knickscity wrote:Holfresh with Wade, the team wouldn't have needed a monster month from one player.

You'd have consistency throughout, and efficiency, and a naturally willing defender.

I'm glad Melo is here, but to say he's a better player than Wade is just so wrong.

That's not the point...Point is, do u think Wade can carry a team for a month in that manner surrounded by the same type of players??

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:Hotfresh,

Wade would have done squat with last years Knicks team. And, you swap out Melo for Lebron and he does not do much either.

That being said ... look at Wades efficiency numbers as he skies over PP, Melo and even Kobe.

Its no comparison IMHO

What Melo did last year cannot be overlooked...He needed to be the best player in basketball for a month and he was...Am I the only on that saw this???..Forget about Hollingers's crap...Do you think Wade could have carried the Knicks the way Melo did??

I think that Wade might not have needed to.

Melo was great in that stretch but you need to look at the season as a hole. Melo was pretty awful for most of it.

Come on, the dude was hurt, MDA was coaching...What are u talking about.???..Have u seen the Heat in the years without LeBron???..Average team like the Knicks were last year...But again, do you think Wade is capable of carrying a team in that manner for one month???

Yes. I do.

And, you can't give Melo a complete pass for last season and blame it on injury - its a cop out (to a certain extent) and disingenuous

ok...I just don't think Wade is that type of player...but what are u talking about the entire season..Do you think Wade's teams were doing that much better than the Knicks of last year???..Before Bron Wade's team have the same winning percentage if not less then last years Knicks...

Its too vague of a comparison.

I just think the Wade is in a different league. He is a far better passer and much more of an efficient - heady player.

I know you don't care about advanced stats but I do and have respect for them (not all, but many of them).

The only thing that Wade is not good at is 3 pt shooting but like Rondo, he is smart enough to restrain from doing it often. Just because a shot is open does not mean you have to take it.

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:Hotfresh,

Wade would have done squat with last years Knicks team. And, you swap out Melo for Lebron and he does not do much either.

That being said ... look at Wades efficiency numbers as he skies over PP, Melo and even Kobe.

Its no comparison IMHO

What Melo did last year cannot be overlooked...He needed to be the best player in basketball for a month and he was...Am I the only on that saw this???..Forget about Hollingers's crap...Do you think Wade could have carried the Knicks the way Melo did??

I think that Wade might not have needed to.

Melo was great in that stretch but you need to look at the season as a hole. Melo was pretty awful for most of it.

Come on, the dude was hurt, MDA was coaching...What are u talking about.???..Have u seen the Heat in the years without LeBron???..Average team like the Knicks were last year...But again, do you think Wade is capable of carrying a team in that manner for one month???

Yes. I do.

And, you can't give Melo a complete pass for last season and blame it on injury - its a cop out (to a certain extent) and disingenuous

ok...I just don't think Wade is that type of player...but what are u talking about the entire season..Do you think Wade's teams were doing that much better than the Knicks of last year???..Before Bron Wade's team have the same winning percentage if not less then last years Knicks...

Its too vague of a comparison.

I just think the Wade is in a different league. He is a far better passer and much more of an efficient - heady player.

I know you don't care about advanced stats but I do and have respect for them (not all, but many of them).

The only thing that Wade is not good at is 3 pt shooting but like Rondo, he is smart enough to restrain from doing it often. Just because a shot is open does not mean you have to take it.

Bro for all their careers, I had no doubts that Wade was a better player...After last year's run...I don't think Wade could have done that...No advance stats needed for my assessment...

Ok. Go with your gut - thats fine.

Can't argue with someones gut :-)

I myself can only dream for a player like Wade.

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:Holfresh with Wade, the team wouldn't have needed a monster month from one player.

You'd have consistency throughout, and efficiency, and a naturally willing defender.

I'm glad Melo is here, but to say he's a better player than Wade is just so wrong.

That's not the point...Point is, do u think Wade can carry a team for a month in that manner surrounded by the same type of players??

He's natural with the ball, unlike Melo, and he is efficient with it, unlike Melo.

