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Gambling on unproven big men
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rvhoss
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3/9/2005  11:08 PM
i loved camby. You watching the spurs?
all kool aid all the time.
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BRIGGS
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3/10/2005  12:26 AM
Curry is the best of that bunch. While there is some issues with rebounding at times, perhaps intensity--he is a consistent 20 point scorer who shoots well over 50% and hes only 22.

Tonight for example 25 pts 8 reb

he is the only consisntent player out of the bunch because you can count on him for 20 points, unlike the others. I think some of you guys dsicount this guy, but remember he is an athletic 6-11 285 pd C with skills. If used correctly, he as close to shaq as you are going to get. hes not the rbeounder or SB like that, but he cAN score 25 points a night shooting 52-55% IMHO. that trumps anyone else on the list
RIP Crushalot😞
gunsnewing
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3/10/2005  12:32 AM
you can count on 17pts 9rebs & 2blks from Nene when Camby goes down and he starts. just look at the stretch he had when Camby was down.

curry scores but no defense, blksir rebounding. But yeah I'd still put curry 2nd behind Nene

[Edited by - gunsnewing on 03/10/2005 00:34:05]
MS
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3/10/2005  8:10 AM
I think our best bet is to go after Chris Wilcox, size is not an issue here its all about the best fit for the team:

Curry: doesn't take pride in his game is a below average defender, and he can't rebound, so why add another player that is typical Isiah mode

Chandler: He can't score and has no outside game, and is often injured so taking a chance on him is not a smart decision

Brown: Is not going anywhere Grunfeld is too smart and is not letting the knicks rob his bank, The team is in a great position and an improving brown next to their big three is essential

Nene: He is strong and can rebound and finish around the basket and isn't as high profile which is a nice plus....

My Winner: Wilcox

He is the best fit for this team, he won't get in the way of the offense runs the floor can block shots, and is one of the best leapers in the NBA, his size is not an issue the Clipper were playing great at center.....Why he is so valuable is he has Amare type finishing ability around the rim, with Crawford and Marbury breaking down the defense he is perfect....Not to mention Ariza finds the open man.....

Marbury 18-22pts 11as
Craw 16-19 6ass
Wilcox 15-18pts 8rbs 2-3blks
Bonn1997
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3/10/2005  8:20 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:

Curry is the best of that bunch. While there is some issues with rebounding at times, perhaps intensity--he is a consistent 20 point scorer who shoots well over 50% and hes only 22.

Tonight for example 25 pts 8 reb

he is the only consisntent player out of the bunch because you can count on him for 20 points, unlike the others. I think some of you guys dsicount this guy, but remember he is an athletic 6-11 285 pd C with skills. If used correctly, he as close to shaq as you are going to get. hes not the rbeounder or SB like that, but he cAN score 25 points a night shooting 52-55% IMHO. that trumps anyone else on the list
How is Curry a consistent 20 point scorer? He's averaging 15.5 this year and 11.6 for his career! Also, if a player scores *a few* more points but gives up *many* more points, it outweighs his scoring. I wouldn't mind gambling on Curry, but I'd go after a more well-rounded passionate player first like Nene. He's played well when given minutes but he's burried behind K-Mart and Camby.
diderotn
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3/10/2005  8:25 AM
How do you figure that size is not an issue???? Do you realize that we are one of the smallest team in an eastern conference that has gotten considerably big, especially with Shaq, Z, Sheed, and others??????

Posted by MS:

I think our best bet is to go after Chris Wilcox, size is not an issue here its all about the best fit for the team:

Curry: doesn't take pride in his game is a below average defender, and he can't rebound, so why add another player that is typical Isiah mode

Chandler: He can't score and has no outside game, and is often injured so taking a chance on him is not a smart decision

Brown: Is not going anywhere Grunfeld is too smart and is not letting the knicks rob his bank, The team is in a great position and an improving brown next to their big three is essential

Nene: He is strong and can rebound and finish around the basket and isn't as high profile which is a nice plus....

My Winner: Wilcox

He is the best fit for this team, he won't get in the way of the offense runs the floor can block shots, and is one of the best leapers in the NBA, his size is not an issue the Clipper were playing great at center.....Why he is so valuable is he has Amare type finishing ability around the rim, with Crawford and Marbury breaking down the defense he is perfect....Not to mention Ariza finds the open man.....

