TeamBall wrote:

Nalod wrote:Some prefer the former players all blow out their ACL making any trade goof proof and impervious to second guessing

I said I want the knicks to win.

Gallo was liked in the Garden.

This is like the guys that wish the old girlfriends are all miserable because they lack self confidence in themselves and what their lives are about. Knicks take care of their own business then it don't matter who does what.

If you want to argue the trade Its all about the knicks doing well because of it. Took a season and a half to get the roster back after depleting after the trade. If you did not have confidence that could be done perhaps you hated the trade. If you were confident the knicks would then you loved it.

The team is 15-4. It would be fun for an ex knick to have a good game and entertain viewers. As long as our team wins.

Thats how you win trades, by winning.

If you have to see abject failure from the trading partner to validate ones moves, then thats your criteria and so beit. Me, I like to see players I once rooted for do well.

Did you really imply all this from the one question I asked you? Good god...

I have no problem with any former players scoring any amount of points or doing whatever. I just dont want them to do it against the Knicks

Someone gotta score for teams.

Gallo went 7-11 and 6 rebs. He brings the ball up a lot and not expected to rebound despite his size. I thought he played good.

KNick Defense was great last nite. Put the Clamp down in the nuggs.

NYDiva wrote:Sometimes it's about the 'eye-test'. Melo is passing out of double teams and forcing up less off-balance/bad shots than he has in the past. He has been operating within the flow of the offense. The Knicks have TWO point guards in the starting lineup; there is no real reason for him to try to be a facilitator. However, I see him passing the ball A LOT to JR Smith for open shots/good looks that he misses, b/c he's shooting so poorly. Melo would probably be averaging 3 to 3.5 assists a game if not for that.

Yep, but of course the stat book won't show that, sometimes you just have to actually watch the games, instead of sitting with a a calculator.

The good thing is he will give up the ball, even if the player doesn't make the shot.

dk7th wrote:

FoeDiddy wrote:

dk7th wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

dk7th wrote:carmelo hits his career average with 54.7TS% the knicks will struggle like they did. 24FGA too many but 16FTA helps. 1 assist

knicks as a team also shot 54.7

gallo 70.2%TS 9 boards 3 assists; but their problem is iguodala underachieving (5 TO) and that lawson turnover killed them

nuggets as a team 62.5%TS

Translation

Gallo played a good game but it is other players fault that Denver lost. Uh huh. If Gallo is so good he should be able to put the team on his back to win.

What Gallo is doing is called STAT PADDING. See Shareef Abdur Rahim. Great stats lots of losses.

gallo played a very efficient good game. melo made a couple of great baskets on him late. it was a good duel.

22 points off turnovers for the knicks: that is a key statistic.

faried 0 offensive boards this is underachieving for faried as he is the second best offensive rebounder in the league.
iguodala 5 turnovers and 3 assists it is usually the other way around isn't it. he, like melo, could also afford to be more efficient.
gallo fired up an air ball. that was the only glaring error.
lawson lost the ball at the end while the nuggets had a chance. that was the game right there.

how about mentioning that the knicks won despite JR going 5-19 and the dope Felton was 4-15?

The knicks won despite playing awful. That's awesome.

Denver shot 55 pct.

when the ball doesn't move players like smith and felton suffer. problem is they themselves contribute to the lack of ball movement.

all they need to do is focus on making the extra pass.

if there is a flaw in lawson's game i would say that he too should focus on making the extra pass in the half court. that and learning how to maintain his dribble. his is a youthful game not a veteran game. but then nobody can stay in front of him.

Felton and JR ARE the reason for lack of ball movement (very often). I don't care for either. Still hope the knicks win with them.

The knicks in general don't make the extra pass and it is certainly frustrated. Sometimes you have to take the good with the bad and just hope that the good wins out.

Melo is not really my type of player since I always played PG and he is a hog. I also appreciate that we have an unstoppable crunch time player and a guy who can carry a team. I try to appreciate him for what he is. His defense has certainly improved and I credit Woody for that. JR plays pretty good D too buy his offense makes me cringe.

