CashMoney wrote:

holfresh wrote:

CashMoney wrote:

holfresh wrote:

arkrud wrote:

misterearl wrote:FACTORIAL

The disparities appear to be even starker for unarmed suspects, according to an analysis of 2015 police killings by the Guardian. Racial minorities made up about 37.4 percent of the general population in the US and 46.6 percent of armed and unarmed victims, but they made up 62.7 percent of unarmed people killed by police.

More than half of murders, rapes, robberies, aggravated assaults, burglaries, and fraud in US are committed by black Americans.
African Americans represent 13% of population.
http://civilrightsmovement.net/us-crime-statistics-by-race/
I know that there are unfortunate historical reasons for this.
But it clearly explains why law enforcement is getting into conflict and killing black people more that anybody else.

I had to come out of retirement for this one...Maybe you and CashMoney, who claims he works in the Criminal Justice system but goes to a Financial website to get stats on Crime, need a few pointers on where to find stats to support your arguments...

According to the FBI, the people who are responsible for gathering these stats, as of 2014:

1. Whites in America commits 69.4% of all crime versus 27.8% by blacks
2. Whites in America commits 59.4% of all violent crimes versus 37.7% by blacks..Cash Money had non-whites including blacks committing 90% of all violent crimes...

According to a study by the Washington Post, Unarmed blacks are 7 times as likely to killed by police than unarmed whites...SEVEN TIMES!!!!

In 2015, The Post documented 990 fatal shootings by police, 93 of which involved people who were unarmed. Black men accounted for about 40 percent of the unarmed people fatally shot by police and, when adjusted by population, were seven times as likely as unarmed white men to die from police gunfire, The Post found.

https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2014/crime-in-the-u.s.-2014/tables/table-43
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/study-finds-police-fatally-shoot-unarmed-black-men-at-disproportionate-rates/2016/04/06/e494563e-fa74-11e5-80e4-c381214de1a3_story.html

What does a financial website have to do with anything? Reporting is reporting. I do indeed work in the Criminal Justice system. I can give you my shield number and command if you like, just send me a message.

I'll appease you so here you go..... http://newobserveronline.com/90-nonwhite-violent-crime-rate-fbi/

The bottom line is that we can all go back and forth on crime stats and BS from here to the end of time but things won't change until we can all look at each other and simply refer to each other as people!

Whenever you watch the news it's never "Police killed a man today" it's "Police killed a black man today."

So called movements like "Black Lives Matter" do nothing than add fuel to the fire. "Black Lives Matter" only when the person doing the killing is a white police officer and the person being killed is black. The fact is 90% of black people are killed by other black people! Where in the hell is Black Lives Matter on this issue? Why not start an organization called White Lives Matter and concentrate on black people who kill white people? That would be considered racist wouldn't it? Would this do nothing more than create a larger gap in the racial divide? Ignoring the fact that over 80% of whites are killed other whites would be a moot point wouldn't it? It would be simply labeled a racist movement by white people wouldn't it?

None of this crap stops until we as people stand up and say enough is enough. Not black people, Hispanic people, white people, etc. Just we as people, regardless of race, religion or creed.

I highly doubt that I will see this day nor do I feel my child will see this day but I do believe this day will come. I judge people based on who they are as people not by the color of their skin. I teach my child to do the same. I hope that there are others out there like me who call BS, BS who will teach their children the same until the day comes when a spade is able to be called a spade. Only when people who are held in high regard in their communities preach this nothing will change and it will continue to be "us" vs "them."

As the late and great MLK once said......

"When we let freedom ring, when we let it ring from every village and every hamlet, from every state and every city, we will be able to speed up that day when all of God's children, black men and white men, Jews and Gentiles, Protestants and Catholics, will be able to join hands and sing in the words of the old Negro spiritual, "Free at last! free at last! thank God Almighty, we are free at last!"

LET'S GO KNICKS!!!!!!!!!!

It's interesting that the stats I presented is completely opposite to the stats you initially recorded, and now, after posting the same stats I have posted, you some how you draw the same conclusion as before...

Just to answer a few questions you have posted...There are many other community organizations that protest black on black crimes. These protest don't get covered by the press...I personally remember many walks across the Brooklyn Bridge regarding black on black crime..Spike Lee always talks about black on black crime. Press don't cover it...Black lives matter have more traction...But now you want Black Lives Matters to be the black umbrella organization??..In my opinion, the reason you don't see an animated protest against black on black crimes is because when the police capture the assailant, they are often prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law...When a police officer kills a black man, there are often no repercussions...It's a freebee...The criminal justice system protects the police in those instances. So they don't have to practice restraint...Prosecute those officers who commit murder and you won't see protest...But what really gets me is that there are those who are pissed at the community(blacks and whites) protesting being killed by the police at an appalling rate and you are supposed to accept it as the way it is...Insanity...

