gradyandrew wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:I understand that we can have a trade add free agents etc... BUT the more I personally evaluated the whole schmeal--I think we made a BRUTAL BRUTAL mistake not simply drafting Keon Johnson. I know we have rookies galore BUT imho the arent high end caliber rookies--more like role players with upside.

I didnt really look at Keon Johnson much--his name honestly was not close to where we were drafting. Sometimes players fall Giannis 15 Kobe 13 ETC>>> but we gave up the opportunity to cultivate an uber athletic wing whose fundamentals are much better than what was perceived. I think all the way down at 19--a guy like that falls for whatever reason--I think you take him. Teams become obsessed with process---they have something in place a player teyve keyed on. We keyed on Duarte Grimes and McBride. But this guy has open floor power and athletiscm that only a few players have. I think we will look back on this miss. Even Kai Jones hurts when I step back and look at the picks. We had Kai Jones and Keon Johnson? We took the path of role players instead of high end upside. Not going to get this opportunity much.

Your argument is what? Talent outweighs a plan? The Knicks got the guys they wanted except for Duarte，hopefully that was payback from us stealing Marcus Morris and Leon can send R.C Buford a nice fruit cake in December.

Also， it seems clear that for the first time since Isiah took over， the front office is hoping for a second contract themselves. Previous regimes have operated under the "all in before the flop with pocket 10s" principle; yeah those signings might work out， but everyone can see the downside. I will start criticizing once they start losing games.

200%. Talent outweighs a plan. What plan did Milwaukee have when they picked giannis? No doubt about it. In the end we could’ve had grimes Johnson and McBride. I think trading pick 19 for a future to a perennial shtty team was wrong. That was an opportunity to take a calculated risk on an Uber athlete who has very decent fundamentals.

Ultimately the Knicks traded out to get a future pick and save 2.7mm in cap space- at the moment I'm wondering what the marginal room is gonna give us if anything. There's a world where we could've not saved the space and gotten Grimes + someone else out of the first round whether it was Keon or someone else but we wanted to net a bit more space for this year.

VDesai wrote:

Chandler wrote:https://ca.nba.com/news/nba-draft-combine-all-time-combine-records-for-max-vertical-leap-keon-johnson/4fks3iogu2rm10mk4lo2y3qc0

not a very august list. was surprised DSJ didn't make the list

Props to Pat Connaughton for making that list. We have one of those guys now in Sims. Larkin had a much better vert than I would've thought - he did absolutely nothing with it in the NBA.

who doesn't like a vertical leap, but at the same time most rebounds are below the rims and a consequence of positioning and team rebounding. there are much more meaningful stats

i much prefer the guys who are fast off the floor. many times they're only going 9.5 to 10.5 feet but doing so with hardly loading up their quads. Capella is very good at that. SO is Mitch when he's not hurt. So was McDyess and Pippen

honestly don't get Briggs' complaint. I mean we got his guy J.Sims who has a much better chance of making an impact from his hops. He can be a young D'Andre catching lobs 12' in the air. how does someone stop that?

Chandler wrote:
Didn't we just live through the uber-athlete DSJ?

And Mudiay, who was touted as freak athlete when he was traded. And Kevin Knox, who was touted as a + athlete for his size. And Obi, who is a + NBA athlete by run and jump standards

So in the end I think our biggest regret will be ignoring our PG needs during free agency.

Caseloads wrote:I think grimes will be no better than dotson, who was solid.

sims, man, that guy has the best hops and ups i've ever seen. including better than prime kemp.

Dot was never solid. Grimes will be MUCH better IMHO

Chandler wrote:
Didn't we just live through the uber-athlete DSJ?

One of the frequent problems with super athletic BB players is that in their early years, they don't see the necessity of working on their jump shooting, because they can dominate in other ways.

Maybe we regret not taking him...maybe we don't, but I was happy we let him pass.

But I've been wrong before (Frank was my biggest misread).

CleaverGreene wrote:A shooting guard who is not a great shooter. Average size and wingspan for the position.

Thibs is clearly a guy who wants rookies with more NBA ready games, and we know the team needed some 3pt snipers. It is no surprise that Grimes and McBride both shot well from deep. Both of them are also capable defenders.

Thibs probably saw Keon as a project, something he didn't want to deal with, especially with Knox and Obi (yeah, he's a project, live with it) already on the roster.

What was wrong with taking grimes at 21 Johnson 19? You provide a hedge by drafting a high talent rookie with clear upside. It’s not that it’s like woke 48 inch vertical man-/ watch the tape// he is a good two way basketball player. Also if Johnson played in the AAC like grimes did—he would’ve been head over on him. Grimes played at Kansas and was porous— Johnson way better