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isiah to fans: we're going to lose in november
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BRIGGS
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10/24/2006  1:00 PM
Posted by efw:
same team as last year. isiah doesn't have to integrate a new quentin, jerome, eddy, frye, lee, nate. they were here last year. and their "unified" now.

lb's wasn't an excuse. it's how all his teams (well at least all of them except us) perform his first year.

now isiah has all the same pieces back and a supposedly healthy and in shape quentin and eddy. enough with this nonsense. just say we're going to play hard and try hard to win every game. but no, he's already saying we're going to lose...at least that's what he's telling the fans.

Whether or not that how all his teams start out, we used it as an excuse nonetheless.

Personally, I don't think the start will be as rocky as last year but to get out of the gate fast like the Suns did with their amazing turnaround, you need everybody to be 100% healthy (mentally and physically). They need to be a unit before the season starts. Not only do we not have our starting SF, but we'll have to work him back in when he does come back.

To be honest, if we do start winning games, it won't be because of our starting unit. It will be because our second unit will either give us a comfortable lead, or get us back into games. Our bench is very good and very deep and very cohesive.

You can continue to bitch at IT if you want but I don't see him lying to me. I see someone who's disappointed that he can't give me the product he wanted and is saying so. At least he's not trying to sabotoge team spirit and chemistry.

Please stop. The suns won 57 last year AFTER revamping the entire roster with new guys and LOSING Amare Stoudemire. EVERY team faces injury problems. EVERY team, every year--its part of the nBA. why was it last week we were going to win the title, now its --guys were going 4-10? How about play hard and play to win? And for once in your life STFU with the self-indulgent subterfuge. If we get off to a poor start he Should be CANNED.
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djsunyc
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10/24/2006  1:13 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by efw:
same team as last year. isiah doesn't have to integrate a new quentin, jerome, eddy, frye, lee, nate. they were here last year. and their "unified" now.

lb's wasn't an excuse. it's how all his teams (well at least all of them except us) perform his first year.

now isiah has all the same pieces back and a supposedly healthy and in shape quentin and eddy. enough with this nonsense. just say we're going to play hard and try hard to win every game. but no, he's already saying we're going to lose...at least that's what he's telling the fans.

Whether or not that how all his teams start out, we used it as an excuse nonetheless.

Personally, I don't think the start will be as rocky as last year but to get out of the gate fast like the Suns did with their amazing turnaround, you need everybody to be 100% healthy (mentally and physically). They need to be a unit before the season starts. Not only do we not have our starting SF, but we'll have to work him back in when he does come back.

To be honest, if we do start winning games, it won't be because of our starting unit. It will be because our second unit will either give us a comfortable lead, or get us back into games. Our bench is very good and very deep and very cohesive.

You can continue to bitch at IT if you want but I don't see him lying to me. I see someone who's disappointed that he can't give me the product he wanted and is saying so. At least he's not trying to sabotoge team spirit and chemistry.

Please stop. The suns won 57 last year AFTER revamping the entire roster with new guys and LOSING Amare Stoudemire. EVERY team faces injury problems. EVERY team, every year--its part of the nBA. why was it last week we were going to win the title, now its --guys were going 4-10? How about play hard and play to win? And for once in your life STFU with the self-indulgent subterfuge. If we get off to a poor start he Should be CANNED.

don't worry. if the team starts to falter, he'll give them another "how i ducked bullets as a kid" speeches to insire them.
efw
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10/24/2006  1:13 PM
I was talking about the Suns team the year before. They built team chemistry throughout the whole summer and everyone was healthy and rearing to go at the start of '04.

You're like a caricature, blowing everything out of proportion into some cartoonish picture of reality.

Isiah didn't say we were going to win a title a week ago. He said he wasn't afraid to ask for it. He also said it might not happen in the first couple of months, but that by the end of the year we would compete with the top teams in the league. Just because he changes his wording a little when his SF goes down, doesn't mean he's engaging in some manipulative subterfuge.

The end results is what counts. Firing Isiah after a rough start would be a stupid thing to do. Dolan laid it out very simply. He's got a year. If we suck at the end of the year, he's gone. next chapter begins.
fishmike
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10/24/2006  1:17 PM
was it stupid to fire Layden before the year was over? Isiah has proven he's able to do pretty considerable damage in a short time.
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BRIGGS
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10/24/2006  1:25 PM
Posted by fishmike:

was it stupid to fire Layden before the year was over? Isiah has proven he's able to do pretty considerable damage in a short time.

that's right fishmike--there is a point that the majority have to step up and say enough is enough--same thing with this country----IT gets his chance--but if we are 7-20--getting smoked in the process--thats it--half a season--its the same team ONLY older and more cohesive that was supposed to win 35-38+ with LB--if they sck after 30--it doesnt take brain science. the fans at the garden will be the axe.
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efw
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10/24/2006  1:27 PM
I didn't say anything about Layden. I said it would be stupid to fire Isiah mid year.