Felton is just ....... Felton

any point guard worth his salt will have less than 1:1 ratio of usg/assist rate.

the benchmark is nash with a 1:3 ratio.
chris paul is 1:2
kidd here is 1:2
stockton 2:5
thomas .67:1
rondo 1:2
marbury .70:1
felton .74:1

the two latter players are uncomfortably close to a 1:1 ratio to be truly effective as orchestrators and facilitators.

melo 3:1

"ball hog" is apt.

Why are you comparing Melo to Point Guards..he is a small forward/Power forward...his main job isn't to get others involved..that's a bonus. How do his numbers compare to other Small forwards/power forwards in the league?

unfavorably

lebron .87:1 in the scoring point guard range, incredibly
durant 1.45:1 in the elite shooting guard range
gallo 1.70:1
pierce 1.55:1
horford 1.36:1
josh smith 1.5:1
joe johnson 1.26:1
wallace 1.27:1
deng 1.74:1
boozer 2:1
gay 2.26:1 he may be being overrated this year
d. lee 1.42:1

get the picture?

His strong perimeter defense, quality rebounding, stls, blks outside shooting are ignored and he may be overrated because he doesn't measure strongly getting assist?

You can make your teammates better in more ways then just getting ast. Spacing the floor and knocking down open shots. Rebounding, Playing good perimeter/man to man/post defense, help defense, playing the passing lanes. Drawing fouls and getting opponents in foul trouble all make the game easier for your teammates.

newyorknewyork wrote:

dk7th wrote:

FoeDiddy wrote:

dk7th wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

dk7th wrote:carmelo hits his career average with 54.7TS% the knicks will struggle like they did. 24FGA too many but 16FTA helps. 1 assist

knicks as a team also shot 54.7

gallo 70.2%TS 9 boards 3 assists; but their problem is iguodala underachieving (5 TO) and that lawson turnover killed them

nuggets as a team 62.5%TS

Translation

Gallo played a good game but it is other players fault that Denver lost. Uh huh. If Gallo is so good he should be able to put the team on his back to win.

What Gallo is doing is called STAT PADDING. See Shareef Abdur Rahim. Great stats lots of losses.

gallo played a very efficient good game. melo made a couple of great baskets on him late. it was a good duel.

22 points off turnovers for the knicks: that is a key statistic.

faried 0 offensive boards this is underachieving for faried as he is the second best offensive rebounder in the league.
iguodala 5 turnovers and 3 assists it is usually the other way around isn't it. he, like melo, could also afford to be more efficient.
gallo fired up an air ball. that was the only glaring error.
lawson lost the ball at the end while the nuggets had a chance. that was the game right there.

how about mentioning that the knicks won despite JR going 5-19 and the dope Felton was 4-15?

The knicks won despite playing awful. That's awesome.

Denver shot 55 pct.

when the ball doesn't move players like smith and felton suffer. problem is they themselves contribute to the lack of ball movement.

all they need to do is focus on making the extra pass.

if there is a flaw in lawson's game i would say that he too should focus on making the extra pass in the half court. that and learning how to maintain his dribble. his is a youthful game not a veteran game. but then nobody can stay in front of him.

Felton and JR ARE the reason for lack of ball movement (very often). I don't care for either. Still hope the knicks win with them.

The knicks in general don't make the extra pass and it is certainly frustrated. Sometimes you have to take the good with the bad and just hope that the good wins out.

Melo is not really my type of player since I always played PG and he is a hog. I also appreciate that we have an unstoppable crunch time player and a guy who can carry a team. I try to appreciate him for what he is. His defense has certainly improved and I credit Woody for that. JR plays pretty good D too buy his offense makes me cringe.