That's the point.

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:Hotfresh,

Wade would have done squat with last years Knicks team. And, you swap out Melo for Lebron and he does not do much either.

That being said ... look at Wades efficiency numbers as he skies over PP, Melo and even Kobe.

Its no comparison IMHO

What Melo did last year cannot be overlooked...He needed to be the best player in basketball for a month and he was...Am I the only on that saw this???..Forget about Hollingers's crap...Do you think Wade could have carried the Knicks the way Melo did??

I think that Wade might not have needed to.

Melo was great in that stretch but you need to look at the season as a hole. Melo was pretty awful for most of it.

Come on, the dude was hurt, MDA was coaching...What are u talking about.???..Have u seen the Heat in the years without LeBron???..Average team like the Knicks were last year...But again, do you think Wade is capable of carrying a team in that manner for one month???

Yes. I do.

And, you can't give Melo a complete pass for last season and blame it on injury - its a cop out (to a certain extent) and disingenuous

ok...I just don't think Wade is that type of player...but what are u talking about the entire season..Do you think Wade's teams were doing that much better than the Knicks of last year???..Before Bron Wade's team have the same winning percentage if not less then last years Knicks...

Its too vague of a comparison.

I just think the Wade is in a different league. He is a far better passer and much more of an efficient - heady player.

I know you don't care about advanced stats but I do and have respect for them (not all, but many of them).

The only thing that Wade is not good at is 3 pt shooting but like Rondo, he is smart enough to restrain from doing it often. Just because a shot is open does not mean you have to take it.

Bro for all their careers, I had no doubts that Wade was a better player...After last year's run...I don't think Wade could have done that...No advance stats needed for my assessment...

Ok. Go with your gut - thats fine.

Can't argue with someones gut :-)

I myself can only dream for a player like Wade.

Don't get me wrong, Wade is no slough...I just don't think there are many NBA players can will a team like that...To me, Wade isn't the type of scorer to carry a team for a month like that while doing the other things...I have to see it...Over a 24 game period, Melo was the best player in the league...I'm not looking at how they got there...When he needed to be...Not at any random time in the season, but when he needed to be...I'm not sure if you are appreciating the gravity of moment..

Gravity?

If he carried us to a playoff win I would be more excited.

18-6 in the regular season is really nice. Not "giddy" nice.

Wade carried his team to a championship - he was a freak!

Of course he could not win it all without Shaq but he was stupid good.

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:Hotfresh,

Wade would have done squat with last years Knicks team. And, you swap out Melo for Lebron and he does not do much either.

That being said ... look at Wades efficiency numbers as he skies over PP, Melo and even Kobe.

Its no comparison IMHO

What Melo did last year cannot be overlooked...He needed to be the best player in basketball for a month and he was...Am I the only on that saw this???..Forget about Hollingers's crap...Do you think Wade could have carried the Knicks the way Melo did??

I think that Wade might not have needed to.

Melo was great in that stretch but you need to look at the season as a hole. Melo was pretty awful for most of it.

Come on, the dude was hurt, MDA was coaching...What are u talking about.???..Have u seen the Heat in the years without LeBron???..Average team like the Knicks were last year...But again, do you think Wade is capable of carrying a team in that manner for one month???

Yes. I do.

And, you can't give Melo a complete pass for last season and blame it on injury - its a cop out (to a certain extent) and disingenuous

ok...I just don't think Wade is that type of player...but what are u talking about the entire season..Do you think Wade's teams were doing that much better than the Knicks of last year???..Before Bron Wade's team have the same winning percentage if not less then last years Knicks...

Its too vague of a comparison.

I just think the Wade is in a different league. He is a far better passer and much more of an efficient - heady player.

I know you don't care about advanced stats but I do and have respect for them (not all, but many of them).

The only thing that Wade is not good at is 3 pt shooting but like Rondo, he is smart enough to restrain from doing it often. Just because a shot is open does not mean you have to take it.

