tkf wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

3G4G wrote:Golden State should be up 2 games but they got 1 of them....

Young Team On The Rise.....Building Your Team Through the Lottery has it's benefits and if done right it doesn't take took long.

What about Cleveland? All they got was Kyrie Irving. Tristan Thompson and Dion Waiters have been meh......

I think the key is that you build your core around those guys and then you add free agents.. but you are only as good as your foundation... I take the yankees for example.. they have won 5 rings and numerous division titles, many free agents have come and gone, but the constant has been jeter, rivera, petite...... look at the spurs, manu, duncan, parker.... that just seems to be a recipe for sucess, now there are exceptions to the rule, but honestly I don't understand the contempt for doing things in a way that has worked over and over again, more so than not.... this is not to say other ways can't work, but it tends to be the exception, not the rule...

Doesn't every team try to build through the draft? Everyone always points to the Spurs and OKC as having the blue print but then again we're talking about 2 teams in the entire league. The bottom line is that you have to get lucky to obtain the "franchise" player to build around in the 1st place. It's always been a mixture of drafting, trades and free agency. If it were so easy to say "This is the right way to build" everyone would be doing it.

NBA CHAMPIONS SINCE 1989
Pistons
Pistons
Bulls
Bulls
Bulls
Rockets
Rockets
Bulls
Bulls
Bulls
Spurs
Lakers
Lakers
Lakers
Spurs
Pistons
Spurs
Heat
Spurs
Celtics
Lakers
Lakers
Mavericks
Heat

That's 24 years of NBA Champions but only 8 teams.

AnubisADL wrote:

tkf wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

3G4G wrote:Golden State should be up 2 games but they got 1 of them....

Young Team On The Rise.....Building Your Team Through the Lottery has it's benefits and if done right it doesn't take took long.

What about Cleveland? All they got was Kyrie Irving. Tristan Thompson and Dion Waiters have been meh......

I think the key is that you build your core around those guys and then you add free agents.. but you are only as good as your foundation... I take the yankees for example.. they have won 5 rings and numerous division titles, many free agents have come and gone, but the constant has been jeter, rivera, petite...... look at the spurs, manu, duncan, parker.... that just seems to be a recipe for sucess, now there are exceptions to the rule, but honestly I don't understand the contempt for doing things in a way that has worked over and over again, more so than not.... this is not to say other ways can't work, but it tends to be the exception, not the rule...

No one is saying building through the draft is bad. Small markets have to build through the draft. Big markets can entice free agents. Knicks have been "building" through the draft for over a decade. The reality is unless your tanking yearly or lucky you are going to have a hard time building through the draft.

Sacrmento has/had Tyreke Evans, Demarcus Cousins, Fredette, Jason Thompson, Spencer Hawes, etc.

Minnesota has/had Kevin Love, Ricky Rubio, Derrick Williams, Wesley Johnson, Johnny Flynn, Ty Lawson, Corey Brewer, Brandon Roy

The list goes on and on.

the knicks haven't been building through the draft for decades, proof is the knicks have never extended any of their first round picks and KEPT them in almost 20 years, I think that is the case..
we haven't... building through the draft affords you several luxuries.... if it doesn't work, it allows you to reset or change course quickly.... which is why teams like Houston were able to take advantage and strike quickly, now they are set for years to come, the same can be said for Denver, GS and heck the wolves, the verdict is still out, but I sure would like to see them healthy.. when they were for a stretch they looked like a playoff team..

Again, if you are happy with the way the knicks are doing things.. Fine... but the contempt for building a team in a way that has worked, over and over again in pro sports, especially the NBA is just mind boggling.. again, no one said it was a surefire way, but jeez history shows it is a way that has benefited teams, over, and over, and over again.....

tkf wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

3G4G wrote:Golden State should be up 2 games but they got 1 of them....

Young Team On The Rise.....Building Your Team Through the Lottery has it's benefits and if done right it doesn't take took long.

What about Cleveland? All they got was Kyrie Irving. Tristan Thompson and Dion Waiters have been meh......

I think the key is that you build your core around those guys and then you add free agents.. but you are only as good as your foundation... I take the yankees for example.. they have won 5 rings and numerous division titles, many free agents have come and gone, but the constant has been jeter, rivera, petite...... look at the spurs, manu, duncan, parker.... that just seems to be a recipe for sucess, now there are exceptions to the rule, but honestly I don't understand the contempt for doing things in a way that has worked over and over again, more so than not.... this is not to say other ways can't work, but it tends to be the exception, not the rule...

