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Curry Problem?
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rvhoss
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4/12/2006  9:45 AM
I think the last paragraph says it all...we all know that yes, this is his 5th year, he is still a kid, this would be his rookie season if he was a 4 year college player, I know it's been said time and time again, but when did Jordan finally realize his potential?

Give Curry and Crawford a couple of years in the same system on the same team, by then Frye will be seasoned as will Lee.

QRich and QWoods will be veterans as well.
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holfresh
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4/12/2006  9:53 AM

The only problem is that Jackie Brown is not out playing Eddy, so not sure how he accounts for Jackie's minutes...
rvhoss
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4/12/2006  10:15 AM
Brown hates Zeke's type of players. He's looking for quiet shut your mouth and listen players, rasheed wallace was the exception and he probably hated rasheed as well.

While Curry is unassuming, I think next year he will be in shape and focused on the task at hand.
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SlimPack
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4/12/2006  10:21 AM
I think butler has more upside than curry, despite being less athletic. but I could be wrong. I thing if butler could start consistently like curry has and play as many minutes as curry has that he would put up better numbers. but since it never really happene I cant prove that.
rvhoss
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4/12/2006  10:25 AM
they are kind of different players, one is athletically gifted the other is fundamentally sound. One can get up and around the defender the other uses the skyhook and other sound bball skills to get his points. One catches Oops the other lays it off the glass. One blows dunks, the other is easily stripped.

One is a Zeke type player, the other is a Larry Brown type player.

Will both remain knicks?

[Edited by - rvhoss on 04-12-2006 10:26 AM]
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djsunyc
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4/12/2006  10:32 AM
all this f'n curry talk is making me hungry...
McK1
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4/12/2006  10:46 AM
Posted by rvhoss:

Brown hates Zeke's type of players. He's looking for quiet shut your mouth and listen players, rasheed wallace was the exception and he probably hated rasheed as well.

While Curry is unassuming, I think next year he will be in shape and focused on the task at hand.

thats why he pressed Joe to trade for him.

if Curry or anyone else on this team defended like Rasheed does, they could talk and demonstrate as much as they want
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McK1
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4/12/2006  10:50 AM
Posted by holfresh:




What, are you saying that Tim Duncan, Jermaine Oneil,Weed Wallace, Dirk and Gasol are all faster than Frye...you are on drugs......None of these guys are fast nor do they use speed to beat their opponents....


yes

Its obvious they raen't Kenyon Martin running down the court but they aren't 7 foot Stiphs like Frye. They are quick players laterally and they can motor from baeline to baseline.

Frye can jump, however, he has slow feet
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
holfresh
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4/12/2006  1:52 PM
Posted by McK1:
Posted by holfresh:




What, are you saying that Tim Duncan, Jermaine Oneil,Weed Wallace, Dirk and Gasol are all faster than Frye...you are on drugs......None of these guys are fast nor do they use speed to beat their opponents....


yes

Its obvious they raen't Kenyon Martin running down the court but they aren't 7 foot Stiphs like Frye. They are quick players laterally and they can motor from baeline to baseline.

Frye can jump, however, he has slow feet



None of those guys motors anywhere and has quicker feet than Fyre does...


And stop saying that Larry pressed Joe to trade for Weed...Anyway you guys can credit Larry for anything you will do it....Dumars gets the credit for that trade...Everyone wanted Weed including the Knicks and he wanted to come to New York...





[Edited by - holfresh on 04-12-2006 1:54 PM]
Pharzeone
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4/12/2006  2:12 PM
Posted by McK1:
Posted by holfresh:




What, are you saying that Tim Duncan, Jermaine Oneil,Weed Wallace, Dirk and Gasol are all faster than Frye...you are on drugs......None of these guys are fast nor do they use speed to beat their opponents....


yes

Its obvious they raen't Kenyon Martin running down the court but they aren't 7 foot Stiphs like Frye. They are quick players laterally and they can motor from baeline to baseline.

