Knixkik wrote:So the Knicks are dedicated to the development of Barrett, IQ, Toppin, Grimes, Reddish, Sims, McBride and maybe Mitch as under-25 talent. That’s 8 guys. At least 6 of those guys will occupy 10 rotation spots next year. Knicks flipped 11 and Kembas salary into 3 first round picks. Maybe fans would have been happy if they traded down to 13 and still got a guy like Griffin plus a couple of extra picks, but griffon or anyone else in that spot still isn’t a thrilling prospect that will get prioritized for the next 2 plus years. Short of landing Ivey, I just don’t see the avenue for really making a great upgrade to the young core. It feels like adding a guy just to add a guy. It’s weird because Knicks fans want instant gratification in the draft but want long term planning during the season.

Are they? We didn't even see guys like Toppin, McBride, Sims, etc play nearly as much as they should have this past season. It would be different if the Knicks actually showed a commitment to playing their young guys, but they haven't at all. Thibs has no interest in that either.

What I think Knicks fans want is something resembling a coherent plan. If it's about the young core...then actually make it about them.

Knixkik wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

Panos wrote:

fishmike wrote:phuck Brunson... we spend last year's max cap space and this year's lottery pick to eventually sign Jalen Phucking Brunson. Absolute trash.

+1.
Why is Brunson some kind of prize that gives this org a pass?

Because the other option was draft another mediocre wing prospect at 11 and we are already overloaded with that

And still no pg

Pretty much. Once Davis was gone I was out on most of these guys. Even if you trade the vets, a guy you don’t love at 11 isn’t playing over Barrett, reddish, grimes and Quickley. People complain about all these guys not playing like there’s a million minutes a game. What’s the point ? If there’s no franchise player available and no holes to plug where a good prospect is avail.

Brunson is a low ceiling, high floor, stupidly overpriced option that probably gets us back to 45 wins which is prolly exactly what MSG wants. Thibs will push them to play hard, We'll win 45 games. Dolan will erect a statue of himself and the garden glory will return.

Leon will have used 2 years of assets and his prize will be a player who probably isnt even top 10 in his position... and that's in the conference.

i am not a fan of signing Brunson to big money but i am also giving credit to the fact that Leon and company probably have some inside feeling and intel on what kind of character he is. I'm more about a player's heart and mind anyway. A lot of talented college guys fold as soon as they hit real competition in NBA. Some (fewer) continue to grow. SO if they do sign Brunson I'll support it

tons of teams don't play young guys much. Golden state barely played its lottery picks; Charlotte kept Bouknight pinned to the bench. We played KK as a rookie and it did nothing. So it don't accept the idea that you must play rookies: it all depends

Regarding the draft so far i have been happy with this FO's drafting. My assumption is that they must have felt that once 11 came along they were looking at a lot of JAGs and decided to push for cap space and flexibility. You need those assets to later be opportunistic

Clean wrote:

fishmike wrote:

nycdan wrote:Not to mention that no player we picked at 11 or 13 was ever going to play, given who our HC is. McBride and Grimes are still waiting for their uniforms. Unless lightning strikes, we might be looking at a new HC in 2023 who actually gives minutes to talented rookies so we might as well wait until then to draft one.

Grimes got playing time. McBride missed every basket he shot. Did IQ play for the same coach? Why didnt you mention him?

Grimes only got playing time because the roster was decimated due to Covid and injuries . When he finally got consistent minutes he showed Thibs that is was dumb he did not play him until forced to. If not for that he warms the bench the whole season with McBride. Also McBride had consistently one of the best +/- on the team. If his shooting hurt the team so much why they constantly outscore their opponents when he played? might be because shooting is not all there is to basketball.

Edit: Just want to add that I have no issue with how Thibs coaches the youth. After that story from a trusted journalist with quotes from IQ I will say Thibs does a good job behind the scenes. I mainly want Thibs to give someone else a chance earlier if its obvious that the vets are not playing well that season.

Its weird.. I read the same things over and over, Thibs doesnt develop and play kids. Yet all the kids are ready to play. And there's IQ who Thibs has stuck with since day 1. Obi doesnt count because Thibs HAS to play him and that's the only reason because if Thibs could he would play Randle 48

martin wrote:

Clean wrote:Edit: Just want to add that I have no issue with how Thibs coaches the youth. After that story from a trusted journalist with quotes from IQ I will say Thibs does a good job behind the scenes. I mainly want Thibs to give someone else a chance earlier if its obvious that the vets are not playing well that season.

