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Who do u want to start at pf next year?


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BRIGGS
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Just checking sentiment
Julius Randle
Obi Toppin
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Author Thread
HofstraBBall
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5/6/2022  2:22 PM
Uptown wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
Nalod wrote:Randle. Change the PG. Change the pecking order with RJ, and bring in Brunson. I have a belief that either randle stays and buys in to what ever his coach wants or he get made gone.
So given a choice between the two, I want Randle. If Obi can take minutes, even all of them, thats cool too.
If change can happen, let them both play.
I know Randle is a ball stopper, but if he wasn't?
Obi has to show he can shoot. If he can, sure let him play.

See, both need to up their game. I believe part of Randles issues was there was a changing of the guard last season. That needs to be sorted.

Agree. So many ignore the importance of a good PG. Payton was definitely not the best but he had a familiarity with Randle that helped Randle and made a difference. Hopefully a solid PG will lead to a good start for Randle. Which he will need in order to turn around how fans support him.

I just do not see Obi able to get to Randle's level. However, I did see signs of Randle not fitting in with a fast paced, run and gun team. Which if that is what the Knicks decide to go with, Obi would be the better fit. The million dollar question is does that style translate to more success?

I think most understand the need for an impactful pg. You are overstating Paytons impact on Randle last year. Leading up to last season, Payton averaged nearly 7 assist per game. Last year, his assists average dropped to a career low, 3 per game and that was due to an emphasis on Randle-ball. On offense, Payton did one of two things: drive all the way to the hoop, or dumped the ball to Randle at the elbow and then hid in the corner. Paytons main impact on this team was on the defensive end.

Randle struggling to make the low % mid-range jumpers this year, that he made at a higher % last year, is on Randle. Payton rarely got Randle easy baskets. Randle got his, mainly out of iso-ball.

Think you are minimizing the importance of having a PG that you are familiar with. A PG that gets you the ball at your spot. Something that can be added is that our first unit not only had new, out of position PG's but also 2 completely new starters. However, can agree that Randle's other issue was that he could not maintain the high 3pt percentage.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
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fishmike
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5/6/2022  3:53 PM
THE MOVE is to trade Randle for Bledsoe and their pick and take Sharpe/Eason and resign Mitch. Let Thibs coach them up. Team would be loaded with fresh legs and long athletic guys.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
BigDaddyG
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5/6/2022  5:03 PM
fishmike wrote:THE MOVE is to trade Randle for Bledsoe and their pick and take Sharpe/Eason and resign Mitch. Let Thibs coach them up. Team would be loaded with fresh legs and long athletic guys.

I don't think Portland goes for that. That pick is too valuable. Maybe they bite if it's a lower pick, but I have idea what direction they think they're heading.

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
WOODMANnYk
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5/6/2022  5:20 PM
C'mon folks! this is a no brainer. You start OBI and trade RANDLE.
The Future. GO KNICKS!
BRIGGS
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5/7/2022  9:08 AM
I didn’t vote but my thinking

Julius Randle said f u to the fans. The same fans who chanted mvp for him. It’s not the favs fault he was well below the following years level. They were disappointed understandably so.

Obi played very well to end the season. There’s absolutely no guarantee he can follow through but he sure looked good.

Fans will likely have short fuse w Randle and if he doesn’t bring it consistently —it will be a nightmare problem.

RIP Crushalot😞
Philc1
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5/7/2022  11:03 AM
BRIGGS wrote:I didn’t vote but my thinking

Julius Randle said f u to the fans. The same fans who chanted mvp for him. It’s not the favs fault he was well below the following years level. They were disappointed understandably so.

Obi played very well to end the season. There’s absolutely no guarantee he can follow through but he sure looked good.

Fans will likely have short fuse w Randle and if he doesn’t bring it consistently —it will be a nightmare problem.

Wasn’t an FU it was a thumbs down

Kyrie Irving said FU to the fans

Philc1
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5/7/2022  11:04 AM
WOODMANnYk wrote:C'mon folks! this is a no brainer. You start OBI and trade RANDLE.

Ok and who is taking on that behemoth of a contract?

