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After sleeping on it I think we did well
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fishmike
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8/3/2021  9:56 PM
Hard to say we did well. Its underwhelming to have a FO clearly capable of wheeling and dealing during the draft but cant leverage a league high $50mm plus in cap space for anything more than Fournier and Luca and keeping our own guys.

Now this drama about doing nothing and probably not even a playoff team is total **** however so hopefully folks get over that poop fast.

Knicks were 27-15 after the Rose trade. That's a .643 winning% and translates to a 53 win season. They are bringing the exact same team back except McBride or Luca replaces ELF, Grimes replaces Frank and Fournier replaces Reggie. While it doesnt include a marquee player that does constitute a talent upgrade.

Knicks remain VERY young with several key rotation guys looking to level up:
RJ
Obi
IQ
Mitch

Rose really showed he could be positive in a mentoring role last year as well. Folks were worried Thibs would show favoritism and it was the opposite... Rose was a conduit for the coach and Obi and IQ both talked glowingly about how Rose helped them when he got here. I wanted a veteran floor general. Looks like Rose is the guy. I think he's a 50-60 game a year player so I guess we will get some good long looks at IQ/Luca/McBride at PG

Fournier, Burks and Noel are productive guys on cap friendly deals.

I think we are deep and good so we should win a bunch of games. I mean what if we are basically the same team except next time in the playoffs Jules balls, RJ gets buckets and McBride is the Marcus Smart we all hoped Frank would be.

While this offseason isnt very exciting it does represent patience with a group that had a .643 winning% and they plugged some holes as well. Boring doesnt always mean bad job.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
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EwingsGlass
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8/3/2021  9:57 PM
Chicago is an odd mix of players. A lot of talent. They just kind of feel weird on the fit. A lot of players that need the ball to be moderately effective. I have them as the most likely to implode. Or they could gel. I don’t know. I wanted Ball for a bit.

Lakers free agency feels like the system is broken. It is what it is. I wanted Nunn and possibly Melo. Considered Monk for a bit, but would have needed to move some players to do this. I’m rooting against them mostly because we are not them.

Heat look better than last year. I started talking myself into Kyle Lowry toward the end of the offseason. His skills are declining. Resigning Butler certainly took some of the juice out of 2022.

Celts look worse unless you count addition by Subtraction.

Warriors had an amazing draft. Can’t fathom how they are going to pay those luxury taxes.

Sixers not trading Simmons feels like a festering wound. Not sure what they do about that.

I dunno. I wished myself into thinking there was some magical offseason coming. We improved marginally, but feel like we need to find a PG somewhere. Probably need summer league to decide on Vildoza and whether to go to the piggy bank for help.

You know I gonna spin wit it
fishmike
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8/3/2021  10:00 PM
If last year didn't happen I would think that's 32-50 roster. Except I know Thibs will have those guys playing D like their shoes are on fire and the rest of the coaching staff seem to know what's up as well and I bet its closer to 50-32. Question is, will they have legs when the post season starts and play a style that can a series?
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Allanfan20
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8/3/2021  10:05 PM
If we are going to be good, it’s going to be because RJ, Toppin, Randle (Yes, Randle) and Quickley showed a lot of improvement. Not because of these signings. That’s being Captain Obvious though.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
EwingsGlass
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8/3/2021  10:07 PM
fishmike wrote:If last year didn't happen I would think that's 32-50 roster. Except I know Thibs will have those guys playing D like their shoes are on fire and the rest of the coaching staff seem to know what's up as well and I bet its closer to 50-32. Question is, will they have legs when the post season starts and play a style that can a series?

They still need to replace Payton’s production and defense. I like McBride but I am not sure he is ready to take the reins of an NBA team. Guess I just expected something a little flashier.

You know I gonna spin wit it
Philc1
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8/3/2021  10:09 PM
KnickDanger wrote:Lots of didn't sleep on it threads.

One more thing -- has the last move been made?

No
Philc1
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8/3/2021  10:10 PM
homeskillitprigioni wrote:
Knicksfan wrote:If you sip some kool aid, yeah, the Knicks are fine. Fournier will help the offense and, we’ll, that’s where the improvement stops. To expect anything from the rookies is wishful thinking. Not that it won’t happen, but it’s not a given.

In all honesty, expecting the Knicks to repeat at the 4th spot is a little delusional. Not only are the Hawks considerably better than us, but the Heat and Bulls could argue to be better than last season and better than us.

And after the season and hopefully another playoff berth, what’s next? We are primed for another first round exit as currently constructed. We did improve offense, but not by much. PG is still an issue and the plan might not hold for a whole season unless one of the rooks claims the nod. Oh, how much I wish that happens, but again, it’s not a given.