All groups kill individuals in the community where they live in...90% of black murders are by blacks just like 84% of all white murders are by whites...

Philando Castile, who was killed by the police in Minnesota, was pulled over 52 times since 2002...Half o the charges against him were thrown out in court..

I wanted to expand the response to your post more but I don't have time, just answer me one question...

I was in middle school in Brooklyn, walking home on a half day of school, when I had my first experience with a police officer reaching for his firearm, who told me to stop and don't move...When was the first time a police officer pull a gun on you??..I remember living in Brooklyn and there was a robbery called in at the train station closest to my house..A black plain cloths officer ran to the scene of the crime with his badge around his neck. He was shot by white plain cloths officer...Keep thinking there isn't a problem..

Acknowledging black on black crime is nothing new...

I was 15 when a police officer pulled a gun on me. I was doing the same dumb crap I had being doing up until that point. Hanging out with drug dealers and known criminals always wondering "Why do the cops keep messing with us?" The answer became apparently clear which is why after that event I decided to make changes in my life. I stopped hanging out with "those people" and decided to concentrate on school and getting out of the neighborhood. I voluntarily went to summer school in order to graduate early, studied for my SAT's and applied to colleges outside of New York City. I looked for grants and obtained a small one, took out a butt load of student loans and went away to college. I became a college graduate before I was legally able to drink an alcoholic beverage.

Police have and always will have a stronger presence in neighborhoods with high crime rates. South Queens in the 90's was a freaking war zone. I remember police choppers in the air every night in the summer with the search light on and what my naïve mom though were fireworks constantly going off. I used to get stopped by the cops all the time. Thinking back what did I expect? Young kid in a nice car, limo tints all around where you couldn't see inside, expensive rims and a sound system you could hear 5 blocks away.

What I remember more than anything was my so called friends constantly making fun of me by going the "nerd" route and becoming a "sell out!" Once I left I left. I don't keep in touch with any of the people I grew up with unless Facebook counts. I saw a problem, thought of a solution and went about my business. It's the opportunity everyone has but the problem in this day and age is more people are prone to the "Poor me" mentality than actually doing something to change their situations for the better.

We live in the day and age of entitlement. People want things handed to them but won't work their ass off to get what they want. I am the only college graduate EVER in my family but I won't be the last. I could have easily said "Well, I live in the hood so I might as well sell drugs and impregnate 5 chicks, become a deadbeat and bitch about police messing with me" or go the route that I did.

The truth of the matter, in my opinion, is that we as a society have been brainwashed to accept that there is more than one "race" You're White, Black, Hispanic, Asian, pacific islander, etc. but in reality we all belong to one race.....THE HUMAN RACE!

I never said there wasn't a problem. What I will say is that the "problem" is not as big as the media would like you to think it is. If you live in a high crime area police are going to do what police do.....try to get the problem off the street and into the clink.

Respect....
I want to say same about one race but was hoping anyone who racists see as black man will come forward.
And you did... It is much more powerful on this board and I hope will make many think about it.
Anyone who see people as something else but humans for good or bad reason are racist.
The society have good intentions to help people in need but unfortunately in US we are trying to distribute this help by racial framework.
This is where the root of evil is and change badly needed.

DrAlphaeus wrote:

I have been in jail twice but never in prison. Is should not be taken as a racist statement to point out the factual reality that there has been a much higher propensity of blacks to commit violent crimes than whites or any group which is the bulk of prison sentences and that account for at least some of the observed racial disparities in prison populations.

There is big difference between using the word "propensity" and "percentage".

I have no argument with the higher percentages cited as reality. Even as holfresh pointed out, there are systematic reasons why even this data can be questioned. I just question whether it is fair this data is interpreted as a "propensity of blacks".

The definition of propensity is "an inclination or natural tendency to behave in a particular way". This word choice signifies criminal stereotypes of African-Americans to me.

I've tried to provide some context around this in my posts to try to get folks to see it from my side as a black man who has never spent a day in jail or prison. I know about individual responsibility and I'm not in a minority — or part of some elite talented tenth — but part of a not-so-silent majority of black people. Every "comply with the cops" message from parents to children is a cold lesson in personal responsibility and I personally headed my mother's lessons well.

What Bill Cosby said was only notable because of his fame and white folks aren't used to hearing these messages. But us black folks talk about this all the time. Obama says stuff like this all the time. I don't abide nonsense arguments like black folks have let Obama down because we didn't figure out how to inoculate our communities from devastating wealth loss in the Recession or overcome hundreds of years of history in 7. And by what criteria? Questionable percentage numbers and our current image in the media?

And I also fear misterearl's koans of outrage get interpreted as hate. Earl is also questioning assumptions and perceptions. "Outrage" and "hate" are also two different words.