WOODMANnYk
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5/7/2022  1:38 PM    LAST EDITED: 5/7/2022  1:54 PM
What behemoth of a contract??? Randle's contract is reasonable and he'll be 28 yrs old at the start of the new season so he got some good yrs left. Based on the analytics on data and pure stat numbers, Out of these players averaging over 20 pts, 10 reb and 5 asst or more in the NBA, Randle getting paid way less than Giannis and the Joker.. He's the 5th highest scoring power forward in the NBA and the 4th best rebounding Power forward in the the entire league. Honestly, Randle is underpaid! Knicks can move his contract and other than his attitude, he does have some value teams would be willing to take a chance on.. Its only a 4 yr contract.. By the time it expires, he'll be 32 yrs of age..
The Future. GO KNICKS!
Nalod
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5/7/2022  3:36 PM
BRIGGS wrote:I didn’t vote but my thinking

Julius Randle said f u to the fans. The same fans who chanted mvp for him. It’s not the favs fault he was well below the following years level. They were disappointed understandably so.

Obi played very well to end the season. There’s absolutely no guarantee he can follow through but he sure looked good.

Fans will likely have short fuse w Randle and if he doesn’t bring it consistently —it will be a nightmare problem.

Dear lord jesus that Randle put his thumbs down. Tell us, was he doing that for aspeccific moment or in hindsight a whole season to ALL THE FANS ROUND THE WORLD? He should be a good knick, and the more money he makes an emmotionally void one and be nice to the fans. Especially all of us who rarely attend a game in person. Dear goodness, that poor reporter (Bond) asked randle after the game what he meant by the thumbs down. What randle might have been upset about was how this was now being reported as a thing and would make him look bad. It did and his comment was worse.
So lets trade him because after a slow start, he was booed. Then later in the game he scored and he put thumbs down.
Resepct the Timeline I preach………..
Lets go to the moment. who did they play?. Celtics. After a slow start, randle finished 8-20. But if he started slow, as depicted the boos, makes sense that 8-20 he got hot there.
Respect the time line.
WHo won? Knicks came back!!!!! This was the JR Barrett buzzer beater. Knicks must have felt pretty good……
Maybe randle. Likley this was a game Kemba did not return.
And feeling good, Bondy asks that question.

So lets forget the day, and ****ing trade him after all fans deserve to never be told the player does not like the boos. Make sure we lop all that is bad into one narrative and forget all he can do.
Did Love his body language all season? No. But im not shortsighted to weigh the good and bad and at least understand this, and others things were met with and discussed and its either disclosed behind closed doors what his problem was, how it was going to get fixed, or he told them he wants out.
But lets not pretend Randle is knocking over wheel chair bound grandmas and raping choirboys, Obi and IQ are being oppressed, and Thibs is clueless as a coach. Shit happens. lets see how its dealt with.

Its easy to promote fables. Briggs is a highly intelligent poster but we all make mistakes. I reapeat, we all do. But its important we self correct and understand the context of things the moment it occurred. Otherwise we parrot the inaccuracy making it more legit. Respect the timeline.

BigDaddyG
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5/7/2022  5:50 PM
WOODMANnYk wrote:What behemoth of a contract??? Randle's contract is reasonable and he'll be 28 yrs old at the start of the new season so he got some good yrs left. Based on the analytics on data and pure stat numbers, Out of these players averaging over 20 pts, 10 reb and 5 asst or more in the NBA, Randle getting paid way less than Giannis and the Joker.. He's the 5th highest scoring power forward in the NBA and the 4th best rebounding Power forward in the the entire league. Honestly, Randle is underpaid! Knicks can move his contract and other than his attitude, he does have some value teams would be willing to take a chance on.. Its only a 4 yr contract.. By the time it expires, he'll be 32 yrs of age..

The thing is Randle's value is down. You mention Giannis
s and Jokic, but we all know Randle is nowhere close to that and the analytics more than prove it. So what do you expect back. If you trade Randle now, I doubt you even get back the return that Sabonis got. Plus the salary matching. I've been on record of saying I want to trade Randle, but that may be easier said than done, unless you're willing to take back less value. Would a mid to low or protected first be a sufficient return along with some short-term salary fodder be good enough?
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
Nalod
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5/8/2022  5:28 AM
BigDaddyG wrote:
WOODMANnYk wrote:What behemoth of a contract??? Randle's contract is reasonable and he'll be 28 yrs old at the start of the new season so he got some good yrs left. Based on the analytics on data and pure stat numbers, Out of these players averaging over 20 pts, 10 reb and 5 asst or more in the NBA, Randle getting paid way less than Giannis and the Joker.. He's the 5th highest scoring power forward in the NBA and the 4th best rebounding Power forward in the the entire league. Honestly, Randle is underpaid! Knicks can move his contract and other than his attitude, he does have some value teams would be willing to take a chance on.. Its only a 4 yr contract.. By the time it expires, he'll be 32 yrs of age..