IMO, Knicks played to repeat in the season, not to improve as to not have a repeat of the Hawks series.

Right. We'd still get smoked in a series vs the Hawks.

So would pretty much everyone else in the east except the bucks and nets
Philc1
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8/3/2021  10:11 PM
BigDaddyG wrote:
NYKBocker wrote:I think we did well. We added 3 shooters and a backup C in the draft. 2 of them are Thibs type defenders. We added a a 20 point scorer that can shoot. Brought back our own FA's that was vital to our success last season. We did well.

Shooting really wasn't that big of a need during the regular season. They already had more than enough center depth and it looks like that will continue. What they needed was a legit NBA PG. Short of that, I can't see how anyone can say the Knicks did well. There's still work to do as far as I can see.

We got lucky last year in that a lot of our players got hot at the same time. There’s no way our shooting percentages are as high next year with the same roster
DJMUSIC
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8/4/2021  12:00 AM
fitzfarm wrote:I think the Knicks upgraded with Fournier while still keeping the core intact that allowed us to finish 4th in the east. After watching Fournier in the Olympics and last year highlights he can really score and put the ball on the floor as well as make the right pass when needed . Plus we upgraded just by drafting grimes and McBride .

Mitch,Noel,Simms
Randle,Obi,knox
RJ,grimes,knox
Fournier,burks,IQ
Rose,IQ,McBride

That’s a really balanced roster the way Obi played at the end of the year and playoffs I think a lot of fans are sleeping on how good he’s going to be in year two. Quick is Lou Williams 2.0 on year two, burks was one of the best 4th quarter players in the league. Randle is a borderline superstar, rj is a stud that could become a All Star in year 3. everyone except Mitch in the starting line up can put the ball on the floor .

Simply put the Knicks improved from a team that finished 4 th in the east.

The bulls added ball who I think is grossly overrated. He’s a low motor player, who still takes plays off. He might get them the 8th seed of there firing on all cylinders.

This whole lowery makes the heat contenders is silly he is on the downward swing in his career and really looked over the hill last year. On a underwhelming raptors squad that was supposed to make the playoffs last season. They also locked in Robinson who I like but not for 90 mil. They are locked into untradable contracts . Lowery was out for a money grab, while his market value hasn’t hit rock bottom, it will this year.

The way I see it we are still the fourth best team in the east. Put into the fact that now a non basketball move is a offensive foul that young lives off of we might see a big drop off from players like young and harden .

Bucks
Nets
76ers
Knicks
Hawks
Heat
Celtics
Bulls
Pacers
Hornets

All the other teams are bottom feeders two teams that might be a downward surprise are the Celtics and 76ers

76ers were exposed vs the hawks.

Surprise teams I see could be the hornets if healthy and pacers if healthy. But by all means the Knicks are 4th or 5th pending on how the hawks play with the new rules


See it as:
Bucks
Nets
Hawks
Heat
76ers
Knicks Or Celtics (Toss up)
Bulls
Pacers
Hornets

Going to be interesting to see if Thibs can mess the roster for improvements.
But as Knickerbockers got better so did alot of NBA Eastern conference teams.

Turntable Musiclover & Mix-Master-ologist
gradyandrew
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8/4/2021  3:13 AM
Shouldn't the defense be better this season? The ball is gonna roll in or out sometimes but good defense is the key to a good record.
fitzfarm
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8/4/2021  3:52 AM
DJMUSIC wrote:
fitzfarm wrote:I think the Knicks upgraded with Fournier while still keeping the core intact that allowed us to finish 4th in the east. After watching Fournier in the Olympics and last year highlights he can really score and put the ball on the floor as well as make the right pass when needed . Plus we upgraded just by drafting grimes and McBride .

Mitch,Noel,Simms
Randle,Obi,knox
RJ,grimes,knox
Fournier,burks,IQ
Rose,IQ,McBride

That’s a really balanced roster the way Obi played at the end of the year and playoffs I think a lot of fans are sleeping on how good he’s going to be in year two. Quick is Lou Williams 2.0 on year two, burks was one of the best 4th quarter players in the league. Randle is a borderline superstar, rj is a stud that could become a All Star in year 3. everyone except Mitch in the starting line up can put the ball on the floor .

Simply put the Knicks improved from a team that finished 4 th in the east.

The bulls added ball who I think is grossly overrated. He’s a low motor player, who still takes plays off. He might get them the 8th seed of there firing on all cylinders.