Should have said "greater" propensity . Our President said out of whack. My bad . I didn't mean to imply innateness.

I tried also to add some context to the conversation. I have not yet read the book but I did read this paper on the book by James Forman Jr who is a Clinical Professor of Law at Yale Law School. https://www.law.yale.edu/james-forman-jr

http://www.nyulawreview.org/sites/default/files/pdf/NYULawReview-87-1-Forman_Jr.pdf

BRIGGS wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:Great job by Melo.

These athletes though need to pool money together and find ways to put some things in place to create and fund the needed change. My suggestion would be creating businesses like supermarkets, housing, medical practices, mechanics etc.. in highly populated urban areas. Use there fame and visibility to promote the support of these specific businesses from the population. With the purpose of doing so not to make certain people rich. But to use profits to reinvest in the community and develop and fund low cost or free (if possible) private schools and after school programs. Developing children from day care to 6th grade. The police force should be highly involved with the private schools to gain familiarity with the children and families. The hope would be the the children would become that when they reach middle school level there test scores would excel and force a raise in funding for public schools. If possible though to generate enough money where private schooling could be through high school level even better. Then the hope would be to generate more educated and college ready children who can become the leaders of urban communities like mayors and police commish, judges, governors etc.. among other things.

In America we have

A majority white police force
majority white judicial demographic
majority white government
majority white Tv and news networks
Basically all real decision makers, positions of power, are majority white

Can we really expect this layout to have the best interest of blacks in America who they don't relate to over favoring who they do relate to? The results are what they are. African American children being tried as adults more then any other race for the same crimes. The African American image and history inaccurately portrayed.

Sure with enough constant fighting and some band aids will be put in place. But the truth of the matter is African Americans need to use the freedom we do have to establish our own.

new york

74% of the entire population of the United States is white and its lower than it was. That means white people will have a dominant number or role in almost any category by sheer volume

In the last 20 years African Americans have held the ABSOLUTE highest job titles in the Unites States from President to Attorney General Joint Chief of Staff Secretary of State. The United States police force is made up of 13% African American (the same as the African American population) and 80% white police officers (slightly higher than the 73% population) There is thousands of African American police officers who hold high title in their respective jobs.

African Americans committed 52 percent of homicides between 1980 and 2008, despite composing just 13 percent of the population. Across the same timeframe, whites committed 45 percent of homicides while composing 77% of the population, according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics. Worse 93% of all African American deaths by homicide were committed by other African Americans

Cops killed nearly twice as many whites as blacks in 2015. According to data compiled by The Washington Post, 50 percent of the victims of fatal police shootings were white, while 26 percent were black. If you look at the overall crime rate the amount of white deaths by police exponentially higher.

Do African Americans think that white people are happy when pulled over by a police officer? That they dont fear some kind of strange repercussion? Its scary to be pulled over at any time for any reason.

I was watching TV last night and I saw something that prompted me to post this. I saw a young African American woman stating that this was today's modern day lynching by white people. That was awful on so many fronts. First ordinary white citizens had no role killing anyone. Its a disgrace and embarrassment to compare what happened to African Americans 60-70+ years ago who WERE at their time so wrongfully treated. You can live anywhere you want go anywhere you want and do anything you want as an African American today without fear of any harm. You can be want you want to be in the United States--nothing holds you back. Can a white person walk through a minority housing project without the same fear?

I think some common sense needs to be applied. Police officers hold a very high stress job that puts their life in danger on a daily basis. Their internal fear will be locked on to those who they will most likely have to deal with. Your sense and actions go on fight or flight. I would say African Americans could really help themselves by taking more responsibility for their actions on whole. If you are disproportionately committing crime common sense is that police will be on a higher guard against you as a whole. And at the end of the day there are going to be a small % of some not so nice police but I dont think thats the major problem.

An overwhelming majority of white people dont sit around the table thinking or talking in any derogatory way towards the African American race. The majority of people that I have been associated whether my family my friends my co workers from the past dont talk or think anything like that. The people I know know are kind and caring and would wish harm on no one. I have not been sheltered from African Americans in my life---I grew up next door to really great people who happened to be African American who I have enjoyed relations with for my 47 years of life on this Earth. Did I see some other white people saying some and doing derogatory things towards them growing up---YES but the majority not only did not but would always have their backs.

In conclusion--there will be some racism on this Earth and those who are willing to be part of that--thats on them--that doesnt represent anywhere near the majority--I can accept that. Unfortunately any race is subject to an encounter to a person with a gun who has authority to potentially use it--we can hope that we can figure out to continue how to minimize that as a whole. The one thing that African American can do as a whole is to help their communities out by not committing violent crime on each other. The high crime rate--the VIOLENT crime rate is the conduit to problems with police--not an ideology.