The thing is Randle's value is down. You mention Giannis
s and Jokic, but we all know Randle is nowhere close to that and the analytics more than prove it. So what do you expect back. If you trade Randle now, I doubt you even get back the return that Sabonis got. Plus the salary matching. I've been on record of saying I want to trade Randle, but that may be easier said than done, unless you're willing to take back less value. Would a mid to low or protected first be a sufficient return along with some short-term salary fodder be good enough?

WE got him via free agnency so he cost nothing. His contract is not as outrageous as some say. If one keeps reading it and your not respecting the reality that he is basically 50th in the league paid, which does not put him in max territory then its not like we hve to attach big assets to move him. Unless you hate him something bad and prone to ignore those realities. Then you can light your hair on fire and run down the fan street promoting that agenda until others also ignite there follicle proteins also and before you know it you now have company and who loves that? “Misery!”, thats who. Misery loves company.

BigDaddyG
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5/9/2022  7:55 AM    LAST EDITED: 5/9/2022  7:55 AM
Nalod wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
WOODMANnYk wrote:What behemoth of a contract??? Randle's contract is reasonable and he'll be 28 yrs old at the start of the new season so he got some good yrs left. Based on the analytics on data and pure stat numbers, Out of these players averaging over 20 pts, 10 reb and 5 asst or more in the NBA, Randle getting paid way less than Giannis and the Joker.. He's the 5th highest scoring power forward in the NBA and the 4th best rebounding Power forward in the the entire league. Honestly, Randle is underpaid! Knicks can move his contract and other than his attitude, he does have some value teams would be willing to take a chance on.. Its only a 4 yr contract.. By the time it expires, he'll be 32 yrs of age..

The thing is Randle's value is down. You mention Giannis
s and Jokic, but we all know Randle is nowhere close to that and the analytics more than prove it. So what do you expect back. If you trade Randle now, I doubt you even get back the return that Sabonis got. Plus the salary matching. I've been on record of saying I want to trade Randle, but that may be easier said than done, unless you're willing to take back less value. Would a mid to low or protected first be a sufficient return along with some short-term salary fodder be good enough?

WE got him via free agnency so he cost nothing. His contract is not as outrageous as some say. If one keeps reading it and your not respecting the reality that he is basically 50th in the league paid, which does not put him in max territory then its not like we hve to attach big assets to move him. Unless you hate him something bad and prone to ignore those realities. Then you can light your hair on fire and run down the fan street promoting that agenda until others also ignite there follicle proteins also and before you know it you now have company and who loves that? “Misery!”, thats who. Misery loves company.


Let's ignore the argument about whether Randle is overpaid for a second. $25+ million annually is still a lot of money to juggle around. That decreases the amount of teams available and willing to do a trade right there. Personally, I'd trade Randle for a pack of Newports, but I realize most of the posters on this forum would want more back. So my question is cents on the dollar are you guys willing to take back in a deal if he's traded next month? There might not be palatable deal available that can get done this off-season.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
DJMUSIC
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5/10/2022  1:07 AM
Unless we get a STUD PG (Mitchell SG/PG) I am not sure which Randle will return as a Knick.
Whether the 2020-2021 ? or this prior season 2021/2022 Randle. I am worried about Randle in NY unless Knicks bounce back with draft & summer deals.
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Philc1
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5/10/2022  7:52 AM
WOODMANnYk wrote:What behemoth of a contract??? Randle's contract is reasonable and he'll be 28 yrs old at the start of the new season so he got some good yrs left. Based on the analytics on data and pure stat numbers, Out of these players averaging over 20 pts, 10 reb and 5 asst or more in the NBA, Randle getting paid way less than Giannis and the Joker.. He's the 5th highest scoring power forward in the NBA and the 4th best rebounding Power forward in the the entire league. Honestly, Randle is underpaid! Knicks can move his contract and other than his attitude, he does have some value teams would be willing to take a chance on.. Its only a 4 yr contract.. By the time it expires, he'll be 32 yrs of age..

Randle is about to start a 4 year $117 million guaranteed contract. If that’s not a bad contract I don’t know what is

Nalod
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5/10/2022  8:43 AM
Philc1 wrote:
WOODMANnYk wrote:What behemoth of a contract??? Randle's contract is reasonable and he'll be 28 yrs old at the start of the new season so he got some good yrs left. Based on the analytics on data and pure stat numbers, Out of these players averaging over 20 pts, 10 reb and 5 asst or more in the NBA, Randle getting paid way less than Giannis and the Joker.. He's the 5th highest scoring power forward in the NBA and the 4th best rebounding Power forward in the the entire league. Honestly, Randle is underpaid! Knicks can move his contract and other than his attitude, he does have some value teams would be willing to take a chance on.. Its only a 4 yr contract.. By the time it expires, he'll be 32 yrs of age..