Let's not leave out Dreymond Green/Ezeli who is in their top rotation now. Players like Jefferson/Biendrins sitting watching the youngsters.....

GET IT DUNNY IN GOLDEN STATE WHERE IT'S SUNNY ALL THE WAY TO THE BANK OF AMERICA WHERE THE BACK COURT SHOT IS MONEY

The core of who they play was built through the draft....

CashMoney wrote:

tkf wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

3G4G wrote:Golden State should be up 2 games but they got 1 of them....

Young Team On The Rise.....Building Your Team Through the Lottery has it's benefits and if done right it doesn't take took long.

What about Cleveland? All they got was Kyrie Irving. Tristan Thompson and Dion Waiters have been meh......

I think the key is that you build your core around those guys and then you add free agents.. but you are only as good as your foundation... I take the yankees for example.. they have won 5 rings and numerous division titles, many free agents have come and gone, but the constant has been jeter, rivera, petite...... look at the spurs, manu, duncan, parker.... that just seems to be a recipe for sucess, now there are exceptions to the rule, but honestly I don't understand the contempt for doing things in a way that has worked over and over again, more so than not.... this is not to say other ways can't work, but it tends to be the exception, not the rule...

Doesn't every team try to build through the draft? Everyone always points to the Spurs and OKC as having the blue print but then again we're talking about 2 teams in the entire league. The bottom line is that you have to get lucky to obtain the "franchise" player to build around in the 1st place. It's always been a mixture of drafting, trades and free agency. If it were so easy to say "This is the right way to build" everyone would be doing it.

NBA CHAMPIONS SINCE 1989
Pistons
Pistons
Bulls
Bulls
Bulls
Rockets
Rockets
Bulls
Bulls
Bulls
Spurs
Lakers
Lakers
Lakers
Spurs
Pistons
Spurs
Heat
Spurs
Celtics
Lakers
Lakers
Mavericks
Heat

That's 24 years of NBA Champions but only 8 teams.

Good point. Lots of teams and coach's that had good runs but not on that list.

Warrior had a change of ownership the last few years and have been using the draft to build assets.

I say "assets" because if you can grow your own for either use or trade. If you grow your own and develop them you have greater value to trade. The better teams grow within and then can trade. Example Nene was traded for two reasons, he was a bad contract (quick mistake corrected) and Faried was ready. McGee in return has upside and they are taking a long view with him (value of contract not yet apparent or validated). Aaron affalo was the prime piece for Iggy. If they can resign him for a longer term deal that could be a great trade. IF they lose him, not so much. Sometimes you don't win! Philly got Bynum in return but they might think they were done with Iggy and the upside to bynum was worth it. Could still be!

Say Bynum is signed to a reaonable deal and comes back strong the PHilly exec will get a lot of credit even though the deal would be two years old.

Many ways to win or screw up. Spurs are masters at collecting and developing talent. Many teams are just snake bitten and have little good fortune! ATL passed over how many Pgs to take Marvin Williams? Denver after the Dice trade passed on Amare twice in the same draft? Took Skita at 4th? Then Nene before AMare!!!

Steph curry is a steal while healthy! His contract is a steal also!

tkf wrote:

CashMoney wrote:

tkf wrote:

Papabear wrote:

tkf wrote:

Papabear wrote:

Hersports85 wrote:

Papabear wrote:

tkf wrote:

Hersports85 wrote:

tkf wrote:

Hersports85 wrote:

tkf wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

tkf wrote:

CashMoney wrote:

tkf wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

tkf wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

CashMoney wrote:Considering Durant is in Lebron land he should be able to carry OKC over Memphis into the WCF's. He doesn't need Westbrook cus he's KEVIN DURANT the 2nd best player in the association.

Hahaha that made me laugh hard for some reason!

Everyone loves putting KD on a pedestal. Whether it's his stats, his lack of tattoo arm and neck sleeves, or his Mama's boy demeanor.

All I know if in the oft chance Melo and the Knicks were to face off against Durantula and OKC, it wouldn't be pretty for that choir boy(Melo's teams have won 11 of 12 against Durant).

were those games in the finals?

you talking about facing OKC...heck deal with indiana first.... 10-35 shooting is not going to beat anyone....

13-26 last night, try again.

sure..2013 playoff shooting % 39% boing!!

That has led us to a 62% winning percentage in the playoffs thus far.

this is the problem.. led us? really, no that didn't lead us at all.. saying that diminishes the play of guys like felton who honestly has been the best knick player, hands down, so far..