So how do you determine that?

And how long do you think it takes a rookie to get ramped up for a first jaunt into the NBA?

And how long do you give vets in the starting lineup time to figure things out? This is not the YMCA league where you just flip guys in and out cause you feel like it.

Fournier let us know it took him until January to get comfy in his role and he is a vet that's been around the block. It took Boston 40 games this season before they started to feel comfortable. A new team of LeBron, Wade, Bosh back in 2010 - and I don't need to remind anyone that these are high level all stars - it took 2+ months before they settled in.

1 month into the season (game 15 of the season), Grimes started to get his chance. And then he was out a bit due to COVID. And then he played a lot from Xmas to end of Feb. And then he got hurt.

That's literally the high level sequence for Grimes for the season.

Grimes literally got a long look this season. It was HIM getting COVID and then injured that kept him out after the first month.

Just check out the game logs: https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/g/grimequ01/gamelog/2022

I thought Thibs was kinds stupid with the Randle/Obi situation. But with RJ, Mitch, Grimes, IQ... they all got their full slate of playing time. And when they played well, it's the vets who sat and they finished the game. Except Obi.

And for clarity, it was around game 19, not 15. It's when the Knicks decided to end the Kemba experiment and move Burks into starting lineup and Grimes got his minutes.

The Knicks were 10-9 at that point in the season.

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/NBA_NewYork/status/1540416023555342341

Kemet wrote:Didn't Leon Rose watch the Mavs playoff run .. Brunson needed PG-Dinwiddie playmaker skills, plus PG-Doncic's creative distribution in his lineup to play on the next level. GS Warriors could've SWEPT the Mavs in the WCF.
Brunson is not a max contract player !!!

I agree 1000% …………… YET

Basically we have to over pay him to pry him away from Dallas. But he’s now the quarterback who plays unselfish and selfish when needed. He’s young enough to grow into a van vlette type impact. But he plays strong / downhill. I think it’s a move that might pan out if everybody takes a step forward. And Brunson is that type of player to have the ball in his hands. He’s not afraid of playing next to a star or waving Randle off to run a play. And this is now Year 3. Rose has to over pay to protect his brand as a GM. He needs swing hard but also get on base.

What if RJ and company takes a step forward? What if All star Randle is back? IQ and Obi came on strong. Lots of momentum and playoff expectations if we add Brunson and Mitch back. I believe that team competes in the playoffs better than adding a rookie at 11 just to send him to the gleague.

Rose is playing a long game of chess. Year 3 he had to make a move.

blkexec wrote:

Kemet wrote:Didn't Leon Rose watch the Mavs playoff run .. Brunson needed PG-Dinwiddie playmaker skills, plus PG-Doncic's creative distribution in his lineup to play on the next level. GS Warriors could've SWEPT the Mavs in the WCF.
Brunson is not a max contract player !!!

I agree 1000% …………… YET

Basically we have to over pay him to pry him away from Dallas. But he’s now the quarterback who plays unselfish and selfish when needed. He’s young enough to grow into a van vlette type impact. But he plays strong / downhill. I think it’s a move that might pan out if everybody takes a step forward. And Brunson is that type of player to have the ball in his hands. He’s not afraid of playing next to a star or waving Randle off to run a play. And this is now Year 3. Rose has to over pay to protect his brand as a GM. He needs swing hard but also get on base.

What if RJ and company takes a step forward? What if All star Randle is back? IQ and Obi came on strong. Lots of momentum and playoff expectations if we add Brunson and Mitch back. I believe that team competes in the playoffs better than adding a rookie at 11 just to send him to the gleague.

Rose is playing a long game of chess. Year 3 he had to make a move.

I am a fan of Brunson game. He plays off 2 feet. always on balance, has excellent foot work, is a really good finisher at the rim and is good from lid range. He will be the best pg we had in a while. But, with the way this roster is currently constructed, I don't think he moves the needle that much. I think we will continue to chase a play in spot with no guarantees that we grab one.

foosballnick wrote:Brunson is meh. But I'll continue to reserve judgement on this until the moves are actually made. I wasn't that enamored with this draft, so I liked the idea of moving the 11 for future first rounders. The FO did F-up and waaaay overpay to move Kemba's salary though (one more year at eight mil).

You like trading pick # 11 for picks likely to be in the 20s or convey to 2nd rounders? I’m scared when I see the spurs take 3 first rounders Memphis pike drives into rd 1 Oklahoma steals our pick. Even gs picked twice. They had different opinions than u. Pick 11 is pretty good.