Frye can jump, however, he has slow feet

Are you kidding, Duncan doesn't have lateral quickness and now after all his injury issues he has even less. Duncan is just a methodical force in and out of the paint. Solid but not flashy. Ben Wallace is the athlethic one, that guy has alot of stamina. O'Neal is second but his inside game is why he comes after Duncan for being a force. Frye has stamina issues, not so much slow footed. If you notice, most of the Knicks look winded after a bit. I attributed it to poor training and conditioning. That's one area where I totally agree with Brown on is that these guys need to seriously work on their conditioning before the start of the season.
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McK1
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4/12/2006  2:22 PM
wso why can't Frye guard on the perimeter if he is so fleet footed?

as for Sheed:

Dumars also said that Detroit head coach Larry Brown was happy to have Wallace in the fold.

"He (Brown) was very happy," said Dumars. "He's a Rasheed fan, he's a Carolina guy, and you know how Larry is partial to those guys. He's a big-time talent, and then you hand him over to your coach and giving him a chance to win more games - Larry was very happy to say the least."

With the addition of Wallace, who has averaged 16.1 points and 6.7 rebounds over 610 games in his career, Detroit will have a potent starting lineup that consists of Ben Wallace at center, Rasheed Wallace and Tayshaun Prince at the forwards and Chauncey Billups and Richard Hamilton in the backcourt.

According to Dumars, Rasheed Wallace is happy to be a member of the Pistons.

"He (Rasheed) was very happy," said Dumars. "He's looking forward to it. He knows what type of guys we have. He and Larry talked on the phone, they got caught up, and he sounded very excited to be coming here. We clearly feel like he's a guy that can fit. We think he's a guy that can come in and give us some juice. We're not looking at him as the guy that's going to save us; we just think that he's an incredible piece to add to the mix that we already have."

http://www.sportsbooks.com/news/sports_betting/44880.html

I'm not discrediting Joe's work, but you're blind if you think Larry had nothing to do with Wallace, whose agent stated publicly, wanted to go to NY, coming and staying there.

Beautiful thing having a GM and coach on the same page in terms of how they want a team to play.
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
McK1
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4/12/2006  2:24 PM
Posted by Pharzeone:



Are you kidding, Duncan doesn't have lateral quickness and now after all his injury issues he has even less. Duncan is just a methodical force in and out of the paint. Solid but not flashy.

TD redefined the position and became the best by having the athleticism of Brad Miller.

okey dokey!

just last night I watched Seattle try to iso him on Wilcox on the perimeter and Duncan stay with him step for step and cut off his moves. Whether you are a fan of Wilcox' game or not, he is still one of the fastest most active power-forwards in the league

[Edited by - McK1 on 04-12-2006 2:35 PM]
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
McK1
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4/12/2006  2:26 PM
more quotes holfresh

Pistons Head Coach Larry Brown

Opening remarks
“Coach (Dean) Smith is smiling right now. I talked to him about the trade. This is the first time in my memory I hadn’t had a chance to coach a (North) Carolina guy. Everybody obviously feels we can benefit from this trade. We made a dramatic trade and only lost four quality players that meant a lot to us as coaches. I think in the long run it will be good for Bobby (Sura), Chucky (Atkins), and Zelly (Rebraca) and hopefully Lindsey (Hunter).”

On the North Carolina connection
“I remember I had a chance to be apart of the All-Star game in Washington. Rasheed (Wallace) looked around and there was (Jerry) Stackhouse, Vince (Carter), and all of our coaches from Carolina. Everyone was talking about the Carolina Mafia. We have to remember that we are here because this guy can play. I’ve had the opportunity to coach a lot of Carolina guys, and you know when a coach calls you about a guy. You know that he knows how to play, and I know coach would admit that he (Wallace) is one of his favorites.”