Felton is just ....... Felton

any point guard worth his salt will have less than 1:1 ratio of usg/assist rate.

the benchmark is nash with a 1:3 ratio.
chris paul is 1:2
kidd here is 1:2
stockton 2:5
thomas .67:1
rondo 1:2
marbury .70:1
felton .74:1

the two latter players are uncomfortably close to a 1:1 ratio to be truly effective as orchestrators and facilitators.

melo 3:1

"ball hog" is apt.

Why are you comparing Melo to Point Guards..he is a small forward/Power forward...his main job isn't to get others involved..that's a bonus. How do his numbers compare to other Small forwards/power forwards in the league?

unfavorably

lebron .87:1 in the scoring point guard range, incredibly
durant 1.45:1 in the elite shooting guard range
gallo 1.70:1
pierce 1.55:1
horford 1.36:1
josh smith 1.5:1
joe johnson 1.26:1
wallace 1.27:1
deng 1.74:1
boozer 2:1
gay 2.26:1 he may be being overrated this year
d. lee 1.42:1

get the picture?

His strong perimeter defense, quality rebounding, stls, blks outside shooting are ignored and he may be overrated because he doesn't measure strongly getting assist?

You can make your teammates better in more ways then just getting ast. Spacing the floor and knocking down open shots. Rebounding, Playing good perimeter/man to man/post defense, help defense, playing the passing lanes. Drawing fouls and getting opponents in foul trouble all make the game easier for your teammates.

NEWYORK, and all the observations that you made above are all from WATCHING THE GAMES, not sitting at your comp digging up stats just for the point of showing meaningless dribble. As I said stats dont mean squat,winning does.

newyorknewyork wrote:

dk7th wrote:

FoeDiddy wrote:

dk7th wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

dk7th wrote:carmelo hits his career average with 54.7TS% the knicks will struggle like they did. 24FGA too many but 16FTA helps. 1 assist

knicks as a team also shot 54.7

gallo 70.2%TS 9 boards 3 assists; but their problem is iguodala underachieving (5 TO) and that lawson turnover killed them

nuggets as a team 62.5%TS

Translation

Gallo played a good game but it is other players fault that Denver lost. Uh huh. If Gallo is so good he should be able to put the team on his back to win.

What Gallo is doing is called STAT PADDING. See Shareef Abdur Rahim. Great stats lots of losses.

gallo played a very efficient good game. melo made a couple of great baskets on him late. it was a good duel.

22 points off turnovers for the knicks: that is a key statistic.

faried 0 offensive boards this is underachieving for faried as he is the second best offensive rebounder in the league.
iguodala 5 turnovers and 3 assists it is usually the other way around isn't it. he, like melo, could also afford to be more efficient.
gallo fired up an air ball. that was the only glaring error.
lawson lost the ball at the end while the nuggets had a chance. that was the game right there.

how about mentioning that the knicks won despite JR going 5-19 and the dope Felton was 4-15?

The knicks won despite playing awful. That's awesome.

Denver shot 55 pct.

when the ball doesn't move players like smith and felton suffer. problem is they themselves contribute to the lack of ball movement.

all they need to do is focus on making the extra pass.

if there is a flaw in lawson's game i would say that he too should focus on making the extra pass in the half court. that and learning how to maintain his dribble. his is a youthful game not a veteran game. but then nobody can stay in front of him.

Felton and JR ARE the reason for lack of ball movement (very often). I don't care for either. Still hope the knicks win with them.

The knicks in general don't make the extra pass and it is certainly frustrated. Sometimes you have to take the good with the bad and just hope that the good wins out.

Melo is not really my type of player since I always played PG and he is a hog. I also appreciate that we have an unstoppable crunch time player and a guy who can carry a team. I try to appreciate him for what he is. His defense has certainly improved and I credit Woody for that. JR plays pretty good D too buy his offense makes me cringe.

Felton is just ....... Felton

any point guard worth his salt will have less than 1:1 ratio of usg/assist rate.

the benchmark is nash with a 1:3 ratio.
chris paul is 1:2
kidd here is 1:2
stockton 2:5
thomas .67:1
rondo 1:2
marbury .70:1
felton .74:1

the two latter players are uncomfortably close to a 1:1 ratio to be truly effective as orchestrators and facilitators.

melo 3:1

"ball hog" is apt.

