DrAlphaeus wrote:

nixluva wrote:

nyk4ever wrote:

nixluva wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Wow, Republicans control the ENTIRE country - they have the Presidency, The Senate, the House, the Governorships, the State Congresses. Unless Trump surprises us and is more moderate than he seemed, I think the country is going to move very far to the right for many decades.

America's first independent President. It's the best thing to ever happen to us

You are naive. The real Power is in the House and Senate and Trump is not a serious Policy man. The same old Republicans that have been in power all these years will be running the show. You will not get the change you were promised because Trump can't "drain the swamp". All he gets to do is change the Drapes in the Oval Office. It's all about the House and Senate and those people have not changed.

if clinton had won, you would NEVER call her powerless, so why are you calling trump powerless? your post is saying who the president is doesn't matter, because the house and senate are the same. you should try alleviating your bias every now and then.

You don't know what you're talking about!!! If Clinton had won and won the Senate that would be a different situation. Sure there would've been divided government but some things that Dems want would get done. Trump of course has the powers given to the Executive but right now Trump has his NON Conservative plans which call for massive spending and he doesn't have a way to pay for any of it. The Republicans will not give him what he wants which means he will not be able to directly do what he promised his voters.

Now the only way it happens is if the Republicans abandon their fiscal responsibility and Cut Taxes but give him his money unpaid for. That would lead to Economic ruin. You can't do both massive Tax Cuts and Major Spending Bills like Infrastructure.

Welp, here is his "contract with the American voter":
https://assets.donaldjtrump.com/_landings/contract/O-TRU-102316-Contractv02.pdf

Donald Trump’s Contract
with the American Voter

What follows is my 100-day action plan to Make America Great Again.
It is a contract between myself and the American voter — and begins with restoring honesty and accountability, and bringing change to Washington.

On the first day of my term of office, my administration will immediately pursue the following:

Six measures to clean up the
corruption and special interest
collusion in Washington, DC:
★ FIRST, propose a constitutional amendment to
impose term limits on all members of Congress.
★ SECOND, a hiring freeze on all federal employees
to reduce the federal workforce through attrition
(exempting military, public safety, and public health).
★ THIRD, a requirement that for every new federal regulation,
two existing regulations must be eliminated.
★ FOURTH, a fi ve-year ban on White House and
Congressional offi cials becoming lobbyists after they
leave government service.
★ FIFTH, a lifetime ban on White House offi cials lobbying
on behalf of a foreign government.
★ SIXTH, a complete ban on foreign lobbyists raising
money for American elections.

Seven actions to protect
American workers:
★ FIRST, I will announce my intention to renegotiate
NAFTA or withdraw from the deal under Article 2205.
★ SECOND, I will announce our withdrawal from the
Trans-Pacifi c Partnership.
★ THIRD, I will direct the Secretary of the Treasury to label
China a currency manipulator.
★ FOURTH, I will direct the Secretary of
Commerce and U.S. Trade Representative to
identify all foreign trading abuses that unfairly
impact American workers and direct them to
use every tool under American and international
law to end those abuses immediately.
★ FIFTH, I will lift the restrictions on the
production of $50 trillion dollars’ worth of
job-producing American energy reserves,
including shale, oil, natural gas and clean coal.
★ SIXTH, lift the Obama-Clinton roadblocks and allow vital
energy infrastructure projects, like the Keystone Pipeline,
to move forward.
★ SEVENTH, cancel billions in payments to U.N. climate
change programs and use the money to fi x America’s
water and environmental infrastructure.
Five actions to restore security
and the constitutional rule of law:
★ FIRST, cancel every unconstitutional executive action,
memorandum and order issued by President Obama.
★ SECOND, begin the process of selecting a replacement
for Justice Scalia from one of the 20 judges on my list,
who will uphold and defend the U.S. Constitution.
★ THIRD, cancel all federal funding to sanctuary cities.
★ FOURTH, begin removing the more than two million
criminal illegal immigrants from the country and cancel
visas to foreign countries that won’t take them back.
★ FIFTH, suspend immigration from terror-prone regions
where vetting cannot safely occur. All vetting of people
coming into our country will be considered “extreme vetting.”

There is back page of various acts he plans to implement. This is the starting point right now when talking about Trump's policy and the way forward.