Felton is avg 16ppg, 5 dimes, 3.5 dimes and shooting 50%, yet carmelo until last night was shooting 31% LED US? this is the level of ridiculousness I am talking about around here..

The level of ridiculousness is measured by the continuation of arguing when the current facts don't bail you out, again and again.
I'm sure Felton would be the first to say his 5 dimes and 50% shooting was what leads the team. I truly doubt he's that blinded by Melo hate.

Why, I bet he even thinks the Knicks have a good chance to win a chip, or even get to the ECF!

Hey, why does the Nugget in the middle have a really nice rack? Is this some sort of veiled reference to Jason Collins?

so I get it, the 39% shooting and no assist is leading the knicks? do you really think felton would think that? felton is no fool and he is a competitor... without his play, knicks don't get past boston... you don't have to hate to understand that 31% shooting in a series is hardly what we call "leading" a team... that is homerism, plain and simple...

the difference here, you don't see me using the term "felton led the knicks" or this player.. or that player.. Honestly no knick is really shining, but I doubt anyone would dissagree that felton is clearly playing the best.. of course those involved in the hero worship would clearly disagree because in their eyes things like efficiency, defense and passing are for the birds...

Felton is hands-downs the best Knick in these playoffs so far. However, there were twice during the playoffs where Melo has stepped up during crunch time and willed us a victory ... Every freaking expert and ex-player have acknowledged this, but who really cares? We are in the semi-conference finals because of a collective effort. Not because of one person.

But no matter what Melo does, only the "bad" will be recognized by a select few. That's I respect Bonn a lot, especially since the playoffs started. You can tell he's rooting for the team, doesn't hesitate to point out when we're playing like crap but he's also consistent and balanced, and displays good basketball knowledge.

Throughout the course of the season and playoffs it's been a different player stepping up. Kind of put to bed the argument in the beginning of the season that we really weren't that deep or other teams were deeper. Just like when Felton wasn't a point guard to lead this team ... EVERYTHING that was said that we wasn't or couldn't do is being proven incorrect. So, I don't think we will be joining that picture anytime soon, at least not this round. And if we do, I'll be the first to "man up" although I'm a woman lol.

And yes, Melo shooting been off, but if i'm not mistaken you consider Paul Pierce a leader ... have you looked at his playoff shooting percentage? It's more to basketball than stats. Some players (example: J Kidd) can have a huge impact on a game with shooting 0-20 and slim to none in other categories.

I figured the paul pierce reference would come in, but here is the key and i mentioned it earlier, pierce does more than just shoot.. that is the key... tell me what does carmelo does other than shoot?

Well, since being a Knick, in the playoffs,

1. Melo has out rebounded Pierce in the last 3 years; in fact doubled his total in one season.

2. Playing better defense under woodson. I counted 3 turnover he directly caused last night. And him in pierce have been basically tied with steals the last 3 years.

3. Shooting over 90% at the line, which is important because this year he's 7th in FTA .. which means he's getting his opponent in foul trouble. Which is always a plus

4. Causes the double/triple team - When he plays the right way, and kick out, this is just as important as assist.

5. And according to Kidd ( who YOU states as being a leader) says that in the locker room and on the floor ... Melo is very vocal and leads the team, and also gave examples on when Melo either challenged woodson to let someone else shoot or how about when he asked MDA to play lin - straight from Lin's mouth that Melo actually did approach MDA.

ok, great then nothing less than a NBA championship and finals MVP will do.. right? Because pierce has been there, done that..

Papabear Says

Pierce won nothing until Garnett and Ray Allen cam to Boston.

Exactly, and this is the type of sh&t that pisses me off. I don't pretend that Melo is on Jordan, Kobe or Lebron level as far as talent, but some people do so much bashing and try to make him look like a bum or loser when in fact, throughout history it's only a few that have done it and when they did, they had a hell of a supporting cast. I'm a fan a basketball period. Been watching, playing and studying it since day one, and it's too much stat watching going on along with you have to do this or that to be great. I miss the old days when we just knew a player was good or had above average talent without all the BS.

I guess that's why some of the great players ... i.e Jordan recognizes that although Melo have his faults , he's a damn good basketball player. Only few can be productive while being the main focus on a team.

