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I Can’t Even Imagine What This Team Looks like After OG Learns the Offrnse/Defense
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Panos
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1/7/2024  9:40 PM
martin wrote:
ekstarks94 wrote:
martin wrote:Now imagine this team with a healthy Mitch beasting with the bench unit.

Are they going to pay two centers between 36 to 40 mill per season…..not sure about that long term

Mitch makes $14M next year, highest iHart can be offered by Knicks is $16M.

If we can lock him up at $16M per, you do that deal all day long.
Then we have all value contracts and it comes down to what it takes to resign OG. I think $25M is really more than he's worth, and I hope the Knicks can convince him to be part of the bigger picture here in NY. No way I would give him 30M or more.
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KnickDanger
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1/7/2024  11:10 PM
Panos wrote:
martin wrote:
ekstarks94 wrote:
martin wrote:Now imagine this team with a healthy Mitch beasting with the bench unit.

Are they going to pay two centers between 36 to 40 mill per season…..not sure about that long term

Mitch makes $14M next year, highest iHart can be offered by Knicks is $16M.

If we can lock him up at $16M per, you do that deal all day long.
Then we have all value contracts and it comes down to what it takes to resign OG. I think $25M is really more than he's worth, and I hope the Knicks can convince him to be part of the bigger picture here in NY. No way I would give him 30M or more.


Someone wrote elsewhere that centers in the NBA are like running backs in the NFL - what was once the premier position you now fill with secondary assets. IHart is tremendous, I would love to keep him and Mitch. But he isn’t irreplaceable and that’s not where you put your eggs.
Clean
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1/8/2024  4:47 AM
I think we have to keep iHart with Mitch. Centers are especially important to Thibs system. Mitch is amazing but injury prone. We are looking real good right now but if iHart got injured our center rotation would be rough and I think we would look much worse. Trading Quick and RJ opened up some money in the cap. Depending on what we do by the trade deadline we can decline Evans contract to open up more money. If you think about it, with our CAA contacts we might be able to pull a Josh Hart with OG. Have him opt in to his old contract opening up more cap space this season and sign him later to a bigger deal that covers the money lost because of the opt in. We have to remember we have the Cap master in our front office. He will find a way.
martin
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1/8/2024  10:52 AM
Clean wrote:I think we have to keep iHart with Mitch. Centers are especially important to Thibs system. Mitch is amazing but injury prone. We are looking real good right now but if iHart got injured our center rotation would be rough and I think we would look much worse. Trading Quick and RJ opened up some money in the cap. Depending on what we do by the trade deadline we can decline Evans contract to open up more money. If you think about it, with our CAA contacts we might be able to pull a Josh Hart with OG. Have him opt in to his old contract opening up more cap space this season and sign him later to a bigger deal that covers the money lost because of the opt in. We have to remember we have the Cap master in our front office. He will find a way.

+1

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joec32033
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1/9/2024  12:55 AM
martin wrote:
Clean wrote:I think we have to keep iHart with Mitch. Centers are especially important to Thibs system. Mitch is amazing but injury prone. We are looking real good right now but if iHart got injured our center rotation would be rough and I think we would look much worse. Trading Quick and RJ opened up some money in the cap. Depending on what we do by the trade deadline we can decline Evans contract to open up more money. If you think about it, with our CAA contacts we might be able to pull a Josh Hart with OG. Have him opt in to his old contract opening up more cap space this season and sign him later to a bigger deal that covers the money lost because of the opt in. We have to remember we have the Cap master in our front office. He will find a way.

+1

In a perfect world I get you, but in honesty, does iHart turn down a similiar contract to Mitch and a starting job with another team? or Does he turn down more (I know the Knicks can only offer him something like 16 mil. I think other teams can offer more) and a starting job?

Ego does come into play here. It's like the old axiom of if you have 2 starting quarterbacks you don't have one starting quarterback. I know Mitch and it seems iHart is starting caliber. I can't picture either of them being ok with coming off the bench long term.

