earthmansurfer wrote:

markvmc wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

markvmc wrote:Not that it will make any difference to the usual suspects on here, but another piece on owners of fake news cites who openly admit to making up anti-Clinton stories because it was a good earner for them. http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/25/world/europe/fake-news-donald-trump-hillary-clinton-georgia.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=a-lede-package-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0

That link doesn't work for me.

I'm sure it goes both ways regarding "Fake News". We need to consider the term came about as a result of Hillary losing. This is very similar to how the term Conspiracy Theory came about (via the CIA) as people didn't accept the Warren Commissions findings. (Look up this point, very easy to verify) Controlling public perception is important and it really seems like traditional MSM has really lost control. I think Alex Jones has more viewership than a few big MSM companies.

Losing control brings us to the new MSM - Social Media, which has a clear presence of propaganda, for lack of a better word, as well as Fake News, editing, censoring, etc.
We are in a difficult situation in that those with $$$ can really influence any platform there is, given our current level of technology. Reddit is still being actively censored (Super Pac "Correct the Record" is my guess), forums are being deleted, CEO admitted to editing posts cause he was pissed, etc. We really need something to add credibility checking to news.

Regardless of who we like, I would think we all can agree that everything is too biased, which makes us too biased. It is a vicious circle of division.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/25/world/europe/fake-news-donald-trump-hillary-clinton-georgia.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=a-lede-package-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0

Sorry; here it is again.

My concern in that article and it has been brought up before (by me) is:

Google announced that it would ban websites that host fake news from using its online advertising service, while Facebook’s chief executive, Mark Zuckerberg, outlined some of the options his company was considering, including simpler ways for users to flag suspicious content.

Who is going to decide what is Fake News? Is Fake News really Fake or perhaps does it just go against an agenda. What about biased news? It isn't necessarily fake but it promotes and agenda and is an important part of propaganda. Anyone remember the first Iraq War? I watched that on CNN and man was it disgusting (though at the time, I was naive and bought it.)

As Bonn said, we really need to be the ones who decipher what is Fake and what isn't. These hierarchical corporations do not have our best interests at heart. One might argue certain aspects of the government as well.

Sometimes things that are too sensitive to our minds are often banned. Not picking on people for doing this, but for example, Martin deleted a post in this thread regarding the connection between the Clintons and a known pedophile (billionaire Epstein). (Bill was on his plane many many times going to one of his parties on his island.) Now, fast forward a few weeks, #PizzaGate is blowing up, alt media all over are covering it. And it all started from the Wikileaks (which oddly and often enough, can be verified through Google.) Maybe it is Fake, but the connections, imagry, etc. in #PizzaGate are just uncanny... and sick. That forum was deleted from Reddit. It promptly moved to Voat.co.

Mainstream, as far as I know, have written one hit piece on it (NYT) which was easily debunked but just will not look at it. My point, we have to decipher what is real and not MSM, the government, etc.

earthmansurfer wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:Depending on where you look, I see it ranging from 3 Billion to 10 Billion.

you have to do the digging since you are the one claiming some random number between 3 and 10 billion. has he shown you or any credible source his taxes?

You asked me, sarcastically it appears. I don't really care about how much he made and if it is so important to you, then look it up or do your DD.

I'm more worried about what Trump is going to do. I have some reservations (e.g. Nuclear Energy, Tax cuts = he must cut government spending).
We are in a difficult situation. Obama tripled the deficit in 8 years (I understand the banking system was on the brink) so the next few years are going to really be tough.

your post earlier in this thread...

earthmansurfer wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:Hugely successful businessman who couldnt beat the stock market - Check

Speaking out against ISIS makes him strong and principled - Check

He will liberate us from Corporate fascism, by reaching out to Jamie Dimon to take the treasury job - Check

I am the one making stuff up - Check

You are on a roll, don't let the big bad wolves attack precious little red riding Trump.

He started with a million and now has billions. What are you talking about?

Where do you get your logic from?

So do you care how much he made or not...Coz apparently you did care when meloshouldgo questioned your logic?

The real barrier to discussing politics with some of these people is language. Most of them don't understand what "facts" are. Just ask them what it means. The responses will astound you. They can't do even basic math and they think they're smarter than Einstein. One of them has 2000 years of instinct, no wonder they're voting to go back to the dark ages. Let them be. Democracy requires an informed electoral base, when your electoral base can't do seventh grade math you get Trump.