I already knew that there was a majority white population and that there are blacks who are in position of power. The question was though if blacks could actually depend on a layout which positions of power are all majority white and expect to have there best interest? For example more blacks are going to run into white officers and white judges then they will Obama.

Tamir Rice wasn't shot because of black on black crime. Tamir Rice was shot because of failure to follow proper protocol probably due to racism. Trayvon Martin wasn't killed because of black on black crime. Trayvon Martin was killed due to racism. Alton Sterling wasn't killed due to black on black crime. Sterling was killed due to failure to follow proper protocol possibly due to racism. Philando Castile wasn't killed due to black on black crime. He was killed due to failure to follow proper protocol possibly due to racism. Eric Gardner, Sandra Bland etc etc etc etc etc.

Speaking on black on black crime in order to deflect attention away from holding failure to follow proper protocol accountable seems to be the common theme.

Black on black crime is mostly fueled by drugs, with gangs and guns used to protect drug territory. Just like the majority of white on white crime. Drugs will always have high demand in low poverty areas making high amounts of supply and demand.

We have progressed past a lot of the things you have spoken on already.

misterearl wrote:BS

mekoanyk - Higher propensity?

I have been in jail twice but never in prison. Is should not be taken as a racist statement to point out the factual reality that there has been a much higher propensity of blacks to commit violent crimes than whites or any group which is the bulk of prison sentences and that account for at least some of the observed racial disparities in prison populations.

Care to cite facts?

Higher "propensity" than the Charleston church butcher dylann roof, Aurora CO movie mass killer James E. Holmes, Oklahoma City bomber Timothy McVeigh, and Sandy Hook elementary school (ELEMENTARY SCHOOL) mass killer Adam Lanza?

Educating people is tiring.

Anecdotes don't override statistics.

nykshaknbake wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

arkrud wrote:

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

meloanyk wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

meloanyk wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

meloanyk wrote:

misterearl wrote:arkrud and gonygo - please stop with the stereotypical descriptions. Family is the most important thing to everyone.

Every single person.

When people refer to family structure, they are talking about the nuclear family, a couple and their dependent children, it is as a basic social unit. It takes two committed parents, working hard and sacrificing for their children with cultural norms establishing direction and guidance from birth. In all those other minorities mentioned, education is stressed and monitored. It is not a sterotype to say that there has been a degradation of nuclear familes in black communities where the out of wedlock birthrate among blacks is 72% resulting in a preponderance of single parent households with many reliance on welfare. Study after study show that people of all races with high rates of out of wedlock births suffer higher unemployment and higher crime rates and black author Tom Sowell has cited this in his studies as a prime driver for the disprpotinate crime rates and income levels of blacks. The cultural norm that accept bearing children without benefit of marriage-72%- and absent fathers is a major issue facing black America going forward and needs to recognized and addressed by the black community to change and escape a culture of poverty for so many

Cool, we'll just keep getting shot and suffer injustice until you feel like we've cleaned our act up enough for you to stop pertifogging the issue and actually giving a damn. Hope your age-old anecdotes about how we are the worst ethnic group gets you to sleep at night.

Childish response. I would not be surprised if I've volunteered more in poor black communities that you have, it's not to cleanse my soul but to simply help. Started in hs and the younger generation of family continues the tradition of volunteering to the less fortunate. Just last month my nephew collected alot of used lax equipment that is quite expensive to donate to Harlem Lacrosse in addition to teaching the sport. I cite a serious and pertinent issue backed by facts that undermine black communities and do so not to the exclusion or dismissal of other points. You should not limit the scope of contributing factors if you want to make true progress

Blakcs don't benifit from poor family structure, poor education, and division. So if these are the issues permitting blacks from advancing why do you believe that blacks choose to ignore these issues.

Your question gets to the crux of accountability. Do you think out of wedlock births is something within a person's control and can be reduced? Do you think it would be better for children to be raised in a nuclear family than by a single parent ?Do you think the learning environment can be improved by disciplining or removing unruly kids from the classroom ? Do you think that it is better to take a job that affords growth potential even if it may pay less than welfare?

The supposed lack of traditional family value structure... do you think that may be tied to the issue that 1/3 of black men under 40 serve time in prison... for crimes that white men do not go to prison for when they commit the same crime? Read the New Jim Crow. It talks very well about how the supposed lack of nuclear families is tied inextricably to the institutional racism that fills up our for profit prisons. Seriously, read it. It addresses exactly what you are talking about, but deals with facts.

Also, this - every time a cop shoots first and kills a black man for no reason, guess what? That's another nuclear family down the drain.

If I could pick one thing that is biggest of the core issues its the bold. Its why I am so disgusted with our drug laws. There is no more racial and economic bias set of laws. Whites go to rehab and come out with praise. Minorities and poor go to jail and come out felons. Best part, is that now you can shoot em. White cop shoots colored man (turns out he was felon). See how that works?