That's a very interesting list. We'll have to see how all of that goes. Especially the Foreign Policy stuff which will have ramifications. Some of the stuff he has on there will be simple because it won't require anything from Congress. I am not contesting those types of changes. The things he wants to do that will require major Tax Revenue to pay for is where he'll run into issues. How will it be paid for once the get the Tax Cuts they want?

Knickoftime wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:I know the dumbing down of America is all part of the plan but I truly feel we are being underestimated

No, if America concludes Donald Trump has any interest in public service much less the capacity for it, we're being estimated just right.

holfresh wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

holfresh wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

fishmike wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:So, what of these "polls". It was brought up how Brexit was wrong and that our polls were oversampled. Is it another coincidence or is there something to it?
I mean, all of the MSM polls, wrong??? This is probably what Trump meant about corruption.

No one really knows. The polling average had Hillary up by 3.3 and it looks like it's going to be closer to 0.1. Nate Silver at 538 did say there was a pretty high chance (greater than 10%) that Hillary would win the popular vote but lose the electoral vote.

We seem to be near the historically high end regarding result/poll deviation.

As a service, for the sake of future elections, this needs to be looked into and see exactly how these (specific) results were achieved. A part of going forward and healing, is seeing where things are broken and fixing them, making things better all round - more transparent, etc. We need to get back trust in our system. We need more transparency.

We need to be careful, because if polls can easily be influenced, the affect on the outcome of a vote could, in part, steered. Another tool in the chest of corruption.

It is not a corruption for monetary and political gain.
This is corruption of people who cannot let go the old cozy world crumbling in front of their wide open eyes.
Mainstream old-fashioned media losing its ground along with bankrupt politicians and preachers of any kind.
Truth and common sense are storming back into the picture pushing millions from convenient social holes.
From obstacles they became a problem. We will see a lot of this on every level from state government, to local, down to corporations.
Too many bloodsuckers to tolerate. Time to make them all make the leaving the hard way.

Just so you know cuz I don't think most of you understand this, but the local governments outside of the big cities are NOT CHANGING. Congress is relatively UNCHANGED!!! In fact all this hype from Trump about "draining the swamp" is utter BS! All of the same politicians are still in charge in RED America. They didn't get rid of their own chosen representatives. All the people who have been there FOR YEARS are still in Washington!!!

Republicans did everything in their power to obstruct so that they could regain power and now that they have it what will they do? Big Tax Cuts? Get rid of Regulation? Basically nothing that really will bring back the thousands of small towns and dying Rust Belt cities in terms of Manufacturing Jobs. These guys are the ones who believed in Outsourcing and allowing Big Business to pay low wages and ship jobs overseas. These same Republicans are the ones who are backed by Big Business and always have been.

We can call this a process. Trump can get things going. People need inspiration. Maybe Obama tried going in that direction but the changes didn't happen. Things got worse - economically, socially, etc.

We can't depend on one person to make things better for us, but together, we can do our part and move forward. Might be a long process but I'm game.

For example, IF Hillary is prosecuted and IF Comey or Podesta are also, we can see a trickle down prosecution like effect. That would at least be a start, give people hope, get people motivated to make things better. Put corruption in prion. Work on our relations with Russia (e.g. trade agreement) and work together more. Where we have been headed lately, it seems to make companies more money, save rich people more money, remove the middle class, conquer the world, remove all kinds of borders (while waging wars next door), etc. That was a dead end street.

Yea? Think those things bolded were better under Bush? Wow. Good post.

Thanks.

If I had to choose between Bush and Obama, I think I would choose Obama.

But you are putting out a false narrative..How is the economy worse now than when Obama met it losing over 800 jobs per month, unemployment rate rockets over 10%, Stock market was at 6700 not at 18000..What are your gauges, what are you looking at???

What has happened to our debt? America, if it was a company (and ironically it almost is), would be bankrupt right now. We are riding a wave of faith and money printing.
They are printing money to no end, inflating the supply (but they have an elegant name for it - Quantitative Easing.) That steals from people. A fair amount of that money goes into the markets, hence why an economy that is not really going up much, has a market that is rocketing. It is basically inflation, a big big bubble waiting to pop. The stock market is not indicative, truly, of the economy, it reflects money coming into it (look at rising P/E's http://www.multpl.com/). And many countries e.g. Saudi Arabia, put LOTS of money into it.