Why are you comparing Melo to Point Guards..he is a small forward/Power forward...his main job isn't to get others involved..that's a bonus. How do his numbers compare to other Small forwards/power forwards in the league?

unfavorably

lebron .87:1 in the scoring point guard range, incredibly
durant 1.45:1 in the elite shooting guard range
gallo 1.70:1
pierce 1.55:1
horford 1.36:1
josh smith 1.5:1
joe johnson 1.26:1
wallace 1.27:1
deng 1.74:1
boozer 2:1
gay 2.26:1 he may be being overrated this year
d. lee 1.42:1

get the picture?

His strong perimeter defense, quality rebounding, stls, blks outside shooting are ignored and he may be overrated because he doesn't measure strongly getting assist?

You can make your teammates better in more ways then just getting ast. Spacing the floor and knocking down open shots. Rebounding, Playing good perimeter/man to man/post defense, help defense, playing the passing lanes. Drawing fouls and getting opponents in foul trouble all make the game easier for your teammates.

as i said he MAY be being overrated. of course these other factors mean a great deal. he looked better in the memphis game than i remember.

AnubisADL wrote:

dk7th wrote:melo did very little to pick up the slack. he remains a volume shooter whose positive impact on the game remains overhyped. jason kidd picked up the slack, again.

the game was close right to the end and the knicks went on a 12-0 run with both gallo and melo on the bench. you need to see the whole game and digest the goings-on. sounds like all you did was look at the points he scored and not how he scored them, and that he made a very nice drive on gallinari from the left side to help seal a victory. yay melo. you seem like a fool's gold viewer, looking for shiny stuff and believing it has genuine value.

gallo let his team lose? nah i don't see it that way. he is a role player, a borderline all-star reserve, and played his role as dictated by his coach. it's lawson's role to orchestrate and he falls short in that area which holds the nuggets back. notice that lawson's shooting has gone down and he can't make up for it in other areas.

now how does gallinari help iguodala from committing 5 turnovers? or help faried from getting his usual number of offensive rebounds?

i understand that gallinari is a sensitive touchstone and we all know how important this game was to melo and gallo.

like i said it was a good duel between those two and the knicks won.

If Gallinari put the team on his back and scored 7 more points we wouldn't be having this discussion. If Gallo could have matched Melo point for at the END of the game we wouldn't be having this discussion.

You bring up the TO's by those 2 guys like they had some huge effect on the game. The game was close and could have went either way. Melo the "volume shooter" chose to make sure the Knicks would win.

Why didnt Gallo facilitate if Lawson wasn't doing his job?

Great players put their team on their back to get the win by any means necessary. Gallo could have done more but chose to defer. That's on him.

the knicks went on a 12-0 run with melo on the bench and gallo on the bench. hard for you to acknowledge that for some reason so i repeat it for you.

how is gallo supposed to facilitate when lawson is on the floor? if you are going to ask a rhetorical question at least make it a valid one and not misdirection.

this "putting the team on his back" stuff is where you go into profound fool's gold mode.

cooch2584 wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

dk7th wrote:

FoeDiddy wrote:

dk7th wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

dk7th wrote:carmelo hits his career average with 54.7TS% the knicks will struggle like they did. 24FGA too many but 16FTA helps. 1 assist

knicks as a team also shot 54.7

gallo 70.2%TS 9 boards 3 assists; but their problem is iguodala underachieving (5 TO) and that lawson turnover killed them

nuggets as a team 62.5%TS

Translation

Gallo played a good game but it is other players fault that Denver lost. Uh huh. If Gallo is so good he should be able to put the team on his back to win.

What Gallo is doing is called STAT PADDING. See Shareef Abdur Rahim. Great stats lots of losses.

gallo played a very efficient good game. melo made a couple of great baskets on him late. it was a good duel.