When the playing field is even remotely level looking at family structure is a nice new set of data. There are such bigger obstacles that at this point we dont even know if thats an obstacle.

Great point Fish....most black inmates come home in worse shape than when they went in...i see it first hand.

Classic chicken and egg problem.
Blacks commit crime because they were put in prison and they were put in prison because they committed crime.
To get out of this logical dilemma the argument is that for the same crime blacks go to jail and whites go home or to rehab.
If this is correct Unites States are without the shadow of the doubt a racist state and instead on traffic stops? Mind-bugging...
Why our bellowed president, good friends of African Americans from democratic party, and even most of the people who claim to be activist for racial equality are not talking about this practice and not doing anything to stop it and focus instead on traffic stops? Mind-bugging...

Blacks do not commit more crime then whites. We are more likely to be arrested for the same crime. More likely to be convicted and more likely to be incarcerated for the same crime though.

The stats seem to say they do.

http://www.martyduren.com/2015/05/12/who-commits-more-crime-whites-or-blacks/

Limitations of the reporting
It really isn’t possible to determine who commits the most crime from the FBI stats, only who is arrested for suspicion of committing a crime. This is a huge problem. People look at the raw numbers and conclude White do X, or Blacks to Y, or Blacks murder more, and the like.

But, the FBI database only shows us the rate of arrest among the various races in the US.

Consider the following:

The FBI tracks crime in 30 categories (plus/minus) ranging from murder to drug abuse to prostitution to offenses against the family and children to rape to vandalism and suspicion. (Suspicion of what isn’t clear.)

The total number of arrests in the US in 2013 (the last year tabulated) was 9,014,635, of which 6,214,197 were Whites (which includes Hispanics), 2,549,655 were Blacks and African Americans, while American Indian/Alaska Natives, Asians and Hawaiian or Other Pacific Islanders account for the rest (just under 3% of all arrests).

The percentage of all arrests for the same year was 68.9% Whites and 28.3% Black or African American. The percentage of the US population for 2013 was broken down as follows: 316,497,531 total, with 77.7% of those being White, and 13.2% being Black.

In the 2013 FBI statistics on arrest by race, we find two categories where Black are arrested more often than Whites: Murder and non negligent manslaughter, and robbery.

That’s it. In every other category including rape, aggravated assault, burglary, larceny/theft, motor vehicle theft, arson, violent and property crime, forgery, fraud, etc, more Whites are arrested. In some categories like sex offenses, DUIs, liquor law violations and drunkenness Whites are arrested at a greater rate than our percentage of the population.

This is where the misinformation happens. Some people see these numbers and say, “Look! Blacks commit more crime that Whites!” Or, in some cases, “Blacks commit a higher percentage of the crimes compared to the population as a whole!” Neither of these are necessarily true because the stats are for arrests not convictions! All we can say for sure from these stats is that Blacks are arrested at a higher rate, not overall, but as a percentage of the population.

CashMoney wrote:

holfresh wrote:

CashMoney wrote:

holfresh wrote:

arkrud wrote:

misterearl wrote:FACTORIAL

The disparities appear to be even starker for unarmed suspects, according to an analysis of 2015 police killings by the Guardian. Racial minorities made up about 37.4 percent of the general population in the US and 46.6 percent of armed and unarmed victims, but they made up 62.7 percent of unarmed people killed by police.

More than half of murders, rapes, robberies, aggravated assaults, burglaries, and fraud in US are committed by black Americans.
African Americans represent 13% of population.
http://civilrightsmovement.net/us-crime-statistics-by-race/
I know that there are unfortunate historical reasons for this.
But it clearly explains why law enforcement is getting into conflict and killing black people more that anybody else.

I had to come out of retirement for this one...Maybe you and CashMoney, who claims he works in the Criminal Justice system but goes to a Financial website to get stats on Crime, need a few pointers on where to find stats to support your arguments...

According to the FBI, the people who are responsible for gathering these stats, as of 2014:

1. Whites in America commits 69.4% of all crime versus 27.8% by blacks
2. Whites in America commits 59.4% of all violent crimes versus 37.7% by blacks..Cash Money had non-whites including blacks committing 90% of all violent crimes...

According to a study by the Washington Post, Unarmed blacks are 7 times as likely to killed by police than unarmed whites...SEVEN TIMES!!!!

