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Game Thread: Can Curry Bully the Bulls and Big Ben? Or Was Last Night Just Pretend?
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PresIke
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11/25/2006  10:23 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by tomverve:

What is this "excuse" thing? Seriously. Are you saying that the booing of the fans, whether it's justified or not, has no effect on the team's play at home?

If so, how do you explain the enormous disparity between home and road records?

If not, why is it an "excuse" to point out a legitimate causal factor in the Knicks' poor home play?


This is the stupidest post of the year nominee. Blame it on the fans--Ive heard it all now! Let me see--- from first hand experience of going to over 500-600+ Knick home games in my life--NY Knick fans are VERY fair and waiting for ANY flickering light to turn on for the team. The Knicks cant go down 15 points at home every game and hope that fans paying a lot of money arent going to get antsy and angry at periods. The Knicks play well-the fans are behind them--the Knicks play like sht--fans let them know about it. Stop making excuses as this one takes 10 cakes!

But BRIGGS this is not the same situation anymore, and tom is not saying it is ONLY THE MSG fans that are the cause, but it might be the case that the level of ease that fans have been booing this year plays some role in the Knicks struggles at home. In sports like basketball and football home court advantage is real, you know that.
Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
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BlueSeats
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11/25/2006  10:24 PM
it's pretty sad that now it's the fans job to entertain the players.

maybe it's time we start handing out max contracts to fans too.
NYKniCksFan87
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11/25/2006  10:24 PM
i want marbury off this team ASAP...i was willing to give him a shot, but the man just doesnt care, he's only worried about himself and doesnt care about whats going on..the team got a 24 point deficit to 5, and his ass was still pouting and just sitting there, when players were being subbed in and out of the game int he end, nobody slapped his hand, but they clearly avoided him and slapped whoever he was sitting next to
''We don't have the luxury to take anybody lightly,'' New York's Quentin Richardson said. ''We're not that good.''
simrud
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11/25/2006  10:25 PM
Hey if I you give me a 7 year guaranteed multi million dollar contract, I'll cheer every fing game even if we are loosing by 50 int he 1st quarter.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
PresIke
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11/25/2006  10:26 PM
So not one of the people here who say the fans booing plays no role believes that cheering plays no role either?

Just curious.
Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
Anji
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11/25/2006  10:27 PM
This just makes me sad.......... seems the players truely hate playing at MSG. Even Guys like Rose and Q were fumbling the ball in the first half under the pressure of being booed if they messed up. Can't tell the crowd not to boo, even guys like Lee and nate looked to be energy-less in the first half. Everybody was unsure and making stupid plays. *Sigh!!*


It's going to be tough at home all year.................

[Edited by - anji on 11-25-2006 10:28 PM]
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
simrud
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11/25/2006  10:28 PM
Cheering plays a role when you are already playing hard. If you are moping around and are playing like crap, the 2nd coming will not help you unless it plays center for you.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
PresIke
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11/25/2006  10:28 PM
btw, I am MORE THAN WILLING to admit that the team is also to blame. In fact the way we play in first quarters, often enough, has been awful, and SOOO inconsistent.
Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
BasketballJones
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11/25/2006  10:30 PM
Posted by PresIke:

So not one of the people here who say the fans booing plays no role believes that cheering plays no role either?

Just curious.


I don't know for sure, but I think the fans are trying to use both positive and negative reinforcement. When the team does well, they cheer like mad. When they do badly, they boo.

I think the fans are much quicker to boo this season than in the past, and I do think it can affect the players, probably some more than others. However, I really don't blame the fans. The Knicks franchise has given them precious little to cheer about over the past five years.



[Edited by - basketballjones on 11-25-2006 22:30]
https:// It's not so hard.
joec32033
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11/25/2006  10:32 PM
Andraise just said: "the fans only turn and get negative, so to speak, when the team, if they were sitting in the stands, would do the same thing".
~You can't run from who you are.~
BRIGGS
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11/25/2006  10:33 PM
Posted by PresIke:

btw, I am MORE THAN WILLING to admit that the team is also to blame. In fact the way we play in first quarters, often enough, has been awful, and SOOO inconsistent.


Im glad you are willing to admit that the team is also to blame for poor play:)

I don't know if you are old enough to remember, but Pat ewing took a LOT of boos in his time and played right through it and won a LOT of games. this is the first time in 30+ years as a fan that I heard knick fans as a blame-- EVERY NY team gets booed even the Yankees Boos are the fans telling you to PLAY better and harder.
RIP Crushalot😞
PresIke
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11/25/2006  10:35 PM
Posted by simrud:

Cheering plays a role when you are already playing hard. If you are moping around and are playing like crap, the 2nd coming will not help you unless it plays center for you.


I'm not saying that the fans should cheer when the team is struggling, but if cheering plays a role when playing well, what role will booing have when you play poorly?

Anyway, it's not even a matter of opinion. It's basically fact that people are more likely to do worse if they feel that they are viewed negatively. There are athletes who seem to figure out a way to function with it, which is the model we look to for why they should find a way to deal, but I just think that if we want the Knicks to win, then it is in our interests to see them be in the best position to be successful. I know the fans want to see them win because they cheer when the team seems to try hard. In some sense I understand why some fans boo, but it seems like more of a reaction than anything.
Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
BasketballJones
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11/25/2006  10:37 PM
Posted by PresIke:
Posted by simrud:

Cheering plays a role when you are already playing hard. If you are moping around and are playing like crap, the 2nd coming will not help you unless it plays center for you.


