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Has RJ become bad Melo?
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BigDaddyG
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2/13/2023  6:19 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
Knixkik wrote:Something to consider, Barrett was the 3rd pick in the draft and drafted to be a star like every other high lottery pick. If at some point it’s clear he’s not headed to stardom, he will have to adjust his game to switch more into a role player. It’s much different than guys like Mikal Bridge and OG Aunuoby who are drafted to be role players and they become elite role players over time. Barrett may have to eventually make the transition.

Knicks coaching staff isn't putting him in the starting line-up every night if he's defying his instructions/breaking plays.

His usage and shot volume is by design and approval.

No, it isn't up to him to adjust and switch. Its up to the coaching stuff to make him.

The onus is on both. I'm sure the staff points out the instances where RJ doesn't put in the effort in D, misses a defensive rotation or fails to pass to the open man. Part of the problem is that there weren't many options to go to when RJ is effing up. This team doesn't have the talent. Now that Hart is here that changes a little bit. Let's see how much of a leash the coaching staff gives RJ now.

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
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Jmpasq
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2/13/2023  6:29 PM
foosballnick wrote:
ramtour420 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:The timing of all of the RJ hate is weird. The Knicks are good and RJ has been a big reason why. I think since Randle is playing well than Barrett has to be the fall guy for the fan base now. That being said, you’re right about a lot of what you said.

You are right, there has been criticism. But it's been constructive The kid needs to go through the thorns to get to the top. Hence the nitpicking

Not sure if I would refer to the OP in this thread as nitpicking nor constructive. Seems like he and others think RJ is utter worthless trash. Here are the comments broken down for convenience.....

- He is a black hole
- He has become a really selfish player
- He doesn't rebound or do anything to support the team except score
- His man and help defense is poor.
- He turns the ball over, sometimes, at the worst time
- those lazy bone headed passes for turnovers are head slippers.
- He has become an inefficient volume shooter who doesn’t support the team in any other way.
- Very selfish player who’s head isn’t always in the game.
- Other than get down hill to the rim, what does he provide to help the team?
- RJ has become a selfish inefficient chucker and a bad version of Melo.

My only issue with him is his poor shooting. I think the team would be better if he shot less.

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HofstraBBall
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2/13/2023  6:43 PM    LAST EDITED: 2/13/2023  6:43 PM
Melo never missed!
He is one of the best scorers of all time. Even at his worst the guy was a walking bucket.
'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
BigDaddyG
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2/13/2023  6:46 PM    LAST EDITED: 2/13/2023  6:46 PM
HofstraBBall wrote:Melo never missed!
He is one of the best scorers of all time. Even at his worst the guy was a walking bucket.

Yeah, I won't believe you until you can back it up with ✅ and ❎s.

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
Philc1
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2/13/2023  8:40 PM
There was a good Melo?
Panos
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2/13/2023  9:33 PM
Until RJ can get his **** together, Josh Hart is SO much more complimentary player for the big 2.
fishmike
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2/13/2023  11:59 PM
Panos wrote:Until RJ can get his **** together, Josh Hart is SO much more complimentary player for the big 2.
I just dont know how much longer Thibs is gonna keep running him out there with Hart/Grimes/IQ all playing the same position and better
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
LivingLegend
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2/14/2023  1:02 AM
Just to pile on a bit —- I can’t argue with most of the complaints about RJ.

RJ has the athleticism of Kyle Anderson - nickname slow-mo and his offensive game reminds me a bit of Aelfric Payton putting his head down and pre determining he was to to the rim. Said part is Elfrid and Kyle both are far superior defenders and passers vs RJ…maybe even rebounders.

I don’t know unless RJ comes into camp in absolutely elite condition next year I think we are looking at a K-Car long term or a Yugo.

I struggle to see the upside because there is limited athleticism and skill - not to mention little sign of any tangible adjustments being made.
LivingLegend
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2/14/2023  1:06 AM
fishmike wrote:
Panos wrote:Until RJ can get his **** together, Josh Hart is SO much more complimentary player for the big 2.
I just dont know how much longer Thibs is gonna keep running him out there with Hart/Grimes/IQ all playing the same position and better

If we could get Grimes playing like a month ago and Obi like earlier in the year we would be much better off vs RJ —- hell there is even Duece and Fournier I’d prefer to see get RJ minutes.

Will add - very impressed with I-Hart lately—— kid is battling and already has nice connections with Josh Hart, IQ, Grimes and Duece
Nalod
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2/14/2023  5:17 AM
Seems this kid is degrading fast and perhaps its a nagging injury? They thinking week off during allstar break and keeping him in until then?
22 year olds don’t just stop being good defenders and start getting into foul trouble. The boxscore has not been kind to him but the eye test seems off. Some movements getting back on defense looks awkward. Less explosion to the rim.
With JHart we now have the luxury to cut his minutes.

He was out due to “non covid illness” a few games back. His play is consistently getting worse over the last 2-3 weeks.
I have no conspiracy or pretend inside knowledge. Its been mentioned by someone here as a guess that it could be his back?
Knixkik
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2/14/2023  6:12 AM    LAST EDITED: 2/14/2023  6:14 AM
LivingLegend wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Panos wrote:Until RJ can get his **** together, Josh Hart is SO much more complimentary player for the big 2.
I just dont know how much longer Thibs is gonna keep running him out there with Hart/Grimes/IQ all playing the same position and better

If we could get Grimes playing like a month ago and Obi like earlier in the year we would be much better off vs RJ —- hell there is even Duece and Fournier I’d prefer to see get RJ minutes.

