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The door is Open Time For Isiah and Marbury to walk out together; and Trade Channing to Toronto
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Bippity10
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12/22/2005  3:15 PM
The Chicago Bulls have changed rebuilding directions three times and are now a .500 team. When you rebuild you are going to make mistakes and you are going to have flameouts. But all it takes is one guy with potential and bam. That guy could be Gay(the player that is, and the sexual orientation), Morrison and any of the other guys. It could also be Curry.

You and I can agree to disagree on this. I don't know about Curry. I personally don't like players like him, but it is far to early(in my view) to say Curry is who he is. He is still a child.
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martin
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12/22/2005  3:15 PM
Posted by islesfan:
Posted by Bippity10:

Why don't we let Frye, and ARiza and Lee and Butler and curry grow up before we determine their ceiling. Athletic prime is 27-32.

Because it's very rare for players to improve that greatly over a course of a few years. And as you've stated, it's not just 1 or 2, it's all of the young players that need to develop very basic skills.


... but don't give up on guys too early. I am picking and choosing, but here are a few who did pan out after early disappointment: J Oneal, SNash, JRichardson, Gerald Wallace, Artest, Brand (remember everyone complaing about weight and height and not being about to build around him?), Larry Hughes, Doug Christie, Bruce Bowen, Pau Gasol (early edition is that he was soft). THere are an equally good number of prospects that have failed.
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nyk4ever
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12/22/2005  3:20 PM
Posted by martin:
Posted by islesfan:
Posted by Bippity10:

Why don't we let Frye, and ARiza and Lee and Butler and curry grow up before we determine their ceiling. Athletic prime is 27-32.

Because it's very rare for players to improve that greatly over a course of a few years. And as you've stated, it's not just 1 or 2, it's all of the young players that need to develop very basic skills.


... but don't give up on guys too early. I am picking and choosing, but here are a few who did pan out after early disappointment: J Oneal, SNash, JRichardson, Gerald Wallace, Artest, Brand (remember everyone complaing about weight and height and not being about to build around him?), Larry Hughes, Doug Christie, Bruce Bowen, Pau Gasol (early edition is that he was soft). THere are an equally good number of prospects that have failed.

John Starks!
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Bippity10
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12/22/2005  3:25 PM
Anthony Mason
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Bippity10
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12/22/2005  3:25 PM
Remember Karl Malone's early part of his career at the free throw line?
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Bippity10
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12/22/2005  3:30 PM
For years I've been hearing fans talk about how we get the right coach in here and we win 10 more games. And I would say that's nonsense. People were confused why I thought coaching wasn't important. Finally here is my answer. A coach can come in and immediately change a mediocre team to an above average team. Or a team on the cusp of a championship into a champion. But a great coach cannot come in and take a pi-ss poor Knicks team and turn them into a winner overnight. So why would I beg for a big time coach like LB if they can't turn us around immediately?

Because big time coach's like LB can turn guys like Curry into hustlers, Marbury's into leaders and Ariza/Butler's into 10 year starters. But unfortunately it takes time. And Ny Fans don't beleive in that.
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BasketballJones
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12/22/2005  3:36 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

For years I've been hearing fans talk about how we get the right coach in here and we win 10 more games. And I would say that's nonsense. People were confused why I thought coaching wasn't important. Finally here is my answer. A coach can come in and immediately change a mediocre team to an above average team. Or a team on the cusp of a championship into a champion. But a great coach cannot come in and take a pi-ss poor Knicks team and turn them into a winner overnight. So why would I beg for a big time coach like LB if they can't turn us around immediately?

Because big time coach's like LB can turn guys like Curry into hustlers, Marbury's into leaders and Ariza/Butler's into 10 year starters. But unfortunately it takes time. And Ny Fans don't beleive in that.

I think as NY fans we like to gripe a lot. I really believe the fans would support this team if they just saw some more consistent effort from them. I thought they played well against Indiana. I don't think anyone booed them during that game.

Early on in the season they seemed to be playing better defense. I think NY fans like to see that. Maybe they just didn't progress and adjust as other teams have improved but - for whatever reason,they are just letting other teams score too much. They've lost their focus on defense.

As fans, we need some reason to hope that things will improve.



[Edited by - BASKETBALLJONES on 12-22-2005 3:41 PM]
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Bonn1997
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12/22/2005  4:14 PM
Posted by islesfan:

Bippity, I apologize if you took offense. There was no intent to offend you. Only Bonn. I really am sorry.

I guess I missed all this. No need to apologize. I don't understand what's so hard to comprehend about Curry being compared to players who we could have had with the draft picks, but there's no point in endlessly repeating the same arguments that you and Bip covered.
Bippity10
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12/22/2005  4:19 PM
Bonn: Don't worry I had your back. Up until I called you an idiot
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Bonn1997
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12/22/2005  5:33 PM
Thanks! That's longer than most people have my back for!
Allanfan20
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12/22/2005  6:05 PM
Bonn, I never thought you were an idiot until Islesfan called you one. Then I realized he could have been right. Then Bip called you one and since he's always wrong I realized that I'm just so confused. Is or isn't Bonn an idiot? Maybe I should write that Marbury poem that Bip told me about.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
nyk4ever
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12/22/2005  6:08 PM
Posted by Allanfan20:

Bonn, I never thought you were an idiot until Islesfan called you one. Then I realized he could have been right. Then Bip called you one and since he's always wrong I realized that I'm just so confused. Is or isn't Bonn an idiot? Maybe I should write that Marbury poem that Bip told me about.

