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boy this team quit so bad
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crzymdups
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2/13/2006  11:10 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by crzymdups:
Posted by nyballer:

The hornets were the second worst team in the league last year, and they traded away an all-star center in jamal magloire for desmond mason, who is only putting up 10/4. Chris Paul turned the team around from 2nd worst in the league to 9th overall - that's impressive.

they added Desmond Mason, Speedy Claxon and other players.

The Knicks looked a lot better with a real PG, too.

wait a second crz the hornets have one every game since chris paul got hurt--so whats the excuse there?

dude, are you going to deny the overall mentality of this team sucks right now? And last time I checked, Claxon is a real PG, too. we have nothing outside of Marbury. Frye and Lee and Nate are rookies, Curry is learning. This team has talent, but it takes time to gel. How did Speedy and West look last year? did they suck and magically transform to good players over the summer? no. it's circumstances and with a young team these bad stretches are going to snowball.

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McK1
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2/13/2006  11:11 PM
Posted by crzymdups:
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by crzymdups:
Posted by nyballer:

The hornets were the second worst team in the league last year, and they traded away an all-star center in jamal magloire for desmond mason, who is only putting up 10/4. Chris Paul turned the team around from 2nd worst in the league to 9th overall - that's impressive.

they added Desmond Mason, Speedy Claxon and other players.

The Knicks looked a lot better with a real PG, too.

wait a second crz the hornets have one every game since chris paul got hurt--so whats the excuse there?

dude, are you going to deny the overall mentality of this team sucks right now? And last time I checked, Claxon is a real PG, too. we have nothing outside of Marbury. Frye and Lee and Nate are rookies, Curry is learning. This team has talent, but it takes time to gel. How did Speedy and West look last year? did they suck and magically transform to good players over the summer? no. it's circumstances and with a young team these bad stretches are going to snowball.

West looked crippled and in a suit for most of the season. Speedy looked good in GS through February.

[Edited by - McK1 on 02-13-2006 11:12 PM]
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
crzymdups
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2/13/2006  11:11 PM
Posted by ultknicks524:
Posted by crzymdups:

13-22, when he was single-handedly bringing them back from 18 down against the Twolves. They were down by 6 with 8 minutes to go when he went down.

THE RECORD STILL SUCKS!!!!!!!!! My God!!!!!!!! How can anyone be in such ****ing denial!

you're right, Curry didn't miss 9 of those earlier games and training camp and QRich didn't miss training camp and have his brother killed and we aren't playing 3 rookies major minutes and Brown has set a lineup and we just suck.

it's not denial it's reality. you can be a cry baby or you can accept it as a lost season and realize there is still a decent base to build on here.

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crzymdups
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2/13/2006  11:13 PM
Posted by McK1:

[
West looked crippled and in a suit for most of the season. Speedy looked good in GS through February.

[Edited by - McK1 on 02-13-2006 11:12 PM]

yet when Speedy got to New Orleans he suddenly sucked or was it just a bad situation? West was crippled? how about Marbury, Curry and Qrich through various parts of the season.

wait, I forget, are excuses only applicable for other teams but not the Knicks?

has Ridnour been crippled this season or does he just suck?
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djsunyc
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2/13/2006  11:18 PM
Posted by crzymdups:
Posted by McK1:

[
West looked crippled and in a suit for most of the season. Speedy looked good in GS through February.

[Edited by - McK1 on 02-13-2006 11:12 PM]

yet when Speedy got to New Orleans he suddenly sucked or was it just a bad situation? West was crippled? how about Marbury, Curry and Qrich through various parts of the season.

wait, I forget, are excuses only applicable for other teams but not the Knicks?

has Ridnour been crippled this season or does he just suck?

marbury will help us. we will look alot better and i think we'll be better after the allstar break. it still doesn't take away from the fact that the foundation of this team is not built on defense and we are structurally flawed. for the short term, yes marbury will help us, anyone that disputes that is crazy. and the reason we blow is b/c our vets suck. our young guys are exactly that, young. there are some questions with them but that's ok, they're young. but our vets are just doo doo. and we added another one that isn't a big a difference that people think...MAN UP!!!
McK1
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2/13/2006  11:19 PM
Posted by crzymdups:
Posted by McK1:

[
West looked crippled and in a suit for most of the season. Speedy looked good in GS through February.

[Edited by - McK1 on 02-13-2006 11:12 PM]

yet when Speedy got to New Orleans he suddenly sucked or was it just a bad situation? West was crippled? how about Marbury, Curry and Qrich through various parts of the season.

wait, I forget, are excuses only applicable for other teams but not the Knicks?

has Ridnour been crippled this season or does he just suck?

when Marbury misses 30 games like Baron and Curry misses 30 games like West, then maybe I'll buy some of the bull**** you are selling.