Stockton is one of the greatest guards ever along with Nash, never won a ring ... guess they won't amount to much either. SMH

Papabear Says

I agree! you see you have to do your homework on these azz holes. They will say anything and know it's not true just to put it out there. Example the Pierce statement! They out right lied about it. Coach Rivers was about to loose his job before Garnett and Allen came to Boston. they lied about Pierce record compared to Melo. I will give the Trolls credit that they can articulate with words. But what is words if they are lies. Here we are in the second round of the playoffs and they just can't stand it. They rather talk about Denver but guess what?? they are gone They rather talk about Houston and Jeremy Lin but guess what? they are gone. But guess who is still standing?? The New York Knicks.

dude you are just not that good at this..just tell me what does doc rivers losing his job have to do with the lack of production in postseason from carmelo anthony? carmelo is the reason for his failures.. period...

They rather talk about Denver but guess what?? they are gone They rather talk about Houston and Jeremy Lin but guess what? they are gone. But guess who is still standing?? The New York Knicks.

you know whats funny, this is called the other team thread.. and you are in here.. so guess what you rather talk about? LOL

Papabear Says

If it's other team thread then why is the topic of conversation about Melo. Why?? because you can't help yourself. Just wanted see what the Melo and Knick haters were up to. And as far a Melo's failures he is the face of the New York Knicks. He hasn't failed even though you wish he would. Just because you can't stand him. Just watch this series we will win and it will be because of Melo as you hide behind this thread.

ACTUALLY I was content talking about durant, you are the one brining up denver, Houston, and other topics.....

Just watch this series we will win and it will be because of Melo as you hide behind this thread.

if the knicks win, it won't be because of him... so far the knicks are winning in spite of him.. but if somehow things unfortunately don't work out.. will you hide?

In spite of him? Really?! Here's Melo's playoff team ranking YTD:

29.3 PPG #1
1.4 SPG tied for 3rd. Behind Prigs and Shump and tied with Ray
6.5 RPG #2 behind only Chandler
5.8 DRPG #1
1.9 APG #4 behind our 3 PG's Felton, Prigs and Kidd
.915 FT% #1

No doubt that Melo was in a shooting funk up until last game but it goes to show that he is 100% contributing in other ways. But his shooting percentage....blah, blah, blah.

Winning in spite of him? PLEASE!

27 shots to get 29 points is not good.. I would hope you lead in scoring if you are taking that many shots..

39% is not good

why ignore those important aspects of the game...

No doubt that Melo was in a shooting funk up until last game but it goes to show that he is 100% contributing in other ways. But his shooting percentage....blah, blah, blah.

hey I can't determine your standards, all i can do is express mine.. if this is ok for you then cool.. just not good enough for me.. 27 shots per game is not good if you are not making them, just not a recipe for winning.. 1.9 APG? really you think that is acceptable?

I like how you list the stats and put only behind our 3pg's or only behind.. well I mean really is that suppose to hurt or help his case.. I don't know because.... it's like saying I got a 75% on my test in school.. only behind the other 18 students in a class of 20...

I mean this is reaching a bit... again, you have your standards, I have mine..

plain and simple..

27 shots per game would not be a problem if he was making them, right? What is the magical % for you? Is it 50% or better, 45%, 40%? Shooters shoot plain and simple. 1.9 APG is what it is. Considering that as a team we were dead last in assists per game and Melo is not Lebron he's not going to lead the team in assists but considering out top asisst man is only dishing out 4 per game does this hurt Melo in your humble opinion?

My standards eqaute to W's.

tkf wrote:the knicks haven't been building through the draft for decades, proof is the knicks have never extended any of their first round picks and KEPT them in almost 20 years, I think that is the case..
we haven't... building through the draft affords you several luxuries.... if it doesn't work, it allows you to reset or change course quickly.... which is why teams like Houston were able to take advantage and strike quickly, now they are set for years to come, the same can be said for Denver, GS and heck the wolves, the verdict is still out, but I sure would like to see them healthy.. when they were for a stretch they looked like a playoff team..

Again, if you are happy with the way the knicks are doing things.. Fine... but the contempt for building a team in a way that has worked, over and over again in pro sports, especially the NBA is just mind boggling.. again, no one said it was a surefire way, but jeez history shows it is a way that has benefited teams, over, and over, and over again.....

Dude OKC are lucky Portland drafted Oden and not Durant.

Houston got lucky when OKC decided not to pay Harden.

Golden State signed David Lee to a 6yr 80 million dollar contract 3 years ago and are now just making the playoffs.

If Houston didnt get Harden they would be TERRIBLE.

Denver has alot of salary tied up in guys to get eliminated in the 1st round. I will give Denver credit for correcting mistakes in a hurry. They signed Affalo and Nene to those crazy deals and shipped them out ASAP before they became bad contracts.

My big thing about Denver is they don't have that many great pieces. Outside of Lawson and Faried who do they have that other teams would give up real value to get?