In 2015, The Post documented 990 fatal shootings by police, 93 of which involved people who were unarmed. Black men accounted for about 40 percent of the unarmed people fatally shot by police and, when adjusted by population, were seven times as likely as unarmed white men to die from police gunfire, The Post found.

https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2014/crime-in-the-u.s.-2014/tables/table-43
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/study-finds-police-fatally-shoot-unarmed-black-men-at-disproportionate-rates/2016/04/06/e494563e-fa74-11e5-80e4-c381214de1a3_story.html

What does a financial website have to do with anything? Reporting is reporting. I do indeed work in the Criminal Justice system. I can give you my shield number and command if you like, just send me a message.

I'll appease you so here you go..... http://newobserveronline.com/90-nonwhite-violent-crime-rate-fbi/

The bottom line is that we can all go back and forth on crime stats and BS from here to the end of time but things won't change until we can all look at each other and simply refer to each other as people!

Whenever you watch the news it's never "Police killed a man today" it's "Police killed a black man today."

So called movements like "Black Lives Matter" do nothing than add fuel to the fire. "Black Lives Matter" only when the person doing the killing is a white police officer and the person being killed is black. The fact is 90% of black people are killed by other black people! Where in the hell is Black Lives Matter on this issue? Why not start an organization called White Lives Matter and concentrate on black people who kill white people? That would be considered racist wouldn't it? Would this do nothing more than create a larger gap in the racial divide? Ignoring the fact that over 80% of whites are killed other whites would be a moot point wouldn't it? It would be simply labeled a racist movement by white people wouldn't it?

None of this crap stops until we as people stand up and say enough is enough. Not black people, Hispanic people, white people, etc. Just we as people, regardless of race, religion or creed.

I highly doubt that I will see this day nor do I feel my child will see this day but I do believe this day will come. I judge people based on who they are as people not by the color of their skin. I teach my child to do the same. I hope that there are others out there like me who call BS, BS who will teach their children the same until the day comes when a spade is able to be called a spade. Only when people who are held in high regard in their communities preach this nothing will change and it will continue to be "us" vs "them."

As the late and great MLK once said......

"When we let freedom ring, when we let it ring from every village and every hamlet, from every state and every city, we will be able to speed up that day when all of God's children, black men and white men, Jews and Gentiles, Protestants and Catholics, will be able to join hands and sing in the words of the old Negro spiritual, "Free at last! free at last! thank God Almighty, we are free at last!"

LET'S GO KNICKS!!!!!!!!!!

It's interesting that the stats I presented is completely opposite to the stats you initially recorded, and now, after posting the same stats I have posted, you some how you draw the same conclusion as before...

Just to answer a few questions you have posted...There are many other community organizations that protest black on black crimes. These protest don't get covered by the press...I personally remember many walks across the Brooklyn Bridge regarding black on black crime..Spike Lee always talks about black on black crime. Press don't cover it...Black lives matter have more traction...But now you want Black Lives Matters to be the black umbrella organization??..In my opinion, the reason you don't see an animated protest against black on black crimes is because when the police capture the assailant, they are often prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law...When a police officer kills a black man, there are often no repercussions...It's a freebee...The criminal justice system protects the police in those instances. So they don't have to practice restraint...Prosecute those officers who commit murder and you won't see protest...But what really gets me is that there are those who are pissed at the community(blacks and whites) protesting being killed by the police at an appalling rate and you are supposed to accept it as the way it is...Insanity...

All groups kill individuals in the community where they live in...90% of black murders are by blacks just like 84% of all white murders are by whites...

Philando Castile, who was killed by the police in Minnesota, was pulled over 52 times since 2002...Half o the charges against him were thrown out in court..

I wanted to expand the response to your post more but I don't have time, just answer me one question...

I was in middle school in Brooklyn, walking home on a half day of school, when I had my first experience with a police officer reaching for his firearm, who told me to stop and don't move...When was the first time a police officer pull a gun on you??..I remember living in Brooklyn and there was a robbery called in at the train station closest to my house..A black plain cloths officer ran to the scene of the crime with his badge around his neck. He was shot by white plain cloths officer...Keep thinking there isn't a problem..

Acknowledging black on black crime is nothing new...

I was 15 when a police officer pulled a gun on me. I was doing the same dumb crap I had being doing up until that point. Hanging out with drug dealers and known criminals always wondering "Why do the cops keep messing with us?" The answer became apparently clear which is why after that event I decided to make changes in my life. I stopped hanging out with "those people" and decided to concentrate on school and getting out of the neighborhood. I voluntarily went to summer school in order to graduate early, studied for my SAT's and applied to colleges outside of New York City. I looked for grants and obtained a small one, took out a butt load of student loans and went away to college. I became a college graduate before I was legally able to drink an alcoholic beverage.

Police have and always will have a stronger presence in neighborhoods with high crime rates. South Queens in the 90's was a freaking war zone. I remember police choppers in the air every night in the summer with the search light on and what my naïve mom though were fireworks constantly going off. I used to get stopped by the cops all the time. Thinking back what did I expect? Young kid in a nice car, limo tints all around where you couldn't see inside, expensive rims and a sound system you could hear 5 blocks away.