Last I heard, many more people are working PT jobs because they couldn't get FT jobs. And companies love this as then they don't have to pay benefits for FT, but just looking at unemployed doesn't tell the whole story.

Maybe I misunderstood you (and different issues, Bush and Obama as people and then just the economic aspects while president) but what is the false narrative?

Your description of the economy is false..We were heading into the deepest recessions since the depression..Look it up...The debt is because of the recession...Obama has actually reduced the deficit he walked into, look that up too...

Not to get even more off the point here, but in 2008 that was a very dangerous situation. There was little chance of fixing things after that. They
started pumping money into the system, getting away from using interest rates to change the economy and instead using money supply. A big big experiment.
Really, you need to give some information. I have a fairly good understanding here, so would like to hear what you think. I know what I think. ;-)

nixluva wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

nixluva wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

holfresh wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:So, what of these "polls". It was brought up how Brexit was wrong and that our polls were oversampled. Is it another coincidence or is there something to it?
I mean, all of the MSM polls, wrong??? This is probably what Trump meant about corruption.

No one really knows. The polling average had Hillary up by 3.3 and it looks like it's going to be closer to 0.1. Nate Silver at 538 did say there was a pretty high chance (greater than 10%) that Hillary would win the popular vote but lose the electoral vote.

We seem to be near the historically high end regarding result/poll deviation. http://www.gallup.com/poll/9442/Election-Polls-Accuracy-Record-Presidential-Elections.aspx (edit)

As a service, for the sake of future elections, this needs to be looked into and see exactly how these (specific) results were achieved. A part of going forward and healing, is seeing where things are broken and fixing them, making things better all round - more transparent, etc. We need to get back trust in our system. We need more transparency.

We need to be careful, because if polls can easily be influenced, the affect on the outcome of a vote could, in part, steered. Another tool in the chest of corruption.

So you are concerned about polls and not about a Republican majority in the Supreme Court allowing laws to change so the Republicans in their districts can systemically close 860 polling stations in minority districts across the South in battleground states, to restrict minorities access to voting..You aren't concerned that the Supreme Court has ushered in Citizen's United to allow the rich both foreign and domestic to influence our election more so than the average citizen..You had zero problem watching Russia weight in on our election process by hacking the DNC databases are releasing vital campaign strategies..And lastly, You had no problem with the FBI releasing critical leaks on the eve of the election to help the republican candidate..But it's the POLLS that keeps you up at night, where we need more transparency...Right...

Again, why is this a "this or that" argument (false dilemma)? Can't we work on all of these things?
I'm not the opposition.

You're misguided if you think this election was about fixing corruption or polls or "draining the swamp". That's all BS for the masses that bought that tripe. The same people that have been in government are STILL in government but now they have even more power to screw the people.

Please someone explain how things are better today for the people just cuz Trump is President? Trump is just a figurehead and the real power is still in the same hands. There has been no real change except now Big Business is in total control.

Who backed the Republicans that have been in the House and the Senate??? The same Koch Brothers and other Big Business leaders. They could give a crap about "the people "!

Nixluva - You don't know and yet you speak with certainty. If you want to give up before he even gets in office that is on you. I wouldn't have given up had Hillary won.
Trump is the first non politician to be in office since when? Was Reagan a politician after acting? We have a chance, I'll take that over a known corrupt quantity.

The sad part is that I DO KNOW that The Congress is made up of the very same Republicans that have been there for YEARS and they are bought and paid for by Big Business like the Koch Brothers. That's always been their thing and they have not changed even if Trump was selling his populist spiel to RED America. These voters have put their trust in Trump and he will not be able to overcome the wishes of the House and Senate Republicans. He will soon learn that his power is very limited.

The worst may very well happen. For me, I feel like there is hope of some big changes. I think the economy, without huge changes to America, is going to take a dive. The banking system is teetering and has been. You can only endlessly print money for so long. We got some big problems. As I mentioned before, I was really worried about War, still might happen, but not with Russia.
I hope this election was a wake-up call. We have a chance of some big things happening, but corruption has to be weeded out.

earthmansurfer wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:David Duke is feeling very empowered this morning:

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/DrDavidDuke/status/796249464826687488

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/DrDavidDuke/status/796422624624656389

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/DrDavidDuke/status/796423769707413504

Bro, do you really want it to come to this? There will always be some pretty bad people who like whomever is elected, Hillary, Trump, don't matter.
What is the point?