CashMoney wrote:

tkf wrote:

CashMoney wrote:

tkf wrote:

Papabear wrote:

tkf wrote:

Papabear wrote:

Hersports85 wrote:

Papabear wrote:

tkf wrote:

Hersports85 wrote:

tkf wrote:

Hersports85 wrote:

tkf wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

tkf wrote:

CashMoney wrote:

tkf wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

tkf wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

CashMoney wrote:Considering Durant is in Lebron land he should be able to carry OKC over Memphis into the WCF's. He doesn't need Westbrook cus he's KEVIN DURANT the 2nd best player in the association.

Hahaha that made me laugh hard for some reason!

Everyone loves putting KD on a pedestal. Whether it's his stats, his lack of tattoo arm and neck sleeves, or his Mama's boy demeanor.

All I know if in the oft chance Melo and the Knicks were to face off against Durantula and OKC, it wouldn't be pretty for that choir boy(Melo's teams have won 11 of 12 against Durant).

were those games in the finals?

you talking about facing OKC...heck deal with indiana first.... 10-35 shooting is not going to beat anyone....

13-26 last night, try again.

sure..2013 playoff shooting % 39% boing!!

That has led us to a 62% winning percentage in the playoffs thus far.

this is the problem.. led us? really, no that didn't lead us at all.. saying that diminishes the play of guys like felton who honestly has been the best knick player, hands down, so far..

Felton is avg 16ppg, 5 dimes, 3.5 dimes and shooting 50%, yet carmelo until last night was shooting 31% LED US? this is the level of ridiculousness I am talking about around here..

The level of ridiculousness is measured by the continuation of arguing when the current facts don't bail you out, again and again.
I'm sure Felton would be the first to say his 5 dimes and 50% shooting was what leads the team. I truly doubt he's that blinded by Melo hate.

Why, I bet he even thinks the Knicks have a good chance to win a chip, or even get to the ECF!

Hey, why does the Nugget in the middle have a really nice rack? Is this some sort of veiled reference to Jason Collins?

so I get it, the 39% shooting and no assist is leading the knicks? do you really think felton would think that? felton is no fool and he is a competitor... without his play, knicks don't get past boston... you don't have to hate to understand that 31% shooting in a series is hardly what we call "leading" a team... that is homerism, plain and simple...

the difference here, you don't see me using the term "felton led the knicks" or this player.. or that player.. Honestly no knick is really shining, but I doubt anyone would dissagree that felton is clearly playing the best.. of course those involved in the hero worship would clearly disagree because in their eyes things like efficiency, defense and passing are for the birds...

Felton is hands-downs the best Knick in these playoffs so far. However, there were twice during the playoffs where Melo has stepped up during crunch time and willed us a victory ... Every freaking expert and ex-player have acknowledged this, but who really cares? We are in the semi-conference finals because of a collective effort. Not because of one person.

But no matter what Melo does, only the "bad" will be recognized by a select few. That's I respect Bonn a lot, especially since the playoffs started. You can tell he's rooting for the team, doesn't hesitate to point out when we're playing like crap but he's also consistent and balanced, and displays good basketball knowledge.

Throughout the course of the season and playoffs it's been a different player stepping up. Kind of put to bed the argument in the beginning of the season that we really weren't that deep or other teams were deeper. Just like when Felton wasn't a point guard to lead this team ... EVERYTHING that was said that we wasn't or couldn't do is being proven incorrect. So, I don't think we will be joining that picture anytime soon, at least not this round. And if we do, I'll be the first to "man up" although I'm a woman lol.

And yes, Melo shooting been off, but if i'm not mistaken you consider Paul Pierce a leader ... have you looked at his playoff shooting percentage? It's more to basketball than stats. Some players (example: J Kidd) can have a huge impact on a game with shooting 0-20 and slim to none in other categories.

I figured the paul pierce reference would come in, but here is the key and i mentioned it earlier, pierce does more than just shoot.. that is the key... tell me what does carmelo does other than shoot?

Well, since being a Knick, in the playoffs,

1. Melo has out rebounded Pierce in the last 3 years; in fact doubled his total in one season.

2. Playing better defense under woodson. I counted 3 turnover he directly caused last night. And him in pierce have been basically tied with steals the last 3 years.