Another barrier is many of you pro Hillary guys believe MSM. They are dying and lying the whole way down. Just be open to other sources of information, even if it disagrees with your views.
I still give MSM some of my time to see what they are saying. You exclude based on name, when it is content that counts.

Thank you for proving my point. I have completely exposed Hillary Clinton as a false flag democratic candidate who is corrupt, untrustworthy and bad for the middle class and cozy with Wall St. So now you call me pro-Hillary. I have, unlike you and arkrud and a bunch of others given actual data from World Bank and Federal Reserve to back up what I said and you call me believer of Mainstream Media. OTOH you have never once referenced anything even remotely negative about Trump - but you accuse others of excluding content based on name. Like I said your level of ignorance and naivete has basically distorted the language itself. Pathetic

Not sure what you are talking about here. I'm just replying to your post, not past posts.
If you look at information based on it's factual nature and not the publisher, great. Sure, be more careful with certain sources, but when someone won't look at news that alt media says, just because of the name, then we have a problem because that feeds into MSM's (past) control of information.

You called me pro Hillary and told me I listen to MSM.that is what I am talking about here.

djsunyc wrote:

In a statement posted to Medium on Saturday morning, the general counsel for Hillary for America announced the campaign would get behind recounts in Pennsylvania and Michigan should Green Party candidate Jill Stein make good on her promise to look into voting totals in those states

According to attorney Marc Erik Elias, the campaign has been reviewing their options since the loss to GOP presidential nominee Donald Trump, including allegations of tampering.

“It should go without saying that we take these concerns extremely seriously. We certainly understand the heartbreak felt by so many who worked so hard to elect Hillary Clinton, and it is a fundamental principle of our democracy to ensure that every vote is properly counted,” he wrote. “Since the day after the election we have had lawyers and data scientists and analysts combing over the results to spot anomalies that would suggest a hacked result. These have included analysts both from within the campaign and outside, with backgrounds in politics, technology and academia.”

Outlining the steps they taken, Elias wrote that, while they have not uncovered “actionable evidence of hacking or outside attempts to alter the voting technology,” the success of Green Party candidate Jill Stein to successfully launch a recount in Wisconsin has made them reconsider joining in.

“Now that a recount has been initiated in Wisconsin, we intend to participate in order to ensure the process proceeds in a manner that is fair to all sides. If Jill Stein follows through as she has promised and pursues recounts in Pennsylvania and Michigan, we will take the same approach in those states as well,” Elias wrote. “We do so fully aware that the number of votes separating Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton in the closest of these states — Michigan — well exceeds the largest margin ever overcome in a recount. But regardless of the potential to change the outcome in any of the states, we feel it is important, on principle, to ensure our campaign is legally represented in any court proceedings and represented on the ground in order to monitor the recount process itself.”

Elias added: “We believe we have an obligation to the more than 64 million Americans who cast ballots for Hillary Clinton to participate in ongoing proceedings to ensure that an accurate vote count will be reported.

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/11/clinton-to-follow-steins-lead-and-back-recounts-in-michigan-and-pennsylvania-campaign-attorney/

i don't expect anything to come out of this but the election was influenced by outside sources so might as well make 100% sure the results were legit.

arkrud wrote:Good Russian saying goes:
"No point to swing the fists after fight is over".
Hillary is history and Trump is reality.
And the world is spinning same as it was.
In a couple of years we all will find out that the the rock gave birth to the mouse.
All of us including the most famous and most powerful are driven by Karma and the unstoppable flow of Human civilization.
But yet most of us think we are in charge and we are moving the world forward.
Hello!!! Wake up!!! The Earth is circling the Sun not all the way around as we thought for thousands of years.
The only change some of us can do is to take care our own life and the lives of our family.
This is the only thing that matters and the only think worth fighting for.
And obviously The Knicks... The rest is baloney...