This whole lowery makes the heat contenders is silly he is on the downward swing in his career and really looked over the hill last year. On a underwhelming raptors squad that was supposed to make the playoffs last season. They also locked in Robinson who I like but not for 90 mil. They are locked into untradable contracts . Lowery was out for a money grab, while his market value hasn’t hit rock bottom, it will this year.

The way I see it we are still the fourth best team in the east. Put into the fact that now a non basketball move is a offensive foul that young lives off of we might see a big drop off from players like young and harden .

Bucks
Nets
76ers
Knicks
Hawks
Heat
Celtics
Bulls
Pacers
Hornets

All the other teams are bottom feeders two teams that might be a downward surprise are the Celtics and 76ers

76ers were exposed vs the hawks.

Surprise teams I see could be the hornets if healthy and pacers if healthy. But by all means the Knicks are 4th or 5th pending on how the hawks play with the new rules


See it as:
Bucks
Nets
Hawks
Heat
76ers
Knicks Or Celtics (Toss up)
Bulls
Pacers
Hornets

Going to be interesting to see if Thibs can mess the roster for improvements.
But as Knickerbockers got better so did alot of NBA Eastern conference teams.

I just don’t see how the heat or Celtics are getting so much love … the heat grossly over preformed in the bubble and went crashing back down to earth in a real season . Why is the addition of a old out of shape over the hill lowery making them any better then last year?

And the Celtics lol they lost Fournier and Kemba with nothing to show, they’ll be lucky to even make the play in .

I think it will be a tight race and 4-6 will be a crap shoot but still think knicks finish 4 or 5 in the east .
Jmpasq
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8/4/2021  5:45 AM
fishmike wrote:Hard to say we did well. Its underwhelming to have a FO clearly capable of wheeling and dealing during the draft but cant leverage a league high $50mm plus in cap space for anything more than Fournier and Luca and keeping our own guys.

Now this drama about doing nothing and probably not even a playoff team is total **** however so hopefully folks get over that poop fast.

Knicks were 27-15 after the Rose trade. That's a .643 winning% and translates to a 53 win season. They are bringing the exact same team back except McBride or Luca replaces ELF, Grimes replaces Frank and Fournier replaces Reggie. While it doesnt include a marquee player that does constitute a talent upgrade.

Knicks remain VERY young with several key rotation guys looking to level up:
RJ
Obi
IQ
Mitch

Rose really showed he could be positive in a mentoring role last year as well. Folks were worried Thibs would show favoritism and it was the opposite... Rose was a conduit for the coach and Obi and IQ both talked glowingly about how Rose helped them when he got here. I wanted a veteran floor general. Looks like Rose is the guy. I think he's a 50-60 game a year player so I guess we will get some good long looks at IQ/Luca/McBride at PG

Fournier, Burks and Noel are productive guys on cap friendly deals.

I think we are deep and good so we should win a bunch of games. I mean what if we are basically the same team except next time in the playoffs Jules balls, RJ gets buckets and McBride is the Marcus Smart we all hoped Frank would be.

While this offseason isnt very exciting it does represent patience with a group that had a .643 winning% and they plugged some holes as well. Boring doesnt always mean bad job.


People assume Randle will play that well again. I think there will be some regression. He was awful in the playoffs. If he doesn't play like an MVP we could easily slip out of the playoffs
Check out My NFL Draft Prospect Videos at Youtube User Pages Jmpasq,JPdraftjedi,Jmpasqdraftjedi. www.Draftbreakdown.com
Chandler
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8/4/2021  7:37 AM
Steven’s wants smart gone. Celts are having a lot of issues surface. Many rooted in no feeling of loyalty to players. Not even faked loyalty. Thibs and knicks are opposite of that at the moment. Players feel respected

I am not buying Miami. I think they’re in decline. Lowry is a fine player but no Lebrun. If I had to pick one player that did not seem like Miami it would be him. Maybe they’ll get him on the juice

Last year dipo was their desperation move. This year Lowry

(5)(7)
knicks1248
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8/4/2021  8:04 AM
Chandler wrote:Steven’s wants smart gone. Celts are having a lot of issues surface. Many rooted in no feeling of loyalty to players. Not even faked loyalty. Thibs and knicks are opposite of that at the moment. Players feel respected

I am not buying Miami. I think they’re in decline. Lowry is a fine player but no Lebrun. If I had to pick one player that did not seem like Miami it would be him. Maybe they’ll get him on the juice

Last year dipo was their desperation move. This year Lowry

The most impressive part of Miami is the fact that they always make the biggest moves with NO CAP SPACE

ES
Knicksfan
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8/4/2021  8:23 AM
smackeddog wrote:We did much better! Bagely reporting all the deals are not fully guaranteed in the third year- our flexibility remains in tact, and they should all be moveable- might even get something back for them at the deadline if needed

Yep, this makes me feel better about the moves and realize that there indeed was always a plan to make us compete but also keep us flexible for trades as it will be in that market that we will land the desired star.