3. Shooting over 90% at the line, which is important because this year he's 7th in FTA .. which means he's getting his opponent in foul trouble. Which is always a plus

4. Causes the double/triple team - When he plays the right way, and kick out, this is just as important as assist.

5. And according to Kidd ( who YOU states as being a leader) says that in the locker room and on the floor ... Melo is very vocal and leads the team, and also gave examples on when Melo either challenged woodson to let someone else shoot or how about when he asked MDA to play lin - straight from Lin's mouth that Melo actually did approach MDA.

ok, great then nothing less than a NBA championship and finals MVP will do.. right? Because pierce has been there, done that..

Papabear Says

Pierce won nothing until Garnett and Ray Allen cam to Boston.

Exactly, and this is the type of sh&t that pisses me off. I don't pretend that Melo is on Jordan, Kobe or Lebron level as far as talent, but some people do so much bashing and try to make him look like a bum or loser when in fact, throughout history it's only a few that have done it and when they did, they had a hell of a supporting cast. I'm a fan a basketball period. Been watching, playing and studying it since day one, and it's too much stat watching going on along with you have to do this or that to be great. I miss the old days when we just knew a player was good or had above average talent without all the BS.

I guess that's why some of the great players ... i.e Jordan recognizes that although Melo have his faults , he's a damn good basketball player. Only few can be productive while being the main focus on a team.

Stockton is one of the greatest guards ever along with Nash, never won a ring ... guess they won't amount to much either. SMH

Papabear Says

I agree! you see you have to do your homework on these azz holes. They will say anything and know it's not true just to put it out there. Example the Pierce statement! They out right lied about it. Coach Rivers was about to loose his job before Garnett and Allen came to Boston. they lied about Pierce record compared to Melo. I will give the Trolls credit that they can articulate with words. But what is words if they are lies. Here we are in the second round of the playoffs and they just can't stand it. They rather talk about Denver but guess what?? they are gone They rather talk about Houston and Jeremy Lin but guess what? they are gone. But guess who is still standing?? The New York Knicks.

dude you are just not that good at this..just tell me what does doc rivers losing his job have to do with the lack of production in postseason from carmelo anthony? carmelo is the reason for his failures.. period...

They rather talk about Denver but guess what?? they are gone They rather talk about Houston and Jeremy Lin but guess what? they are gone. But guess who is still standing?? The New York Knicks.

you know whats funny, this is called the other team thread.. and you are in here.. so guess what you rather talk about? LOL

Papabear Says

If it's other team thread then why is the topic of conversation about Melo. Why?? because you can't help yourself. Just wanted see what the Melo and Knick haters were up to. And as far a Melo's failures he is the face of the New York Knicks. He hasn't failed even though you wish he would. Just because you can't stand him. Just watch this series we will win and it will be because of Melo as you hide behind this thread.

ACTUALLY I was content talking about durant, you are the one brining up denver, Houston, and other topics.....

Just watch this series we will win and it will be because of Melo as you hide behind this thread.

if the knicks win, it won't be because of him... so far the knicks are winning in spite of him.. but if somehow things unfortunately don't work out.. will you hide?

In spite of him? Really?! Here's Melo's playoff team ranking YTD:

29.3 PPG #1
1.4 SPG tied for 3rd. Behind Prigs and Shump and tied with Ray
6.5 RPG #2 behind only Chandler
5.8 DRPG #1
1.9 APG #4 behind our 3 PG's Felton, Prigs and Kidd
.915 FT% #1

No doubt that Melo was in a shooting funk up until last game but it goes to show that he is 100% contributing in other ways. But his shooting percentage....blah, blah, blah.

Winning in spite of him? PLEASE!

27 shots to get 29 points is not good.. I would hope you lead in scoring if you are taking that many shots..

39% is not good

why ignore those important aspects of the game...

No doubt that Melo was in a shooting funk up until last game but it goes to show that he is 100% contributing in other ways. But his shooting percentage....blah, blah, blah.

hey I can't determine your standards, all i can do is express mine.. if this is ok for you then cool.. just not good enough for me.. 27 shots per game is not good if you are not making them, just not a recipe for winning.. 1.9 APG? really you think that is acceptable?

I like how you list the stats and put only behind our 3pg's or only behind.. well I mean really is that suppose to hurt or help his case.. I don't know because.... it's like saying I got a 75% on my test in school.. only behind the other 18 students in a class of 20...

I mean this is reaching a bit... again, you have your standards, I have mine..

plain and simple..

27 shots per game would not be a problem if he was making them, right? What is the magical % for you? Is it 50% or better, 45%, 40%? Shooters shoot plain and simple. 1.9 APG is what it is. Considering that as a team we were dead last in assists per game and Melo is not Lebron he's not going to lead the team in assists but considering out top asisst man is only dishing out 4 per game does this hurt Melo in your humble opinion?

