[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

Steve Kerr: Butler is one of "Free agency's best buys"
Author Thread
holfresh
Posts: 38679
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/14/2006
Member: #1081

7/28/2006  4:38 PM
Posted by newyorknewyork:

Yes we needed a void at center. But you don't spend 5yrs 36mil on him. Why couldn't we just sign Diop or Steven Hunter for 2yrs 2-3mil and go stop gap that way. Yes James has way more potential then either of them. But bottom line is Isiah tried to hit a home run with James. Ignored all the red flaqs and thought that he could turn James into some kind of allstar calibre center in NY becuase he showed the flashes in Seattle that last season. Sure James could be a huge defensive monster for us if he really wanted it. Look what he did for Seattle cloging the lanes forcing opponents to settle for jumpers which allowed Allen & Lewis to be comfortable playing up on there man. But the odds of him doing it wasn't good so why risk 36mil on that chance. When we could have got Diop cheap and waited for a better option to come along.

It probably had to do with 33win season the yr before. Which Dolan didn't like. So Isiah felt he didn't have the time to settle for a guy like Diop until a better option came along. And felt he had to hit a home run with James.


Your entire argument is based on the benefit of hindsight...Diop wasn't on anyone's radar,Hunter is a good third string to ok backup center....JJ can start in this league..



AUTOADVERT
nyk4ever
Posts: 41010
Alba Posts: 12
Joined: 1/12/2005
Member: #848
USA
7/28/2006  4:46 PM
Your argument is based on the benefit of only looking at his stats when his contract is up. JJ can only start at the end of contract years. At no other time in his career has he been good.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
newyorknewyork
Posts: 30260
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #541
7/28/2006  5:18 PM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by newyorknewyork:

Yes we needed a void at center. But you don't spend 5yrs 36mil on him. Why couldn't we just sign Diop or Steven Hunter for 2yrs 2-3mil and go stop gap that way. Yes James has way more potential then either of them. But bottom line is Isiah tried to hit a home run with James. Ignored all the red flaqs and thought that he could turn James into some kind of allstar calibre center in NY becuase he showed the flashes in Seattle that last season. Sure James could be a huge defensive monster for us if he really wanted it. Look what he did for Seattle cloging the lanes forcing opponents to settle for jumpers which allowed Allen & Lewis to be comfortable playing up on there man. But the odds of him doing it wasn't good so why risk 36mil on that chance. When we could have got Diop cheap and waited for a better option to come along.

It probably had to do with 33win season the yr before. Which Dolan didn't like. So Isiah felt he didn't have the time to settle for a guy like Diop until a better option came along. And felt he had to hit a home run with James.


Your entire argument is based on the benefit of hindsight...Diop wasn't on anyone's radar,Hunter is a good third string to ok backup center....JJ can start in this league..

I didn't want JJ when when Layden was considering him way back. And didn't want JJ when Isiah signed him to 5yrs 36mil. If Isiah signed JJ for 2yrs 8-10 I would have no problem. But he signed him for 5yrs 36mil. If I can blast Layden like I did for signing Spoon & Anderson for as long as he did then I could blast Isiah for signing JJ at the price he did.

Diop worked out for Isiah and the Knicks before he worked out for Dallas and signed there. I knew of Diop and I don't work for anybodys scouting team. If Diop who was a lottery pick a few yrs back out of highschool. And who plays in the same division was under the radar than out scouting team isn't doing there job. Not that Diop is all that great. But value wise he is way better than JJ.

Its like u paid 10 dollars for a double cheese burger. While you buddy spent 1 dollar a regular cheesburger. Now after you ate the cheesburger you and your fried are thristy. But guess what. You spent all your money on that cheesburger. So now your friend is enjoying that soda with the 9 dollars he saved in your face. And he is very insecure about sharing.

Say your the GM. Would you sign a guy who in 5yrs in the league played over 65games once was 30-31yrs old. Has never averaged over 5pts 4rebs. And is known around the league as lazy with no passion for the game of basketball to 5yrs 36mil. Or would you rather settle for some cheap scrubs until better options come along. Sure we would have been hurting in the middle this season though we got Curry. But we would have been way better down the line. And guess what, all the negatives happend anyway and JJ ended up sucking and we still overpaid. Id rather have a scrub with limited potential at one tenth the price than overpay for a scrub with potential. Thats just smart buisness and I don't need hindsight to know that. Actually its common sense.