Bro for all their careers, I had no doubts that Wade was a better player...After last year's run...I don't think Wade could have done that...No advance stats needed for my assessment...

Ok. Go with your gut - thats fine.

Can't argue with someones gut :-)

I myself can only dream for a player like Wade.

Don't get me wrong, Wade is no slough...I just don't think there are many NBA players can will a team like that...To me, Wade isn't the type of scorer to carry a team for a month like that while doing the other things...I have to see it...Over a 24 game period, Melo was the best player in the league...I'm not looking at how they got there...When he needed to be...Not at any random time in the season, but when he needed to be...I'm not sure if you are appreciating the gravity of moment..

Gravity?

If he carried us to a playoff win I would be more excited.

18-6 in the regular season is really nice. Not "giddy" nice.

Wade carried his team to a championship - he was a freak!

Of course he could not win it all without Shaq but he was stupid good.

What was his teams like without Shaq and Lebron???..A lot like last year's Knicks....

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

holfresh wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:Hotfresh,

Wade would have done squat with last years Knicks team. And, you swap out Melo for Lebron and he does not do much either.

That being said ... look at Wades efficiency numbers as he skies over PP, Melo and even Kobe.

Its no comparison IMHO

What Melo did last year cannot be overlooked...He needed to be the best player in basketball for a month and he was...Am I the only on that saw this???..Forget about Hollingers's crap...Do you think Wade could have carried the Knicks the way Melo did??

I think that Wade might not have needed to.

Melo was great in that stretch but you need to look at the season as a hole. Melo was pretty awful for most of it.

Come on, the dude was hurt, MDA was coaching...What are u talking about.???..Have u seen the Heat in the years without LeBron???..Average team like the Knicks were last year...But again, do you think Wade is capable of carrying a team in that manner for one month???

Yes. I do.

And, you can't give Melo a complete pass for last season and blame it on injury - its a cop out (to a certain extent) and disingenuous

ok...I just don't think Wade is that type of player...but what are u talking about the entire season..Do you think Wade's teams were doing that much better than the Knicks of last year???..Before Bron Wade's team have the same winning percentage if not less then last years Knicks...

Its too vague of a comparison.

I just think the Wade is in a different league. He is a far better passer and much more of an efficient - heady player.

I know you don't care about advanced stats but I do and have respect for them (not all, but many of them).

The only thing that Wade is not good at is 3 pt shooting but like Rondo, he is smart enough to restrain from doing it often. Just because a shot is open does not mean you have to take it.

Bro for all their careers, I had no doubts that Wade was a better player...After last year's run...I don't think Wade could have done that...No advance stats needed for my assessment...

Ok. Go with your gut - thats fine.

Can't argue with someones gut :-)

I myself can only dream for a player like Wade.

Don't get me wrong, Wade is no slough...I just don't think there are many NBA players can will a team like that...To me, Wade isn't the type of scorer to carry a team for a month like that while doing the other things...I have to see it...Over a 24 game period, Melo was the best player in the league...I'm not looking at how they got there...When he needed to be...Not at any random time in the season, but when he needed to be...I'm not sure if you are appreciating the gravity of moment..

Gravity?

If he carried us to a playoff win I would be more excited.

18-6 in the regular season is really nice. Not "giddy" nice.

Wade carried his team to a championship - he was a freak!

Of course he could not win it all without Shaq but he was stupid good.

What was his teams like without Shaq and Lebron???..A lot like last year's Knicks....

Not arguing that.

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:Holfresh with Wade, the team wouldn't have needed a monster month from one player.

You'd have consistency throughout, and efficiency, and a naturally willing defender.

I'm glad Melo is here, but to say he's a better player than Wade is just so wrong.

That's not the point...Point is, do u think Wade can carry a team for a month in that manner surrounded by the same type of players??

With Wade, you wouldn't need that month performance, and the team would have won more of those games they had lost.

He's natural with the ball, unlike Melo, and he is efficient with it, unlike Melo.

That's the point.

No, that's your point...

My point is you're putting too much stock into one month.