My standards eqaute to W's.

what kind of question is that.. of course if you are making most of your shots, it will be less of a problem, but no one really should be taking 27spg.. 45% or better would be fine, but I will say this.. 39% really should not be acceptable especially if you are taking 27spg and I think you know that...

sure all standards should equate to wins.. and right now the knicks are tied in a dogfight... so we will see I guess..

tkf wrote:

Hersports85 wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

tkf wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

3G4G wrote:Golden State should be up 2 games but they got 1 of them....

Young Team On The Rise.....Building Your Team Through the Lottery has it's benefits and if done right it doesn't take took long.

What about Cleveland? All they got was Kyrie Irving. Tristan Thompson and Dion Waiters have been meh......

I think the key is that you build your core around those guys and then you add free agents.. but you are only as good as your foundation... I take the yankees for example.. they have won 5 rings and numerous division titles, many free agents have come and gone, but the constant has been jeter, rivera, petite...... look at the spurs, manu, duncan, parker.... that just seems to be a recipe for sucess, now there are exceptions to the rule, but honestly I don't understand the contempt for doing things in a way that has worked over and over again, more so than not.... this is not to say other ways can't work, but it tends to be the exception, not the rule...

No one is saying building through the draft is bad. Small markets have to build through the draft. Big markets can entice free agents. Knicks have been "building" through the draft for over a decade. The reality is unless your tanking yearly or lucky you are going to have a hard time building through the draft.

Sacrmento has Tyreke Evans, Demarcus Cousins, Fredette, Jason Thompson, Spencer Hawes, etc.

Minnesota has/had Kevin Love, Ricky Rubio, Derrick Williams, Wesley Johnson, Johnny Flynn, Ty Lawson, Corey Brewer, Brandon Roy

The list goes on and on.

Finally someone who gets it. I think a lot of people forget that in 2005 we had 3 first round picks. You just don't know how players will turn out, not only that, you have to have the right coach. We drafted:

C. Frye
Nate Robinson
David Lee

Passed on:
Monta Ellis
Jared Jack
Danny Granger

But it was a lot of other teams with high picks that just got it wrong. Atl picked Marvin Williams over Chris Paul and Deron Williams lol. After so many tries, you're bound to get it right.

Wonder how many teams are kicking themselves over Shumpert - stop saying we don't have assets or still can't get good players through the draft. And although I hate this years draft, we do own our 1st rd draft pick.

Honestly, I don't think either of you get it.. but whatever...

Wonder how many teams are kicking themselves over Shumpert

LOL I like shumpert, but come on.. I can see teams kicking themselves over Faried and parsons who were not only drafted after shumpert but have been more productive.. not even close...

again, just step out of knick land for a moment, honestly, you can be a fan, but look at things from a different perspective... just try it for a minute...

Who was even speaking on Faried or Parson? My point was that some teams get it wrong, and there are about 6 draft picks before Shump that didn't turn out well. So they can kick themeselves over Shump, Faried and Parsons ... the fact that remain is that I bet anyone of the 6 teams would take those 3 players in a minute over who they drafted.

I look at things from all perspectives. It's you that turn anything Knicks into a negative. lol ridiculous

AnubisADL wrote:

tkf wrote:the knicks haven't been building through the draft for decades, proof is the knicks have never extended any of their first round picks and KEPT them in almost 20 years, I think that is the case..
we haven't... building through the draft affords you several luxuries.... if it doesn't work, it allows you to reset or change course quickly.... which is why teams like Houston were able to take advantage and strike quickly, now they are set for years to come, the same can be said for Denver, GS and heck the wolves, the verdict is still out, but I sure would like to see them healthy.. when they were for a stretch they looked like a playoff team..

Again, if you are happy with the way the knicks are doing things.. Fine... but the contempt for building a team in a way that has worked, over and over again in pro sports, especially the NBA is just mind boggling.. again, no one said it was a surefire way, but jeez history shows it is a way that has benefited teams, over, and over, and over again.....

Dude OKC are lucky Portland drafted Oden and not Durant.

Houston got lucky when OKC decided not to pay Harden.

Golden State signed David Lee to a 6yr 80 million dollar contract 3 years ago and are now just making the playoffs.

If Houston didnt get Harden they would be TERRIBLE.

Denver has alot of salary tied up in guys to get eliminated in the 1st round. I will give Denver credit for correcting mistakes in a hurry. They signed Affalo and Nene to those crazy deals and shipped them out ASAP before they became bad contracts.