Will add - very impressed with I-Hart lately—— kid is battling and already has nice connections with Josh Hart, IQ, Grimes and Duece

Regarding Obi, he was playing ok early in the year but Knicks were losing. Knicks went on their run when he was injured, and when he came back the Knicks struggled again. Not putting that on Toppin, but there isn’t a world where the Knicks are better off in any scenario where Toppin is getting minutes over RJ. It’s criminal how RJ is getting beat down in this forum when he’s been a huge part of the winning and a guy like Toppin makes zero contributions and still gets a pass.
Chandler
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2/14/2023  8:22 AM

I’m starting to wonder if RJ has some form of injury, e.g., plantar fasciitis or something. Might explain the less than 100% effort when the ball is not in his hands.

One of the assistant coaches should be compiling a film reel of J.Hart, IQ or Grimes playing D and brainwashing RJ that if he does that he has a better chance of being an allstar than raising his scoring average by 2 or 3 points.

(5)(7)
gradyandrew
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2/14/2023  8:35 AM
Nalod wrote:Seems this kid is degrading fast and perhaps its a nagging injury? They thinking week off during allstar break and keeping him in until then?
22 year olds don’t just stop being good defenders and start getting into foul trouble. The boxscore has not been kind to him but the eye test seems off. Some movements getting back on defense looks awkward. Less explosion to the rim.
With JHart we now have the luxury to cut his minutes.

He was out due to “non covid illness” a few games back. His play is consistently getting worse over the last 2-3 weeks.
I have no conspiracy or pretend inside knowledge. Its been mentioned by someone here as a guess that it could be his back?

I think RJ's shot profile more than anyone else benefits from having Robinson in the game. Because he takes so many shots at the rim Robinson draws away the rim protection and cleans up his misses. Brunson and Randle shoot a lot further away.

I think anyone who's been watching games can see that RJ s play of late has hurt more than helped the team on both sides of the ball. Could be injury, missing MitchRob, or just mental from having his name in potential deals and the Hart trade. Not much to do about it now except cut his minutes (last night he played 24). The long term downside of removing him from the starting lineup doesn't make sense for the regular season.
gradyandrew
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2/14/2023  8:43 AM
January 45% FG/ 36% 3
February 39% FG/ 27% 3

For the season RJ is shooting 63% at the rim (career high).
martin
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2/14/2023  8:48 AM
RJ vibing Julius of last year

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Nalod
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2/14/2023  9:02 AM
martin wrote:RJ vibing Julius of last year

That was a nonsensical possession. But two games now his PF’s are bad.
Either his head is messed up, or physical something? Guesses are just that.
gradyandrew
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2/14/2023  9:29 AM
Nalod wrote:
martin wrote:RJ vibing Julius of last year

That was a nonsensical possession. But two games now his PF’s are bad.
Either his head is messed up, or physical something? Guesses are just that.

Can't say for certain but it seems like the Orlando game was the first time any team ever dared him to shoot from outside. The close out guy just stopped at the free throw line and RJ still missed.
blkexec
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2/14/2023  9:59 AM    LAST EDITED: 2/14/2023  10:04 AM
gradyandrew wrote:
Nalod wrote:
martin wrote:RJ vibing Julius of last year

That was a nonsensical possession. But two games now his PF’s are bad.
Either his head is messed up, or physical something? Guesses are just that.

Can't say for certain but it seems like the Orlando game was the first time any team ever dared him to shoot from outside. The close out guy just stopped at the free throw line and RJ still missed.

Sometimes that’s the best defense against an inconsistent shooter. Mental games at its best.

But regarding this clip, RJ doesn’t have too many counter moves in half court. He’s more of a full court player. Hopefully this clip will be replayed for him mentally as a learning lesson.

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
blkexec
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2/14/2023  10:33 AM
So I’m one of the hardest critics on RJ and pretty much everybody on the team. But even I have to say stop the RJ hate. He’s a kid. Could’ve used another year in college without zion. Because in college he only needed to play down hill with minimal counter moves.

So he will adjust over time. The question not about RJ but the Knicks fans. How much patience with knick fans have, to see him reach his ceiling? How much patience will knick fans have, should be the thread title.

Now that we have Hart, that should give RJ more time to develop even more and a model in hart to learn from. He’ll be fine if he can survive all this negative back lash. Thumbs down Randle is a great example how fans can turn on you one minute, then chant MVP the following year, due to his on court performance.

Born in Brooklyn, Raised in Queens, Lives in Maryland. The future is bright, I'm a Knicks fan for life!
foosballnick
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2/14/2023  10:40 AM
Interesting that the Knicks seem to have their act together with the addition of JHart who appears to have nicely slipped into the rotation....watching the continued emergence of JB who is averaging over 33 ppg in his last 10 or so games and may even have a chance to be added to the all-star roster .....blown out the Nets after 9 consecutive losses to them.....within 1/2 game of the 6th playoff spot and may even be well suited to get the 5 spot.....and doing this all without their starting center.

And pretty much all anyone is discussing in the game thread and top threads on this board is RJ and how much he sucks.

Deep breaths everyone! Its a long season and thing tend to cycle good and bad.
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Has RJ become bad Melo?
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