In just his 2nd season, Ridnour started point and played 31 mpg on a 50 win division winning team last season. Can Marbury say that?
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ultknicks524
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2/13/2006  11:21 PM
Posted by McK1:

In just his 2nd season, Ridnour started point and played 31 mpg on a 50 win division winning team last season. Can Marbury say that?

Did Marbury play with anyone who are half the players Ray Allen and Rashard Lewis are?

[Edited by - ultknicks524 on 02-13-2006 11:22 PM]
jaydh
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2/13/2006  11:23 PM
Posted by McK1:

In just his 2nd season, Ridnour started point and played 31 mpg on a 50 win division winning team last season. Can Marbury say that?

how many elite players, outside of maybe shaq, can say that?

McK1
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2/13/2006  11:25 PM
Posted by ultknicks524:
Posted by McK1:

In just his 2nd season, Ridnour started point and played 31 mpg on a 50 win division winning team last season. Can Marbury say that?

Did Marbury play with anyone who are half the players Ray Allen and Rashard Lewis are?

[Edited by - ultknicks524 on 02-13-2006 11:22 PM]

haha!
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
McK1
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2/13/2006  11:26 PM
Posted by jaydh:
Posted by McK1:

In just his 2nd season, Ridnour started point and played 31 mpg on a 50 win division winning team last season. Can Marbury say that?

how many elite players, outside of maybe shaq, can say that?



a division title too high a bar

what about the fifty win thing?
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
jaydh
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2/13/2006  11:28 PM
Posted by McK1:
Posted by jaydh:
Posted by McK1:

In just his 2nd season, Ridnour started point and played 31 mpg on a 50 win division winning team last season. Can Marbury say that?

how many elite players, outside of maybe shaq, can say that?



a division title too high a bar

what about the fifty win thing?

one player doesnt carry a team unless hes micheal jordan.
crzymdups
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2/13/2006  11:29 PM
Posted by McK1:


when Marbury misses 30 games like Baron and Curry misses 30 games like West, then maybe I'll buy some of the bull**** you are selling.

In just his 2nd season, Ridnour started point and played 31 mpg on a 50 win division winning team last season. Can Marbury say that?

hey, with Marbury and everyone healthy, we're a 45 win team AT BEST this season. that's if EVERYTHING went right. so much has gone wrong, I don't even know where to start. this was a FRAGILE balance, and it wasn't good at the start because Q, Curry and Jerome (our three vet additions, starters on 50 win teams) missed training camp and started behind and all three weren't in game shape until like December 28th for Curry, like the last week for QRich and never for Jerome James. With Marbury going down, you have no PG and a bunch of guys who haven't played together for more than 10 or 15 games and ever-shifting lineups because of injury and the whims of LB. it's a f!cking disaster, but I don't think it means this group sucks.

Like Ridnour, Jerome James started for a 50 win division winning team last season too. the reason that team won was: Ray Allen, Rashard, Reggie Evans, Antonio Daniels, Vlad Rad/Ridnour tied for 5th with Jerome a close 6th.
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McK1
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2/13/2006  11:29 PM
one player can lead a team though.

the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
crzymdups
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2/13/2006  11:30 PM
Posted by McK1:

one player can lead a team though.

like Marbury? question: who led the team to the playoffs in 03-04? Allan Houston?
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jaydh
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2/13/2006  11:32 PM
Posted by McK1:

one player can lead a team though.

and you think it was ridnour that lead that 50win seattle team??
tkf
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2/13/2006  11:35 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
chris paul is better than marbury
What's Chris Paul doing this year that Marbury didn't do his first year on the Knicks? Paul has a better team than Marbury. David West is better than any teammate Marbury has. Speedy Claxton is better than any gaurd we have. Desmond Mason is better than any SG/SF we have. Chris Anderson is a druggie who has missed half the season but he's still blocked and altered more shots than any Knick! Paul's awesome and may some day be better than Marbury but his team has a better record now because he has better teammates.