Randle is about to start a 4 year $117 million guaranteed contract. If that’s not a bad contract I don’t know what is

You don’t.
Because you don’t get 10% of his deal has annual incentives:

Incentives: (a) >= 65 reg games + playoffs, (b) All-Star roster, or (c) NBA All-Defense (1st or 2nd)

So that “Guarantee” you spew is not. His base makes him the 47th paid player. He put up 20-8. Granted, he had a bad season. But while most of you want to discard him thinking OBI is the ****, and I would hope he is, the trade kicker at 15% makes it very hard to move.
This deal was reported as very team friendly after an NBA all pro year. Does it suck he fell back? Yep. Does a PG help? Might. Can he come back from that? I hope so.
He does not have to return to his all pro season for that contract to tilt back to “good”. This year his base salary is 23mil. Goes up about 2 mil per for next 4 yeaers. The incentives kick in make him easy worth it. The cap hits are there so don’t circumvent the cap by adding them.
Bad contract would have been Max at over 30 mil and up from there.
Bad contract is he was highest paid at 21mil this year on a team that did not make playoffs. And nobody here can say wTF went thru his head and caused him the level of frustration he demonstrated and did so badly.

Im more centric on how to fix him and the team than outright exile.
Bad examples of bad contracts? KLove, John Wall, westbrook, Haywood, KP at 31mil1!!, Tobias harris at 36 mil. Good player, not close to 36mm!!!!!,

Philc1
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5/17/2022  10:58 AM
Nalod wrote:
Philc1 wrote:
WOODMANnYk wrote:What behemoth of a contract??? Randle's contract is reasonable and he'll be 28 yrs old at the start of the new season so he got some good yrs left. Based on the analytics on data and pure stat numbers, Out of these players averaging over 20 pts, 10 reb and 5 asst or more in the NBA, Randle getting paid way less than Giannis and the Joker.. He's the 5th highest scoring power forward in the NBA and the 4th best rebounding Power forward in the the entire league. Honestly, Randle is underpaid! Knicks can move his contract and other than his attitude, he does have some value teams would be willing to take a chance on.. Its only a 4 yr contract.. By the time it expires, he'll be 32 yrs of age..

Randle is about to start a 4 year $117 million guaranteed contract. If that’s not a bad contract I don’t know what is

You don’t.
Because you don’t get 10% of his deal has annual incentives:

Incentives: (a) >= 65 reg games + playoffs, (b) All-Star roster, or (c) NBA All-Defense (1st or 2nd)

So that “Guarantee” you spew is not. His base makes him the 47th paid player. He put up 20-8. Granted, he had a bad season. But while most of you want to discard him thinking OBI is the ****, and I would hope he is, the trade kicker at 15% makes it very hard to move.
This deal was reported as very team friendly after an NBA all pro year. Does it suck he fell back? Yep. Does a PG help? Might. Can he come back from that? I hope so.
He does not have to return to his all pro season for that contract to tilt back to “good”. This year his base salary is 23mil. Goes up about 2 mil per for next 4 yeaers. The incentives kick in make him easy worth it. The cap hits are there so don’t circumvent the cap by adding them.
Bad contract would have been Max at over 30 mil and up from there.
Bad contract is he was highest paid at 21mil this year on a team that did not make playoffs. And nobody here can say wTF went thru his head and caused him the level of frustration he demonstrated and did so badly.

Im more centric on how to fix him and the team than outright exile.
Bad examples of bad contracts? KLove, John Wall, westbrook, Haywood, KP at 31mil1!!, Tobias harris at 36 mil. Good player, not close to 36mm!!!!!,

Oh wow 10% of a guaranteed $117 million contract is incentives!

SergioNYK
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5/17/2022  3:22 PM
I think I'd take a homeless guy at PF over having to watch Randle and his antics again next season.
BigDaddyG
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5/17/2022  4:30 PM    LAST EDITED: 5/17/2022  4:31 PM
SergioNYK wrote:I think I'd take a homeless guy at PF over having to watch Randle and his antics again next season.

Can the homeless guy play basketball, or does he just do regular homeless guy things? Nevermind, doesn't even matter. Let's get this deal done!

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
Who do u want to start at pf next year?

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