Marbury 18-22pts 11as
Craw 16-19 6ass
Wilcox 15-18pts 8rbs 2-3blks
The true Knickabocker..........
MS
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3/10/2005  8:39 AM
Wilcox is 6'10, I believe that Sheed is 6'10, if you are basing your argument around something so meaningless, how tall is Ben Wallace, around 6'7-8, so frankly if you have an athlete that plays well around the basket and is a couple inches shy of seven it doesn't matter....

And Z is not effective inside, and doesn't muscle players in the paint, he is a jump shooter that gets his points because big men won't step out.....
MS
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3/10/2005  8:45 AM
When he was playing 30 min a game the first month of the season at center he was averaging 14 and 7 you post that to 38 he is up around 16 and 8....

If they can make a trade, perhaps ariza, or sign him to deal at 6 for the mid-level......

If you can pull off a sign and trade....and draft warrick and sign pietrus you are in serious business......and you have rebuilt your team.....I would even give them Crawford if we had to, you need to free up space

Marbury
Crawford/Pietrus
TT/Warrick
Sweetney/Rose
Thomas/Wilcox

That is why getting Mo Taylor was such a bad decision
Knixkik
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3/10/2005  8:45 AM
I think Curry is our best option at this point. He's a true center, has a solid post game, and already one of the top 10 centers in the league averaging more than 15 points per game. I think he is very well capable of averaging 20 points and 8 rebounds per game down the road and can be taught good defensive techniques from our coaching staff. He could be one of the top 5 centers in the league by next year if he continues to develop the right way. Although he's not a great post defender or shotblocker, he can be taught to be solid in those aspects, and as long as we have good post defenders at PF and off the bench we should be fine.
diderotn
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3/10/2005  8:59 AM
I am so sick and tired of the way some Knicks fans think...The center position needs to be our toughest area. With the scorers that we have around, we only need a shot blocker a la Ratlif to turn this Knicks team into a real contender....that is why Isiah was crazy about Dampier....Why in the world would he want to bring in another 6'9" player to the Knicks???????
The true Knickabocker..........
MS
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3/10/2005  9:08 AM
Number one he is 6'10, number two he can block shots, Ratliff and Dampier are not good centers, you are the reason teams end in cap hell

Dampier sucks and doesn;t try Isiah was going to give him 70 million dollars, Ratliff is always injured and isn't a scorer, all he does is block shots....

Isiah had to go and be stupid and make two dumb ****ing trades, instead of waiting....I would have loved to get Birdman as the back up center last year because he runs, brings energy and blocks shots....

Your a genius Eddie Curry lives in Chicago, so you think he would want to get paid and stay there for life, but he doesn;t care just the type of attitude that fits perfectly with the losers we have on this team......and don't give me we are playing well we have the same record as the Raptors!
gunsnewing
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3/10/2005  9:08 AM
thats why Nene is the best!
diderotn
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3/10/2005  9:13 AM
Nene is definitely my #1 choice, after comes Chandler. The rest in my opinion, is garbage...No to Kwame, I would much rather go for Haywood....



Posted by gunsnewing:

thats why Nene is the best!
The true Knickabocker..........
Kwazimodal
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3/10/2005  9:17 AM
MS makes a good point about sub 7fters making an impact in the paint.Correct me if im wrong but didnt Larry Johnson do some time briefly at the 5? No I dont want a 6'4 center but sometimes fans pay more attention to height than skills."You cant teach height" adage doesnt mean as much in the NBA as it used to.
diderotn
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3/10/2005  9:25 AM
Look here, Larry Johnson was not labelled Grand Mama for no reason...That boy was a star thoughout his career, he could do almost everyting on the court when he was healthy....I don't mind a 6'9" Center, but whoever that is has to have the abilities of Ben Walace...The closest to Ben Walace I see at Center is my man Etan Thomas...He is fearless, and most of all can flat out play...if Wilcox was that good, he would have gotten a lot more playing time with the Clippers....However, I am still looking for Isiah to acquire a 7' from the draft...I really don't care about the other unproven bigs that you have mentioned....I want our coaching staff to cultivate their own...Draft: Dwayne Jones from St Jo 6'11" 230 10pts 11rbs 3.2 blks
Keven Steenberge Richmond 6'11" 240 13pts 6 rbs 2blks
D'or Fisher West Virginia 6'11" 240 10 pts 5rbs 3blks
Aaron Gray Pitt 7' 275 5pts in just 7 minutes of play, 3rbs, and 1blk
Roy Hibbert Georgetown 7'2" 272 6pts, 4rbs, 2blks, in just 17minuts. Georgetown is where Ewing was from, combine with Sweetney, he may become something special...Kevin Pittsnogle
Center | #34 | Junior | Roster
Height: 6-11
Weight: 240 lbs.
Hometown: Martinsburg, WV


This young dude 24 minutes and scored 24/8rbs last night...Not a strong shot blocker, but how do you all feel about this dude???