oh bonn that is bullcrap, West is agood, but come on and at one point in this season Claxton could not hold Jamals Jock strap, chris anderson is a clown, always has and always will be, and Desmond mason? please, people said the same thing about nash, they bitched that nash had marion and amare and Joe Johnson and Q rich, and marbury had nothing. Now JJ is gone, Q is on the knicks, Amare has been out all year and the suns are still kicking ass, are you now going to tell me how good diaw and House are? and how great KT is? please man...
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
Finestrg
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2/13/2006  11:36 PM
Out of everything we can single out that's wrong, to me, one of the most glaring and baffling things is the totally inept perimeter defense. It's almost like they SHOULDN'T help one another, if you can believe that, instead maybe everyone should just concentrate on sticking with their own man only. Let's try hard-nosed man-to-man only, no helping, since it's completely clear they were never taught how to play help defense. Weird, I know, other team's defensive woes usually revolve around a lack of help defense, but with the Knicks, it's almost like they overplay it on defense to a fault. Help defense is so much more than just double-teaming the nearest guy with the ball. Their feeble attempts to "help" one another only get them in trouble as they continually get picked apart with ease by opponents - good teams, bads teams, it doesn't even matter. It only takes about 2-3 passes to get a wide open shot, not even sometimes. That's got to be the first thing opposing coaches write about on the locker room blackboard when playing the Knicks: "BE PATIENT," "SHARE THE BALL," "MAKE THE EXTRA PASS," "SWING THE BALL, YOU WILL GET A WIDE OPEN SHOT ON EVERY POSESSION AGAINST THIS TEAM!!!"
In the half-court set guys try to help one another, only to completely lose sight of their own man in the process. 1 pass, 2 passes, wide open J, count it. I've never seen anything like it. Larry Brown contantly talks about a lack of effort (He's said stuff like, "I never thought I would have to coach effort" recently) and sometimes he's right - like any team, sometimes you just come out and don't have it, effort-wise. But overall, I really don't think a lack of effort is the problem. The Knicks are a decent rebounding team and they get to the foul line better than any team in the league, so for me, the effort's there. It's the way they play that's the problem especially on defense. Jeez, you'd think that after all this time their overrated, hall-of-fame coach would've reviewed enough tape to pin-point the defensive problems, then implement the appropriate changes accordingly. But after a whopping 50 GAMES, it's the same old story, at least on defense: 1 pass, 2 passes, wide open J, count it. I'm sorry, but the defensive woes rest with coach Brown. And he's supposed to be a defensive minded coach?!? God forbid he actually taught these guys how to help one another, how to rotate, etc... Look, I tune in ever game and I'm dying to see even the smallest improvement, even if it's one single play in a game, one single sign that they're trying something different, taught something different, something new... But nothing. Same old thing...
As I write this, I actually just saw Larry Brown on TV, rubbing his eyes in horror after this lastest disaster against Dallas. I know I'm hard on the guy and I do feel bad for him and Isiah too for that matter - they both work extremely hard and deserve a better fate than this. Larry's just got to implement changes, especially on defense, and I don't care how drastic or radical those changes are - play zone, try a Rick Pitino-style trap, hire a defensive-minded guy to come in here and totally re-vamp the defense like a Tex Winter, a Dick Harter, etc., make it gimmickly like how the old Duke teams used to play defense where everyone would bang their hands on the floor to motivate each other as the opponent would bring the ball up, I don't care, whatever, just show me a commitment to play better defense because this current defensive gameplan just doesn't cut it - if there even is a gameplan. It's the biggest problem I can see and one that can be corrected.
McK1
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2/13/2006  11:36 PM
Posted by crzymdups:



Like Ridnour, Jerome James started for a 50 win division winning team last season too. the reason that team won was: Ray Allen, Rashard, Reggie Evans, Antonio Daniels, Vlad Rad/Ridnour tied for 5th with Jerome a close 6th.

Jerome James played 16 minutes a game. Luke played 31. Luke was third on the team in minutes played. third in scoring, first in assists, first in steals.

truly pathetic...
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
SlimPack
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2/13/2006  11:36 PM
Posted by jaydh:

[quote]Posted by McK1:

In just his 2nd season, Ridnour started point and played 31 mpg on a 50 win division winning team last season. Can Marbury say that?

you cant give credit to one player for something that was a result of good team play, good coaching, and the gm'ing(which isnt a word BTW). anyway, marbury was a better point in his sophmore season than luke was in his, for all thats worth, I suppose it still isnt impossible for luke to turn out to be a better pg than marbury is now in the future though.

[Edited by - slimpack on 02-13-2006 11:38 PM]
crzymdups
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2/13/2006  11:36 PM
also, McK1, since rookies can't get better, how did the Sonics do in Ridnour's rookie season? Or do you have a big fat hairy pile of excuses for why Ridnour didn't lead that team to the playoffs? and how did a team with Marbury and KVH and little else blow out that team by 30 with Marbury getting 18 assists? or can rookies maybe get better? can the same group of players learn how to play together once everyone gets healthy? the Sonics make the case that you can do that.

[Edited by - crzymdups on 02-13-2006 11:39 PM]
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boy this team quit so bad

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