Why bring up Scottie? Why try to impose a similarity on two completely different situations? In my mind, Layden did nothing positive during his time here. nothing. Despite Isiah's faults, I can find several things to be hopeful about.
Bippity10
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10/24/2006  2:03 PM
Here's the key. Bip was 100% right when he noticed this 4 years ago and is still right today. Our GM's are trying to rebuild/win now/buy time all at the same time. This leads them to draft young players, trade those young players for washed up "saviors" and lower expectations daily. In order to protect themselves from being fired over their moves that represent some sort of multiple personality they must try to lower the standard of the fans in order to save their arses. Now most fans are smart enough not to buy it. Most fans can accept a young team that loses and needs time to gel if that team is giving 100% But when that team is not hustling, complaining and making excuses it becomes a problem. They then start to scream.

To avoid all the screaming our GM's must constantly push that it is okay to lose. "Just wait. Just wait and in the future our team will actually hustle(not play well, hustle. We are actually told to wait for an honest effort). Don't call for my firing. I need time. Continue to lower your standard. I know my team turned the ball over 31 times and quit halfway through the first quarter, but that's all part of the plan. Don't judge me or the players. Lower your standards. When your team quits at the beginning of each game and turns it over 63 times, don't complain. That's part of our plan. they have to turn it over that many times to exorcise the ghost of LB."

Some fans in NY have lowered their standards to unbeleivable depths. In the past if someone didn't make a game winning shot in the 7th game of the playoffs we blasted them. Now guys can play half-asse and we make excuses for them. The standard is in the toilet. Our players make excuses for everything and our GM/Coach backs them. Win 40 games and this attitude will never get you anywhere. We need a culture change. When will we become "real fans" and demand better effort instead of accepting less?
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Nalod
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10/24/2006  2:30 PM
"We're going to be swimming, and they're going to grab your head and stick it under the water," Thomas said. "If you can't [fight], you're going to drown. We got a tough road ahead."

Sounds like knick fans are about to have another "Swirly" of a season!
TrueBlue
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10/24/2006  2:36 PM
Why is everything a fight when it comes to Zeke? This is Basketball! X's & O's, Passion, Desire, Conditioning, Fundamentals, Skill, and Execution. It sounds like he's on the verge of suicide or jumping off a cliff. Why is he talking to the media so much?
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Bippity10
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10/24/2006  2:45 PM
Well we are too the point where we've made LB the key to all our problems last year. So if a player exhibits a fault that he had last year it's not really a fault. I mean it is, but we can't say that because that would be legitimizing LB. Instead we have to sugarcoat everything. The only hope is that Isiah is blasting these guys behind closed doors because his media personality is ridiculous. Enough excuses. Get the guys to work hard every day. If they can't do that, get rid/bench them. Enough catering to "sensitivity". They did not go through war and are suffering from PTSD. They went through a failed season in which they in part inflicted pain upon themselves. It's time to raise the standard and stop accepting attitudes that expect less.

My program went through 20 years averaging 6 wins a season. Why? Because everyone felt we weren't a basketball school. When I came in they said it would take time. I demanded more. My way or the highway. If you don't like my way and don't want to be a part of it, that's okay. I don't hate you. I love you as much as anyone else, but you can't play for me. In two seasons we were winning. It was a complete culture change. We need that here. Enough coddling and cradling to sensitive babies.

[Edited by - bippity10 on 10-24-2006 2:46 PM]
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Nalod
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10/24/2006  2:53 PM
Posted by SeatsBlue:

Why is everything a fight when it comes to Zeke? This is Basketball! X's & O's, Passion, Desire, Conditioning, Fundamentals, Skill, and Execution. It sounds like he's on the verge of suicide or jumping off a cliff. Why is he talking to the media so much?


He is insecure. The regular bull$hit he has spewed the last few years is all too familiar. He is married to Stephon. Its like you marry a real nice hot looking girl with a real rich daddy you go to work for. You over look the fact she is a complete bitch. After a few years you realize your life is hell and if you walk you have nothing. Oh yeah, she made you sign a prenup. And one day you know she is going to be fat and ugly like here mother. YOu thought it was going to be different.

Isiah is marburys Bitch. Look a it this way, Its your team, your on the hot seat, your the 5th coach since you became GM, your owner is sticking your nose in the feces you made, your star player is moron, the coach you seduced might get 60 mil which is all your fault, your not getting no 60mil, the press is all over you, the fans don't respect you, it might get real ugly, youve failed in two other executive roles, you have a grown son who you had while engaged to your present wife and everyone knows it, and you got a sexual harrasemnt case against you with an ugly women accusing you of all kinds of things.