Knicks_Fan
Uptown
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8/4/2021  9:50 AM
Jmpasq wrote:
fishmike wrote:Hard to say we did well. Its underwhelming to have a FO clearly capable of wheeling and dealing during the draft but cant leverage a league high $50mm plus in cap space for anything more than Fournier and Luca and keeping our own guys.

Now this drama about doing nothing and probably not even a playoff team is total **** however so hopefully folks get over that poop fast.

Knicks were 27-15 after the Rose trade. That's a .643 winning% and translates to a 53 win season. They are bringing the exact same team back except McBride or Luca replaces ELF, Grimes replaces Frank and Fournier replaces Reggie. While it doesnt include a marquee player that does constitute a talent upgrade.

Knicks remain VERY young with several key rotation guys looking to level up:
RJ
Obi
IQ
Mitch

Rose really showed he could be positive in a mentoring role last year as well. Folks were worried Thibs would show favoritism and it was the opposite... Rose was a conduit for the coach and Obi and IQ both talked glowingly about how Rose helped them when he got here. I wanted a veteran floor general. Looks like Rose is the guy. I think he's a 50-60 game a year player so I guess we will get some good long looks at IQ/Luca/McBride at PG

Fournier, Burks and Noel are productive guys on cap friendly deals.

I think we are deep and good so we should win a bunch of games. I mean what if we are basically the same team except next time in the playoffs Jules balls, RJ gets buckets and McBride is the Marcus Smart we all hoped Frank would be.

While this offseason isnt very exciting it does represent patience with a group that had a .643 winning% and they plugged some holes as well. Boring doesnt always mean bad job.


People assume Randle will play that well again. I think there will be some regression. He was awful in the playoffs. If he doesn't play like an MVP we could easily slip out of the playoffs

Last season, Randle was a 2nd team All NBA performer and first time All star. During the playoffs, he regressed, badly, and looked like the player we saw when Fiz was walking the sidelines. Was last regular season an outlier? For this upcoming season, will we see regular season Randle or Playoff Randle? I think next season we will get a version of Randle that will be closer to regular season Randle, but I would be surprised if a career 34% shooter from 3 shoots 41% again.
Uptown
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8/4/2021  9:56 AM
Chandler wrote:Steven’s wants smart gone. Celts are having a lot of issues surface. Many rooted in no feeling of loyalty to players. Not even faked loyalty. Thibs and knicks are opposite of that at the moment. Players feel respected

I am not buying Miami. I think they’re in decline. Lowry is a fine player but no Lebrun. If I had to pick one player that did not seem like Miami it would be him. Maybe they’ll get him on the juice

Last year dipo was their desperation move. This year Lowry

Miami was the one puzzle that Thibs couldn't solve in the regular season. I think they will be better next season when you consider they were hit hard with covid issues last year.
fishmike
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8/4/2021  11:45 AM
Jmpasq wrote:
fishmike wrote:Hard to say we did well. Its underwhelming to have a FO clearly capable of wheeling and dealing during the draft but cant leverage a league high $50mm plus in cap space for anything more than Fournier and Luca and keeping our own guys.

Now this drama about doing nothing and probably not even a playoff team is total **** however so hopefully folks get over that poop fast.

Knicks were 27-15 after the Rose trade. That's a .643 winning% and translates to a 53 win season. They are bringing the exact same team back except McBride or Luca replaces ELF, Grimes replaces Frank and Fournier replaces Reggie. While it doesnt include a marquee player that does constitute a talent upgrade.

Knicks remain VERY young with several key rotation guys looking to level up:
RJ
Obi
IQ
Mitch

Rose really showed he could be positive in a mentoring role last year as well. Folks were worried Thibs would show favoritism and it was the opposite... Rose was a conduit for the coach and Obi and IQ both talked glowingly about how Rose helped them when he got here. I wanted a veteran floor general. Looks like Rose is the guy. I think he's a 50-60 game a year player so I guess we will get some good long looks at IQ/Luca/McBride at PG

Fournier, Burks and Noel are productive guys on cap friendly deals.

I think we are deep and good so we should win a bunch of games. I mean what if we are basically the same team except next time in the playoffs Jules balls, RJ gets buckets and McBride is the Marcus Smart we all hoped Frank would be.

While this offseason isnt very exciting it does represent patience with a group that had a .643 winning% and they plugged some holes as well. Boring doesnt always mean bad job.