We all know that im as big a support of the team than anyone hear. But Isiah was dead wrong on this one. No need to even defend this move.
https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 2/2/2004
Member: #581
USA
7/28/2006  5:38 PM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by Masterplan:
Posted by purple012870:

JJ was horrific, but in July '06, we did not CHOOSE him and his contract over Butler.

no, but making that decision to pay $60 million for JJ was dumb in many ways, including shortsighted, costing us the chance to keep JB for $14m.

if letting JB go means we're looking to stop overpaying for mediocre players, i'm for it. time will tell, but if that is our philosophy going forward i just regret that it's a year too late and hope it lasts past when baron davis ends up on the trading block.


Dude, I know you are a Knick fan if you are posting on this board....If you remember correctly, the Knicks had no center when they acquired JJ...None..Nada

They had some guy named Jackie Butler on the roster already! I could have sworn I've heard that name before!


Like I said, they had no center on the roster...


Kurt and Jackie were on the roster and 1000 times better at center than JJ has ever been
arkrud
Posts: 32217
Alba Posts: 7
Joined: 8/31/2005
Member: #995
USA
7/28/2006  5:40 PM
Isaiah is a gambler.
And he gambles with Dolan’s money. So why he will care?
He is having fun. If I will be an owner I will keep this guy as far as possible from my organization.
He is Marbsx10 - Me, Me, Me...
He is bad person and bad JM.
Sorry for the Knicks he happened to run into this club to abuse it


"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
Anji
Posts: 25523
Alba Posts: 9
Joined: 4/14/2006
Member: #1122
USA
7/28/2006  5:45 PM
JJ makes 7million plus????? Wow, JJ contract just keeps getting bigger and butler just keeps getting better and better in retrospect.
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
nyk4ever
Posts: 41010
Alba Posts: 12
Joined: 1/12/2005
Member: #848
USA
7/28/2006  5:50 PM
Posted by Anji:

JJ makes 7million plus????? Wow, JJ contract just keeps getting bigger and butler just keeps getting better and better in retrospect.

Thats your argument? You want to argue over 5 million dollars instead of the fact that Jerome James is a poor basketball player who is going to be 31 in November and the Knicks just gave up a very promising 21 year old who showed prowess for rebounding and scoring around the basket? That's your argument?
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
holfresh
Posts: 38679
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/14/2006
Member: #1081

7/28/2006  11:14 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by Masterplan:
Posted by purple012870:

JJ was horrific, but in July '06, we did not CHOOSE him and his contract over Butler.

no, but making that decision to pay $60 million for JJ was dumb in many ways, including shortsighted, costing us the chance to keep JB for $14m.

if letting JB go means we're looking to stop overpaying for mediocre players, i'm for it. time will tell, but if that is our philosophy going forward i just regret that it's a year too late and hope it lasts past when baron davis ends up on the trading block.


Dude, I know you are a Knick fan if you are posting on this board....If you remember correctly, the Knicks had no center when they acquired JJ...None..Nada

They had some guy named Jackie Butler on the roster already! I could have sworn I've heard that name before!


Like I said, they had no center on the roster...


Kurt and Jackie were on the roster and 1000 times better at center than JJ has ever been


Jackie was in the NBA for a cup of coffee at the time...He barely played..We didn't even know if he would make the roster the following year let alone going into the season as your man in the middle...Do you really think the Knicks would go into the season with KT as the center..KT was the center when we had no choice....Come on I know you saw the games..

joec32033
Posts: 30632
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #583
USA
7/28/2006  11:27 PM
Holfresh everyone understands WHY we signed JJ, but-IMO-there were better options available. Diop was on Isiah's radar, he just chose to go with JJ. I understand why and I accept it, but that doesn't mean it doesn't warrant some type of criticism when there were toher options available.

I have defended the JJ signing(even though I didn't like it) because of the exact same reason you are defending it.

Jerome was signed by the Knicks on July 14, 2005(http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/content?statsId=3279), Diop signed with Dallas on August 20, 2005(http://www.insidehoops.com/diop-mavs-082005.shtml). I would have even been happy signing both of them, even it it cost us Curry(at the time the Curry Drama didn't unfold yet).

Bottom line is James was not the only option. To be honest he was pn the same level as signing Diop when age and cost are taken into account(at the time of the signing).
~You can't run from who you are.~
Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 2/2/2004
Member: #581
USA
7/29/2006  12:02 AM
Holfresh: I'm 5'5". If I put on 19 inch high heals and you were GM and Kurt was the current center, would you give me a $30 mil contract? I bet I could still move around better than JJ even in the heals!
Allanfan20
Posts: 35947
Alba Posts: 50
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #542
USA
7/29/2006  1:50 AM
Only Bonn would make that type of analogy. lol
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 2/2/2004
Member: #581
USA
7/29/2006  7:44 AM
Posted by Allanfan20:

Only Bonn would make that type of analogy. lol
I'm creative!

Steve Kerr: Butler is one of "Free agency's best buys"

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy