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NY post--NY closing on Jalen rose
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McK1
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1/22/2006  5:07 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by McK1:

see the management of those teams. Pax was not there. Pax has already proved himself an able GM.

The addition by subtraction with Crawford followed up by drafting Gordon and trading picks with Phoenix, a no. 7 that yielded Deng vs what turned out to be a no. 21 is proof enough. They took a short-term step back with the Curry trade but we'll see this summer if Pax made the right move.

[Edited by - McK1 on 01-22-2006 4:31 PM]
The Bulls had one playoff run but otherwise have been a lottery team for several consecutive years and are still a lottery team. The Crawford trade did nothing for the Bulls. They could have let Jamal walk and gotten a year of solid play and role model behavior from JYD instead. Pax has developed a nice core young at PG, SG, and SF but I don't see him as the genius others do.

noone said he was a genious. This is his 3rd year on the job.

In his 2nd year they won 47 and made the play-offs. They replaced Crawford with a much more complete guard in Gordon and replaced JYD with a guy in Nocioni of the Argentenian team that kicked ass in the Olympics who is every bit as tough and hustles just as hard defensively as JYD did plus is a player on the offensive side of the ball. He nabbed Duhon in the second round. Chi's backup point is getting 10 pts and 5.6 assists and a stl. He is 4th in assist to turnover ratio. He is getting 3 mil per.

Bulls have taken a step back in the standings but they still are a team that competes night in and night out.

the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
AUTOADVERT
Finestrg
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1/22/2006  5:47 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by jaydh:

I would probably do the trade if it had the denver 1st. plus jalen can actually shoot the ball better than most on our team. he can play the 1,2, or 3. the only thing that bugs me is his attitude. i believe he could have been playing like this all along and has only turned it on because he wants to be traded, just like a player in a contract year. to me, i'd rather trade ariza+davis for rose+den 1st. and then use penny for theo+patterson+cash or 2nd rounder(not sure what portlands assets are).

this would give you.

PG-marbury/JC
SG-Rose/JC/Nate
SF-patteron/Lee
PF-ratliff/Frye/Lee
C-curry/Frye/JJ/Butler

I'd have no problems w/those trades, but i'd work the rotations like this:

starting 5:

C - Curry (establish lowpost scoring early)
PF - Frye (good perimeter threat to complement Curry's inside game)
SF - Lee (good rebounding to offset not so great rebounding by Curry & Frye)
SG - Jalen (perimeter scoring)
PG - Marbury (orchestrator & penetrator)


2nd unit:

C - Ratliff (shotblocking & rebounding presence to come off bench)
PF - Mo T (lowpost scoring option #2)
SF - Patterson (good help defender to offset poor perimeter D by Craw on point)
SG - Nate Rob (hustle guy & sparkplug)
PG - Crawford (perimeter scoring)

Use Q. Woods & Butler in the rotations according to matchups.


IR (dead weight):
JJ / Q. Rich / Malik

Very well thought out TMS! I'm with you on the Jalen trade but I wouldn't go near Portland for Theo and Patterson. If this all breaks just right for us come draft night, we'll get Hilton Armstrong who will supply what Ratliff would and hopefully Zeke can acquire one more pick in the first round that we can turn into a serviceable wing. I just think for the big money we'd be taking back, Ratliff is really starting to show signs of slipping and Patterson just has too much baggage for only marginal talent (myself, if we got Ron Artest I could find a way to deal with his baggage). I hear what you're saying though - both trades do supply immediate needs...
Bonn1997
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1/22/2006  6:00 PM
Posted by McK1:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by McK1:

see the management of those teams. Pax was not there. Pax has already proved himself an able GM.

The addition by subtraction with Crawford followed up by drafting Gordon and trading picks with Phoenix, a no. 7 that yielded Deng vs what turned out to be a no. 21 is proof enough. They took a short-term step back with the Curry trade but we'll see this summer if Pax made the right move.

[Edited by - McK1 on 01-22-2006 4:31 PM]
The Bulls had one playoff run but otherwise have been a lottery team for several consecutive years and are still a lottery team. The Crawford trade did nothing for the Bulls. They could have let Jamal walk and gotten a year of solid play and role model behavior from JYD instead. Pax has developed a nice core young at PG, SG, and SF but I don't see him as the genius others do.

noone said he was a genious. This is his 3rd year on the job.

In his 2nd year they won 47 and made the play-offs. They replaced Crawford with a much more complete guard in Gordon and replaced JYD with a guy in Nocioni of the Argentenian team that kicked ass in the Olympics who is every bit as tough and hustles just as hard defensively as JYD did plus is a player on the offensive side of the ball. He nabbed Duhon in the second round. Chi's backup point is getting 10 pts and 5.6 assists and a stl. He is 4th in assist to turnover ratio. He is getting 3 mil per.

Bulls have taken a step back in the standings but they still are a team that competes night in and night out.
I was commenting on the Crawford trade, which did nothing for them. They could have let Crawford walk and still replaced him with Gordon. Duhon is putting up 10 and 6 as their STARTING, not backup, PG. Hinrich is their starting SG. They're set nicely from 1 to 3 (the three easiest positions to get players at) and have nothing at PF and C (two harder positions to get good young talent at).

McK1
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1/22/2006  6:08 PM
Hinrich and Gordon start. Duhon has been moved to the bench.

Not having Jamal on their r oster did alot for them. If he was there Duhon's minutes get cut.

off the bench he is averaging 8 pts and 4.7 assist 1 turnover in 26.2 minutes per

[Edited by - McK1 on 01-22-2006 6:13 PM]
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
tkf
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1/22/2006  6:21 PM
Posted by McK1:

Hinrich and Gordon start. Duhon has been moved to the bench.

Not having Jamal on their r oster did alot for them. If he was there Duhon's minutes get cut.

off the bench he is averaging 8 pts and 4.7 assist 1 turnover in 26.2 minutes per

[Edited by - McK1 on 01-22-2006 6:13 PM]

well you know what, then it is fair to say that losing curry has hurt them as much, last year they were a playoff team with curry, curry misses the playoffs and they get swept, they are so far just 3 games better than the knicks and don't look nearly as good as the team they were last year with curry.. now what?

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
NYKBocker
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1/22/2006  7:25 PM
Jalen and a 1st Rd pick for Penny is a no-brainer.
McK1
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1/22/2006  7:36 PM
Posted by tkf:
Posted by McK1:

Hinrich and Gordon start. Duhon has been moved to the bench.

Not having Jamal on their r oster did alot for them. If he was there Duhon's minutes get cut.

off the bench he is averaging 8 pts and 4.7 assist 1 turnover in 26.2 minutes per

[Edited by - McK1 on 01-22-2006 6:13 PM]

well you know what, then it is fair to say that losing curry has hurt them as much, last year they were a playoff team with curry, curry misses the playoffs and they get swept, they are so far just 3 games better than the knicks and don't look nearly as good as the team they were last year with curry.. now what?

ALREADY DISCUSSED THAT EARLIER IN THE THREAD

see the management of those teams. Pax was not there. Pax has already proved himself an able GM.
The addition by subtraction with Crawford followed up by drafting Gordon and trading picks with Phoenix, a no. 7 that yielded Deng vs what turned out to be a no. 21 is proof enough. They took a short-term step back with the Curry trade but we'll see this summer if Pax made the right move.

[Edited by - McK1 on 01-22-2006 4:31 PM]

[Edited by - McK1 on 01-22-2006 7:36 PM]
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
EnySpree
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1/22/2006  8:09 PM
I wanted jalen for the longest time. I think the young guys at the three need someone to beat out. Tkf talked about this in an earlier post.

Antonio Davis needs to play the Jerome James role and spell curry. Frye must start. The knicks have got to attack teams from the opening tip.

Jalen has a killer instinct. Jalen with the team the knicks have will win the knicks a lot of games cuz jalen is just ice cold especially down the stretch.

I would do the trade without the pick. I see a lot of convo about the pick. Larry brown didn't want to play the rookies this year why would anyone be crying about draft picks?

Jalen should already be a knick. I hope he can get here soon. He's not pierce or artest but he can sure look like either player on any given night.

Marbury needs help. If jalen can get here soon the knicks can take some time and then see uf something else can be done to possibly save the season at the deadline.
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tkf
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1/22/2006  8:17 PM
eny: I am not a fan of jalen, but the thing with jalen is that when teams are pressing us hard as they did yesterday, guys were crawling under a rock, jalen is not like that, he likes that type of challenge and can get very hot, that instills confidence in a young team, Rose is a killer on offense, his attitude on offense is what we need, guys may stop doubling curry, who knows...
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
EnySpree
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1/22/2006  8:34 PM
I feel you tkf.

Jalen rose is just a triple threat on offense.

People have been saying we need a defensive minded guy at the three. The knicks more than proved they have no clue on offense either.

I think jalen can bring some stability. What I mean is he could come in and replace Lee at the three or come in and help marbs in the backcourt. With that situation guys like woods, ariza, and Richardson will know exactly why they are not playing.

Knicks gotta get jalen. Then just hope Larry can stop playing around and get these guys attacking and just go from there. This just has to be done now so by the deadline knicks can still improve.
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nyk4ever
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1/22/2006  8:48 PM
Thats alot of feeling of TKF there Eny.
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BRIGGS
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1/22/2006  10:36 PM
jalen didnt look good tongiht so far. Everytime I watch the raptors, Mike james looks like an all star. he has to be a VERY VERY serious consideration for the FULL MLE
RIP Crushalot😞
bigbeast
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1/22/2006  10:40 PM
Briggs- wouldn't you perfer a legit 6'6 sg rather than adding another small guard to an already small perimeter. James is 6'1 and he too isn;t a pure pg.
"Man, who knows with this team." Aguirre.
attaboy2005
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1/22/2006  10:50 PM
Posted by bigbeast:

Briggs- wouldn't you perfer a legit 6'6 sg rather than adding another small guard to an already small perimeter. James is 6'1 and he too isn;t a pure pg.

We have a legit 6'6" SG, he is Q.

This want and Need for certain type of players is getting ridiculous, this team has these players like they just need to start playing like they belong on an NBA team, no other teamis gonna help out the Knicks to make them better, it's just not gonna happen. The other GM's like to see NYK on their butts they aren't gonna make us any better, we just have to get what we have to finally play they way they are supposed to like professionals.
bigbeast
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1/22/2006  10:59 PM
Q is garbage. I was totally opposed to this trade. True, I thought the Knicks needed to Kurt but not for Q, who couldn;t even get his back insured. His back is so bad he has no lift, can't post smaller guards as everyone said he could and has turned into a specialist. He's a three point shooter who needs a high volume of shots in order to make his share.

Sometimes you have to cut your loses. You can;t just sit back waiting on players who just arent that good to perform on a level they are capable of. If thats the case, we should have kept Shandon Anderson, Howard Eisley, Othella Harrington, and Wheatherspoon and waited for them to perform like Professionals as you say.
"Man, who knows with this team." Aguirre.
Bonn1997
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1/22/2006  11:06 PM
Not having Jamal on their r oster did alot for them.
That was never under dispute. I said the Crawford trade did nothing for them because they could have let Jamal walk.
Hinrich and Gordon start. Duhon has been moved to the bench.
I didn't realize he was benched.
SlimPack
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1/22/2006  11:11 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Not having Jamal on their r oster did alot for them.
That was never under dispute. I said the Crawford trade did nothing for them because they could have let Jamal walk.
Hinrich and Gordon start. Duhon has been moved to the bench.
I didn't realize he was benched.

the crawford trade helped chicago becuase it allowed them to unload JYD's contract, that's what IT does. he helps other teams.



[Edited by - slimpack on 01-22-2006 11:12 PM]
Bonn1997
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1/22/2006  11:53 PM
the crawford trade helped chicago becuase it allowed them to unload JYD's contract, that's what IT does. he helps other teams.
That helped Chicago's owners wallets. It didn't help Chicago win games unless you think JYD was harming that team.
BRIGGS
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1/22/2006  11:55 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
the crawford trade helped chicago becuase it allowed them to unload JYD's contract, that's what IT does. he helps other teams.
That helped Chicago's owners wallets. It didn't help Chicago win games unless you think JYD was harming that team.

wait a second, how many games did chicago win last year? maybe it had something to do with GETTING RID of Jamal?
RIP Crushalot😞
Bonn1997
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1/23/2006  12:06 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by Bonn1997:
the crawford trade helped chicago becuase it allowed them to unload JYD's contract, that's what IT does. he helps other teams.
That helped Chicago's owners wallets. It didn't help Chicago win games unless you think JYD was harming that team.

wait a second, how many games did chicago win last year? maybe it had something to do with GETTING RID of Jamal?
No $hit Sherlock. Did you read any of the posts in this thread you started? They could have let Jamal walk like I said. The point was that they got nothing out of the Jamal trade that they couldn't have gotten out of letting Jamal walk
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