People assume Randle will play that well again. I think there will be some regression. He was awful in the playoffs. If he doesn't play like an MVP we could easily slip out of the playoffs
I am glad to hear this because generally your doom and gloom predictions are trash.

Knicks are likely to see MORE production and improvement from
RJ
Obi
IQ
Mitch

2 starters and 2 bench players who should improve (even if its just staying on the court for Mitch)

Next in the improvement zone:

ELF is replaced by Kemba Walker, Luca. That is an UPGRADE
Bullock is replaced by Fournier. That is an UPGRADE
Frank is replaced Grimes/McBride. That is an UPGRADE

But we are on a Knick's fan site and Jmpasq comes strong with "Julius prolly wont shoot 40% and I dont expect the Knicks to make the playoffs"


Its just so lame.

Knicks were a young team who played .643 ball after they upgraded PG with Rose. He's back, they have upgraded those holes, brought back the depth guys who played really well and helped us win games (Burks, Noel, Taj). You just hate the Knicks. Open your eyes.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
fishmike
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8/4/2021  11:47 AM
Chandler wrote:Steven’s wants smart gone. Celts are having a lot of issues surface. Many rooted in no feeling of loyalty to players. Not even faked loyalty. Thibs and knicks are opposite of that at the moment. Players feel respected

I am not buying Miami. I think they’re in decline. Lowry is a fine player but no Lebrun. If I had to pick one player that did not seem like Miami it would be him. Maybe they’ll get him on the juice

Last year dipo was their desperation move. This year Lowry


The Heat have a bounceback season in them. If Lowry/Jimmy/Bam are healthy in the post season they will be a real pain in the ass. But they are NOYT getting any younger. Knicks are def in a position to pass them by in a year or two.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
jrodmc
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8/4/2021  11:56 AM
fishmike wrote:
Jmpasq wrote:
fishmike wrote:Hard to say we did well. Its underwhelming to have a FO clearly capable of wheeling and dealing during the draft but cant leverage a league high $50mm plus in cap space for anything more than Fournier and Luca and keeping our own guys.

Now this drama about doing nothing and probably not even a playoff team is total **** however so hopefully folks get over that poop fast.

Knicks were 27-15 after the Rose trade. That's a .643 winning% and translates to a 53 win season. They are bringing the exact same team back except McBride or Luca replaces ELF, Grimes replaces Frank and Fournier replaces Reggie. While it doesnt include a marquee player that does constitute a talent upgrade.

Knicks remain VERY young with several key rotation guys looking to level up:
RJ
Obi
IQ
Mitch

Rose really showed he could be positive in a mentoring role last year as well. Folks were worried Thibs would show favoritism and it was the opposite... Rose was a conduit for the coach and Obi and IQ both talked glowingly about how Rose helped them when he got here. I wanted a veteran floor general. Looks like Rose is the guy. I think he's a 50-60 game a year player so I guess we will get some good long looks at IQ/Luca/McBride at PG

Fournier, Burks and Noel are productive guys on cap friendly deals.

I think we are deep and good so we should win a bunch of games. I mean what if we are basically the same team except next time in the playoffs Jules balls, RJ gets buckets and McBride is the Marcus Smart we all hoped Frank would be.

While this offseason isnt very exciting it does represent patience with a group that had a .643 winning% and they plugged some holes as well. Boring doesnt always mean bad job.


People assume Randle will play that well again. I think there will be some regression. He was awful in the playoffs. If he doesn't play like an MVP we could easily slip out of the playoffs
I am glad to hear this because generally your doom and gloom predictions are trash.

Knicks are likely to see MORE production and improvement from
RJ
Obi
IQ
Mitch

2 starters and 2 bench players who should improve (even if its just staying on the court for Mitch)

Next in the improvement zone:

ELF is replaced by Kemba Walker, Luca. That is an UPGRADE
Bullock is replaced by Fournier. That is an UPGRADE
Frank is replaced Grimes/McBride. That is an UPGRADE

But we are on a Knick's fan site and Jmpasq comes strong with "Julius prolly wont shoot 40% and I dont expect the Knicks to make the playoffs"


Its just so lame.

Knicks were a young team who played .643 ball after they upgraded PG with Rose. He's back, they have upgraded those holes, brought back the depth guys who played really well and helped us win games (Burks, Noel, Taj). You just hate the Knicks. Open your eyes.

+1
Let's just temper the happiness, without pulling out all the tank craziness. If Kemba stays healthy for more than 60 games, we will be a much tougher out in the playoffs.

Howsabout: all these additions can only make Jules less concerned with the crowds, and he'll have a lot less pressure on him during those turnaround fade aways from the baseline...
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