~You can't run from who you are.~
ESOMKnicks
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1/9/2024  7:18 AM    LAST EDITED: 1/9/2024  7:18 AM
joec32033 wrote:
martin wrote:
Clean wrote:I think we have to keep iHart with Mitch. Centers are especially important to Thibs system. Mitch is amazing but injury prone. We are looking real good right now but if iHart got injured our center rotation would be rough and I think we would look much worse. Trading Quick and RJ opened up some money in the cap. Depending on what we do by the trade deadline we can decline Evans contract to open up more money. If you think about it, with our CAA contacts we might be able to pull a Josh Hart with OG. Have him opt in to his old contract opening up more cap space this season and sign him later to a bigger deal that covers the money lost because of the opt in. We have to remember we have the Cap master in our front office. He will find a way.

+1

In a perfect world I get you, but in honesty, does iHart turn down a similiar contract to Mitch and a starting job with another team? or Does he turn down more (I know the Knicks can only offer him something like 16 mil. I think other teams can offer more) and a starting job?

Ego does come into play here. It's like the old axiom of if you have 2 starting quarterbacks you don't have one starting quarterback. I know Mitch and it seems iHart is starting caliber. I can't picture either of them being ok with coming off the bench long term.

In all fairness, iHart has openly admitted that he'd love a chance to play for the German national team, even though he realizes they are very deep at center.
If the money is similar, he plays a meaningful role and is adored by the fans, why go hunting for a starting spot elsewhere? He knows that it's not like another team is going to guarantee him a starting spot for the entire duration of his contract.
Nalod
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1/9/2024  9:00 AM
ESOMKnicks wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
martin wrote:
Clean wrote:I think we have to keep iHart with Mitch. Centers are especially important to Thibs system. Mitch is amazing but injury prone. We are looking real good right now but if iHart got injured our center rotation would be rough and I think we would look much worse. Trading Quick and RJ opened up some money in the cap. Depending on what we do by the trade deadline we can decline Evans contract to open up more money. If you think about it, with our CAA contacts we might be able to pull a Josh Hart with OG. Have him opt in to his old contract opening up more cap space this season and sign him later to a bigger deal that covers the money lost because of the opt in. We have to remember we have the Cap master in our front office. He will find a way.

+1

In a perfect world I get you, but in honesty, does iHart turn down a similiar contract to Mitch and a starting job with another team? or Does he turn down more (I know the Knicks can only offer him something like 16 mil. I think other teams can offer more) and a starting job?

Ego does come into play here. It's like the old axiom of if you have 2 starting quarterbacks you don't have one starting quarterback. I know Mitch and it seems iHart is starting caliber. I can't picture either of them being ok with coming off the bench long term.

In all fairness, iHart has openly admitted that he'd love a chance to play for the German national team, even though he realizes they are very deep at center.
If the money is similar, he plays a meaningful role and is adored by the fans, why go hunting for a starting spot elsewhere? He knows that it's not like another team is going to guarantee him a starting spot for the entire duration of his contract.

Good points for "all things being equal. I suppose what kind of money can he command this off season will matter and at some point it won't make sense from a financial standpoint to pay beyond a certain level.
Mitch injury has devalued his worth while iHart gets to show up and perhaps increase his own?
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1/9/2024  10:30 PM
5-0 in the OG era. 23 pts in 29 min. Probably had his first practice with the team on Monday with the extra day off
joec32033
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1/9/2024  10:50 PM
ESOMKnicks wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
martin wrote:
Clean wrote:I think we have to keep iHart with Mitch. Centers are especially important to Thibs system. Mitch is amazing but injury prone. We are looking real good right now but if iHart got injured our center rotation would be rough and I think we would look much worse. Trading Quick and RJ opened up some money in the cap. Depending on what we do by the trade deadline we can decline Evans contract to open up more money. If you think about it, with our CAA contacts we might be able to pull a Josh Hart with OG. Have him opt in to his old contract opening up more cap space this season and sign him later to a bigger deal that covers the money lost because of the opt in. We have to remember we have the Cap master in our front office. He will find a way.

+1

In a perfect world I get you, but in honesty, does iHart turn down a similiar contract to Mitch and a starting job with another team? or Does he turn down more (I know the Knicks can only offer him something like 16 mil. I think other teams can offer more) and a starting job?

Ego does come into play here. It's like the old axiom of if you have 2 starting quarterbacks you don't have one starting quarterback. I know Mitch and it seems iHart is starting caliber. I can't picture either of them being ok with coming off the bench long term.