With Wade, that month isn't necessary.

Personally I don't care for that month, I like Melo but he played like ass for pretty much the whole year.

Look at his career without big guns next to him...Look at his records...

Who's records?

Both guys made the playoffs when they played.

Wade got further as a rookie though, and he absolutely took over the finals in his first ring.

Since you won't look...Wade's teams without Shaq and Bron were essentially .500 winning percentage teams...44/45 win teams...I don't think Wade can score consistently enough over a month and carry a team like Melo did...But yeah he won two rings...Must be nice to have the world's best players at your side...

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:

holfresh wrote:

knickscity wrote:Holfresh with Wade, the team wouldn't have needed a monster month from one player.

You'd have consistency throughout, and efficiency, and a naturally willing defender.

I'm glad Melo is here, but to say he's a better player than Wade is just so wrong.

That's not the point...Point is, do u think Wade can carry a team for a month in that manner surrounded by the same type of players??

With Wade, you wouldn't need that month performance, and the team would have won more of those games they had lost.

He's natural with the ball, unlike Melo, and he is efficient with it, unlike Melo.

That's the point.

No, that's your point...

My point is you're putting too much stock into one month.

With Wade, that month isn't necessary.

Personally I don't care for that month, I like Melo but he played like ass for pretty much the whole year.

Look at his career without big guns next to him...Look at his records...

Who's records?

Both guys made the playoffs when they played.

Wade got further as a rookie though, and he absolutely took over the finals in his first ring.

Since you won't look...Wade's teams without Shaq and Bron were essentially .500 winning percentage teams...44/45 win teams...I don't think Wade can score consistently enough over a month and carry a team like Melo did...But yeah he won two rings...Must be nice to have the world's best players at your side...

How do you explain the second round as a rookie?

They beat New Orleans 4-3...New Orleans...

Bonn1997 wrote:

CashMoney wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

CashMoney wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

CashMoney wrote:We're 7-1 and need to point to Melo's TS%?

Give me Harden's TS% at the end of this season as top dog and then let's talk about it.

The team is doing great. I never said otherwise. You can start a positive comments only thread if you think there aren't enough of them. I'd gladly contribute to such a thread because the team is doing many things very well.

Not the point. Comparing Harden and Melo is ludicrous.

I disagree but I'm not the one who brought up the comparison anyway.

Considering that Harden is starting for the 1st time in his career and is now the lead dog on his team I'll disagree with you. Besides, what would Melo's TS% be with all those open looks created by Durant and Westbrook be?

TS% is remarkably stable regardless of who you're teammates are. Durant's not known for elevating the play of his teammates anyway. You're talking about a guy who has the ball in his hands all the time but averages only 2.9 assists a game.

You put way too much weight on TS%.

CashMoney wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

knickscity wrote:

3G4G wrote:

knickscity wrote:

3G4G wrote:Well thank goodness the Pacers were so bad today especially Hibbert but Melo taking 22FGA to score 26pts with 0ast will not prove beneficial in the long run if he duplicates this kind of output. He needs to learn to become a more efficient player.

Stats really don't tell the full story.

It was a few plays where he passed out but that particular player whipped the ball to a better shot.

Plus, a few of his attempt he was fouled on but no call but he was able to stay with the ball to eventually make a score with it.

He's averaging 1.7ast on the season with 0 today....if this continues I can't see how it will prove to be a positive for us

It's the pass that leads to another pass to a good shot.

He doesn't get the statistical credit for that, but alot of that is going on.

Here's an interesting stat to put assists into perspective...

The Knicks are 27th in the league in team assists, yet are first in not turning the ball over at 10, and the next team is at 13.

You know what that tells me......

They are sharing the ball until someone h
as a great chance to make their move.

Low assists but high PPG tells me something very different - they're getting a lot of their points from one-on-one play rather than passing.

Kidd passes the ball to Felton who passes the ball to a wide open JR. JR pump fakes, takes 4 dribbles to get a better and closer shot and drains the basket. Great possession but no assist on the play. See what I'm getting at?