You take the first prize for saying the dumbest shyte on this forum consistently. BAR NONE!

earthmansurfer wrote:

holfresh wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

holfresh wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

holfresh wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

djsunyc wrote:

holfresh wrote:You guys still don't get it..This isn't about party politics..It's about right and wrong...Trump has stolen from the working man/woman, people working for him..It's people like Trump why our taxes are so high..They don't pay their fair share...Sexual abuse because he can get away with it, Walking in on naked 15 year olds at his beauty pageant to "inspect them"..He brags about this on the radio...Stiffing contractors..He has a child rape case on Dec. 16th, I won't miss this...The hate for Muslims, Jews, dark skinned people...The sudden rise and empowerment of nationalist and white supremacist groups are coincidental, right...His top advisor is openly promoting Satan, just a few day ago..He is trying to openly profit from the Presidency and no one cares now...Just a few weeks ago you had a problem with pay for play and now????I tell my kids do the right thing in life, how do I explain to them that I voted for Trump, a man who does everything I tell them not to do and he is proud of it..What do you tell your kids???

I can't believe Romney would consider working for this guy...

oh stop your whining. only losers whine. you might as well have a twitter account and go whine there. i hear thats an effective way to campaign.

kids dont matter.
neither does racism.
neither does sexism.
trump will get me a tax break...thats why i voted for him.
trump will bring back my job...thats why i voted for him.
trump will get rid of "them"...thats why i voted for him.
trump will fix that darn pothole on my block...thats why i voted for him.[/greenfont]

the rest is all noise. at the core, most people voted for him based purely on how he will help them individually. they could care less about what heppens to everyone else.

I dont think trump does anything for me personally. All I have to say is do some homework on my man George Soros--H Clinton's good buddy. Then tell me who the scumbag is. He is probably the # 1 scumbag in this world since Hitler.

Isn't Soros Jewish??

Just watch this George short Soros Video that was almost cleaned off the net. He helped the Nazi's when 14 or so (to stay alive he said) and was fine with it (and yes, he is Jewish as far as I know). Trying to describe this man, what he has done to countries (notably shorting money) is hard to put into words. He is a globalist where only the ends mean anything.

Put it into words, I'm very familiar with those situations..It's actually funny that you are worried about Soros putting on trades against Central Banks around the globe and not concerned about Trump bilking students thinking they can learn about real estate...

I'm not worried about what happens to the banks. It is all a write off for them. I'm more worried about what it does to people (look around you.)
Soros is a Globalist who, apparently will do whatever he can to reach that end. And they are failing.

I'm not real worried about a Real Estate school. Soros is on a whole other level. (And a close friend of Hillary of course.)

Those countries blame Soros for their problems much like the rest of the world blame the US for all their ills...

If you don't know anything about Soros just say so, but don't outright lie. Your ignorance is telling.

Why do you always go swimming in deep water where you don't belong?

meloshouldgo wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

Cartman718 wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:Depending on where you look, I see it ranging from 3 Billion to 10 Billion.

you have to do the digging since you are the one claiming some random number between 3 and 10 billion. has he shown you or any credible source his taxes?

You asked me, sarcastically it appears. I don't really care about how much he made and if it is so important to you, then look it up or do your DD.

I'm more worried about what Trump is going to do. I have some reservations (e.g. Nuclear Energy, Tax cuts = he must cut government spending).
We are in a difficult situation. Obama tripled the deficit in 8 years (I understand the banking system was on the brink) so the next few years are going to really be tough.

your post earlier in this thread...

earthmansurfer wrote:

meloshouldgo wrote:Hugely successful businessman who couldnt beat the stock market - Check

Speaking out against ISIS makes him strong and principled - Check

He will liberate us from Corporate fascism, by reaching out to Jamie Dimon to take the treasury job - Check

I am the one making stuff up - Check

You are on a roll, don't let the big bad wolves attack precious little red riding Trump.

He started with a million and now has billions. What are you talking about?

Where do you get your logic from?

So do you care how much he made or not...Coz apparently you did care when meloshouldgo questioned your logic?

The real barrier to discussing politics with some of these people is language. Most of them don't understand what "facts" are. Just ask them what it means. The responses will astound you. They can't do even basic math and they think they're smarter than Einstein. One of them has 2000 years of instinct, no wonder they're voting to go back to the dark ages. Let them be. Democracy requires an informed electoral base, when your electoral base can't do seventh grade math you get Trump.

Another barrier is many of you pro Hillary guys believe MSM. They are dying and lying the whole way down. Just be open to other sources of information, even if it disagrees with your views.
I still give MSM some of my time to see what they are saying. You exclude based on name, when it is content that counts.

