value/salary value in NBA and may be in whole world of pro sport.
The Knicks became a joke and has a Public relations at the level of Britney Spears and Paris Hilton
Like what this f..in rich Celebes are up to...
I wish all good to Ariza and he blessed to get out of this mess just in time to save his bbal future.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
Rich
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1/3/2007  8:43 PM
WTG, Larry.
arkrud
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1/3/2007  8:49 PM
Actually LB did the best thing possible for the kid.
Ariza was Delusional that he has any future in NY and he LB pushed him out to set his mind strait
And it worked for Ariza perfectly
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
Rich
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1/3/2007  8:53 PM
Larry didn't have Ariza's best interests in mind when he smeared him.
arkrud
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1/3/2007  9:01 PM
Posted by Rich:

Larry didn't have Ariza's best interests in mind when he smeared him.

Intensions are nothing - result is everything...
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
Bonn1997
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1/3/2007  9:02 PM
Posted by arkrud:
Posted by Rich:

Larry didn't have Ariza's best interests in mind when he smeared him.

Intensions are nothing - result is everything...
What's your point? The results for the Knicks weren't good either.
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