About making a fresh start
“I’ve known him (Wallace) for a long time. I remember as a young player and as a coach I did some crazy things because I wanted to win so badly. It has taken me 30 years and I still have to work on it every day. I know that when we see him go nuts on the court it is because he wants to win so badly. If you look at his recent success, he’s had a better time dealing with people and with the referees. He said the most important thing every player and coach that has ever worked with him talk about what a great person he is. He has such a positive situation here. I feel that he will be a good fit.”

What Wallace brings to the team
“I’m going to play him as much as we can. I know he can score and defend plus I know he has been well coached. I know he can guard people of the on the perimeter and on the post. When we lost Cliff Robinson, we lost a big guy that can change the defense. We now have a guy that can do similar things. They are both great big guys and they can both defend and shoot the outside jumper. I know he’s going to make the players around him better, so whatever we need, he’ll give us great flexibility. Again, Joe (Dumars) really went to bat with us. He and Mr. Davison did. The goal was to get the best player available and I think we did. It’s not on him (Wallace); don’t think he’s coming here to save us. We lost four straight to New Jersey last year. We all have to get better. I have to coach better and the players have to play better. I think he’ll make it better on everybody.”

On being the front-runner in the Eastern Conference
“New Jersey is still the power house and Rick (Carlisle) has done a great job with Indiana. I think we’re a good team. If I don’t screw us up, I think we have a chance to make a run. As I talked to him today and as I said to him all last summer, I think he’s one of the top five players in the league because of all that he brings. If we adjust quickly we can beat any team on any given night.”

On how badly he wanted Wallace here
“It was a sensitive issue with me, since I’m so close with Maurice Cheeks. If you ask him who his favorite player was, he would say Rasheed (Wallace). I wanted him to do well, and I knew how close to his family and Portland. When I heard that there was a possibility that he might be moved, I was on Joe to get him. I did not want to hurt our core players and our future. When Joe said that there might be a chance to bring him here and not hurt our core group of guys and sacrificing our future, I couldn’t not go for a player like this.

On Wallace starting right away
“I think I’m going to bring him off the bench so he can get a bigger hand. We are going to stick with our starting line up, but he’s here to play and I don’t think anyone will have any problems with him starting. Just based on the conversation that I had with the team, everyone is as happy as I am. He’ll be starting real soon.”
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
holfresh
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4/12/2006  10:25 PM
Posted by McK1:

more quotes holfresh

Pistons Head Coach Larry Brown

Opening remarks
“Coach (Dean) Smith is smiling right now. I talked to him about the trade. This is the first time in my memory I hadn’t had a chance to coach a (North) Carolina guy. Everybody obviously feels we can benefit from this trade. We made a dramatic trade and only lost four quality players that meant a lot to us as coaches. I think in the long run it will be good for Bobby (Sura), Chucky (Atkins), and Zelly (Rebraca) and hopefully Lindsey (Hunter).”

On the North Carolina connection
“I remember I had a chance to be apart of the All-Star game in Washington. Rasheed (Wallace) looked around and there was (Jerry) Stackhouse, Vince (Carter), and all of our coaches from Carolina. Everyone was talking about the Carolina Mafia. We have to remember that we are here because this guy can play. I’ve had the opportunity to coach a lot of Carolina guys, and you know when a coach calls you about a guy. You know that he knows how to play, and I know coach would admit that he (Wallace) is one of his favorites.”

About making a fresh start
“I’ve known him (Wallace) for a long time. I remember as a young player and as a coach I did some crazy things because I wanted to win so badly. It has taken me 30 years and I still have to work on it every day. I know that when we see him go nuts on the court it is because he wants to win so badly. If you look at his recent success, he’s had a better time dealing with people and with the referees. He said the most important thing every player and coach that has ever worked with him talk about what a great person he is. He has such a positive situation here. I feel that he will be a good fit.”