In all fairness, iHart has openly admitted that he'd love a chance to play for the German national team, even though he realizes they are very deep at center.
If the money is similar, he plays a meaningful role and is adored by the fans, why go hunting for a starting spot elsewhere? He knows that it's not like another team is going to guarantee him a starting spot for the entire duration of his contract.

National Team and your job in the NBA is two different animals. Yeah, money is similiar, unless he LOVES NY and LOVES Mitch, and is ok being labeled a backup C (maybe the best back up C) then sure I guess he'll stay.

But that is alot of ego to suppress.

If he gets the same money and a starting job? He's gone.

~You can't run from who you are.~
Panos
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1/9/2024  10:54 PM
joec32033 wrote:
martin wrote:
Clean wrote:I think we have to keep iHart with Mitch. Centers are especially important to Thibs system. Mitch is amazing but injury prone. We are looking real good right now but if iHart got injured our center rotation would be rough and I think we would look much worse. Trading Quick and RJ opened up some money in the cap. Depending on what we do by the trade deadline we can decline Evans contract to open up more money. If you think about it, with our CAA contacts we might be able to pull a Josh Hart with OG. Have him opt in to his old contract opening up more cap space this season and sign him later to a bigger deal that covers the money lost because of the opt in. We have to remember we have the Cap master in our front office. He will find a way.

+1

In a perfect world I get you, but in honesty, does iHart turn down a similiar contract to Mitch and a starting job with another team? or Does he turn down more (I know the Knicks can only offer him something like 16 mil. I think other teams can offer more) and a starting job?

Ego does come into play here. It's like the old axiom of if you have 2 starting quarterbacks you don't have one starting quarterback. I know Mitch and it seems iHart is starting caliber. I can't picture either of them being ok with coming off the bench long term.

TBH, it may be Mitch who will have to be ok with coming off the bench.
martin
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1/9/2024  10:56 PM
Everyone is better

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BigDaddyG
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1/9/2024  11:08 PM
martin wrote:Everyone is better

This is a passive aggressive way to say it was all RJs fault.

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
joec32033
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1/9/2024  11:09 PM
Panos wrote:
martin wrote:Everyone is better

HAHAHA. 100% FT? Really?

Looked it up. it's 8-8.

~You can't run from who you are.~
Panos
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1/9/2024  11:12 PM
joec32033 wrote:
Panos wrote:
martin wrote:Everyone is better

HAHAHA. 100% FT? Really?

Looked it up. it's 8-8.

I think better than the 100% is that he actually got to the line 8 times!
martin
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1/9/2024  11:13 PM
BigDaddyG wrote:
martin wrote:Everyone is better

This is a passive aggressive way to say it was all RJs fault.

We had the wrong plan the whole time. Shoulda been Trade RJ!

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Panos
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1/9/2024  11:15 PM
martin wrote:
We had the wrong plan the whole time. Shoulda been Trade RJ!

I think we both been saying that for a while.
joec32033
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1/10/2024  12:12 AM
Panos wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
Panos wrote:
martin wrote:Everyone is better

HAHAHA. 100% FT? Really?

Looked it up. it's 8-8.

I think better than the 100% is that he actually got to the line 8 times!

Remember that's over 5 games lol. To me he doesn't go to the basket strong. Seems like he is always looking to pass first and is always jumping away from contact in the lane. He'll never get calls that way. I'm still not sure he is anything more than a really good 3 and D guy, but he is the type of player winning teams need.

~You can't run from who you are.~
gradyandrew
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1/10/2024  2:39 AM
One of my favorite stats is that over the first 20 games Vegas over/ under has the strongest correlation to actual wins and losses but after 20 games +/- is the best predictor. A win is a win but over the long term, how much you win or lose by is pretty important too. The fact that Knicks are blowing teams out of the water says a lot.

Furthermore, the cake part of the schedule hasn't even really started yet. From Jan 3-13 Knicks play 3 out of 7 at home but from Jan 15 to Feb 10 Knicks play 12 out of 14 at home. With Philly and Milwaukee struggling, this is a golden time to shoot up the standings.
gradyandrew
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1/10/2024  8:35 AM
https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/all-teams-net-rating-since-january-1st

Knicks number 1 in net rating since Jan 1.
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