Kevin Steenberge
Center | #51 | Junior | Roster

Height: 6-11
Weight: 235 lbs.
Hometown: Columbia, MD

In 31 minutes this young man scored 22 points and grabed 7 boards. He is not too good of a SBlocker, but with practice and weight training he will get stronger..




Posted by Kwazimodal:

MS makes a good point about sub 7fters making an impact in the paint.Correct me if im wrong but didnt Larry Johnson do some time briefly at the 5? No I dont want a 6'4 center but sometimes fans pay more attention to height than skills."You cant teach height" adage doesnt mean as much in the NBA as it used to.
The true Knickabocker..........
BRIGGS
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3/10/2005  9:30 AM
the bottom line is we are not getting ANY one of these guys. it's really not an issue. if you consider GS gave Foyle 40mm$, you can understand that big men are the most precious commodity in the league. Most of these guy have qualifying deals that trump an MLE--Kwame has a standing 4 yr 30mm$ offer. Swift turned down 40mm for 5--i hate to break this news but in reality, a team under the cap, lets say atalanta, may push the envelope for a Curry and all of these guys have full restrictions which have no bearing with us.

even a guy like gadzuric, how can Milwaukee afford to let him go if they can sign him for an MLE?


I still say the only LEGIT athletic 7 footer that we can get as a back up to KT is Hunter. I mean just take a look at the FA list.

thats why a guy like chris taft, even if he had a sub-par year, will still go top 5 simply because there are very few guy who are 6-11 260 with athletiscm and skills.

Channing Frye is a skilled big man but hes soft and a tweener> I dont think you use a lottery pick on that, maybe if it's 13????? but i think that is reaching. Id rather draft the BPA and go after Hunter.

I mean lets take his play last night. He comes in for 10-12 minutes. Has a dunk, a couple of blocked shots, 4-5 rebounds alters a couple of more shots, and hits a TA jumper and sits. 4 pts 5 reb 2 blocks in 10-12 minutes. If you project something like that out to 18-20 minutes within reason, you're looking at 7 pts 7 reb 3 blocks. I mean thats cool for a back up and he can improve because he is only 23.

The Bulls owner can say whatever he wants, at the end of the day, he will be forced to ante up for Curry


wilcox is more like 6-9 in shoes 225 and hes under contract for cheap next year, so hes not going anywhere

im still holding hope for Bogut, until i know we arent in the lottery and our ping pong ball didnt come up, i'll stick to bogut until i know otherwise. thats my first choice! Bogut is better than anyone mentioned anyway!
RIP Crushalot😞
Knixkik
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3/10/2005  9:40 AM
Posted by diderotn:

I am so sick and tired of the way some Knicks fans think...The center position needs to be our toughest area. With the scorers that we have around, we only need a shot blocker a la Ratlif to turn this Knicks team into a real contender....that is why Isiah was crazy about Dampier....Why in the world would he want to bring in another 6'9" player to the Knicks???????
If you're refering to Curry, which i'm not positive you are, he stands 6'11, 285lbs, a great sized center. And although you're right about the shotblocker part, i don't believe just a shotblocker will put us over the top. The thing this team needs is a player that can score with his back to the basket, and having that at the center position is the answer to our problem. With Curry likely available this summer, we need to try to pick him up, and then get another guy who can rebound and block shots at the PF/C position. We might be able to address that in the draft. Marbury needs a player he can get the ball deep in the post to and expect for him to be able to score. I'm not talking about Sweetney because as good as he is, i'm still not convinced hes the answer at PF, being only 6'8 and not real athletic. Curry isn't real athletic, but is one of the league leaders in dunks, along with Shaq and Amare. We have to think big. Start Curry and Thomas up front. Get a big man like Vazquez and Petro in the draft. Plus we got Rose, Taylor, JYD, and Butler off the bench. Providing the guy we get in the draft is tall, a good post defender, and shotblocker, thats the type of team we need.
MS
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3/10/2005  9:41 AM
What the Knicks need to concentrate on is conditioning and strength training these two things are no stressed enough and need to be implemented into these guarenteed long term deals.....