What Wallace brings to the team
“I’m going to play him as much as we can. I know he can score and defend plus I know he has been well coached. I know he can guard people of the on the perimeter and on the post. When we lost Cliff Robinson, we lost a big guy that can change the defense. We now have a guy that can do similar things. They are both great big guys and they can both defend and shoot the outside jumper. I know he’s going to make the players around him better, so whatever we need, he’ll give us great flexibility. Again, Joe (Dumars) really went to bat with us. He and Mr. Davison did. The goal was to get the best player available and I think we did. It’s not on him (Wallace); don’t think he’s coming here to save us. We lost four straight to New Jersey last year. We all have to get better. I have to coach better and the players have to play better. I think he’ll make it better on everybody.”

On being the front-runner in the Eastern Conference
“New Jersey is still the power house and Rick (Carlisle) has done a great job with Indiana. I think we’re a good team. If I don’t screw us up, I think we have a chance to make a run. As I talked to him today and as I said to him all last summer, I think he’s one of the top five players in the league because of all that he brings. If we adjust quickly we can beat any team on any given night.”

On how badly he wanted Wallace here
“It was a sensitive issue with me, since I’m so close with Maurice Cheeks. If you ask him who his favorite player was, he would say Rasheed (Wallace). I wanted him to do well, and I knew how close to his family and Portland. When I heard that there was a possibility that he might be moved, I was on Joe to get him. I did not want to hurt our core players and our future. When Joe said that there might be a chance to bring him here and not hurt our core group of guys and sacrificing our future, I couldn’t not go for a player like this.

On Wallace starting right away
“I think I’m going to bring him off the bench so he can get a bigger hand. We are going to stick with our starting line up, but he’s here to play and I don’t think anyone will have any problems with him starting. Just based on the conversation that I had with the team, everyone is as happy as I am. He’ll be starting real soon.”



You are making this seemed like a genius move or something...everyone in the NBA wanted Wallace....Everyone...If you remember...Isiah wanted him badly as well...Does that now make him a genius...Wallace openly said he wanted to come to the Knicks as well...Ok fine...It was Larry's trade...wow...he's the man...
McK1
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4/12/2006  10:48 PM
it was Detroit's trade and it was a genious one. Wallace was obtained with the help of 2 other EASTERN CONFERENCE teams. And he was indeed the mising piece.
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
WOODMANnYk
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4/12/2006  10:52 PM
hawks and the stupid *** g.m danny ainge with the celtics.. wallace was practically given to the pistons on a silver player...

From what i recalled, Chauney billups was da man during the playoffs and finals.. he was the finals MVP, not wallace.
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McK1
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4/12/2006  10:54 PM
Billups had a good Finals. He played inconsistently versus Jersey and Indy.

Wallace working Karl Malone's bum leg over in the post in game 1 contributed alot to Chauncey's open looks because LA had to double down.

[Edited by - McK1 on 04-12-2006 11:11 PM]
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
bobs3304
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4/12/2006  10:57 PM
he's a decent-good man defender, but a poor help defender.

he's more of a post defender than a shotblocker. he boxes out decently.

his ceiling is probly 15 and 7 or 8. He's not a franchise player. He's a borderline All-Star at best.

But he's a Center that draws fouls and opens up shots for other guys (once he learns to pass better out of the double team).
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
holfresh
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4/12/2006  11:06 PM
Posted by bobs3304:

he's a decent-good man defender, but a poor help defender.

he's more of a post defender than a shotblocker. he boxes out decently.

his ceiling is probly 15 and 7 or 8. He's not a franchise player. He's a borderline All-Star at best.

But he's a Center that draws fouls and opens up shots for other guys (once he learns to pass better out of the double team).



You are making a case for being a big man that does everything...
bobs3304
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4/12/2006  11:07 PM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by bobs3304:

he's a decent-good man defender, but a poor help defender.

he's more of a post defender than a shotblocker. he boxes out decently.

his ceiling is probly 15 and 7 or 8. He's not a franchise player. He's a borderline All-Star at best.

But he's a Center that draws fouls and opens up shots for other guys (once he learns to pass better out of the double team).



You are making a case for being a big man that does everything...




What are you talkin about?

My "analysis" was pretty damn fair.


He's in no way a complete big man. But I gotta give props when props is due.
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
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