Thank you for proving my point. I have completely exposed Hillary Clinton as a false flag democratic candidate who is corrupt, untrustworthy and bad for the middle class and cozy with Wall St. So now you call me pro-Hillary. I have, unlike you and arkrud and a bunch of others given actual data from World Bank and Federal Reserve to back up what I said and you call me believer of Mainstream Media. OTOH you have never once referenced anything even remotely negative about Trump - but you accuse others of excluding content based on name. Like I said your level of ignorance and naivete has basically distorted the language itself. Pathetic

Not sure what you are talking about here. I'm just replying to your post, not past posts.
If you look at information based on it's factual nature and not the publisher, great. Sure, be more careful with certain sources, but when someone won't look at news that alt media says, just because of the name, then we have a problem because that feeds into MSM's (past) control of information.

You called me pro Hillary and told me I listen to MSM.that is what I am talking about here.

Where did I say to watch MSM? I said don't only listen to MSM. Just as I get news from alt news, I also look at MSM - go in reverse. Can you not see that in my post?

holfresh wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

holfresh wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

holfresh wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

holfresh wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

djsunyc wrote:

holfresh wrote:You guys still don't get it..This isn't about party politics..It's about right and wrong...Trump has stolen from the working man/woman, people working for him..It's people like Trump why our taxes are so high..They don't pay their fair share...Sexual abuse because he can get away with it, Walking in on naked 15 year olds at his beauty pageant to "inspect them"..He brags about this on the radio...Stiffing contractors..He has a child rape case on Dec. 16th, I won't miss this...The hate for Muslims, Jews, dark skinned people...The sudden rise and empowerment of nationalist and white supremacist groups are coincidental, right...His top advisor is openly promoting Satan, just a few day ago..He is trying to openly profit from the Presidency and no one cares now...Just a few weeks ago you had a problem with pay for play and now????I tell my kids do the right thing in life, how do I explain to them that I voted for Trump, a man who does everything I tell them not to do and he is proud of it..What do you tell your kids???

I can't believe Romney would consider working for this guy...

oh stop your whining. only losers whine. you might as well have a twitter account and go whine there. i hear thats an effective way to campaign.

kids dont matter.
neither does racism.
neither does sexism.
trump will get me a tax break...thats why i voted for him.
trump will bring back my job...thats why i voted for him.
trump will get rid of "them"...thats why i voted for him.
trump will fix that darn pothole on my block...thats why i voted for him.[/greenfont]

the rest is all noise. at the core, most people voted for him based purely on how he will help them individually. they could care less about what heppens to everyone else.

I dont think trump does anything for me personally. All I have to say is do some homework on my man George Soros--H Clinton's good buddy. Then tell me who the scumbag is. He is probably the # 1 scumbag in this world since Hitler.

Isn't Soros Jewish??

Just watch this George short Soros Video that was almost cleaned off the net. He helped the Nazi's when 14 or so (to stay alive he said) and was fine with it (and yes, he is Jewish as far as I know). Trying to describe this man, what he has done to countries (notably shorting money) is hard to put into words. He is a globalist where only the ends mean anything.

Put it into words, I'm very familiar with those situations..It's actually funny that you are worried about Soros putting on trades against Central Banks around the globe and not concerned about Trump bilking students thinking they can learn about real estate...

I'm not worried about what happens to the banks. It is all a write off for them. I'm more worried about what it does to people (look around you.)
Soros is a Globalist who, apparently will do whatever he can to reach that end. And they are failing.

I'm not real worried about a Real Estate school. Soros is on a whole other level. (And a close friend of Hillary of course.)

Those countries blame Soros for their problems much like the rest of the world blame the US for all their ills...

If you don't know anything about Soros just say so, but don't outright lie. Your ignorance is telling.

Why do you always go swimming in deep water where you don't belong?

As I was saying, your ignorance is telling.

XXXX wrote:I really hesitate to type this but here goes...

I’ve been completely bewildered that so many Americans voted for a guy that was so obviously unqualified, a liar, a conspiracy peddler, incapable of admitting a mistake, vicious to anyone that questioned him, ethically challenged and so obviously in everything for his own personal benefit.

I didn’t find him to be a very good speaker, he speaks in very adolescent terms and often contradicts himself or cites entirely wrong information. What did people see in him? I stumbled around trying to figure this out. I’d often run into the Hitler comparisons and write it off quickly while Godwin’s Law echo’d in my head. Then I ran into an article where his ex wife claimed the one book he read was Mein Kampf. I hesitated to explore that but it seemed like it was confirmed that he was given a Hitler book but it was “My New Order”. So I thought well maybe I should look into this, not that I thought Trump had the same ideologies, commitment or focus as Hitler did just that maybe he took a page out of the book of another guy that managed to stir up a nationalist movement.