What I remember more than anything was my so called friends constantly making fun of me by going the "nerd" route and becoming a "sell out!" Once I left I left. I don't keep in touch with any of the people I grew up with unless Facebook counts. I saw a problem, thought of a solution and went about my business. It's the opportunity everyone has but the problem in this day and age is more people are prone to the "Poor me" mentality than actually doing something to change their situations for the better.

We live in the day and age of entitlement. People want things handed to them but won't work their ass off to get what they want. I am the only college graduate EVER in my family but I won't be the last. I could have easily said "Well, I live in the hood so I might as well sell drugs and impregnate 5 chicks, become a deadbeat and bitch about police messing with me" or go the route that I did.

The truth of the matter, in my opinion, is that we as a society have been brainwashed to accept that there is more than one "race" You're White, Black, Hispanic, Asian, pacific islander, etc. but in reality we all belong to one race.....THE HUMAN RACE!

I never said there wasn't a problem. What I will say is that the "problem" is not as big as the media would like you to think it is. If you live in a high crime area police are going to do what police do.....try to get the problem off the street and into the clink.

I respect the choices you made especially given your environment. (Not saying you are but many do) All races go through these issues and shouldn't be tied to blacks. There are plenty of whites in trailer parks that go through these same issues. This environment will have more negative outcomes then positive unfortunately though because at the end of the day we are still human. Also If you notice there is no outrage over drug raids that result in the death of criminals while in shootouts with the police. Or police killing a black man as he attempts to kill another man/woman. There is no way of quantifying how many blacks do nothing and strictly look to blame the white man vs people who are actually in the day to day struggle trying to do the right thing. Blacks use and sell drugs at the same rate as whites.

newyorknewyork wrote:

nykshaknbake wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

nykshaknbake wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

arkrud wrote:

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

meloanyk wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

meloanyk wrote:

DrAlphaeus wrote:

meloanyk wrote:

misterearl wrote:arkrud and gonygo - please stop with the stereotypical descriptions. Family is the most important thing to everyone.

Every single person.

When people refer to family structure, they are talking about the nuclear family, a couple and their dependent children, it is as a basic social unit. It takes two committed parents, working hard and sacrificing for their children with cultural norms establishing direction and guidance from birth. In all those other minorities mentioned, education is stressed and monitored. It is not a sterotype to say that there has been a degradation of nuclear familes in black communities where the out of wedlock birthrate among blacks is 72% resulting in a preponderance of single parent households with many reliance on welfare. Study after study show that people of all races with high rates of out of wedlock births suffer higher unemployment and higher crime rates and black author Tom Sowell has cited this in his studies as a prime driver for the disprpotinate crime rates and income levels of blacks. The cultural norm that accept bearing children without benefit of marriage-72%- and absent fathers is a major issue facing black America going forward and needs to recognized and addressed by the black community to change and escape a culture of poverty for so many

Cool, we'll just keep getting shot and suffer injustice until you feel like we've cleaned our act up enough for you to stop pertifogging the issue and actually giving a damn. Hope your age-old anecdotes about how we are the worst ethnic group gets you to sleep at night.

Childish response. I would not be surprised if I've volunteered more in poor black communities that you have, it's not to cleanse my soul but to simply help. Started in hs and the younger generation of family continues the tradition of volunteering to the less fortunate. Just last month my nephew collected alot of used lax equipment that is quite expensive to donate to Harlem Lacrosse in addition to teaching the sport. I cite a serious and pertinent issue backed by facts that undermine black communities and do so not to the exclusion or dismissal of other points. You should not limit the scope of contributing factors if you want to make true progress

Blakcs don't benifit from poor family structure, poor education, and division. So if these are the issues permitting blacks from advancing why do you believe that blacks choose to ignore these issues.

Your question gets to the crux of accountability. Do you think out of wedlock births is something within a person's control and can be reduced? Do you think it would be better for children to be raised in a nuclear family than by a single parent ?Do you think the learning environment can be improved by disciplining or removing unruly kids from the classroom ? Do you think that it is better to take a job that affords growth potential even if it may pay less than welfare?

The supposed lack of traditional family value structure... do you think that may be tied to the issue that 1/3 of black men under 40 serve time in prison... for crimes that white men do not go to prison for when they commit the same crime? Read the New Jim Crow. It talks very well about how the supposed lack of nuclear families is tied inextricably to the institutional racism that fills up our for profit prisons. Seriously, read it. It addresses exactly what you are talking about, but deals with facts.

Also, this - every time a cop shoots first and kills a black man for no reason, guess what? That's another nuclear family down the drain.