I'm just pointing out why a lot of people are freaking out. Is Duke wrong? "Our people" played a HUGE role. What does "our people" mean? I'm not saying that these people are all virulent racists and anti-Semites like Duke. But there was organization and energy coming from Duke-types. Won't they want to be acknowledged? Trump FORCEFULLY denounced him in 2000, and danced around a denouncement for days this time around. Because he understood the demographics and psychographics?

Don't make me out to be the bad guy for bringing this up. It's answering the question "what do we have to lose" from the OP.

DrAlphaeus wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:
Bro, do you really want it to come to this? There will always be some pretty bad people who like whomever is elected, Hillary, Trump, don't matter.
What is the point?

I'm just pointing out why a lot of people are freaking out. Is Duke wrong? "Our people" played a HUGE role. What does "our people" mean? I'm not saying that these people are all virulent racists and anti-Semites like Duke. But there was organization and energy coming from Duke-types. Won't they want to be acknowledged? Trump denounced him in 2000, and danced around a denouncement for days this time around. Because he understood the demographics and psychographics?

Don't make me out to be the bad guy for bringing this up. It's answering the question "what do we have to lose" from the OP.

Ok, I missed the part about "why a lot of people are freaking out". That post stood on it's own I though.

Not making you out to be a bad guy. Wondering where you are going with it and what good can come from it.

earthmansurfer wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:
Bro, do you really want it to come to this? There will always be some pretty bad people who like whomever is elected, Hillary, Trump, don't matter.
What is the point?

I'm just pointing out why a lot of people are freaking out. Is Duke wrong? "Our people" played a HUGE role. What does "our people" mean? I'm not saying that these people are all virulent racists and anti-Semites like Duke. But there was organization and energy coming from Duke-types. Won't they want to be acknowledged? Trump denounced him in 2000, and danced around a denouncement for days this time around. Because he understood the demographics and psychographics?

Don't make me out to be the bad guy for bringing this up. It's answering the question "what do we have to lose" from the OP.

Ok, I missed the part about "why a lot of people are freaking out". That post stood on it's own I though.

Not making you out to be a bad guy. Wondering where you are going with it and what good can come from it.

Well now is the time you said you'd check out Trump. I'm just trying to show why it was dead quiet on the subway today in New York and people are walking around shellshocked.

It's really about economics and view of the political system. But there is some real cultural stuff happening. Who showed up, who didn't for what candidate. A guy who doubted Obama was a natural born American for years will be succeeding him. It's ****ing deep.

earthmansurfer wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:
Bro, do you really want it to come to this? There will always be some pretty bad people who like whomever is elected, Hillary, Trump, don't matter.
What is the point?

I'm just pointing out why a lot of people are freaking out. Is Duke wrong? "Our people" played a HUGE role. What does "our people" mean? I'm not saying that these people are all virulent racists and anti-Semites like Duke. But there was organization and energy coming from Duke-types. Won't they want to be acknowledged? Trump denounced him in 2000, and danced around a denouncement for days this time around. Because he understood the demographics and psychographics?

Don't make me out to be the bad guy for bringing this up. It's answering the question "what do we have to lose" from the OP.

Ok, I missed the part about "why a lot of people are freaking out". That post stood on it's own I though.

Not making you out to be a bad guy. Wondering where you are going with it and what good can come from it.

Dude you went on a Twitter embed rager for a week or so. I remember you listing a list of deaths you said Clinton were responsible for, attributing millions of deaths on her, and calling her a member of a crime family. And you weren't even going to vote for anyone.

I just point out he has some prominent racist fans who feel a sense of ownership in this election and you ask me "what is the point?" and ask me if I really want it to come to this.

It don't matter to you in Germany if racists are empowered over here? My sister's co-worker is a Muslim Pakistani-American and went to the polls with a friend wearing a headcovering and they got "go back to Syria" jeers. In ****ing Jersey City, New Jersey... not out in some rural district. They are citizens of this country. Shit is real out here and people are scared. The silent majority may not be silent any more.

How will Trump reassure these folks who are scared?

All the Republicans care about is being in power. Once they get what they want they are all so cooperative and all of a sudden looking to actually govern, which they literally stopped doing for 8 years. Now that they have UNITED government they have all these plans and ideas they want to get right to work on. Stuff they could've done to help the country the last 8 years but refused to do. It's truly sinister. Now they'll be passing BOATLOADS of bills and making all kinds of changes. Where was all of that the last 8 years when we needed it?