I'm not saying that the fans should cheer when the team is struggling, but if cheering plays a role when playing well, what role will booing have when you play poorly?

Anyway, it's not even a matter of opinion. It's basically fact that people are more likely to do worse if they feel that they are viewed negatively. There are athletes who seem to figure out a way to function with it, which is the model we look to for why they should find a way to deal, but I just think that if we want the Knicks to win, then it is in our interests to see them be in the best position to be successful. I know the fans want to see them win because they cheer when the team seems to try hard. In some sense I understand why some fans boo, but it seems like more of a reaction than anything.

Okay, booing makes the Knicks play worse. What should we do about it?
https:// It's not so hard.
crzymdups
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11/25/2006  10:38 PM
the fans are not an excuse, but I think it's undeniable that the Knicks are not comfortable playing at MSG right now and that sucks.

I mean, obviously the primary reason for losing these games is that Marbury has turned into a NBDL backup and Curry turns the ball over too much, but I think the fans/hostile home crowd only helps the opponent and hurts our guys.
¿ △ ?
crzymdups
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11/25/2006  10:39 PM
Posted by BasketballJones:
Posted by PresIke:
Posted by simrud:

Cheering plays a role when you are already playing hard. If you are moping around and are playing like crap, the 2nd coming will not help you unless it plays center for you.


I'm not saying that the fans should cheer when the team is struggling, but if cheering plays a role when playing well, what role will booing have when you play poorly?

Anyway, it's not even a matter of opinion. It's basically fact that people are more likely to do worse if they feel that they are viewed negatively. There are athletes who seem to figure out a way to function with it, which is the model we look to for why they should find a way to deal, but I just think that if we want the Knicks to win, then it is in our interests to see them be in the best position to be successful. I know the fans want to see them win because they cheer when the team seems to try hard. In some sense I understand why some fans boo, but it seems like more of a reaction than anything.

Okay, booing makes the Knicks play worse. What should we do about it?

get rid of Marbury - start Mardy Collins, DLee and Balkman.
¿ △ ?
BasketballJones
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11/25/2006  10:39 PM
I'd like to attend a game with you guys, and watch you going around the Garden telling fans to stop booing because it's making the Knicks play badly.
https:// It's not so hard.
BRIGGS
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11/25/2006  10:42 PM
I said it last night--the Knicks shouldve stayed in their zone defense for large chunks of games for the time being. Even the small period where they went back to zone worked. They lost because they turned the ball over repeatedly and didnt play good D until to late.
Boooooooooooooooooo
RIP Crushalot😞
PresIke
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11/25/2006  10:45 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by PresIke:

btw, I am MORE THAN WILLING to admit that the team is also to blame. In fact the way we play in first quarters, often enough, has been awful, and SOOO inconsistent.


Im glad you are willing to admit that the team is also to blame for poor play:)

I don't know if you are old enough to remember, but Pat ewing took a LOT of boos in his time and played right through it and won a LOT of games. this is the first time in 30+ years as a fan that I heard knick fans as a blame-- EVERY NY team gets booed even the Yankees Boos are the fans telling you to PLAY better and harder.


Yeah, I remember fans booing Ewing too, especially towards the end of his career, which I had a problem with. The same goes for booing of Yankee players (Which I believe I wrote about here once). I just don't think it's worth it, or productive. The reason things have been different now is that the way the media functions, Internet forums, blogs, etc. The level of vile talk about the team has reached proportions unseen in the years back when the team stunk, and I think is fueling it. Plus we have been made fun of more so than ever in the media since Layden, and Knick fans and NYers are a proud lot who hate to feel inferior...especially when we mostly feel superior to everyone ;)

There were awful things said back when the first black athletes played, and it isn't quite that bad, but I think the level of anti-Knick talk has gone as far as I have ever seen it since I stared following the team in the mid 80's. I know we are tired of feeling that we are bad, AND what is worse is the sense that things won't get much better without drastic change, and even then it may be more years. Since that has been the feeling for more than a few years fans are tired of it. I understand because I am a Knick fan too, and would love to see the team do better. I just think that the Garden should be the place where we can succeed. Historically the Knicks are a strong home team. Now, it's gotten to the point where some of us are questioning the strength of home court. That's bad. I dunno what the answer is...other than some major move by the organization or the team start to show some consistency, especially at home, no matter what because for all of my whining I don't expect any fans who disagree with me to follow anything I write or say.
Forum Po Po and #33 for a reason...
crzymdups
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11/25/2006  10:46 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:

I said it last night--the Knicks shouldve stayed in their zone defense for large chunks of games for the time being. Even the small period where they went back to zone worked. They lost because they turned the ball over repeatedly and didnt play good D until to late.
Boooooooooooooooooo

the zone woulda helped, but maybe the Knicks couldn't hear their coach through all the cat-calls.

then again, this revelation that Mardy Collins is the one teaching the Knicks the zone is kind of pathetic.
¿ △ ?
simrud
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11/25/2006  10:47 PM
BOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
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Game Thread: Can Curry Bully the Bulls and Big Ben? Or Was Last Night Just Pretend?
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