And all you had to do is sit on your money and play golf, do a few real estate deals here and there, play the market a bit, sign autographs and be a hero. INstead you go out and make everyone foget what great player you were and step on people in trying to reach the top.

They say becareful who you step on while you try to reach the top cuz you might see them again on the way down.

Thats why Isiah is so morose.


[Edited by - Nalod on 10-24-2006 2:54 PM]
Bippity10
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10/24/2006  2:54 PM
Plot Summary for
A Mother's Courage: The Mary Thomas Story (1989) (TV)
The story of Mary Thomas, the mother of basketball star Isiah Thomas, and how she fought to keep her family together and her sons out of trouble despite the surroundings of poverty, drugs, crime and violence of their ghetto neighborhood.

Rent and watch this movie. It will give you incredible insight into why Isiah seems to target malcontents in hopes that he can turn them around. He wasn't a malcontent growing up but his mother did for him a lot of what he is/was trying to do for Marbs, TT, Stevie, Jalen etc. Good movie.
I just hope that people will like me
Nalod
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10/24/2006  3:03 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

Plot Summary for
A Mother's Courage: The Mary Thomas Story (1989) (TV)
The story of Mary Thomas, the mother of basketball star Isiah Thomas, and how she fought to keep her family together and her sons out of trouble despite the surroundings of poverty, drugs, crime and violence of their ghetto neighborhood.

Rent and watch this movie. It will give you incredible insight into why Isiah seems to target malcontents in hopes that he can turn them around. He wasn't a malcontent growing up but his mother did for him a lot of what he is/was trying to do for Marbs, TT, Stevie, Jalen etc. Good movie.

And to think he is quoted saying he would trade her for the right player!

Mary needs to give this team some Chunky Soup and an asswooping!
arkrud
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10/24/2006  3:06 PM
Oh...
So all this is not about basketball. It's about more serious stuff.
So if you will give a 10 mils to each child from ghetto neighborhood there is a good chanse that they wil turn it around.
Very possible.
IT is much better man as I thought.
IT for US president!!! If he will get the Office may be he will leave tte Knicks alone...
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wsdm
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10/24/2006  3:08 PM
Posted by djsunyc:
"We need all hands on deck," Thomas said. "Missing him is a huge piece. A huge piece."
Is that the entire story? He doesn't say anything about losing games.
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TrueBlue
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10/24/2006  3:19 PM
Posted by wsdm:
Posted by djsunyc:
"We need all hands on deck," Thomas said. "Missing him is a huge piece. A huge piece."
Is that the entire story? He doesn't say anything about losing games.


He's quoted several post before yours as saying such.
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Allanfan20
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10/24/2006  3:39 PM
Posted by wsdm:
Posted by djsunyc:
"We need all hands on deck," Thomas said. "Missing him is a huge piece. A huge piece."
Is that the entire story? He doesn't say anything about losing games.

I don't think it could be anymore obvious what he's saying.
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Swishfm3
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10/24/2006  3:44 PM
I think he's trying to lower expectations...but I agree...this was a dumb thing to say
fishmike
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10/24/2006  4:23 PM
Posted by efw:

I didn't say anything about Layden. I said it would be stupid to fire Isiah mid year.

Why bring up Scottie? Why try to impose a similarity on two completely different situations? In my mind, Layden did nothing positive during his time here. nothing. Despite Isiah's faults, I can find several things to be hopeful about.
Obviously I Layden made some bad moves, equally bad as the ones Isiah has made. Layden used the MLE on Deke and Spoon. Is that better or worse than Vin Baker and Jerome James? At least the 2 guys Layden signed played and contributed. Layden drafted Sweetney, Frank Williams, Milos Vujanic and Lampe, all of which people were excited about at some point or another. Layden's only lottery pick was traded in the McDyess deal. Obviously it blew up, but adding a 20/10 frontcourt player to Houston/Spree wasnt a horrible idea... it just didnt work out, and the trade itself was bad. Layden's roster had some useless overpaid guys like Shandon and Eisley. Gee... Isiah's roster doesnt have any of those does it?

The both sucked... just in different ways

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
SugarRayRichardson
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10/24/2006  5:00 PM
At somepoint somebody has to ask Isiah why should this team be so bad. Is it the GM? The coach? or the players?

Then once he blames the players ask who brought all 15 here
I LOVED how Curry just exploded in the 4th, speaking as a fan of the Raptors, Curry looked well, scary I think is the word. Or Shaq-like Curry: 19.1ppg-7.3rpg-58%fg
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isiah to fans: we're going to lose in november
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