DrAlphaeus wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:
Bro, do you really want it to come to this? There will always be some pretty bad people who like whomever is elected, Hillary, Trump, don't matter.
What is the point?

I'm just pointing out why a lot of people are freaking out. Is Duke wrong? "Our people" played a HUGE role. What does "our people" mean? I'm not saying that these people are all virulent racists and anti-Semites like Duke. But there was organization and energy coming from Duke-types. Won't they want to be acknowledged? Trump denounced him in 2000, and danced around a denouncement for days this time around. Because he understood the demographics and psychographics?

Don't make me out to be the bad guy for bringing this up. It's answering the question "what do we have to lose" from the OP.

Ok, I missed the part about "why a lot of people are freaking out". That post stood on it's own I though.

Not making you out to be a bad guy. Wondering where you are going with it and what good can come from it.

Well now is the time you said you'd check out Trump. I'm just trying to show why it was dead quiet on the subway today in New York and people are walking around shellshocked.

It's really about economics and view of the political system. But there is some real cultural stuff happening. Who showed up, who didn't for what candidate. A guy who doubted Obama was a natural born American for years will be succeeding him. It's ****ing deep.

Sure. NY is a finance place, at least in large part. I can imagine Clinton would have been good for them. And I'm not really meaning that in a good way. And likewise there are people in other States who are jumping up and down and smiling all day. We all have those reality tunnels.

The bigger issue, is look at how corrupt and messed up our system is. I mean every part of it needs an over hall. Constant shifts of power and now here we are and none of us know what is going to happen.

Let's just say hypothetically, that Trump is going to "Drain the Swamp", that is going to be the Shizz hitting the fan. Corruption and power (and banking) does not take kindly to being removed/changed, as unfortunately, John F. Kennedy learned. Agree or disagree, look at what he was working on at the time of his death, as well as what he had done. There are some similarly large things Trump has said:

He introduced billion of new Notes, not "Federal Reserve Notes" but "US Treasury Notes". Looked mostly the same and they would have paid interest back to the people.
- Trump wants to audit the Federal Reserve
He called for less oil in the homeland reserves.
He was going hard after the mafia (with his brother at his side, so to speak)
- Trump going after corruption
He said "I'm going to break the CIA up in a million little pieces."
He was talking with Russia about peace, ending the cold war and what not.
- Trump talking with Russia seems a given
Rumors of ending the Vietnam war.

When you try to do to much, too soon, against a deeply entrenched system, hidden one (that Kennedy openly spoke about in speeches), you are going down a dangerous road
(Not saying Trump does do all he said, and not comparing him to JFK directly, but some policy is similar, and to think they would sit and be ok with it, I just don't imagine that.)

DrAlphaeus wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:
Bro, do you really want it to come to this? There will always be some pretty bad people who like whomever is elected, Hillary, Trump, don't matter.
What is the point?

I'm just pointing out why a lot of people are freaking out. Is Duke wrong? "Our people" played a HUGE role. What does "our people" mean? I'm not saying that these people are all virulent racists and anti-Semites like Duke. But there was organization and energy coming from Duke-types. Won't they want to be acknowledged? Trump denounced him in 2000, and danced around a denouncement for days this time around. Because he understood the demographics and psychographics?

Don't make me out to be the bad guy for bringing this up. It's answering the question "what do we have to lose" from the OP.

Ok, I missed the part about "why a lot of people are freaking out". That post stood on it's own I though.

Not making you out to be a bad guy. Wondering where you are going with it and what good can come from it.

Dude you went on a Twitter embed rager for a week or so. I remember you listing a list of deaths you said Clinton were responsible for, attributing millions of deaths on her, and calling her a member of a crime family. And you weren't even going to vote for anyone.

I just point out he has some prominent racist fans who feel a sense of ownership in this election and you ask me "what is the point?" and ask me if I really want it to come to this.

It don't matter to you in Germany if racists are empowered over here? My sister's co-worker is a Muslim Pakistani-American and went to the polls with a friend wearing a headcovering and they got "go back to Syria" jeers. In ****ing Jersey City, New Jersey... not out in some rural district. They are citizens of this country. Shit is real out here and people are scared. The silent majority may not be silent any more.

How will Trump reassure these folks who are scared?

Bump for EMS