22 points off turnovers for the knicks: that is a key statistic.

faried 0 offensive boards this is underachieving for faried as he is the second best offensive rebounder in the league.
iguodala 5 turnovers and 3 assists it is usually the other way around isn't it. he, like melo, could also afford to be more efficient.
gallo fired up an air ball. that was the only glaring error.
lawson lost the ball at the end while the nuggets had a chance. that was the game right there.

how about mentioning that the knicks won despite JR going 5-19 and the dope Felton was 4-15?

The knicks won despite playing awful. That's awesome.

Denver shot 55 pct.

when the ball doesn't move players like smith and felton suffer. problem is they themselves contribute to the lack of ball movement.

all they need to do is focus on making the extra pass.

if there is a flaw in lawson's game i would say that he too should focus on making the extra pass in the half court. that and learning how to maintain his dribble. his is a youthful game not a veteran game. but then nobody can stay in front of him.

Felton and JR ARE the reason for lack of ball movement (very often). I don't care for either. Still hope the knicks win with them.

The knicks in general don't make the extra pass and it is certainly frustrated. Sometimes you have to take the good with the bad and just hope that the good wins out.

Melo is not really my type of player since I always played PG and he is a hog. I also appreciate that we have an unstoppable crunch time player and a guy who can carry a team. I try to appreciate him for what he is. His defense has certainly improved and I credit Woody for that. JR plays pretty good D too buy his offense makes me cringe.

Felton is just ....... Felton

any point guard worth his salt will have less than 1:1 ratio of usg/assist rate.

the benchmark is nash with a 1:3 ratio.
chris paul is 1:2
kidd here is 1:2
stockton 2:5
thomas .67:1
rondo 1:2
marbury .70:1
felton .74:1

the two latter players are uncomfortably close to a 1:1 ratio to be truly effective as orchestrators and facilitators.

melo 3:1

"ball hog" is apt.

Why are you comparing Melo to Point Guards..he is a small forward/Power forward...his main job isn't to get others involved..that's a bonus. How do his numbers compare to other Small forwards/power forwards in the league?

unfavorably

lebron .87:1 in the scoring point guard range, incredibly
durant 1.45:1 in the elite shooting guard range
gallo 1.70:1
pierce 1.55:1
horford 1.36:1
josh smith 1.5:1
joe johnson 1.26:1
wallace 1.27:1
deng 1.74:1
boozer 2:1
gay 2.26:1 he may be being overrated this year
d. lee 1.42:1

get the picture?

His strong perimeter defense, quality rebounding, stls, blks outside shooting are ignored and he may be overrated because he doesn't measure strongly getting assist?

You can make your teammates better in more ways then just getting ast. Spacing the floor and knocking down open shots. Rebounding, Playing good perimeter/man to man/post defense, help defense, playing the passing lanes. Drawing fouls and getting opponents in foul trouble all make the game easier for your teammates.

NEWYORK, and all the observations that you made above are all from WATCHING THE GAMES, not sitting at your comp digging up stats just for the point of showing meaningless dribble. As I said stats dont mean squat,winning does.

I'm glad someone gets it. With every win, it's a new argument from these guys. Who cares what his true shooting percentage is ... like really, what's the point? The point is to win games - check. Improve as a player - he's doing that. Giving effort every time you hit the court - check again.

This is starting to get real sad lol.

dk7th wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

dk7th wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

dk7th wrote:carmelo hits his career average with 54.7TS% the knicks will struggle like they did. 24FGA too many but 16FTA helps. 1 assist

knicks as a team also shot 54.7

gallo 70.2%TS 9 boards 3 assists; but their problem is iguodala underachieving (5 TO) and that lawson turnover killed them

nuggets as a team 62.5%TS

Translation

Gallo played a good game but it is other players fault that Denver lost. Uh huh. If Gallo is so good he should be able to put the team on his back to win.