If I could pick one thing that is biggest of the core issues its the bold. Its why I am so disgusted with our drug laws. There is no more racial and economic bias set of laws. Whites go to rehab and come out with praise. Minorities and poor go to jail and come out felons. Best part, is that now you can shoot em. White cop shoots colored man (turns out he was felon). See how that works?

When the playing field is even remotely level looking at family structure is a nice new set of data. There are such bigger obstacles that at this point we dont even know if thats an obstacle.

Great point Fish....most black inmates come home in worse shape than when they went in...i see it first hand.

Classic chicken and egg problem.
Blacks commit crime because they were put in prison and they were put in prison because they committed crime.
To get out of this logical dilemma the argument is that for the same crime blacks go to jail and whites go home or to rehab.
If this is correct Unites States are without the shadow of the doubt a racist state and instead on traffic stops? Mind-bugging...
Why our bellowed president, good friends of African Americans from democratic party, and even most of the people who claim to be activist for racial equality are not talking about this practice and not doing anything to stop it and focus instead on traffic stops? Mind-bugging...

Blacks do not commit more crime then whites. We are more likely to be arrested for the same crime. More likely to be convicted and more likely to be incarcerated for the same crime though.

The stats seem to say they do.

http://www.martyduren.com/2015/05/12/who-commits-more-crime-whites-or-blacks/

Limitations of the reporting
It really isn’t possible to determine who commits the most crime from the FBI stats, only who is arrested for suspicion of committing a crime. This is a huge problem. People look at the raw numbers and conclude White do X, or Blacks to Y, or Blacks murder more, and the like.

But, the FBI database only shows us the rate of arrest among the various races in the US.

Consider the following:

The FBI tracks crime in 30 categories (plus/minus) ranging from murder to drug abuse to prostitution to offenses against the family and children to rape to vandalism and suspicion. (Suspicion of what isn’t clear.)

The total number of arrests in the US in 2013 (the last year tabulated) was 9,014,635, of which 6,214,197 were Whites (which includes Hispanics), 2,549,655 were Blacks and African Americans, while American Indian/Alaska Natives, Asians and Hawaiian or Other Pacific Islanders account for the rest (just under 3% of all arrests).

The percentage of all arrests for the same year was 68.9% Whites and 28.3% Black or African American. The percentage of the US population for 2013 was broken down as follows: 316,497,531 total, with 77.7% of those being White, and 13.2% being Black.

In the 2013 FBI statistics on arrest by race, we find two categories where Black are arrested more often than Whites: Murder and non negligent manslaughter, and robbery.

That’s it. In every other category including rape, aggravated assault, burglary, larceny/theft, motor vehicle theft, arson, violent and property crime, forgery, fraud, etc, more Whites are arrested. In some categories like sex offenses, DUIs, liquor law violations and drunkenness Whites are arrested at a greater rate than our percentage of the population.

This is where the misinformation happens. Some people see these numbers and say, “Look! Blacks commit more crime that Whites!” Or, in some cases, “Blacks commit a higher percentage of the crimes compared to the population as a whole!” Neither of these are necessarily true because the stats are for arrests not convictions! All we can say for sure from these stats is that Blacks are arrested at a higher rate, not overall, but as a percentage of the population.

Why would you think arrest stats wouldn't tightly correlate conviction stats? The arrest stats as a percentage of the population are much higher than whites. So unless you are saying that somehow the conviction rates for black people arrested are much lower than whites you don't have a case there. If you are, it kinda blows the whole 'white privilege' thing out of the water too.

The incarceration rates for black males far exceed that of any other race.

Then you are making two almost contradictory claims. You are saying that the blacks don't commit more crimes despite the arrest data because the conviction rate is much, much lower than whites. Now you are saying they go to jail far more than whites.

arkrud wrote:

holfresh wrote:CashMoney...I'm trying to understand the narrative you are putting out there...You began this thread by saying "blacks and others" commit 90% of all crimes...Statistics show that blacks commit and are arrested for 28% of all crimes...Now you are saying that you made a decision to "get out" by working hard and going to college...That you didn't want to stay and sell drugs, and didn't want impregnate 5 women...The image you are trying to promote is that there aren't people in the black community, who aren't selling drugs, have a good family life and aren't decent hard working people...It's either college or the other...

What you are doing is feeding the stereotype of the black community that the ill informed already believe and subscribe to...It really isn't hard at all to refute any and everything you say..It's just a waste of time..

He was talking about his personal experience not about everybody's experience.
You imply that he was telling some fictional story?
We all know that majority of black people are not gangs or slackers and do not require any special treatment.
The main point was that we are all human being and all the rest is not important at all.

THANK YOU!

arkrud wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:According to some news outlets, the police were responding to a shooting in progress.

This one even worth man...
The dude who killed officers this time was black man former marine and affiliated with anti-government organization.
I kind of shaking my head...