Ariza during the offseason needs to add 15 pounds of muscle
Crawford should gain at least 10 pounds of muscle or get considerably stronger if he can't gain the weight

Sweetney needs to get his fat ass a nutrionist, a personal trainer and get all the pastries out of his his...He needs to drop a minimum of 15 this offseason, and realistically for him to reach his potential that number is between 20-25...

Mo Taylor needs to learn what muscle definition is, keep him and sweetney away from each other....

And just by doing small things inside your team your defense and rebounding will improve....

And when i say 6'10 big guys i am not talking about TT, and by the way if our front line is 6'8 6'10 6'10 we are not small at all

And considering Thomas made the deal to get first round picks, draft big projects with those late picks....

Because he already blew a chance to get JR & Josh Smith, Jameer Nelson, and David Harrison because he just had to include a draft pick to get Marbury.....Isiah should draft Ismail Mohamed out of GT with his second round pick, Channing Frye will be their at the end of the first, but again we don't have roster space for four new players
Knixkik
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3/10/2005  9:53 AM
Posted by MS:

What the Knicks need to concentrate on is conditioning and strength training these two things are no stressed enough and need to be implemented into these guarenteed long term deals.....

Ariza during the offseason needs to add 15 pounds of muscle
Crawford should gain at least 10 pounds of muscle or get considerably stronger if he can't gain the weight

Sweetney needs to get his fat ass a nutrionist, a personal trainer and get all the pastries out of his his...He needs to drop a minimum of 15 this offseason, and realistically for him to reach his potential that number is between 20-25...

Mo Taylor needs to learn what muscle definition is, keep him and sweetney away from each other....

And just by doing small things inside your team your defense and rebounding will improve....

And when i say 6'10 big guys i am not talking about TT, and by the way if our front line is 6'8 6'10 6'10 we are not small at all

And considering Thomas made the deal to get first round picks, draft big projects with those late picks....

Because he already blew a chance to get JR & Josh Smith, Jameer Nelson, and David Harrison because he just had to include a draft pick to get Marbury.....Isiah should draft Ismail Mohamed out of GT with his second round pick, Channing Frye will be their at the end of the first, but again we don't have roster space for four new players
We don't have a second round pick this year, just the two first rounders. With our second first rounder (likely #29) we need to look at combo guards. My personal favorite is high school prospect CJ Miles. 6'6, 210lbs, can do it all offensively, good athlete, good defender, point guard handle. Could be this year's JR Smith, plus the handle.

BTW, Curry had 25 pts on 12-19 shooting against Portland last night. He also had 8 boards, 7 of which were offensive. So he's not great on the defensive end, but we know he can score and being only 22 years old its just a matter of time, commitment, and instruction.
diderotn
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3/10/2005  10:05 AM
wrong, I wasn't refering to Curry at all...Although I don't like Curry's desire, I would still want him if we were able to trade for him....I was refering to the mentioning of Wilcox at Center, whom is no where as talented as Ben Wallace is...I don't mind a 6'11" Center at all, I just don't want to pay big money for them if their names are not: KG, Duncan, Shaq, Nowitsky, Ben, O'Neal.....

Go in the draft and use our picks to get a good young Center...We will need the cap space to resign Ariza and Sweetney....Unload Kurt Thomas for a Curry or Kwame would be a decent move, but in all actuality, we need a shot blocker and none of the two we've mentioned are shot blockers..Give me Chandler, Nene, or Dalember instead...


If you're refering to Curry, which i'm not positive you are, he stands 6'11, 285lbs, a great sized center. And although you're right about the shotblocker part, i don't believe just a shotblocker will put us over the top. The thing this team needs is a player that can score with his back to the basket, and having that at the center position is the answer to our problem. With Curry likely available this summer, we need to try to pick him up, and then get another guy who can rebound and block shots at the PF/C position. We might be able to address that in the draft. Marbury needs a player he can get the ball deep in the post to and expect for him to be able to score. I'm not talking about Sweetney because as good as he is, i'm still not convinced hes the answer at PF, being only 6'8 and not real athletic. Curry isn't real athletic, but is one of the league leaders in dunks, along with Shaq and Amare. We have to think big. Start Curry and Thomas up front. Get a big man like Vazquez and Petro in the draft. Plus we got Rose, Taylor, JYD, and Butler off the bench. Providing the guy we get in the draft is tall, a good post defender, and shotblocker, thats the type of team we need.
The true Knickabocker..........
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