Can ya include Bonn and Isles in it? Make it kinda heart-warming and a feel good story of the christmas season?
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Bippity10
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12/22/2005  6:25 PM
Allanfan can make a picture with words. I can see it now, Islesfan and Isiah and Eddie Curry sitting around the tree sipping eggnogg(well Eddie's actually gnawing on a side of beef) and singing christmas carols. It's a christmas miracle!!!!!!!!!!
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Bippity10
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12/22/2005  6:27 PM
Allanfan: I think your signature might be a little outdated. 1999 was a long time ago.
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Allanfan20
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12/22/2005  6:31 PM
It's referring to me mofo, dedicated to me making my return to school, getting back to the gym and of course, being drafted by the Knicks in 13 years, when I'm 36, and then I will be the final piece to the championship team.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
Pete99
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12/22/2005  6:56 PM
Trading Frye would be a bad move and won't happen, IT has said he is the future with Curry.
jaydh
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12/22/2005  10:18 PM
Posted by MS:

Isiah has successfully capped the organization out and brought in players that are more watchable but don't have an ounce of pride.....As long as Marbury, Q, Mo, Crawford are still around this team is destined to fail; these guys are out partying all the time and none of them plays an ounce of defense....Isiah is a confused soul who knows he has failed you can hear it in his voice, its just too bad he brought in crawford and couldn't have sent marbury to golden state at the deadline last year (the man just let parker blow by him all night and never fought to get back into the play)

Remember when Isiah wouldn't give up Nazy and Kurt for Vince Carter last year? Nevermind the guy wins games by himself but we have the combination of Malik Rose, Q, and Nate Rob because of it........

I say we see what we can do with Toronoto give them Penny, Butler, Channing for Jalen Rose and Chris Bosh who is never going to resign with them anyway so Babcock might be dumb enough since he already has villeneuva, and wants peja (cauldron, gramham, peja, villenueva, frye)

These building blocks Isiah is talking about? Channing Frye thats it, building blocks are starters....Curry might as well have retired already now that he has his money, i am sick of people pointing out that he was in shape last year; obviously because his contract was up, if teams are in a hurry to get rid of talented players theirs a reason.........

Why not look into sprewell instead of signing matt barnes and then cutting him and then bringing in woods........

I have never seen a home team get blown out in three straight, not even expansion teams, we need to weed out the losers and get more people out there that care; thats why putting Nate on the IR was another stellar move by this pathetic ****ing organization


this post has so many flaws its almost not even worth it...
EnySpree
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12/23/2005  1:58 AM
Posted by McK1:
Posted by EnySpree:
Posted by crzymdups:

Are you kidding me? Toronto would never trade Bosh for Frye. Or Villanueva for Frye. The former because Bosh is on the verge of superstardom and the latter because he picked Charlie ahead of Frye and that would look like he was admitting a mistake.


Nah I don't think that would mean they made a mistake with Charlie. Charlie has had a couple 25pts 15reb games but he plays Bosh's position so he won't get time to shine. I think they would just be coming to grips with the fact that Bosh won't resign.

Now Bosh for Frye would be a terrible deal but if they get cap relief and some more youth slapped in there I know they would consider it. Fyre and Charlie sounds good growing together at the 4-5....then they have Joey Graham too. That's a dynamic mix at the 3-4-5. Like I said if they get cap relief this year too.......Why wouldn't they do it?

Knicks get their franchise player that still has 10 years of good play ahead of him. If Mike James and Jalen can come along too....the Knicks would have seriously gotten better in a very big way.


how does Frye and Charlie growing together at the 4-5 sound better to Toronto than Bosh-Chollie growing together at the 4-5.

If they chose that route the better post scorer, defender, and rebounder Bosh makes more sense to them (and any other team for that matter) at center than Frye.


[Edited by - McK1 on 12-22-2005 2:28 PM]

I'm just going along with the theory that Toronto might not think they can re-sign Bosh down the road that's all. Frye is a nice player to have especially if they get some early cap relief and maybe Nate? Nate would definately come back to haunt us but we get Bosh.
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MS
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12/23/2005  11:32 AM
See if we can give them Eddy Curry, Ariza and Penny for a combination of Bosh and Mo Pete, they get a center to go with Charlie, and get some direction, and they still have their pick to do some damage.....They are not going to be able to resign bosh which is a tremendous probelm they get two good young players clear about 6 million in cap space, the deal could def work out well for both teams....

Caldron
Graham
Ariza
Villenueva
Curry


Then Sign Spree

Marbury
Q
Spree
Frye
Bosh

Thats my dream, I would trade Steph to any team offering anything in return we need to start getting rid of everyone other than Frye, Nate, and Lee
nyk4ever
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12/23/2005  12:08 PM
Posted by MS:


Thats my dream, I would trade Steph to any team offering anything in return we need to start getting rid of everyone other than Frye, Nate, and Lee

What exactly have Nate and Lee shown that make them untradable? There is no way these guys should be dealbreakers for the Knicks. If you guys want to burn it down and start over, the only way teams are going to take our guys is with young players attached to them. I'm down for not trading Frye/Curry but Nate/Lee/Ariza can all say bye-bye.
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The door is Open Time For Isiah and Marbury to walk out together; and Trade Channing to Toronto
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