I don’t blame you if you tune out at the mention of Hitler, I did for quite a while. I do blame people if they jump in claiming I’m comparing Trump to Hitler. No I’m comparing Trump’s approach to propaganda to Hitler’s.

From Hitler's writings

All propaganda must be popular and its intellectual level must be adjusted to the most limited intelligence among those it is addressed to. Consequently, the greater the mass it is intended to reach, the lower its purely intellectual level will have to be.

The more modest its intellectual ballast, the more exclusively it takes into consideration the emotions of the masses, the more effective it will be. And this is the best proof of the soundness or unsoundness of a propaganda campaign, and not success pleasing a few scholars or young aesthetes.

The art of propaganda lies in understanding the emotional ideas of the great masses and finding, through a psychologically correct form, the way to the attention and thence to the heart of the broad masses. The fact that our bright boys do not understand this merely shows how mentally lazy and conceited they are.

Once understood how necessary it is for propaganda in be adjusted to the broad mass, the following rule results:
It is a mistake to make propaganda many-sided, like scientific instruction, for instance.

The receptivity of the great masses is very limited, their intelligence is small, but their power of forgetting is enormous. In consequence of these facts, all effective propaganda must be limited to a very few points and must harp on these in slogans until the last member of the public understands what you want him to understand by your slogan. As soon as you sacrifice this slogan and try to be many-sided, the effect will piddle away, for the crowd can neither digest nor retain the material offered. In this way the result is weakened and in the end entirely cancelled out.

When I read these key points they overlay exactly with Trumps simple messages, his appeal to racists undertones, restorative nostalgia and his power to deal with whatever villain he needs to create. (ISIS, Hillary, Immigrants etc)

Hilter denounced capitalists while taking money from them in support of his cause
Hitler denounced corrupt politicians
Hitler denounced the lying press lugenpresse
Any of this sound familiar?

Trump uses simple messages (Make American Great Again, Build a Wall, Lock her up) to play to the masses. He plays on the fear of foreigners, blames trade deals for the lack of jobs (like Hitler blamed the treaty) promises to restore jobs, increase wages (like Hitler did), promised to re-establish the greatness of their country, grow the armed forces.

Trump uses the "The Big Lie" over an over. He will make absurd claims and not back off them. Hitler lays out exactly what we see today.

All this was inspired by the principle—which is quite true within itself—that in the big lie there is always a certain force of credibility; because the broad masses of a nation are always more easily corrupted in the deeper strata of their emotional nature than consciously or voluntarily; and thus in the primitive simplicity of their minds they more readily fall victims to the big lie than the small lie, since they themselves often tell small lies in little matters but would be ashamed to resort to large-scale falsehoods. It would never come into their heads to fabricate colossal untruths, and they would not believe that others could have the impudence to distort the truth so infamously. Even though the facts which prove this to be so may be brought clearly to their minds, they will still doubt and waver and will continue to think that there may be some other explanation. For the grossly impudent lie always leaves traces behind it, even after it has been nailed down, a fact which is known to all expert liars in this world and to all who conspire together in the art of lying.

 Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf

His primary rules were: never allow the public to cool off; never admit a fault or wrong; never concede that there may be some good in your enemy; never leave room for alternatives; never accept blame; concentrate on one enemy at a time and blame him for everything that goes wrong; people will believe a big lie sooner than a little one; and if you repeat it frequently enough people will sooner or later believe it

That sound like Trump? It was the profile Americans created of Hitler. He basically is working off the same playbook in order to gain power.

also...a podcast that delves into this further.

http://www.slate.com/articles/podcasts/trumpcast/2016/11/drawing_parallels_between_the_rise_of_trump_and_hitler.html

i don't think trump is hitler...but the campaign tactics are interesting.

holfresh wrote:Micheal Flynn has his own private internet/server at the pentagon..

emails, wikileaks...nothing but noise. part of the hustle.

trump also being sexist out in the open by constantly bringing up nafta and bill clinton. he lumps hillary in with bill b/c a woman obviously can't stand on her own merit and must be the same as her husband.