My big thing about Denver is they don't have that many great pieces. Outside of Lawson and Faried who do they have that other teams would give up real value to get?

OKC got lucky.

Rockets were "prepared with assets and cap space to make a trade" when OKC could not pay Harden.

GSD used Dlee and built around him, not as the focal point but with new owner they got a quality "glue" type player!

Denver value of players? Who said they in a hurry to trade and go all in quite yet.

Denvers credits and debts going forward:

Credits:
2014 first round draft pick from New York
New York's own 2014 first round pick to Denver. [Denver - Minnesota - New York, 2/22/2011]

2014 second round draft pick from Portland
Portland's own 2014 2nd round pick to Denver. [Denver - Portland, 6/24/2011]

2015 second round draft pick from L.A. Clippers
The L.A. Clippers' own 2015 2nd round pick to Denver (top 55 protected in the 2015 Draft). If the L.A. Clippers' own 2015 2nd round pick is in the top 55 picks, then the L.A. Clippers' obligations to Denver shall be extinguished. [Denver - L.A. Clippers, 1/5/2009]

2015 second round draft pick from Memphis
Memphis' own 2015 2nd round pick to Denver via The L.A. Clippers and New Orleans, provided however, that Memphis shall have the right to send cash to Denver via the L.A. Clippers and New Orleans in lieu of sending the draft pick to Denver via The Los Angeles Clippers and New Orleans [Memphis - New Orleans - Washington, 12/10/2008 and then Los Angeles Clippers - New Orleans, 12/14/2011 and then Denver-L.A. Clippers-Washington, 3/15/2012]

2016 first round draft pick from New York
Denver has the right to swap its own 2016 1st round pick with New York's own 2016 1st round pick. [Denver - Minnesota - New York, 2/22/2011]

Debits:
2013 second round draft pick to Phoenix
Denver's own 2013 2nd round pick to Phoenix via The L.A. Lakers [Denver - Los Angeles Lakers, 6/24/2011 and then Los Angeles Lakers-Phoenix, 7/11/2012]

2014 first round draft pick to Orlando
Orlando receives the least favorable of Denver's own 2014 1st round pick and New York's own 2014 1st round pick via Denver [Denver - L.A. Lakers - Orlando - Philadelphia, 8/10/2012]

2015 second round draft pick to Minnesota
Denver's own 2015 2nd round pick to Minnesota [Denver - Minnesota - New York, 2/22/2011]

Hersports85 wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

Hersports85 wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

Nalod wrote:When you trade drafted players for others, its assets used, and those assets come from the draft. Monta Ellis for Bogut for example. Barnes, Thompson and cury all draftees.

ONly starter a free agent was Dlee.

Jarret Jack and Carl Landry?

I was just about to say Jarret Jack says hello. Carl Landry is also a major piece to the puzzle, but most importantly Mark Jackson has done a better job than expected.

This year has been amazing, but it took a long time and a lot of moves to make this work. It didn't happen over night, as some would suggest. I been a huge fan of GSW since they first got B. Davis ... and for those not aware, besides this year, they only had 1 playoff appearance in 18 years. So being a fan has not been easy at all.

So of course they received high draft picks:

Harrison Barnes - 7th
Klay thompson - 11th
Stephen Curry - 7th (complete steal)

Well put.

Yea, a lot of people just see them winning now, like where were you the past 20 years. SMH ... how about the last 5 years? No one was saying anything about GS but Curry had "glass" ankles and can't build around him because he's injury prone. I get for trying to make a point, but with Detroit, GS and the Knicks I take it personal cause I follow these teams no matter what.

Next thing it's going to be, look at Detroit. Without knowing how many failed draft picks we had before getting remotely someone decent.

Here's what a couple said....

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=42962&page=1

3G4G wrote:

tkf wrote:

VCoug wrote:In no particular order.

1. Charlotte
2. Orlando
3. Sacramento
4. Golden State
5. Cleveland

if bogut is healthy i think GS will shock some people..

Yeah agreed it's a big if but 1 I might just roll with based on odds. Camby was often injured for a good 3-4yrs period and then snapped out of it. You could say GS's success is more dependent on the health of Curry.

Nevertheless Klay Thompson is going to be absolutely filthy this season, just watch. He could go down as maybe a Top 5 shooter All-Time.....He goes from Moist to Soggy to Drenched in seconds flat. I do not want to see that team this year if healthy. We're going to get Wet up if so.

lol Petey went on to light us up for 50+ @ MSG(although we beat them, it was a scary performance) and then that back court WAXED US ON POETICALLY SHOOTING THE ROCK in the rematch....