What Gallo is doing is called STAT PADDING. See Shareef Abdur Rahim. Great stats lots of losses.

gallo played a very efficient good game. melo made a couple of great baskets on him late. it was a good duel.

22 points off turnovers for the knicks: that is a key statistic.

faried 0 offensive boards this is underachieving for faried as he is the second best offensive rebounder in the league.
iguodala 5 turnovers and 3 assists it is usually the other way around isn't it. he, like melo, could also afford to be more efficient.
gallo fired up an air ball. that was the only glaring error.
lawson lost the ball at the end while the nuggets had a chance. that was the game right there.

Felton and Smith didnt have good games and Melo picked up the slack.

If Gallo saw Igoudala and Faried weren't having good games why didn't he try to compensate? He just essential let his team lose.

melo did very little to pick up the slack. he remains a volume shooter whose positive impact on the game remains overhyped. jason kidd picked up the slack, again.

the game was close right to the end and the knicks went on a 12-0 run with both gallo and melo on the bench. you need to see the whole game and digest the goings-on. sounds like all you did was look at the points he scored and not how he scored them, and that he made a very nice drive on gallinari from the left side to help seal a victory. yay melo. you seem like a fool's gold viewer, looking for shiny stuff and believing it has genuine value.

gallo let his team lose? nah i don't see it that way. he is a role player, a borderline all-star reserve, and played his role as dictated by his coach. it's lawson's role to orchestrate and he falls short in that area which holds the nuggets back. notice that lawson's shooting has gone down and he can't make up for it in other areas.

now how does gallinari help iguodala from committing 5 turnovers? or help faried from getting his usual number of offensive rebounds?

i understand that gallinari is a sensitive touchstone and we all know how important this game was to melo and gallo.

like i said it was a good duel between those two and the knicks won.

I guess you know more than the NBA analyst, Ex-players, some who are going to the HOF, and coaches. Why even bother listening to them break down Melo's impact on the game, we should just listen to you.

NYKMentality wrote:

tkf wrote:lawson is fast!

Just like you were to get off the internet after our Knicks victory. You were fast to run before hiding under a rock postgame. We all know if Denver would've won, you would've posted up a storm. But, Melo out played your favorite basketball player in the whole wide whole in Gallo, Melo destroyed Gallo during the clutch sitatuons of the 4th quarter and our 15-5 New York Knicks beat your favorite 10-11 Denver Nuggets team. You have too much pride to admit you were wrong about not only the trade, but also our Knicks of this year. So, instead of being a true sport and making it known you were wrong as a Knicks fan, you go and hide under a rock after games such as this one. Too funny.

You had 13 post's during the game but yet, only two post's after the Knicks won. The first post after the game was giving credit to Gallo for his losing ways. Then it only took two post's after the game before you stated... "later yall". 13 post's during the game. Only two post's after the game before stating... "LATER YA'LL"?!? Looks like someone who was unhappy with a Knicks victory and/or Denver loss. So instead? You went and hid under a rock.

LOL.. you know I could have come here after the bulls gave us the rundown... I don't get your infatuation with me.. If this theory holds true, then why didn't I post at all in the bulls thread? If I were happy with the knicks losing, I would have come in then.. right? dude, You are reaching, enjoy the win, and stop following me... the infatuation is odd...

want my number?

Up until now I've occasionally looked at his stats and wondered why he gets such a bad rap when he's putting up double doubles in under 20 mins. This game explained why- he has a certain knack for making mistakes that are directly converted into points by the other team.

smackeddog wrote:Can't believe people are arguing whether it was Kidd or Melo who won us the game. The real MVP was McGee- seemed like he had a hand in every play we made during our runs.

Up until now I've occasionally looked at his stats and wondered why he gets such a bad rap when he's putting up double doubles in under 20 mins. This game explained why- he has a certain knack for making mistakes that are directly converted into points by the other team.

mcgee is one of the dumbest players I have ever seen.. honestly.. I said to myself. I know Hakeem didn't teach you any of this crap you are doing.....